Off-Topic

[atomicchaos]

How about they make the assumptions that all wire transfer orders will be paid for, and any Bitcoin transfers are paid, then tell us through what order number will make batch 1. I'd rather see worst case scenario now, then wait until the bank transfers clear. Then some will be happily surprised if some go unpaid.

Also, now that we know the main reason for pre-orders was to refund the money of the original backer, this paypal freeze is going to cause a bit of a crunch.

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[CanaryInTheMine]

All the Bitcoin/PayPal orders that have not been paid fully will be cancelled today. We have been misquoted, that we will wait 6-7 days. We will wait for 2-3 days for the orders marked as "Bank Transfers", for the transfers to come in.

We still need to know where 'in line' we are. I ordered within the first 20 min and made payment at the same time. If someone that just threw in 20 DX-Large and made a request for bank transfer so that he can sell his 'early orders' eats up all the first 10k avalon chips ahead of me I am certainly not interested in keeping my order. Sorry, but I think a lot of people feel the same way.

The largest order we have is 2 DX Larges.

We will send an email day after tomorrow to everyone know where they stand.

terrahash, if there's something the bitcointalk community can do to help you guys, please let us know...  we all want this to go as smooth as possible.

[jdape]

This is my estimate on what order numbers will ship in the first batch
 It's just for fun.  

First, assume TerraHash has 20,000 chips to allocate to the pre-order made on June 18th.  They might have other large customers who have undisclosed orders taking up chips.  Second, this is my *guess* and makes a couple assumptions.

I've been updating the orders in the TerraHash Order Queue and Info thread <https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=238148.0> pretty often and the average number of chips per order has stabilized around 270.

The number of orders that would ship in a batch of 20,000 chips is stable at 75.

Calculating the actual orders which will ship, out of orders 430 through 1000:
570 order numbers total.  
Estimating 1 in 3 are actual order numbers due to WooCommerce RNG leaves 190 'real' orders.
Of  those, 1 in 3 are incomplete.  This leaves 125 'paid' orders with a number under 1000.

75 possible orders out of 125 'paid' orders = 60% of first day paid orders will be in first batch.
570 * .60 = 342.  342 + 430 = highest first order number (order 772).

Conclusion: Orders 432 through about ~772 will ship first batch.


Of course, Terrahash will tell us tomorrow

[chanberg]

This is my estimate on what order numbers will ship in the first batch


First, assume TerraHash has 20,000 chips to allocate to the pre-order made on June 18th.  They might have other large customers who have undisclosed orders taking up chips.  Second, this is my *guess* and makes a couple assumptions.

I've been updating the orders in the TerraHash Order Queue and Info thread <https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=238148.0> pretty often and the average number of chips per order has stabilized around 270.

The number of orders that would ship in a batch of 20,000 chips is stable at 75.

Calculating the actual order which will ship out of order 430 through 1000:
570 order numbers.  
Estimate 1 in 3 are actual order numbers due to WooCommerce RNG leaves 190 'real' orders.
Of  those, 1 in 3 are incomplete.  This leaves 125 paid orders with a number under 1000.

75 available slots out of 125 good orders = 60% of first day paid orders will be in first batch.
570 * .60 = 342.  342 + 430 = highest first order number (order 772).

Conclusion: Orders 432 through 772 will ship first batch.


Of course, Terrahash will tell us tomorrow

Wow missed batch 1 by 6 numbers!~! But definitely will see tomorrow

[aznewsh]

Please add Order # 452 as mine - DX-Large 10 Module (180 GH) w/ PSU - Hosted

This was paid today by Same Day Wire Transfer (It will likely be marked as paid either today or tomorrow by Terrahash which is within the 2-3 Days needed to maintain Queue Spot)

I will be putting this order up for Auction once it has been marked as paid.

I'm fairly confident this order will be within the first batch (10,000 Chips).

If anyone is interested you can PM me but realise that there WILL be an auction that you will have to post on.

I hope you are left holding the baby - selfish behavior just pushes others back in the queue needlessly - TerraHash please cancel all such orders that you become aware of!

[atomicchaos]

Please add Order # 452 as mine - DX-Large 10 Module (180 GH) w/ PSU - Hosted

This was paid today by Same Day Wire Transfer (It will likely be marked as paid either today or tomorrow by Terrahash which is within the 2-3 Days needed to maintain Queue Spot)

I will be putting this order up for Auction once it has been marked as paid.

I'm fairly confident this order will be within the first batch (10,000 Chips).

If anyone is interested you can PM me but realise that there WILL be an auction that you will have to post on.

I hope you are left holding the baby - selfish behavior just pushes others back in the queue needlessly - TerraHash please cancel all such orders that you become aware of!

I simply do not understand this reaction. If he wants to resell his order, how exactly does it impact you?? He wants to make a buck like we all do, and if he thinks he will make more by selling the equipment, just like all of the sellers of this gear, then more power to him. Frankly, the majority of the people reacting like this are actually the selfish ones, caring that their precious spot in the queue will be disrupted and trying to move up by accusing others of doing something that they don't approve of.

Wow people, look in the mirror before you judge others, will you? The early bird gets the worm, and it's about 10pm in the ASIC world, so if he wants to maximize his ROI by reselling, who the F cares? We all had the same playbook in front of us, what plays we choose to run is our business. Next time be quicker if you are concerned what others in front of you in the queue are doing.

[aznewsh]

Please add Order # 452 as mine - DX-Large 10 Module (180 GH) w/ PSU - Hosted

This was paid today by Same Day Wire Transfer (It will likely be marked as paid either today or tomorrow by Terrahash which is within the 2-3 Days needed to maintain Queue Spot)

I will be putting this order up for Auction once it has been marked as paid.

I'm fairly confident this order will be within the first batch (10,000 Chips).

If anyone is interested you can PM me but realise that there WILL be an auction that you will have to post on.

I hope you are left holding the baby - selfish behavior just pushes others back in the queue needlessly - TerraHash please cancel all such orders that you become aware of!

I simply do not understand this reaction. If he wants to resell his order, how exactly does it impact you?? He wants to make a buck like we all do, and if he thinks he will make more by selling the equipment, just like all of the sellers of this gear, then more power to him. Frankly, the majority of the people reacting like this are actually the selfish ones, caring that their precious spot in the queue will be disrupted and trying to move up by accusing others of doing something that they don't approve of.

Wow people, look in the mirror before you judge others, will you? The early bird gets the worm, and it's about 10pm in the ASIC world, so if he wants to maximize his ROI by reselling, who the F cares? We all had the same playbook in front of us, what plays we choose to run is our business. Next time be quicker if you are concerned what others in front of you in the queue are doing.

Actually no, you missed the point - the late bird who is stupid enough to pay more gets the worm.

I am reacting in the same way that I would if you pushed in front of me when I was stood in in line for something, I would not ignore that either!

If you don't care then wtf did you respond?

[atomicchaos]

Actually no, you missed the point - the late bird who is stupid enough to pay more gets the worm.

I am reacting in the same way that I would if you pushed in front of me when I was stood in in line for something, I would not ignore that either!

If you don't care then wtf did you respond?

Your analogy is a very poor self-serving one. A more proper analogy is one in which there is a sale on Ipods, for 50% off, and I go in and abide by all the rules and buy them all. I then post them on Ebay and make a 40% profit.

You know what they call it? Capitalism.

If someone cut you in line, they aren't following rules, and they are in for a swift kick in the arse by me as well. Here, have a 6xx order, so you stop crying.

[bearsworth]

Got some 600-700 orders up for grabs! Capitalism at its best!

[nikycoin]

I would not sell my order spot for my little k16  for any less then 25 btc loll

[bearsworth]

I'm not really scalping btw, anyone who wants pm me. I only charge shipping + me wasting my time to pick it up

[massnerder]

Please add Order # 452 as mine - DX-Large 10 Module (180 GH) w/ PSU - Hosted

This was paid today by Same Day Wire Transfer (It will likely be marked as paid either today or tomorrow by Terrahash which is within the 2-3 Days needed to maintain Queue Spot)

I will be putting this order up for Auction once it has been marked as paid.

I'm fairly confident this order will be within the first batch (10,000 Chips).

If anyone is interested you can PM me but realise that there WILL be an auction that you will have to post on.

I hope you are left holding the baby - selfish behavior just pushes others back in the queue needlessly - TerraHash please cancel all such orders that you become aware of!

I simply do not understand this reaction. If he wants to resell his order, how exactly does it impact you?? He wants to make a buck like we all do, and if he thinks he will make more by selling the equipment, just like all of the sellers of this gear, then more power to him. Frankly, the majority of the people reacting like this are actually the selfish ones, caring that their precious spot in the queue will be disrupted and trying to move up by accusing others of doing something that they don't approve of.

Wow people, look in the mirror before you judge others, will you? The early bird gets the worm, and it's about 10pm in the ASIC world, so if he wants to maximize his ROI by reselling, who the F cares? We all had the same playbook in front of us, what plays we choose to run is our business. Next time be quicker if you are concerned what others in front of you in the queue are doing.

I understand it, not that I completely agree, but I get it.  It is still unclear whether TH is going to allow re-selling of the pre-orders or not.  I hope not.  I am unsure how I feel about selling an order...  essentially he is buying the machine, a risk, now reselling that risk to another for a even higher degree of risk just to reduce his own initial risk.  It's BFL pre-orders on Ebay all over again.  What I do know is that I got my order in during the very first minute.  I (among others) will be very disappointed if that order is pushed back an extra month or more on top of a 2 month initial wait.  All just because one person wasn't comfortable taking the risk on the hardware that he bought for himself.  If you can't take the risk, you probably shouldn't order in the first place.  Waiting to sell the actual machine (in hand) is a different story, as you are mitigating risk for the buyer (who gets the hardware directly after buying) and yourself (by recovering cost+ on the order), rather than passing 100+% of the risk on to someone who didn't have it together when pre-orders opened in the first place.  For instance, I can't afford a full Large DX so I didn't order one.... but I could have put it on a CC and immediately re-sold the order for a profit.  That wouldn't have been right IMHO, so I didn't do it.

All we can do at this point is wait and hope for good news from TH by email.  If the news is bad, then maybe take the refund and put that money elsewhere.

[bearsworth]

I was joking btw. Don't send pms.

[nikycoin]

I was joking btw. Don't send pms.

So i was too :p

I want the machine hashing in my office

[joeventura]

I would not sell my order spot for my little k16  for any less then 25 btc loll

That works out well because no one would buy it for that price!!

[rizzman]

Added all orders up to now:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=198489.msg2513488#msg2513488

So far:
11232 chips accounted for in 37 orders equals 303 chips per order.
20,000 chips = First 66 orders paid within 5 days will be fulfilled in first batch.

(oops - added Cryptoin's orders)

Order # 591

(Klondike 16) × 1
(Klondike 64) × 2

[Vigil]

Please add Order # 452 as mine - DX-Large 10 Module (180 GH) w/ PSU - Hosted

This was paid today by Same Day Wire Transfer (It will likely be marked as paid either today or tomorrow by Terrahash which is within the 2-3 Days needed to maintain Queue Spot)

I will be putting this order up for Auction once it has been marked as paid.

I'm fairly confident this order will be within the first batch (10,000 Chips).

If anyone is interested you can PM me but realise that there WILL be an auction that you will have to post on.

I hope you are left holding the baby - selfish behavior just pushes others back in the queue needlessly - TerraHash please cancel all such orders that you become aware of!

I simply do not understand this reaction. If he wants to resell his order, how exactly does it impact you?? He wants to make a buck like we all do, and if he thinks he will make more by selling the equipment, just like all of the sellers of this gear, then more power to him. Frankly, the majority of the people reacting like this are actually the selfish ones, caring that their precious spot in the queue will be disrupted and trying to move up by accusing others of doing something that they don't approve of.

Wow people, look in the mirror before you judge others, will you? The early bird gets the worm, and it's about 10pm in the ASIC world, so if he wants to maximize his ROI by reselling, who the F cares? We all had the same playbook in front of us, what plays we choose to run is our business. Next time be quicker if you are concerned what others in front of you in the queue are doing.

I understand it, not that I completely agree, but I get it.  It is still unclear whether TH is going to allow re-selling of the pre-orders or not.  I hope not.  I am unsure how I feel about selling an order...  essentially he is buying the machine, a risk, now reselling that risk to another for a even higher degree of risk just to reduce his own initial risk.  It's BFL pre-orders on Ebay all over again.  What I do know is that I got my order in during the very first minute.  I (among others) will be very disappointed if that order is pushed back an extra month or more on top of a 2 month initial wait.  All just because one person wasn't comfortable taking the risk on the hardware that he bought for himself.  If you can't take the risk, you probably shouldn't order in the first place.  Waiting to sell the actual machine (in hand) is a different story, as you are mitigating risk for the buyer (who gets the hardware directly after buying) and yourself (by recovering cost+ on the order), rather than passing 100+% of the risk on to someone who didn't have it together when pre-orders opened in the first place.  For instance, I can't afford a full Large DX so I didn't order one.... but I could have put it on a CC and immediately re-sold the order for a profit.  That wouldn't have been right IMHO, so I didn't do it.

All we can do at this point is wait and hope for good news from TH by email.  If the news is bad, then maybe take the refund and put that money elsewhere.

Exactly, we could have used up the entire first two batches between a couple people by maxing out some cards and selling. I never really thought about doing that. I should have ordered double what I did and sold the other one.

[atomicchaos]

.... but I could have put it on a CC and immediately re-sold the order for a profit.  That wouldn't have been right IMHO, so I didn't do it.

Well stated opinion, that obviously is not based on an angry reaction of having their order bumped. While I did not resell any of the extra orders I had in the queue either, mainly because of the exact reasons you specified, I see no problem with those that did. My orders were primarily to see how quickly the orders were incrementing, I also debated on the possibility of going back and paying for more if things started flowing with proof such as Avalon order info and such.

Nobody buying one of these is doing it as a hobby, we're all greedy in our own way, and at least I can admit that I am in this to make money, and frankly, as long as I'm honest while doing so, I can live with myself.

If someone chose to buy one of these from someone, fully realizing the risk, and hopefully with the guarantee that if they don't ship they will be refunded once a refund is issued to original purchaser (almost like Terrahash with the failed Cloudhashing deal), I see no reason they shouldn't be sold one. Everybody hates scalpers, resellers of popular products, or such, but if people weren't buying, then they wouldn't be around, now would they?

Then the irony of someone complaining about the non-paid order that sold his account to someone else in the process of setting up a group buy. The double standard is astounding.

That said, thank you for a well stated perspective that is obviously just based on your value system, which I applaud. It doesn't change my values, I will do everything within the rules and honestly to make a buck. That's what capitalism is all about. Terrahash took a risk, bought chips and wanted to make a profit. His competitors are numerous, and my competitors, as well as your competitors are each and everyone that ordered one of these and any other ASIC. The best way to make money in that is not to participate in the arms race, but to sell and resell the arms.

[joeventura]

So who is selling a Batch 1 order? Time is running out PM me!

[btceic]

So who is selling a Batch 1 order? Time is running out PM me!

What are you willing to pay?