Off-Topic

[atomicchaos]

 Do you realize that by re-selling the pre-order for something the vendors don't yet have, you are adding and passing along another layer of risk in that equation?  So it is not really the same thing.  My comment about selling the machine in hand was specifically for order re-selling, not the idea of a pre-order itself.  So the actual end user will now assume the risk of hoping TH delivers on time like everybody else while paying more for the same hardware, and that I disagree with that is all that I have said.  At least when someone re-sells a machine in hand, the buyer knows exactly when to expect delivery.  They will still pay more for it but the one re-selling it should assume the risk of waiting on TH to get it out the door IMHO.  Some of these guys might actually do better by waiting to re-sell a machine in hand....  

Are you related to the Mayor of NYC? He also wanted to protect the citizens from risk and ban large sodas for the idiots that drink it like water. It would seem if someone wanted a device bad enough, they are willing to take the risk. But you are correct, the person bearing that risk, should make sure the seller will provide a refund if the units don't ship and they receive a refund themselves. It's hard to do that with a level of trust, I'd require full contact info of the seller.

And full disclosure, I may still sell my 9 module unit if timelines don't start to look better, and I should be in the 10k initial batch, but that won't be until I either find out: A). I'm not in the first batch, or B). The units will not arrive until after July 31st.

[massnerder]

Are you related to the Mayor of NYC? He also wanted to protect the citizens from risk and ban large sodas for the idiots that drink it like water. It would seem if someone wanted a device bad enough, they are willing to take the risk. But you are correct, the person bearing that risk, should make sure the seller will provide a refund if the units don't ship and they receive a refund themselves. It's hard to do that with a level of trust, I'd require full contact info of the seller.

Well, I don't drink gallons of soda....  or I disagree with doing so would be a better way of putting it.  I also don't go around slapping big gulps out of people's hands either    Nor do I walk around extinguishing the cigarettes of smokers.  I just disagree, so what?  It's not like my opinion really changes anything.

C) Who the hell am I anyway??  No reason to start any kicking and/or screaming just because I disagree.  I obviously can't stop anyone from selling or buying the pre-orders, is there some reason that I should not be allowed to just have an opinion?

[atomicchaos]

Well, I don't drink gallons of soda....  or I disagree with doing so would be a better way of putting it.  I also don't go around slapping big gulps out of people's hands either    Nor do I walk around extinguishing the cigarettes of smokers.  I just disagree, so what?  It's not like my opinion really changes anything.

We all have our opinions, and we all are stating them, stop feeling like you are under attack for your opinion, and simply acknowledge that others have differing opinions.

[bitcoin carpenter]

Emmanuel Abiodun (Cloudhashing operator) = SCAMMER

that sums up my feelings on the matter nicely

[massnerder]

We all have our opinions, and we all are stating them, stop feeling like you are under attack for your opinion, and simply acknowledge that others have differing opinions.

I do apologize, but when you compare me to the mayor of NYC it certainly feels like an attack to me    I have acknowledged that, I haven't been telling you what to do or hounding TH to change anything about the way they are doing things.  Take some of your own advice!

[TheFuneral]

when would the people in the first batch start receiving their equipment? I understand dates are set in stone, but what is at least the date people are talking about.

[laughingbear]

when would the people in the first batch start receiving their equipment? I understand dates are set in stone, but what is at least the date people are talking about.

that all depends on a LOT of factors, mostly when they get the chips.  First we need to know who got in the first batch.

[TheFuneral]

when would the people in the first batch start receiving their equipment? I understand dates are set in stone, but what is at least the date people are talking about.

that all depends on a LOT of factors, mostly when they get the chips.  First we need to know who got in the first batch.

Let's pretend I'm the first person on the batch. What other factors do we need? The answer can't be 10 years from now so where is the guesses that people have that make then wanna buy this to be profitable.

[laughingbear]

Q. any ETA for one of your products ?
A. We are still waiting for Avalon to release the specs. As soon as they do it, BkkCoins will hopefully finish the design and be able to send us some boards within 7-10 days, or we will try to get some manufactured locally here in Bay Area. The turn around time for boards is usually 3-4 days. So we hope we will have boards in 2 weeks. After that we will do some testing for about 2 weeks. Basically within a month, we will be ready to assemble and ship upto 250 boards a day, given that we have the Avalon chips. Now that is a big variable, we have no idea when we will get the chips. However we will start taking orders for the assembly service, so that in case you receive your chips, you can send them over to us and we will start assembling your boards.

I am pretty sure they are in the testing phase right now.

Go read the OP

[Silvas]

Q. any ETA for one of your products ?
A. We are still waiting for Avalon to release the specs. As soon as they do it, BkkCoins will hopefully finish the design and be able to send us some boards within 7-10 days, or we will try to get some manufactured locally here in Bay Area. The turn around time for boards is usually 3-4 days. So we hope we will have boards in 2 weeks. After that we will do some testing for about 2 weeks. Basically within a month, we will be ready to assemble and ship upto 250 boards a day, given that we have the Avalon chips. Now that is a big variable, we have no idea when we will get the chips. However we will start taking orders for the assembly service, so that in case you receive your chips, you can send them over to us and we will start assembling your boards.

I am pretty sure they are in the testing phase right now.

Go read the OP

Bkk has received sample chips, and TH has received sample chips.
Bkk has already identified a problem with the K16 board, the vcc power to the pic controller is not connected.  That will mean a board rework.  TH has already assembled a populated k16 board, so hopefully they can recover the sample chips off that board and reuse them on another updated board.  Or maybe they'll find a workaround.
The firmware and cgminer drivers are not yet fully developed, so software work is ongoing.

Delivery will hinge on when avalon delivers chips, when the board design is finalized and all issues ironed out, and the software is done.  The potential does exist for this to drag out for a long time, if they keep identifying issues in the board and have to do reworks (like has reportedly happened with bfl) and if the software work takes longer than expected.

From what I can see, BFLs mistake was largely hubris.  They grossly overestimated what they could deliver in a given timeframe, and made promises they could not keep.  At that point, pride joined the list of transgressions.  Instead of openly admitting that they overreached and made a huge mistake on how difficult the development was going to be and how long it would take them to work things out, they continued to give estimates based on what I believe were best case scenarios, and giving people unrealistic expectations.
I'm seeing a lot of statements from TH that indicate that they might be making some of the same mistakes.  The timeframes they're giving seem awfully tight, and the fact that they don't usually mention the possibilities that problems are found with board designs requiring rework, or possibility that software development holds things up; the only thing I usually see them mentioning is if avalon doesn't deliver the chips on time.  That could give people the expectation that as long as the chips are delivered on time as expected, everything will be great and they'll get their units quickly.  This has the potential to turn into another BFL situation all over again.  Will it?  I don't know, but the potential is there, particularly if people have their expectations set unreasonably high due to statements from TH that don't brutally set people's expectations firmly where they belong - we believe this will be a short process, but any of these X things could prove us wrong and hold this up.

That being said, I have ordered 2 units from TH, and I do hope that it all goes well and the way they seem to think it will.  I'm not here to naysay or scare people away, or say anything negative about TH; I'm just giving a brutally honest view of what I see and what I think

[kendog77]

Just keep pressing ahead, terrahash.

If you can deliver the first batch of miners in July, I'd say your venture is a smashing success!

[jelin1984]

Yes will be great

[sasadjak]

I have also assembled  K1 USB board, 
http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/5282/4d43.jpg

Tomorrow starts preorder...

[btceic]

I have also assembled  K1 USB board, 


Tomorrow starts preorder...

priceless

[sasadjak]

100 RSD (serbian dinar) if you send me chips i do it for free

[MinermanNC]

Yes, TH, any new start up will have bumps...lets just hope you get the chips and start pumping out them mining boards for us all! Please dont let things get out of control and become like BFL. You would be better to out of stock items for a while then to except more orders and dig yourself into a hole. Im glad to see you defending yourself against the cloudhashing statements as they are discrediting. Please just keep us all posted and be realistic. 

[Tornate]

terrahash, what's the status on assembling and testing the 1st K16 board?

[pixl8tr]

terrahash, what's the status on assembling and testing the 1st K16 board?

You might want to read this thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=190731.1600  by the person who is developing the board.  I assume TH is waiting for him to validate the design. Its not ready yet, there are issues with the prototype boards.

[FUKT]

Just ordered additional 20,000 chips from Avalon. Orders that would not be covered by the first batch, would certainly be covered by these chips.

BitSyncom is going to get the chips produced in bulk from the foundry. We believe that all the orders will be shipped by Avalon in close proximity to each other. So, hopefully, the chips ordered today will be shipped at most a week or two after the ships we ordered on May 10 and 16. In that case, our batch 2 orders will start shipping at most 2 weeks after the batch 1.

This is clearly not what we discussed. Terrahash contact us ASAP.

GO HOME, SCAMMERS.

Terrahash opened for pre-orders despite promising not to take a cent up until they have units in stock. Their hand was forced because 10,000, of their 20,000 chip order (paid for) was for an order agreed by Cloud Hashing!

Cloud Hashing jump ship after KnC are proved more legitimate than assumed, and demand their $80,000 back from Terrahash. The order was $105,000 in value, but $80k was needed up front to secure the chips from Avalon that Terrahash went and did.

This left Terrahash $80k out of pocket despite securing premises to assemble and further parts etc. for Cloud Hashing's order.

This forced Terrahash to demand pre-orders, something they promised not to, but had to or face bankruptcy before starting forced upon them by Cloud Hashing.

The community saved Terrahash because Cloud Hashing has no integrity!

http://www.coindesk.com/terrahash-opens-asic-mining-preorders-loses-business/

Led to believe you would get the equipment before June? BS! Cloud Hashing was well aware the deal with Avalon could be delayed as BitSyncom sorted their shit out, as we all have known, but they were happy to jump on board until KnC started looking more legit, then Cooud Hashing dumped Terrahash high and dry whilst making a similar order for something with delivery in September...not June?!

Now, get this it appears Cloud Hashing want back in since Terrahash have had to order another 20k chips to satisfy demand; https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=198489.msg2527527#msg2527527 presumably ahead of the pre-orderers that just saved Terrahash from going under!!

After this, no one should be doing any business with Cloud Hashing period, that's just common sense. Integrity is everything!

This is without the fact Cloud Hashing's business method to their own customers is at best unstusstainable, and at worst knowingly faudulent. With the latter overtly being the case!!

Terrahash customers, Cloud Hashing put you right in this pre-order mess and now they want back in to jump queue, be warned...

Terrahash don't you dare return that call, Cloud hashing almost unceremoniously, and purposely sank your business!

This might also explain why preorder numbers started at 430#, I think the opening preorders are not even close to been in a batch 1 order since someone else (large company) already has dibs on first units.

[pixl8tr]

 Maybe, or they might of been testing the Order system before they unleashed us upon it.