NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[l8orre]

@CfB - to me this looks like a security feature on the testnet. I have been doing this manually, and not really massively, maybe 10 or 15 times over the course of 1 hour.

Is it a bug, or is it a feature

Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/home/azure/workbench/nxtDev/nxTrader/nxtApiSigs.py", line 249, in getBalance_Slot
    self.apiRepl1=requests.get(  self.userData['serverProt'], params = self.apiReq, verify=False)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/api.py", line 55, in get
    return request('get', url, **kwargs)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/api.py", line 44, in request
    return session.request(method=method, url=url, **kwargs)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/sessions.py", line 357, in request
    resp = self.send(prep, **send_kwargs)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/sessions.py", line 460, in send
    r = adapter.send(request, **kwargs)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/adapters.py", line 354, in send
    raise ConnectionError(e)


requests.exceptions.ConnectionError: HTTPConnectionPool(host='holms.cloudapp.net', port=6874): Max retries exceeded with url: /nxt?account=7126304194855053556&requestType=getBalance (Caused by <class 'ConnectionRefusedError'>: [Errno 111] Verbindungsaufbau abgelehnt)

[pinarello]

off topic:

Interesting development at eMunie what I told for months now, and where the whole emunie community accused me and attacked me for is becoming true.

Emunie is now emunie ltd. (yes an compagny) and applied with UK law. A lot of the early community members have left emunie for that reason. So one of the consequences is

they can not run any exchange in the software, etc…

Pin

Didn't find anything on their forum. Do you have a link?

It is not on the public forum, only beta testers can read it (if not deleted)

[Come-from-Beyond]

@CfB - to me this looks like a security feature on the testnet. I have been doing this manually, and not really massively, maybe 10 or 15 times over the course of 1 hour.

Is it a bug, or is it a feature

Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/home/azure/workbench/nxtDev/nxTrader/nxtApiSigs.py", line 249, in getBalance_Slot
    self.apiRepl1=requests.get(  self.userData['serverProt'], params = self.apiReq, verify=False)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/api.py", line 55, in get
    return request('get', url, **kwargs)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/api.py", line 44, in request
    return session.request(method=method, url=url, **kwargs)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/sessions.py", line 357, in request
    resp = self.send(prep, **send_kwargs)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/sessions.py", line 460, in send
    r = adapter.send(request, **kwargs)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/adapters.py", line 354, in send
    raise ConnectionError(e)


requests.exceptions.ConnectionError: HTTPConnectionPool(host='holms.cloudapp.net', port=6874): Max retries exceeded with url: /nxt?account=7126304194855053556&requestType=getBalance (Caused by <class 'ConnectionRefusedError'>: [Errno 111] Verbindungsaufbau abgelehnt)

The testnet is being updated to new version right now. Maybe this caused ur error?

[abctc]

The world is rapidly drifting into a global electronic police state, where anything and everything we do is recorded, analyzed, scrutinized, etc. We used to be able to use normal cash to buy things. Now, cash transactions are prohibited for most things in america. Soon all cash will become illegal. This is normal cash. Without a crypto replacement for cash, the world will be controlled by people who know what everybody else is doing with their money.

- very well said, James!

And I can see that and agree with jl777's thought, it is well said... but would a government agent who supported the NSA agree with that?  Just seems to me like I could see them being unhappy about it and arguing that people who use them have criminal intent or something along those lines.  Can you name some legitimate reasons you'd want some transactions to remain anonymous though?

- yes, I can:

I have a UK account but wouldn't use it. .. Mine was blocked just because I went on a online shopping spree. Had a phone call claiming to be the fraud team ...

- I don't want any phone calls. I want to spend my money as I want, not as NSA or government agent wants.

[pinarello]

[Zahlen]

The possibility to use LaTeX with JavaScript could be put into the www site. I'm not sure of the purpose. As of now the site is not open for contributors other than myself. It might serve your goals better on the forums or wiki where contributors may want to share mathematical expressions. It's a great idea for the right place. I look forward to hearing more!

Yeah I meant the forums. Joefox is including it in the wiki for the whitepaper (we ought to be proving theorems in it, not just writing prose). Math is the foundation of the Nxt protocol, and supporting algorithms like the Reed-Solomon address encoding ricot and nxtchg are working on and which I've helped with. Definitely easier on the eye if we can display it more like math, instead of like English.

I guess you mean the forum is managed by someone else? (adminius?) I somehow equated forum with www in my mind (even though I realize the wiki is also using a nxtcrypto name and run by joefox rather than you). I'll post this in the forum then.

[pinarello]

[img]

Oh oh... what's wrong?  

nothing, just being sarcastic

[pandaisftw]

[img]

Oh oh... what's wrong?  

http://wiki.nxtcrypto.org/wiki/Whitepaper:Nxt#PoW.27s_Resource_Costs

[l8orre]

@CfB - to me this looks like a security feature on the testnet. I have been doing this manually, and not really massively, maybe 10 or 15 times over the course of 1 hour.

Is it a bug, or is it a feature

Traceback (most recent call last):
  File "/home/azure/workbench/nxtDev/nxTrader/nxtApiSigs.py", line 249, in getBalance_Slot
    self.apiRepl1=requests.get(  self.userData['serverProt'], params = self.apiReq, verify=False)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/api.py", line 55, in get
    return request('get', url, **kwargs)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/api.py", line 44, in request
    return session.request(method=method, url=url, **kwargs)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/sessions.py", line 357, in request
    resp = self.send(prep, **send_kwargs)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/sessions.py", line 460, in send
    r = adapter.send(request, **kwargs)
  File "/usr/lib/python3/dist-packages/requests/adapters.py", line 354, in send
    raise ConnectionError(e)


requests.exceptions.ConnectionError: HTTPConnectionPool(host='holms.cloudapp.net', port=6874): Max retries exceeded with url: /nxt?account=7126304194855053556&requestType=getBalance (Caused by <class 'ConnectionRefusedError'>: [Errno 111] Verbindungsaufbau abgelehnt)

The testnet is being updated to new version right now. Maybe this caused ur error?

no big deal anyway - just a funny thing ..

[Zahlen]

And I can see that and agree with jl777's thought, it is well said... but would a government agent who supported the NSA agree with that?

I would think about what I want in Nxt and work towards it. And if govts and the NSA have a problem with that, then I would think about how to deal with them in Nxt.  

"The universe believes in encryption.
It is easier to encrypt information than it is to decrypt it."
   - Julian Assange.

[simpleunit]

I can draw some pictures for NXT.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/23067214/w-3_5.jpg

[BaiMangal]

Any UK Nxt holders? We need to position ourselves to get on Bittylicious to increase liquidity. The ability to purchase Nxt without Bitcoin is a big deal and one we should put some energy towards.

I was hoping somebody else would step up to the plate on this one, but since they haven't. here's my two cents, er, shillings worth.  I have a UK Barclays bank account I use to fund my online poker adventures.  It's a totally legal one in my own name, no funny business; I've filed the correct paperwork on it with the IRS and Department of the Treasury here in the US and even voluntarily gave up the number for it during my last security clearance interview.  I go thru a proxy and look like I'm in London since the online poker sites block me otherwise coming from an American IP address block.  All of these gyrations are due to the 2006 UIEGA anti-online-poker act that was passed here in America, land of the free; but I digress...

Bottom line, I've got the UK bank account but I have no desire to sell any of the NXT I've accumulated.  However, I understand the importance of getting NXT hooked up to Bittylicious so I'm willing to try and help.  If I've got enough public trust built up here, maybe people could dump NXT they wanted to sell into one of my toy NXT accounts, Bittilocious could take it out of that account to give to a buyer, send GBP to my Barclays account, and I could send that back to the original NXT holders via Moneybookers/Skrill (I've also got accounts there, too.)

This would require me to be a trusted middleman, which I'm OK with if you are.  

If we really want to pursue this, let me know, I'll do my part to get NXT rolling in the UK.

As soon as the Decentralized Exchange is released we should have our EUR-NXT gateway ready.. It should give people an option to buy NXT for Euro

[bithic]

After a month of almost daily work I can present you a full text version of the NxtMyths:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwAGADgnQcrtM3g1cU1VSHZtTGM/edit?usp=sharing

New still unpublished chapters - 7. Rich get richer and 8. (no) Innovations over Bitcoin start at the page 25 (actually 8th chapter is only one known table..). There are also some new tables you probably didn't see on previous pages.

Comments are enabled for grammar mistakes. Facts and wrong ideas can be discussed here...

If you think it's worth any donations, feel free to send them to: 15003961341330858247  


Now I can finally switch to the infographics stage   (infographics will mention the NxtMyths paper as a source...)

This paragraph at the bottom of page 25 seems to conflict with the general thrust of the argument it is supporting:

"The person with 1 million Nxt has 100x higher chance to get the transaction fees than
the person with 100 Nxt. He still pays the same electricity. The person with 1 million GPU
miners has 100x higher chance to get Bitcoin block than the person with 100 GPU miners.
But he pays 100x more for the electricity."

You should add: "However, he was able to purchase those 1 million GPU miners at a fraction of the cost per miner than the person who only purchased 100, due to the economies of scale advantage associated with large-scale acquisitions."

This provides a logical connection with the next statement concerning economies of scale.

Also, I don't know anything about this, but do economies of scale also apply to electricity? I.e. is it more efficient/cheaper-per-unit to run 10000 computers than it is to run one?

[GröBkAz]

I can draw some pictures for NXT.

Very nice, it would be an enrichment for the project.

[2Kool4Skewl]

Also, I don't know anything about this, but do economies of scale also apply to electricity? I.e. is it more efficient/cheaper-per-unit to run 10000 computers than it is to run one?

Yes.  If you use a lot of power, you can negotiate with your power company to get cheaper rates.

[NxtChg]

you also have their C++ code?

https://github.com/Zerocoin/libzerocoin

Mom told me to study C++, but I preferred useless stuff like Asm, Basic and Pascal.

That source code is old anyway.

Here's what I could understand from video and reading till 4 in the morning yesterday:

The core of their system is SNARK (Succinct Non-interactive ARgument of Knowledge) - voodoo math that allows others to verify that you actually executed some piece of code, that's why it's so complicated. Everything else is easy: in the new version they just use SHA256 and Merkle tree to store the coins.

So this SNARK thing looks a bit suspicious to me, but that's probably because it's so original and counter-intuitive and I don't even fully understand it yet

Anyway, what they do with it, is create an alternative way for you to prove that you did a chain of SHA256's up to the root.

So you can prove that your coin is somewhere on the tree, without revealing any actual hashes, which would identify on which branch your coin is located.

Gonna drink my coffee and read more.

[bithic]

Also, I don't know anything about this, but do economies of scale also apply to electricity? I.e. is it more efficient/cheaper-per-unit to run 10000 computers than it is to run one?

Yes.  If you use a lot of power, you can negotiate with your power company to get cheaper rates.

Ok, if that's true, then the assumption of linearly increasing electricity costs needs to be corrected as well. Any idea what rate of discount is reasonable? On page 25:

"The person with 1 million Nxt has 100x higher chance to get the transaction fees than
the person with 100 Nxt. He still pays the same electricity. The person with 1 million GPU
miners has 100x higher chance to get Bitcoin block than the person with 100 GPU miners.
But he pays 100x more for the electricity.
However, he was able to purchase those 1 million GPU miners at a fraction of the cost per miner than the person who only purchased 100, and negotiate a discount with his electricity supplier, due to the economies of scale advantage associated with large-scale operations."

And on page 26:

"World of Bitcoin:

- If you have 1000$, you can mine X Btc thanks to the GPU
- If you have 100.000$, you can mine 1000X Btc thanks to some super machine
you buy
- if you have 100x1000$GPU, you get 100X Btc (+ pay 100x minus discount for electrocity electricity)
- if you have 1x100.000$Machine, you get 1000X Btc (+ pay for electrocity electricity)"

After a month of almost daily work I can present you a full text version of the NxtMyths:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwAGADgnQcrtM3g1cU1VSHZtTGM/edit?usp=sharing

Another edit: on page 26 the title "Only PoW is unfair and rich gets richer" would make more sense as "The rich are favored more in PoW than PoS".

[bithic]

you also have their C++ code?

https://github.com/Zerocoin/libzerocoin

Mom told me to study C++, but I preferred useless stuff like Asm, Basic and Pascal.

That source code is old, anyway.

Here's what I could understand from video and reading till 4 in the morning yesterday:

The core of their proof is SNARK (Succinct Non-interactive ARgument of Knowledge) - voodoo math that allows others to verify that you actually executed some piece of code, that's why it's so complicated. Everything else is easy: in new version they just use SHA256 and Merkle tree to store the coins.

So this SNARK thing looks a bit suspicious to me, but that's probably because it's so original and counter-intuitive and I don't even fully understand it yet

Anyway, what they do with it, is create an alternative way for you to prove that you did a chain of SHA256's up to the root.

So you can prove that your coin is somewhere on the tree, without revealing any actual hashes, which would identify on which branch your coin is located.

Gonna drink my coffee and read more.

He also said he hopes people don't invest too much in it at first in case it's flawed. This might give him reason to be cautious about integrating with Nxt before he can prove it works well in a real-world test application.

[Jean-Luc]

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Release 0.5.11

http://download.nxtcrypto.org/nxt-client-0.5.11.zip

sha256: 2157335852e7b5013229f5b73f5f156b1b72a116f8625fc73d4de80a0f7ffa11

Change log:

Fixed performance problems in getState, getEffectiveBalance and
getGuaranteedBalance. The getGuaranteedBalance calculation now
uses a different algorithm and may in some cases give different
results than the 0.5.10 guaranteedBalance calculation which had
some bugs, so it is advisable that everyone upgrades to 0.5.11
to avoid the risk of a fork.

Fixed a bug with setting the public keys of accounts that forged
blocks without having any outgoing transactions.

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[instacalm]

Thank you, Mr. Picard.