NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[jl777]

It seems one of BCNext plans tackles this stuff?

Yes, but he is upset that community doesn't wish to review and develop his ideas. Anon136 is the only one who does.

I think the majority of people here are interested in reviewing and developing his (BCNext) ideas, we just need a little structured guidance, this thread is so massive.

yup. same here. I am barely hanging on with hanging on.

I guess we should head over to https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=364218.0 and discuss our TF ideas.

I fully agree! I am doing my best to create addons as I am not yet fully understanding of TF, so cant really be of value in reviewing. I will push for ideas that TF can hopefully enable.

[jl777]

James, has anyone been successful in contacting anyone from the zerocoin/cash team?

rickyjames has had no luck. I think we need to show them a working NXTcash testnet. talk is cheap, actions speak louder than words

[Come-from-Beyond]

CfB, please object if is NOT ok to start posting there regarding changes to NXTcore like zerocoin.

I don't mind.

P.S. CfB, can we have a "credits" API call? I am thinking that like in the movies, they show credits and it of course starts with BCNext, CfB (+ maybe your devs if they want to come out of shadow), jean-luc, and now Doctor Evil/Jesse James. I have some "Puzzle" bounties I want to offer, and being added to the NXT credits API call would mean far more to the people who are able to solve these tough puzzles. Having that in addition to NXT bounty would maximize results.

Don't include BCNext and me to the credits.

[davethetrousers]

Hi CFB,

I think I've got it now. The final result;

Another extra;

[jl777]

CfB, please object if is NOT ok to start posting there regarding changes to NXTcore like zerocoin.

I don't mind.

P.S. CfB, can we have a "credits" API call? I am thinking that like in the movies, they show credits and it of course starts with BCNext, CfB (+ maybe your devs if they want to come out of shadow), jean-luc, and now Doctor Evil/Jesse James. I have some "Puzzle" bounties I want to offer, and being added to the NXT credits API call would mean far more to the people who are able to solve these tough puzzles. Having that in addition to NXT bounty would maximize results.

Don't include BCNext and me to the credits.

It will lose a lot of prestige value if you are not included. Will you forbid jean-luc from even just listing BCNext on the first line and Come-from-Beyond on the second line? We dont have to have any other text

[marcus03]

I think from your list of possible features "anonymous transactions" would be the killer feature.

Not just the possibility to use some kind of mixing service, but actually changing pseudo anonymity to real anonymity. It is beyond me to say if this is possible, but if it is and gets implemented, NXT will explode (not (just) the price, but adoption, resources and everything else).

+1

And thanks for replying.

Zerocoin is better than plain mixing, making progress

+10

Keep us posted!

[jl777]

Although the Nxt Asset Exchange will be a useful addition I think that we are missing something that could be much more useful (and perhaps a "killer" addition) and that is "atomic cross-chain crypto-currency transfers" (some of you would recall I've already mentioned it).

As far as I can tell no-one has actually built such a system and also so far I can't even tell if such a transfer using TierNolan's approach (https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Atomic_cross-chain_trading) has ever actually been tested (if anyone has a link that shows such a transaction having taken place then I'd be very interested to see it).

IMO this would really be a "game changer" as it could allow people to trade crypto's directly without an exchange and without risk (beyond having to wait for the "refund" problem that is necessary for TierNolan's solution in case the trade doesn't get finalised).

It wouldn't work fast enough to do "day trading" but for those not in a huge rush the promise of 100% secure transactions with only minimal blockchain fees would be pretty appealing.

What do you guys think?

Of course I agree, 100000 NXT bounty attached so solution
I also think another related solution is using AE for all the trading and then we just need decentralized gateways. In some ways that will be more efficient. People can trade crypto to any other crypto using AE and all the deposits (much easier) and withdrawals (much harder) are decentralized, trustless and automated

[Come-from-Beyond]

It will lose a lot of prestige value if you are not included. Will you forbid jean-luc from even just listing BCNext on the first line and Come-from-Beyond on the second line? We dont have to have any other text

I can't prove that BCNext is against any mention of his name in "credits" coz genesis account passphrase is cracked, just believe me. I'm against including my name into the "credits" too.

[jl777]

Why we need crypto-currency

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-25861717

thats bullshit.. your money so you can withdraw what ever you want! id have a shit attack if my bank said i couldnt withdraw my own money in person in the bank.. id understand a few hundred thou or a million but not just a couple thou... there all goin buyin bitcoin from zipzap lol

Yeah, it's scary.  If a well capitalised bank like HSBC is not letting customers withdrawal 7,000, then the finance world is in a really bad state!

That's not a conspiracy theorist article either--- it's BBC!

ya every thing is made out to be fine and dandy an by the time the majority of people find out theres a serious problem, its too late. if i was that guy i would withdraw every penny from his bank accounts even if it ment going into the bank everyday for a week! shits guna hit the fan sometime this year.. i just hope everyone sees it coming and gets out (not guna happen)

edit: BOO YAA in yo face! check mate apple! your move! http://www.cryptocoinsnews.com/2014/02/07/millennius-stops-all-sales-iphones-protest-apple-removal-blockchain-info-ios-app/

cash is slowly becoming illegal, govts want all transactions for everything in a handy database file on all of us
They have made it so USA citizens cant open bank accounts overseas anymore using strong arm tactics to enforce their REGULATIONS onto other countries. The violation of sovereign rights by america is a sign of the desperate means it will go to in order to bury under the rug its inability to pay for the interest on debt. This summer is estimated critical point, though if they sold the Grand Canyon to Disney, maybe they can delay it for a bit. Regardless new regulations will hit this summer that will effectively prevent taking USD out of america. Hence the war on bitcoin via regulations will continue to get worse and worse

[jl777]

doesnt this mean its illegal to sell anything on craigslist? i mean would it be different if someone sold their bicoins on craigslist instead of localbitcoins? are bitcoins legally speaking any different from any other good that you might buy on craigslist?

It's the dollar amount.  They ran up against anti-money laundering laws.

The feds have an amount ($10,000) and states and local jurisdictions may have their own laws on the subject too.

It's a mine-field for those of us in the US.

so then people buying cars for > 10,000 on craigslist are breaking the law?

I don't believe so since a car is a physical good.  It has to do with money-for-money transmission/exchange.

OWOW bitcoin is considered money in the us now?

No, but accepting $10,000 is under money laundering laws.

FC! See you can make useful posts. I am proud of you!!

I do believe if you buy (or sell) a car for $10001 one or both ** could ** be prosecuted to the full extent of law. Such a nice friendly country america is. Come to america, spend you vacation here. Just dont spend too much money!

[jl777]

rofl. i completely missed that thread where i was mentioned like a dozen times

U should monetize ur reputation. If u were a fiat gateway operator for Asset Exchange, u would help the community a lot. I would accept dollars issued by u without any doubt. Think of such a business plz...

Anybody that runs a fiat gateway in USA will be regulated until they stop it. We need somebody who is outside of US jurisdiction and willing to never enter USA, preferably from a country without extradition treaty. I doubt they will go so far as to extradite someone over running a fiat gateway, but you never know...

[jl777]

It will lose a lot of prestige value if you are not included. Will you forbid jean-luc from even just listing BCNext on the first line and Come-from-Beyond on the second line? We dont have to have any other text

I can't prove that BCNext is against any mention of his name in "credits" coz genesis account passphrase is cracked, just believe me. I'm against including my name into the "credits" too.

OK, I believe you. I guess no point for this API call then

[msin]

James, has anyone been successful in contacting anyone from the zerocoin/cash team?

rickyjames has had no luck. I think we need to show them a working NXTcash testnet. talk is cheap, actions speak louder than words

I've reached out to several Zerocoin members; Matthew Green, Ian Miers and Christina Garman.  All of which were personally referred to me by other Professors.  I did receive a response from Matthew about our initial algo review, but nothing more.  I'm not holding high hopes for getting help with Zerocoin from any of their core group.  We need to explore other options.  

[autumnyellow152]

http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/2014-01/27/bitcloud
http://maidsafe.net/

Any new ideas here? Decentralized internet and cloud services based on the (Nxt) platform, coupled  with a currency and a Proof of Work (or Service) system, that gives the users an initiative to provide space and resources?

[Come-from-Beyond]

http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/2014-01/27/bitcloud
http://maidsafe.net/

Any new ideas here? Decentralized internet and cloud services based on the (Nxt) platform, coupled  with a currency and a Proof of Work (or Service) system, that gives the users an initiative to provide space and resources?

Looks similar to Nxt Service Providers.

[EvilDave]

doesnt this mean its illegal to sell anything on craigslist? i mean would it be different if someone sold their bicoins on craigslist instead of localbitcoins? are bitcoins legally speaking any different from any other good that you might buy on craigslist?

It's the dollar amount.  They ran up against anti-money laundering laws.

The feds have an amount ($10,000) and states and local jurisdictions may have their own laws on the subject too.

It's a mine-field for those of us in the US.

so then people buying cars for > 10,000 on craigslist are breaking the law?

I don't believe so since a car is a physical good.  It has to do with money-for-money transmission/exchange.

OWOW bitcoin is considered money in the us now?

No, but accepting $10,000 is under money laundering laws.

FC! See you can make useful posts. I am proud of you!!

I do believe if you buy (or sell) a car for $10001 one or both ** could ** be prosecuted to the full extent of law. Such a nice friendly country america is. Come to america, spend you vacation here. Just dont spend too much money!

That is insane.
What is happening to Charlie Shrem is also crazy:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=435059.0

If that happened in Russia, u can bet your sweet ass that the US gov would immediately call it a politically motivated and malicious arrest.

[jl777]

Here is my idea for avoiding blockchain bloat while doing 1000TPS. I am surprised nobody mentioned this, so it is either because it is a really bad idea for some reason, or too obvious nobody bothered??

From my understanding, it will be possible to have regular snapshots of the entire state of the NXT blockchain so that you wont need to parse all the blocks from genesis.

Secondly, very little of this "entire state of NXT" data has a life beyond 1440 blocks.

So, my proposal is to generate a daily snapshot, peer reviewed by nodes, checksummed, fingerprinted, signatured, whatever we need to make sure it is a valid unmolested snapshot. We actually dont even need these snapshots, but while we are doing this, might as well avoid having to download the entire blockchain. Bandwidth savings alone makes it worthwhile.

OK, so one way or another, let us assume the node is current. Now the problem is keeping up with 1000TPS (lets make the overall network adaptive so we can handle bursts of 1000TPS, sustained 250 TPS) and that requires bandwidth, though with binary data, 250 TPS should be around what 100TPS will be now. So 100kbps would be enough to handle bursts of 1000TPS and sustained 250TPS

But where does all that data go?

Actually, I say just throw it away! Why can't we use a FIFO that stores the most recent 1441 blocks for all the blockchains (when we go parallel). Since we synced the the full blockchain with the last days checkpoint, then as long as we are properly updating the "entire state of NXT network" at any given block, we are able to forge a valid block.

Unless I totally missed some reason why we need to locally store more than the last 1441 blocks, this should work. We can then specify that any NXT VM (Turing scripts) will need to be designed to use only data from prior 1440 blocks. This I do not see as a big limitation as if it is really important the client issuing script can just get data it needs and put it into AM. So, the NXTcore would need to implement the FIFO, preferably based on a web.xml parameter. That would allow people who run NXT VM generating clients to have access to exactly the window of time they need.

I hope this puts useful forging back on the table for raspis. 100kbps to fully support 1000TPS (peak output) NXT network

James

[jl777]

James, has anyone been successful in contacting anyone from the zerocoin/cash team?

rickyjames has had no luck. I think we need to show them a working NXTcash testnet. talk is cheap, actions speak louder than words

I've reached out to several Zerocoin members; Matthew Green, Ian Miers and Christina Garman.  All of which were personally referred to me by other Professors.  I did receive a response from Matthew about our initial algo review, but nothing more.  I'm not holding high hopes for getting help with Zerocoin from any of their core group.  We need to explore other options.  

The option I chose was to push forward on our own as fast as we can!

[msin]

James, has anyone been successful in contacting anyone from the zerocoin/cash team?

rickyjames has had no luck. I think we need to show them a working NXTcash testnet. talk is cheap, actions speak louder than words

I've reached out to several Zerocoin members; Matthew Green, Ian Miers and Christina Garman.  All of which were personally referred to me by other Professors.  I did receive a response from Matthew about our initial algo review, but nothing more.  I'm not holding high hopes for getting help with Zerocoin from any of their core group.  We need to explore other options.  

The option I chose was to push forward on our own as fast as we can!

We need to get someone on it asap.  Maybe we should have a bounty list somewhere, we need to post link to all open bounties easily.  The mixing solution will get at least 2Mil Nxt, that should be attractive to someone.

[Fern]

http://www.wired.co.uk/news/archive/2014-01/27/bitcloud
http://maidsafe.net/

Any new ideas here? Decentralized internet and cloud services based on the (Nxt) platform, coupled  with a currency and a Proof of Work (or Service) system, that gives the users an initiative to provide space and resources?

I live up the road from Kim Dot Com and he's very approachable. Perhaps he could play a role.