[ANN][WOLF] Project WOLF

[InsanityDev]

everything depends on what happens after week 9, if something at all.

otherwise, it will be a game of musical chairs.

see the big "important read" read link on the ANN..

[mmihai1978]

i have read the announcement; this is why i have made the point above.

the proposal clearly needs more; just keeping the coin alive after the 9 weeks is not enough.  
scarcity and rarity are not value drivers.

just my 0.02 wolf

[greentea]

everything depends on what happens after week 9, if something at all.

otherwise, it will be a game of musical chairs.

see the big "important read" read link on the ANN..

so after 9 weeks the 10% fee is taken away?

Also, it'd be nice to post on the first page the coins outstanding after each week...

[hammer1]

i'm up 12% on 0.7 BTC.

i would like to hear some volumes to match these nice increases mentioned above. I would not risk 10 btc in repeated trading; exit may be really difficult, unless lucky.

To be stuck with wolf bought higher than 0.001 is not my idea of fun, unless i am the dev; and i am not the dev.

I started with around 4100 WOLF. Sold those all in the .0011 - .001155 range. Rebought about 7000 WOLF during the game from .00102-.00107 and sold those from between .00105 - .001175. Ended up with a fair amount I did not sell (but bought at .00102, so a 2% premium over what I will buy from the dev tomorrow) but overall am back to over 5000 WOLF (assuming I exchange my remaining BTC for WOLF for next week), for a gain of around 23%.

example of what I did during the game:
2014-03-09 22:12:25   Sell   0.00105   537.87191936   0.56476551
2014-03-09 22:11:32   Sell   0.00105   1000.65528339   1.05068804
2014-03-09 19:40:37   Sell   0.0011   326.96055958   0.35965661
2014-03-09 19:39:47   Sell   0.00109   1494   1.62846
2014-03-09 19:30:38   Sell   0.0010751   998   1.0729498
2014-03-09 19:29:43   Buy   0.001021   1000   1.021
2014-03-09 19:23:54   Buy   0.00106   1000   1.06
2014-03-09 19:21:37   Buy   0.00103   1000   1.03
2014-03-09 19:21:37   Buy   0.001021   1000   1.021
2014-03-09 19:19:34   Sell   0.00114   10   0.0114
2014-03-09 19:19:26   Sell   0.00114   178.244756   0.20319902
2014-03-09 19:17:29   Buy   0.001052   188.622   0.19843034
2014-03-09 18:54:54   Sell   0.001175   1498   1.76015
2014-03-09 18:54:41   Sell   0.001175   500   0.5875
2014-03-09 18:54:15   Buy   0.00107   500   0.535
2014-03-09 18:54:15   Buy   0.00106   140.5   0.14893
2014-03-09 18:54:09   Buy   0.00106   249.5   0.26447
2014-03-09 18:54:05   Buy   0.00106   110   0.1166

Not perfect but some decent profits there. Obviously not as good as last week (was up around 35% but I wasn't around for the game and could not be active just relied on preset sell orders from the night before) or the 1st week (up around 60% I believe) but still some good returns. And should still be some going forward.

[domtasc3]

i'm up 12% on 0.7 BTC.

i would like to hear some volumes to match these nice increases mentioned above. I would not risk 10 btc in repeated trading; exit may be really difficult, unless lucky.

To be stuck with wolf bought higher than 0.001 is not my idea of fun, unless i am the dev; and i am not the dev.

I started with 3670 wolf today and ended with 5842 from playing the swings. It's worth the risk to buy back in for .00102 even though I got "stuck" with .00102 coins I traded back and forth enough to gain 62%. Reward of buying 2% higher than normal price and trading multiple times far outweighs the risk.

[flo_k]

I admit that , given the time that the game takes place , I constantly fail to focus on it...
But I wonder who and where in the world are those who succeed. Let's see :
- in Europe (where I am ) it's Sunday evening , when most people spend time with families or friends, not to mention the usual drinks .
(as for me, I missed the entire event last night being with my wife and chidren to see a movie)
- on the American continent is Sunday at noon , people are at lunch with the family (or preparing for it ) .
- for the Chinese and Australians is even worse, because it's early Monday morning and people should sleep before going to work (or study).
So, nowhere seems to be too easy for "normal" people.
I begin to understand now the true meaning of the coin's name: this game is suited only for those that love the taste of blood (read "trading") more than any other things, just like WOLVES  

 

[gtac01]

i have read the announcement; this is why i have made the point above.

the proposal clearly needs more; just keeping the coin alive after the 9 weeks is not enough.  
scarcity and rarity are not value drivers.

just my 0.02 wolf

I suggest you guys look at PMC (preminecoin). I got some PMC for free the first day that i ended up selling for 2 btc on poloniex a few weeks later. After the insanity phase, WOLF will be like PMC .

[claudespe]

To be honest, as a market noob, I didn't catch very well the dev strategy and how to take advantage of it.
Just took a small but still nice 12,5% in one shot...

As a post-event teaching, could someone (or dev himself) gently explain what happened this Sunday?

Thanks  

[flo_k]

As a post-event teaching, could someone (or dev himself) gently explain what happened this Sunday?

+1
And, if possible, in english

[Philll90]

Is the WOLF supply open?
Want to invest some but I don't see an address, where I can send my BTC.

[flo_k]

PM to dev

[MsCollec]

For the past 2 weeks, I didn't sell nothing during insanity Sunday. Either I was away from the computer or still waiting for the dev to buy my sell order at 0.004 well at least I'm helping to destroy the coins 

[InsanityDev]

So glad to see you discussing things!

Week 3
Albert Einstein called compound interest ".. the eighth wonder of the world. He who understands it, earns it ... he who doesn't ... pays it".
He didn't really say that, but it's quoted a lot in various forms.

I short, this week I provided a volatile fluctuating market, with prices swinging from base to 5%, 10%, 15%+ forwards and backwards over a few hours.

From my perspective, this allowed me to acquire more WOLF cheaper, even if I had to take a hit on some trades where people were playing the spread, it forced people in to dumping lower, lowering my average acquisition cost massively.

From a traders perspective, if they were active and playing the spread or watching the price movements, they could perform several trades to grow their balances, similar to how compound interest works.

Working with fixed variable of buying at 0.001 and selling at 0.0011 five times in a row, and starting with 1000 WOLF.
Trade 1: Sell 1000 for 1.1 BTC, re buy 1100 WOLF
Trade 2: Sell 1100 for 1.21 BTC, re buy 1210 WOLF
Trade 3: Sell 1210 for 1.331 BTC, re buy 1331 WOLF
Trade 4: Sell 1331 for 1.4641 BTC, re buy 1464.1 WOLF
Trade 5: Sell 1464.1 for 1.1 BTC = 1.61051 BTC or 1610.51 WOLF

So whilst the market only went up 10% in our example, the trader earned 61.05% profit with 5 very simple trades.

Consider this trader did this for the last 3 weeks in a row, the same 5 trades. At the end of week 2 he'd have ~2593, week 3: ~4177.
For the sake of interest, week 9: ~72,890 - yes that is the correct figure, almost 7200% gain if the coin has not gone up in value.. if it has even doubled in value then that's nearer 15000%).

Week 2
This simply demonstrated what happens when everybody rushes for a coin seeking a large gain, they force each other lower, jam up the order book so that even a whale can't move it, and ultimately force many people in to a loss. You may recognise this pattern from most coins you've ever bought that have been "pumping" (allegedly).

Future
Ultimately you all need to learn to hold your ground, to trust that a coin is worth something, if you all believe it is, it simply will be, or even if most of you do.
Each week you know 100 BTC is going in to the market, why be so keen to let go of your WOLF? If you can buy 1000 for 1 BTC, and sell 1 for 1 BTC, do you not have 999 WOLF free, which you can sell at literally any price to make a profit? If you see somebody has placed an order lower than yours, why move lower still, move higher so the low order moves higher too, or leave them alone to get swallowed up for cheap. Remember your numbers though, you can't just keep putting all your coin on the market at a higher price as together you'll all be asking for so much BTC that nobody could move it, and also force your fellow traders to start going lower again.

All of this applies to every coin, successful "pumps" happen because the large coin holders clear the order book of sell orders, you'll notice that the coins which go up the highest have lots bought cheap, then hardly anything on offer for anybody else, frequently only 1-2% of coins in circulation are on the market, allowing the price to rise easily, stabilize high, then the sell start happening (the dump) - a dump wipes the price back down, a slow steady sell of only what you need to keeps the price going higher or roughly stable. This would never happen if the orderbook was full would it? you've seen those coins with lots of sell orders where it dies (check CORG, or check COL for something which is locked at a stale mate).

WOLF This 9 week game is a novel distribution phase, you who are playing are the ones who will and do hold 100% of the coin, you together control it's price, and your own profits, both short and long term. I hope you can make some short term profit each week to either get out with some BTC, or to be holding a decent amount of WOLF which you've lowered your overall purchase price for over the weeks, or even just holding free wolf having taken out your original investment. I also really hope you learn to value the coin(s) you hold, to not let them go too easily, and to start making larger profits on more stable markets - and of course hopefully WOLF will be one of them. I hold ~6000 as you all know, and I'd really like 9 weeks of work, and several months of feature additions after to be worth a bit more than 6 BTC at the end.. but that's all in your hands, and mine a bit I guess.

[gubutou]

Look forward to you giving us more surprises! Wait and see!

[caiql005]

this week  BTC Pot is?today~

[claudespe]

Very interesting review.
Thanks a lot.

[TheWhale]

I think if we all planned our own pump hours before the official insanity sunday pump, everyone (except the dev) would benefit. Because the more coin we buy, the higher the dev needs to buy so we will always be profiting. For example, if I clear out the orderbook to 0.0012 I know I will make a profit as there is a guaranteed 100 BTC pump incoming. That kind of assurance is a luxury exclusive to WOLF, why not use it?

[flo_k]

From a traders perspective, if they were active and playing the spread or watching the price movements, they could perform several trades to grow their balances, similar to how compound interest works.

Working with fixed variable of buying at 0.001 and selling at 0.0011 five times in a row, and starting with 1000 WOLF.

Theoretically this is very correct, but in practice it's very hard to make sure that after you sell at 0.0011, you will find to buy at 0.001, especially when a whale is near you and methodically cleans all the cheap sell orders

But there is something that I can't understand in your trade list: at minute 06:54:00 (for example) you sold a lot of wolf between 0.001-0.00107 and, at the same time, bought another lot between 0.00154-0.001175. What was your reason to sell cheap and buy expensive?
If, by selling cheap, your goal was to decrease the market price, I think that your best next move would have been to buy your own cheap orders - seems the ideal way to reach the goal without losing anything.
But buying, instead, higher orders would increase back the market price, annihilating your first move and also making a loss for you. So, where is the gain?!
Or have you acted this way just to encourage other traders to play more active and to make the game more funny (as you promised)?

[illiki23]

I will not divulge my strategy until after the game is over, but I am currently up 620%

[InsanityDev]

But there is something that I can't understand in your trade list: at minute 06:54:00 (for example) you sold a lot of wolf between 0.001-0.00107 and, at the same time, bought another lot between 0.00154-0.001175. What was your reason to sell cheap and buy expensive?
If, by selling cheap, your goal was to decrease the market price, I think that your best next move would have been to buy your own cheap orders - seems the ideal way to reach the goal without losing anything.
But buying, instead, higher orders would increase back the market price, annihilating your first move and also making a loss for you. So, where is the gain?!
Or have you acted this way just to encourage other traders to play more active and to make the game more funny (as you promised)?

I was hoping to achieve three things:
1) Open up a spread in which the active traders could trade more freely
2) Make the game more fun
3) Slowly move the price up in a rolling fashion, I'd partly hoped more people had brought btc on the day or were actively trading and would put up buy orders also.

Failing that though, a goal was to have a sentiment among traders or "somebody dumped low but the dev is still buying, it's not over yet, I won't sell low" (which would lead to them placing sell orders and jamming up the sell side again if no weight was added to the buy side).

As a private trader, I frequently place orders to re buy everything I've sold at a price point lower, so if I sell at 0.0011, 0.0012, 0.0013, I will place buy orders at 0.00105, 0.00115, 0.00125, this keeps the price moving upwards, and ensures I make a gain even if a dump happens. I'd hoped to see some of this on insanity sunday, adding weight to the buy side which garners buy support and lifts the price higher.

btc pot at 62 for this week so far