GAW / Josh Garza discussion Paycoin XPY xpy.io ION ionomy. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :)

[bumpershot]

What I am seeing here is that you are allowing BTC loans with XPY at current value as collateral, and then paying back the loan (after default) with XPY at the new current rate (always lower). That = ability to short XPY. That sir, is completely insane.

I'd take advantage of this, but it's not worth the risk that these BTCLend people will just cut and run after a "hack" or whatever before they actually issue the loan.

Yeah, this guy is talking in circles and makes no sense.

[Paul Revere]

@cmilian: The complete idiocy of this plan boggles the mind, I can now see why you are targeting the fools who are deeply invested in Paycoin. What you are doing is offering every XPY bagholder an opportunity to cash in on today's XPY value, which can usually be moved 20-30% with a couple thousand dollars. SO, they pump up the XPY price (or better yet, let others do it- like Friday), get the loan at the current inflated value, and then let your investors hold the bag after the market deflates from the pump, along with the usual downward trajectory of XPY that will occur during the life of the loan. Then you factor in that there are people holding so much XPY (MILLIONS-literally) that they have no idea what to do with it and this is a sure way to find failure for your investors. Fucking Brilliant. And yes, I chose that word quite carefully because it fits perfectly. Add on top of that the fact that you openly admit to being a large holder of an "investment" in XPY that plummets in value every day (And the "company" you are CEO of is designed to make it dive more) and we have pure Paycoin Idiocy in one neat package.

[suchmoon]

1. They use X amount of XPY as collateral and a virtual lock goes to those XPY in their wallet. (we don't hold their wallet, these are at third parties)

Who are the third parties and how can we verify that information? i.e. your collateral reserves.

[cmilian]

Has any of you ever looked into btclend because I just requested that they delete my account and they acted up like garza they gave me shit like yeah wait until we relase our new stuff but you cant use it anyway etc they even threatened to release my documents to authorities for false accusations against them they did that after confirming me that they deleted everything

That BTCLend thing is shady as hell. I doubt they have the proper licenses etc to do what they are doing, which essentially falls under banking regulations here in the US. I know sites like LendingClub spent years trying to do P2P lending in fiat, and still don't have it available in all states. Now this site pops up, owned by some questionable individual, and offers BTC loans with cashtakers as collateral... yeah right, I'm sure authorities would like to talk to them.

Hi Guys, this Carmelo. BTCLend CEO. Feel free to PM me if you have any questions. Or at lease let me know if asking on a wild thread. Let's try to avoid the general practice of flaming people without basis. I am happy to answer ALL of your questions and concerns. Let's start with, we do not deal with FIAT. We are an independent company owned by 3 partners. None associated with GAW. We do not point fingers thou. We are pro XPY because we are heavy invested. However our priority is BTC.

Feel free to reach out to me anytime! Ask me anything at all.
I will answer all questions given no one is insulting or offending anyone.  

I do not believe you are taking any risk in Paycoin.  I think you are just riding the wave of interest and have found a way to profit from it.  When Paycoin falls to zero satoshis you will have zero liability in Paycoin just like you have now.  This is just my opinion.  You can prove me wrong. Collateral is always a borrower option. Not madatory to get loans. They can ust go about getting non collateral loans. However, as an investor I am sure you will invest faster in a collateral base loan instead of in a trusted base loan.

Like I said, I am invested, meaning that I hold coin. I rather not works towards damaging XPY if I own XPY, just comon sense in my book. And yes, you are correct. It may end up being zero and I may lose all my XPY. What does that have to do with the integrity of BTCLend? That is the part I don't understand. Just because I did an investment that may turn into something or it may turn into nothing it does not mean that I do not have integrity or that I am running a shady business.

One quick thing,about the guy saying that he requested to be deleted. One thing I have learned is that there are LOTS and LOTS of scammers in the crypto arena. Therefor, if a guys from Helibronn send me an email asking for his account to be deleted, claiming that its because I am associated with GAW (for the record, we are not associated with GAW, We support Paycoin) it raises flags intermediately. Maybe he is trying to erase his tracks, maybe he has multiple accounts and has scammed an investor and wants to be removed?  Who know, so we proceed to delete any open loans he has and delete him from BTCLend. However, we will hold his documentation for a period of time just in case he is linked to a scam in the coming days. If he send me a notarized letter to the address posted in the website. I will gladly deleted all his documents since the notarized document serves as prove of identity.

We are here to make BTCLending Safe for our investors. We only have happy customers so far and no one can claim they have lost BTC or gotten scam.

About riding the wave. Not sure how, the only thing we are doing so far as to help XPY holders is allowing them to use it as the current value for collateral. This adds more security to the loans they take. We will be doing the same thing in the next couple of days for a BTC Mining company. Their users will be able to use their mining contracts as collateral. It just about adding an extra layer of trust to the loan.

Just to say something positive, you have a fancy website. 

I just think if you are truly here to be this major player in Paycoin and want Paycoin to succeed then these are the things you will do:

1.  Hold large amounts of Paycoin and have proof on the blockchain.
2.  Call for the elimination of the pre-mine and ousting Josh Garza from anything to do with Paycoin.
3.  Call for major fixes to the wallet and the code that is currently not maintained.

My understanding to your question.

1. We hold Paycoin, we are 3 of us. I am the one that hold the least. Only 2500 XPY. I dont think I should disclose the others XPY amount, thats up to them. Thats their financials. I am not buying more XPY or BTC for now. When I do, it will be invested in BTC. For now I rather put that in my kids college tuition.
2. Last thing I hear, some coins were destroyed and there is a plan to destroy more. Out of my control thou. I do not belong to the XPY team and have do pull in there. Josh is no longer controllin XPY, XPY is now in the hands of the Paycoin foundation. And they are not associated with Josh.
3. XPY Foundation took over the coin in the last one or two weeks. They now hold the management of the code and will be doing just that.

[cmilian]

What I am seeing here is that you are allowing BTC loans with XPY at current value as collateral, and then paying back the loan (after default) with XPY at the new current rate (always lower). That = ability to short XPY. That sir, is completely insane.

I'd take advantage of this, but it's not worth the risk that these BTCLend people will just cut and run after a "hack" or whatever before they actually issue the loan.

Yeah, this guy is talking in circles and makes no sense.

We have sustained a few attacks already. We do not hold coins. We use Coinbase integration. We do not want to Hold coins. Where are the circles I am talking? is there a question I have not answered? Wow!

[cmilian]

@cmilian: The complete idiocy of this plan boggles the mind, I can now see why you are targeting the fools who are deeply invested in Paycoin. What you are doing is offering every XPY bagholder an opportunity to cash in on today's XPY value, which can usually be moved 20-30% with a couple thousand dollars. SO, they pump up the XPY price (or better yet, let others do it- like Friday), get the loan at the current inflated value, and then let your investors hold the bag after the market deflates from the pump, along with the usual downward trajectory of XPY that will occur during the life of the loan. Then you factor in that there are people holding so much XPY (MILLIONS-literally) that they have no idea what to do with it and this is a sure way to find failure for your investors. Fucking Brilliant. And yes, I chose that word quite carefully because it fits perfectly. Add on top of that the fact that you openly admit to being a large holder of an "investment" in XPY that plummets in value every day (And the "company" you are CEO of is designed to make it dive more) and we have pure Paycoin Idiocy in one neat package.

Paycoin as Collateral is only one of the collateral options that will be available. As an investor, Do you rather do trusted based only loans? Is that safer?

Also, how are the XPY holders a target? Please explain.

[Paul Revere]

@cmilian: The complete idiocy of this plan boggles the mind, I can now see why you are targeting the fools who are deeply invested in Paycoin. What you are doing is offering every XPY bagholder an opportunity to cash in on today's XPY value, which can usually be moved 20-30% with a couple thousand dollars. SO, they pump up the XPY price (or better yet, let others do it- like Friday), get the loan at the current inflated value, and then let your investors hold the bag after the market deflates from the pump, along with the usual downward trajectory of XPY that will occur during the life of the loan. Then you factor in that there are people holding so much XPY (MILLIONS-literally) that they have no idea what to do with it and this is a sure way to find failure for your investors. Fucking Brilliant. And yes, I chose that word quite carefully because it fits perfectly. Add on top of that the fact that you openly admit to being a large holder of an "investment" in XPY that plummets in value every day (And the "company" you are CEO of is designed to make it dive more) and we have pure Paycoin Idiocy in one neat package.

Paycoin as Collateral is only one of the collateral options that will be available. As an investor, Do you rather do trusted based only loans? Is that safer?

NO. Why not trust based loans secured with collateral? THAT makes the most sense from the lenders point of view. Taking loans based on some shit stain, easily manipulated, Monopoly money that certain individuals have an infinite supply of as collateral is just plain old fucking STUPID. Anyone who invests in your scheme (including you) deserves to get ripped off, because that is exactly what they are signing up for.

[cmilian]

In summary:

• We are a peer to peer lending company just like BTCJam but with the Collateral Factor.
• We use Coinbase integration so that we don't hold coins. We do not want to hold coins.
• We will integrate many partners that will bring collateral to BTCLoans, Some collateral will always be more stable than others, as in your bank. Your home can be use as collateral, the bank may lose or may gain. Your home may go up and down in value
• Our goal is to protect you as an investor of BTC. This is why banks use collateral and this is why we wanted to integrate it.

We are available via our support links at any time for real and honest questions. There are a lot of smart people here. Its always good to get your feedback and it can only make us better.

[cmilian]

Let's assume you're not a scammer, and I'll walk through an example.

Let's say I have 2,000,000 XPY. Let's say XPY = .002 BTC today.

So, I send you 1,000,000 XPY and get 2,000 BTC.

Then, I sell 1,000,000 XPY on the market, which sends the price to .... well, practically to zero. Let's be generous and say that there's a million for sale around .00001 BTC.

Then I take 10 BTC, buy 1,000,000 XPY from desperate people, and pay back the loan.

You're out 1,990 BTC. I'm 1,990 BTC richer.

In a shallow market, how can you possibly avoid losing money?

1. You do not send me any XPY. You just authorize for your XPY to be locked from getting sold until loan is paid off.
2. You don't pay back with XPY. You borrow BTC, you pay back BTC. XPY is there only as a security blanket in case you don't pay.

Why would you go thru all that trouble. You can just got to BTCJam and run with anyone's 10 BTC.

Remember at BTCLend you will get verified before you take a loan. Again, We aim to protect investors. Its a peer to peer lending business.

You are stuck in XPY, XPY is distracting your view of BTCLend. It isjust a variable to be used or not used.

[maildir]

Which one are you the CEO of?

http://search.sunbiz.org/Inquiry/CorporationSearch/SearchResults?InquiryType=OfficerRegisteredAgentName&inquiryDirectionType=PreviousList&searchNameOrder=MILIANCARMELO%20L110000928701&SearchTerm=Milian&entityId=L11000092870&listNameOrder=MILIANCARMELO%20L110000928701


What's the registered company name that you are the CEO of?

http://search.sunbiz.org/Inquiry/CorporationSearch/ByName

[bumpershot]

You set an interest rate based on the value of the collateral, right? Otherwise, why have it? So does the interest rate change as the value of XPY changes if you're using that as collateral on the loan?

Because this could work if it's all variable interest rate based on the value of XPY.

[cmilian]

Which one are you the CEO of?

http://search.sunbiz.org/Inquiry/CorporationSearch/SearchResults?InquiryType=OfficerRegisteredAgentName&inquiryDirectionType=PreviousList&searchNameOrder=MILIANCARMELO%20L110000928701&SearchTerm=Milian&entityId=L11000092870&listNameOrder=MILIANCARMELO%20L110000928701


What's the registered company name that you are the CEO of?

http://search.sunbiz.org/Inquiry/CorporationSearch/ByName

Wrong place to search. Its BTCLend, LLC in Delaware.

https://delecorp.delaware.gov/eCorp/LoginAnnualReportsCLF


It another example of how if I was not here someone would post something like this and intermediately call it a scam. Why not ask and get it provided instead of implying?

[FUBAR-BDHR]

How to fix paycoin

1.  create a mandatory update for the wallet that blacklists all exchanges except paybase.
2.  don't allow any value under $20.00 to be entered on paybase.

So simple

[cmilian]

How to fix paycoin

1.  create a mandatory update for the wallet that blacklists all exchanges except paybase.
2.  don't allow any value under $20.00 to be entered on paybase.

So simple

Hold it there Fidel

[cmilian]

You set an interest rate based on the value of the collateral, right? Otherwise, why have it? So does the interest rate change as the value of XPY changes if you're using that as collateral on the loan?

Because this could work if it's all variable interest rate based on the value of XPY.

Actually, the interest is set by the borrower. Its up to the investor to accept. we expect for the market to dictate that thou. Obviously low interest loans take longer to get funded.

[maildir]

Which one are you the CEO of?

http://search.sunbiz.org/Inquiry/CorporationSearch/SearchResults?InquiryType=OfficerRegisteredAgentName&inquiryDirectionType=PreviousList&searchNameOrder=MILIANCARMELO%20L110000928701&SearchTerm=Milian&entityId=L11000092870&listNameOrder=MILIANCARMELO%20L110000928701


What's the registered company name that you are the CEO of?

http://search.sunbiz.org/Inquiry/CorporationSearch/ByName

Wrong place to search. Its BTCLend, LLC in Delaware.

https://delecorp.delaware.gov/eCorp/LoginAnnualReportsCLF


It another example of how if I was not here someone would post something like this and intermediately call it a scam. Why not ask and get it provided instead of implying?

https://delecorp.delaware.gov/tin/GINameSearch.jsp?frmFileNumber=

THIS IS NOT A STATEMENT OF GOOD STANDING

[cmilian]

Which one are you the CEO of?

http://search.sunbiz.org/Inquiry/CorporationSearch/SearchResults?InquiryType=OfficerRegisteredAgentName&inquiryDirectionType=PreviousList&searchNameOrder=MILIANCARMELO%20L110000928701&SearchTerm=Milian&entityId=L11000092870&listNameOrder=MILIANCARMELO%20L110000928701


What's the registered company name that you are the CEO of?

http://search.sunbiz.org/Inquiry/CorporationSearch/ByName

Wrong place to search. Its BTCLend, LLC in Delaware.

https://delecorp.delaware.gov/eCorp/LoginAnnualReportsCLF


It another example of how if I was not here someone would post something like this and intermediately call it a scam. Why not ask and get it provided instead of implying?

KInd of hard to be in bad standing after just 1.5 months up isnt it?

I just paid 10 Dollars to see it and It said good standing but it also said not a certificate. To get a certificate I will need to send $50 and a letter in writing or will get it in tax submit. We are just 1 month and a half old.

So if someone here wants to pay the $10 and get a screenshot and paste it here I will pay you in BTC right back.

Let it be a trusted member of your community, not one looking to edit a document and mess with us.

https://delecorp.delaware.gov/tin/GINameSearch.jsp?frmFileNumber=

THIS IS NOT A STATEMENT OF GOOD STANDING

Please don't be getting 100 Screenshots and have me pay 100 times 10 BTC. If you are to do this, discuss and do it right.

[maildir]

Are any of these you, assorted IT, software companies? This page and the next page:

http://search.sunbiz.org/Inquiry/CorporationSearch/SearchResults?InquiryType=OfficerRegisteredAgentName&inquiryDirectionType=PreviousList&searchNameOrder=MILIANCARMELO%20L110000928701&SearchTerm=Milian&entityId=L11000092870&listNameOrder=MILIANCARMELO%20L110000928701

[maildir]

KInd of hard to be in bad standing after just 1.5 months up isnt it?

Incorporation Date / Formation Date: 12/02/2014

[cmilian]

Are any of these you, assorted IT, software companies? This page and the next page:

http://search.sunbiz.org/Inquiry/CorporationSearch/SearchResults?InquiryType=OfficerRegisteredAgentName&inquiryDirectionType=PreviousList&searchNameOrder=MILIANCARMELO%20L110000928701&SearchTerm=Milian&entityId=L11000092870&listNameOrder=MILIANCARMELO%20L110000928701

Onsetready was. Used it for mobile development projects. I was Working for Microsoft back then and since I was building my own Windows Phone apps I wanted to keep them separated. No longer a company.