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Thank you for the confirmation, Giancarlo.
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is it a fact that our chips have been sold elsewhere?
They probably are not in shipping (like, in a plane, or in customs) when we can request a refund, right? Or some groups would receive both the chips and the refund. And since evidence exists that those chips were produced.. Ente |
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stopp loss is a market order executed after trigger, which is the top price in order book, so you would sell most of the 1000 under the price of 123
Makes sense, thank you. Ente |
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Woah, 82A!
..behalte ich mal im Hinterkopf! :-)
/subscribier
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Puh.. langsam wirds unübersichtlich! :-)
Eines wundert mich: Wenn Yifu nicht von Anfang an nur Sch..wachsinn gequatscht hat (was ich nicht glaube), sind ja schon viele viele Pakete unterwegs, aber irgendwo hängengeblieben. Davon werden ja sicher welche nach einer Weile doch noch ankommen, wenn der Zoll alles geklärt hat etc. Dann werden doch einige 10k Pakete ankommen, die schon längst refundet sind?
Die Chips, die schon unterwegs sind, werden sich ja nicht in Luft auflösen!
Oder bin ich doch zu Naiv?
Na, ich hoffe mal mein Popkornvorrat langt noch übers Wochenende!
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The cost to reach the "break even point" is based on current cost so I don't find it too useful, because cost will decline significantly. The network will approach a small margin below the break even point.
I've always assumed that, in the short-to-medium term, the equilibrium point will be on the wrong side of breakeven, due to optimism bias in the purchase decisions. It's true it wouldn't make much financial sense to continue to mine under those circumstances, but there are other reasons to hash than profit, and even the people who were in it purely for the money will find other ways to justify their purchases to themselves. roy I agree. They may have put a lot of money into the hardware, maybe even more than they should have afforded. With no money left, they simply can't shut down mining and buy bitcoins directly. So it could be "exchanging electricity-money to bitcoins". Expecting the price to rise is easy when you are a bull anyway and invested in hardware. So this dip is just temporary. And finally, noone likes to accept to have made a mistake. ..not even talking about parents paying for electricity, or the landlord splitting the bill among several flats.. Ente |
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Thank you all, I don't think I have any reason to not trust Bitfinex. I don't know how experienced you are, Tamis. I would suggest to trade with 10% of your Bitcoins only, for a start. And maybe with a token amount only until you figure out how all those functions work. They are all well documented, but you still has to wrap your head around them. And then there are details, like for example "what lending gets automatically closed when I sell?" which you simply have to try out. With 0.01 BTC for example.
So, no, I don't see BitFinex as the risk here, we ourselves are the risk for our Bitcoins ;-)
Seeing how bullish the market is I don't think I really risk anything at the time being ! I went to Bitfinex to get stop orders I couldn't use on Bitstamp. I entered at 86$ stop is a 123ish. Nice! :-) Question about stop-loss in general: Lets say I have a large volume margin position, and enter a stop loss. When exactly is it executed? Like, for example, stop loss at 123, at a volume of 1000 BTC? There would not be enough volume at 123. Would the system start at 126 BTC/USD exchange rate, so it closed the position when reaching 123? Or would it start closing at 123, which might not finish selling until the exchange rate dropped to 120? Ente |
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On another note:
Here we go again! Currently 87% yearly interest is paid for USD lendings.
This will rise even more soon.
People, get your USD in here! :-)
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?!? Ist ein Urheberrechtsverstoß - Artikel ist aus dem kostenpflichtigem PDF Hab deswegen auch meins extra nicht gescannt, war klar es gibt hier nachher noch Ärger... Ja, sicher, wenn man es genau nimmt haben wir nicht die Publikationsrechte. Andererseits ist es ja nicht so, dass wir das ganze Heft einscannen, irgendwo hochladen und alle bescheit sagen "hey, kauft nicht das Heft, sondern klaut es lieber über den Download!!1!" Ein Artikel, der inhaltlich hier reingehört, und wo einer der Interviewten ein Forenmember ist.. Da kann man den Ball auch etwas flacher halten. Rausnehmen und zwar sofort!
Anzeige wird sonst folgen.
Aha. Sonst willst du persönlich eine Anzeige machen? Ich dachte die Zeit der Blockwarte wäre so langsam vorbei? Warum, genau, bist du eigentlich hier im Forum? Ist staatlich ausgegebenes und kontrolliertes Geld nicht viel eher etwas für dich? *kopfschüttelnd* Ente |
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Ich halte es für den falschen Weg alle Bestellungen, wo es keine Rückmeldung gibt, zu canceln. Wer sich nicht meldet - alles bleibt wie es ist. Vielleicht ist jemand einen Monat im Urlaub oder im Krankenhaus oder sonstwas.
Sebastian, danke für die professionelle Arbeit. Andere würden schlichtweg im Chaos versinken, und noch mehr fehlerquellen reinbringen - du organisierst gewissenhaft und umsichtig, vielen Dank!
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Bkkcoins...After you finalize the current K16 design, do you plan to do any additional work on the project or pass on the torch to the open source community? The last I read, the Avalon gen2 chip just sounded like a die shrink with the same physical size and pin out configuration.
I guess what I am really asking is; will you still be involved in the project or do you have different plans for the future? I've really enjoyed watching this thread over the past few months. Seeing all of your hard work coming together, along with all of the community input and support has been really exciting. I was just wondering if you could share with us any future plans or new projects you might be involved with going forward. I'm sure many of us would love to read some type of miniblog on any of your future ventures, even if they happen to be outside the bitcoin environment.
Thanks for all of your hard work and contributions!
Chad
From a psychological viewpoint, I would ask such questions a few weeks after all that dust settled, the Klondike is finished and Avalon shipped those chips at a heavy discount.. ;-) Ente |
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If the time comes, I've founded 501(c)3 organizations myself before and I can help. My most recent one uses e-commerce to support other charities, so its not too dissimilar from what Bitcoin100 is doing (though BTC100 is much simpler). I'll send you some resources on setting everything up, if you'd like, Rassah. The longer you can keep it informal though, the better in my opinion.
The turning point when you may want to consider setting up an official tax-exempt organization should be when charities start running into problems accepting the money you're donating because they can't account for it without jeopardizing their own tax-exempt status. It depends a lot on the country that the non-profit lives in, but in many places including the U.S., charities have to prove that they are "publicly" supported. Hence they need to document the persons they receive donations from and their respective amounts. For small organizations, receiving the majority of their support from one particular person or entity can constitute "private" support which can change their designation to a private foundation. Private foundations are taxed on donations and income similarly to for-profit corporations, albeit at a reduced rate.
Most international organizations that want to do fundraising in the U.S. do end up getting a 501(c)3 in the U.S and establishing themselves as a public charity. The IRS laws regarding sending money overseas to NPOs tightened up a lot after 9/11 so pursuing big donations from U.S. corporations and the like practically requires 501(c)3 exempt status. Anyway, this is a pretty complex area of law in the U.S. so i'll leave it at that.
By the way, I agree with you Rassah that this could get rather large. That's what happens to good ideas, after all.
Wow, thank you for the valuable insights! It's great to have a pro here! :-) Ente |
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Rausnehmen und zwar sofort!
Anzeige wird sonst folgen.
?!? Ente |
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I'm about to transfer all my btc to bitfinex, can you guys confirm they are reliable ?
Same here. I do trades, lending and cashing-out with substantial amounts for several months now. I am especially pleased with their fast, friendly and competent customerservice. When I was all new to Bitcoin I was all new to trading, speculation and all this too. So I read a bit, got newsletters and observed the market. And lost a lot of money on MtGox doing bad trades. I thought I then had learned how this game goes, and then I lost more. Then I made some profit. Then I lost even more. Then I stopped. This was my best trading decision ever. :-) I only traded with a part of my Bitcoins. Enough to hurt, but not enough to really hurt. I don't know how experienced you are, Tamis. I would suggest to trade with 10% of your Bitcoins only, for a start. And maybe with a token amount only until you figure out how all those functions work. They are all well documented, but you still has to wrap your head around them. And then there are details, like for example "what lending gets automatically closed when I sell?" which you simply have to try out. With 0.01 BTC for example. So, no, I don't see BitFinex as the risk here, we ourselves are the risk for our Bitcoins ;-) Ente |
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Es gilt deutsches Recht, immernoch. Und da beginnt die Wiederrufsfrist mit Lieferung. Bei einem Wiederruf müssen die gegenseitig erbrachten Leistungen zurück erstattet werden.
Heißt in dem Fall sollte er nur 50% erstatten kann man den Rechtsweg gehen, sprich Strafanzeige wegen Betrugs.
Weil er bisher nicht geliefert hat.
Wenn er jetzt sagt er versichtet auf 12,5 eu für die Boards währe das in meinen Augen in Ordnung alles andere ist.....B.......
also kann jetzt jeder für sich überlegen schenkt man ihm die Kohle ( mit welcher Begründung, oder er wickelt die Bude ab).
Dann kann er nen Insoverfahren beantragen am besten noch heute sonst ist es Verschleppung. Wie gesagt wenn ich unternehmerisch tätig bin habe ich das Risiko des Verlustes, wir sind ja hier nicht in Amerika auch Burninmining hat geltendes Recht zu akzeptieren.
Schließlich und endlich muss man sich den Gefahren bewusst sein, man gewinnt nicht immer aus diesem Grund sollte er die Refund Politik nochmal überdenken.
Gruss
*seufz* Ich hab's vorhin schon jemandem erklärt. Kann jetzt jemand anderes bitte? Ente edit: Also gut, einmal noch. Aber dann verlinke ich nur noch hierauf! Hi,
naja, viele schreien jetzt "verklagen!", weil sie am Ende mit weniger Geld dastehen als vorher. Und weil in diesem Fall ein Teil des Geldes bei z.B. Burnin geblieben ist.
Der Kunde von Burnin kauft ein Produkt (Miner) und eine Dienstleistung (die ASICs drauflöten), liefert dafür die ASICs und bezahlt für Produkt und Dienstleistung.
Jetzt ist die Sache furchtbar schiefgegangen, weil die Difficulty enorm steigt, und die ASICs schon Wochen verspätet sind. Bei letzterem kann man überlegen wie man mit Avalon umgeht. Angeboten wurde ein Refund.
Was genau heißt das für Burnin und Co? Haben die ihren Kaufvertrag gebrochen? Nein. Würden sie, wie vereinbart, die Hardware bauen wenn die ASICs geliefert werden? Ja.
Kann man Burnin irgendetwas anlasten, oder gar verklagen? Mit Sicherheit nicht.
Jetzt erstattet Burnin einen Teil der Kosten, einen anderen Teil gibt er Rabatt bei ggf späteren Bestellungen. Ist er dazu rechtlich verpflichtet? Nein! Ich rechne es ihm hoch an, dass er so viel erstattet, und damit vermutlich ziemlich 0/0 rausgeht!
So, wo ist jetzt dein Geld geblieben? Als zusätzlicher Schaden, den indirekt Avalon verursacht hat. Ist es erfolgsversprechend auf der Grundlage eine Firma in China zu verklagen?
Ergo: Deal with it. Don't risk more than you are comfortable to lose.
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@BkkCoins - what you gonna do with K16? Are you gonna finish this masterpiece or dump it to "for later" shelf. I'm asking because there are a lot of people (incl. myself) who want this device, despite avalon drawbacks. Maybe, just maybe they will send us the frickin chips.
But if you postpone developing of K16, there will be no point to order it from any assembler (in my case Nekonos). Most of people just yelling about refunds etc. In case of many backing off, what will happend with your 'enterprise' (or other involved). Many of you invested alot in it.
Plese, tell us about your plans.
+1! The problem is, now, that the difficulty-price ratio of the chips has gone bad. Yifu already semi-announced he'll sell the chips at a discount later. I guess interest in the Klondike will spike again once the asics are actually shipping at a fraction of the current costs. Ente |
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uh, wtf? Real attack, or a huge botnet switching to tor maybe? Ente |
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ich würd noch abwarten bis Pep sagt "Ich habe fertig"
wenns so weiter geht liegt der preis dann eh bei 20k
Bei der müden Resonanz scheint selbst das nicht zusammenzukommen. Die ersten 7 hätten sich auch nur 2 Leute geteilt... so scheint mir 2.5k nicht wirklich Marktfähig zu sein, so daß ich es nun selber nicht mehr zahlen würde. o_O ... Die diff steuert auch schon wieder auf die 30% zu. Noch 6 Tage bis zur nächsten Difficulty-Anpassung: 100M here we come! Bei 1000 Eur pro Miner schau ich nochmal rein ;-) Ente |
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Those demanding their chips plus some compensation for the delay should follow the proposed approach: get a refund now and order chips later when they are in stock and cheaper. @Zefir: I assume ordering chips later again, once they are in stock and cheaper, would involve yet another group buy? Also if that's the case would you be going through all the group buy hassle again or are you done with it? I would avoid asking those questions just now. At least I would strictly avoid it when face-to-face ;-) Ente |
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/watching!
Maybe I'll join you folks, as the delegation from the Berlin Bitcoinkiez ;-)
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