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1341  Economy / Speculation / Re: Chinese exchange BTC38 suspends CNY deposits due to PBOC's policy on: April 02, 2014, 02:35:49 PM
tl;dr : they stopped BOTH 3rd party processor and bank deposit

CNY withdrawal as usual

BTC deposit/withdrawal as usual

actually that is not what i got out of it. the translation states: On request, we will also revoke a prepaid bank card transfers.

that is not direct bank transfers. im waiting for clarification

So you prefer google translation than a native Chinese speaker? It's up to you
1342  Economy / Speculation / Re: Chinese exchange BTC38 suspends CNY deposits due to PBOC's policy on: April 02, 2014, 01:38:44 PM
tl;dr : they stopped BOTH 3rd party processor and bank deposit

CNY withdrawal as usual

BTC deposit/withdrawal as usual
1343  Local / 中文 (Chinese) / Re: 中共政府狂印鈔 : 通過高通脹由百姓承擔 on: April 02, 2014, 05:47:24 AM
这些国家大事,不要发到这里来,这不是我等屁民可以管的

你是屁民, 我等不是
1344  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Output approach vs. account balance approach on: April 02, 2014, 02:58:02 AM

Wouldn't one issue be that the person you paid could re-play a given transaction, given that the value desired still exists at an address? 

Yes, that's a problem but I think this could be somehow solved this way:

1. For every input, a "sequence" field is added. It is a var_int ( https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Protocol_specification#Variable_length_integer )

2. Sender has to sign the sequence field

3. A signature is valid only if the sequence field is exactly larger by 1 than the last sequence used by the same address (i.e., for the first time to spend money from an address, the sequence must be 0; and for the second time to spend money from the same address, the sequence must be 1, etc.)

4. The NZBA set will record the last used sequence of all addresses.

Problems:

1. Each input is 1-9 bytes bigger. In most case it'd be only 1 byte unless the address is heavily reused.

2. A bigger problem is miners have to keep the record of all used addresses in the history, even the balance is 0.

3. Another potential problem is that could cause trouble for off-line wallet and thin wallet. They need some way to know the latest sequence of an address. For off-line wallet that's similar to our current situation (e.g. Armory needs a online computer to create the un-signed transaction). For thin wallet like the Android Bitcoin Wallet, there may not be a fully trust-free way to learn the latest sequence of an address.

Any other solution?
1345  Economy / Speculation / Re: Bitcoin long-term exponential trend (updated regularly) on: April 02, 2014, 02:34:53 AM
Could you let us know how deep the lows of the 2011 and april 2013 bubbles were below your two trendlines? Percentage wise? How much below are we today?

In 2011 the low was about 0.1x of the trendline

The 2013 July low was exp(-0.31)=0.73x of the trendline

Now we are at about 0.82x


1346  Economy / Speculation / Re: Bitcoin long-term exponential trend (updated regularly) on: April 02, 2014, 02:29:16 AM
We are now 32 days behind, or at 0.82x of the trend line

1347  Economy / Speculation / Re: Bitcoin long-term exponential trend (updated regularly) on: April 02, 2014, 02:27:40 AM
Time to update:

Date:    1-Apr-2014
VWAP:    479.96
x:    1354
a:    0.00606
b:    -1.83009
Rsq:    0.88299
The day's expected price:    584.87
Predicted date for today's price:    27-Feb-2014
Days ahead:    -32.64
Daily price rank:    133
Predicted date for ATH ($1126):    23-Jul-2014
   
(See OP for explanation)   
   
   
   
https://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=e+%5E+%28+0.00605722960118392++%28+number+of+days+since+jul+17%2C+2010+%2Fdays+%29+-1.83009376643144+%29   
1348  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Output approach vs. account balance approach on: April 01, 2014, 04:56:06 PM
Well, there is not much difference between balances and creating an UTXO set, also I'm not too sure what you mean with "computationally expensive". Once a transaction is considered valid, look up the involved addresses, calculate their new balances (negative balances would make a transaction invalid) by doing addition/subtraction of their "total_satoshis" field...

Another issue might be that Bitcoin does not really operate in accounts/addresses to begin with, they were introduced later and not part of the original design.

Ok. I think one big issue is that without P2SH, which is recent, this scheme can't work.

Quote
4. Change output is not needed as a account balance could be spent partially.
Well I think that's still very possible with standard Bitcoin too. Right now the implicitly left out value is simply given to the miner. If you left it implicitly here you'd have to explicitly hand txn fee to miner.

I do like the idea that it's still expensive to create "dust", but cheap to claim. It'd be interesting regardless.

For each input address it will use 8 bytes to indicate the amount to spend, so the difference between total input and total output will be the fee
1349  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Technical Support / Re: Best way to keep my Bitcoins safe? on: April 01, 2014, 04:03:07 PM
come on this is development discussion

You think so?
For me this is Technical Discussion and as I know this sub channel is called " Development & Technical Discussion "
so this thread IMO is placed just right. 

And what about my answer @ "Best way to keep my Bitcoins safe?"

offline wallets - but I must say I don't know which "offline wallets" service is the best.
Maybe some more experienced members will tell us some more.

My question to more experienced members: is this good way to make offline wallet?
 >> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/How_to_set_up_a_secure_offline_savings_wallet <<


Yes, I think so.

This section is for "Technical discussion about Satoshi's Bitcoin client and the Bitcoin network in general. No third-party sites/clients, bug reports that do not require much discussion (use github), or support requests."

Sorry then for my mistake. I can`t find here any option to change it so now probably only moderators can make it.

This is not completely your mistake. The name is misleading. I propose to change to a more proper name but no one is listening to me
1350  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Output approach vs. account balance approach on: April 01, 2014, 09:48:51 AM
Actually 28bytes per input is saved because the outpoint=hash+index takes 36bytes.
1351  Local / 中文 (Chinese) / Re: 怒其不争比特币 on: April 01, 2014, 07:44:17 AM
当代鲁迅, 绝对好文章。
Quote
更何况中国人跪了五千年,而六十多年前中国人民终于趴下去了,这种深刻的恐惧总是围绕着我们

东方雄狮何时苏醒?

在做中國夢的時候  Roll Eyes
1352  Economy / Speculation / Re: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion on: April 01, 2014, 07:34:26 AM
This Chinese thread seems to say that bank deposit (?) at OKCoin was still working today (Apr/01) around 09:00 local time.

Thought it was clarified via bter that they were closing third party partners not a blanket ban.
I understood their clarification as: "we used a payment processor, that suspeded its service; we do not use bank accounts, so we have no information about that part of the rumor."

yes exactly
1353  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Change the name of this subforum to "Bitcoin Protocol and Reference Client" on: April 01, 2014, 07:31:38 AM
Thanks to @roslinpl who demonstrates how misleading the forum name is.

come on this is development discussion

You think so?
For me this is Technical Discussion and as I know this sub channel is called " Development & Technical Discussion "
so this thread IMO is placed just right. 

And what about my answer @ "Best way to keep my Bitcoins safe?"

offline wallets - but I must say I don't know which "offline wallets" service is the best.
Maybe some more experienced members will tell us some more.

My question to more experienced members: is this good way to make offline wallet?
 >> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/How_to_set_up_a_secure_offline_savings_wallet <<



1354  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Technical Support / Re: Best way to keep my Bitcoins safe? on: April 01, 2014, 07:29:01 AM
come on this is development discussion

You think so?
For me this is Technical Discussion and as I know this sub channel is called " Development & Technical Discussion "
so this thread IMO is placed just right. 

And what about my answer @ "Best way to keep my Bitcoins safe?"

offline wallets - but I must say I don't know which "offline wallets" service is the best.
Maybe some more experienced members will tell us some more.

My question to more experienced members: is this good way to make offline wallet?
 >> https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/How_to_set_up_a_secure_offline_savings_wallet <<


Yes, I think so.

This section is for "Technical discussion about Satoshi's Bitcoin client and the Bitcoin network in general. No third-party sites/clients, bug reports that do not require much discussion (use github), or support requests."
1355  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Output approach vs. account balance approach on: April 01, 2014, 05:47:06 AM
Satoshi adopted the "output approach" in bitcoin, which means a transaction output must be fully spent, and different outputs of the same address must be spent separately. There are some known problems of this approach:

1. scriptSig malleability: Since reference to UTXO depends on the transaction hash, scriptSig malleability will break a chain of unconfirmed transactions.

2. Not optimal for micropayment. Since outputs are discrete, it is not economical to spend tiny outputs

Here I propose a different approach, the "account balance approach"

1. Only P2SH is accepted. The scriptPubKey is simply a script hash. People will send bitcoin to addresses, just like what we are doing now.

2. Instead of storing an index of UTXO, miner will store an index of non-zero-balance-address (NZBA). When an address receives a bitcoin, miner will either create a new entry in the NZBA set (if the address did not exist) or add the received amount to the corresponding address

3. To spend bitcoin, the private key holder has to provide a signature and a script, just like the current P2SH. In addition, the sender has to explicitly indicate the amount of bitcoin to spend

4. The sender will only indicate how many bitcoin is sent to a specified address. The sender doesn't care the final balance of the recipient.

5. When a miner sees a transaction, he will hash the script and look for the corresponding hash in the NZBA set. If the spent amount is not bigger than the balance of the address, the miner will verify the signature.

6. In evaluating the balance of an address, all unconfirmed transactions will be considered. Therefore, people could spend newly received bitcoin, as long as both receiving and spending transactions are included in the same block.

7. A block is valid as long as all scripts are valid and none of the address balance is negative

This is better than the current output approach because:

1. There is no reference to txid. scriptSig malleability won't invalidate a chain of unconfirmed transaction

2. It is optimal for micropayment. An address with 100,000,000 deposits of 1 satoshi will only occupy 1 entry in the NZBA set, and could be spent as 1 bitcoin with a single signature

3. Even without micropayment, it saves space because there won't be reference of txid (32bytes) in input. Instead, the transaction value is needed which takes 8bytes. So at least 24bytes are saved for each input.

4. Change output is not needed as a account balance could be spent partially.

5. If people do not want to reuse address for privacy reason, they can always completely spend the balance of an address and create a change, just like what we are doing now. (Space is still saved because txid is not used)

However, I'm not sure if the account balance approach is as computationally efficient as the output approach (in terms of memory use etc.) Also, I'm not sure with its implication to thin clients.

Any comments?
1356  Economy / Speculation / Re: SecondMarket Bitcoin Investment Trust Observer on: April 01, 2014, 02:31:45 AM
All figures are openly available.
I can not find the figures on the Website.
or do you have acces to it being an Investor?

They update everyday and remove the data of the last day
Thanks again, though I do not understand how do figure the selling of 49 BTC as of 28 Mar 2014

The formula is shown on the OP
1357  Economy / Speculation / Re: point of maximum pain on: March 31, 2014, 03:47:22 PM
I'm not convinced we are there yet.  Myself and lots of other people have been around here for years and have been through this numerous times.  I think this is my 6th, but I've lost track.  I've developed a sense for the point of maximum pain and have profited pretty handsomely by being able to recognize it.  Granted, the market could be mature enough that these sorts of things are becoming somewhat less painful, but it doesn't quite feel like we're there yet.  In any event, I'm watching and waiting, because I'm going to try to be there (again) when many of you are feeling that pain.  Sorry, and thanks.

As the overall volatility of the market is decreasing, I believe it will be less painful.
1358  Economy / Speculation / Re: SecondMarket Bitcoin Investment Trust Observer on: March 31, 2014, 01:41:21 PM
All figures are openly available.
I can not find the figures on the Website.
or do you have acces to it being an Investor?

They update everyday and remove the data of the last day
1359  Bitcoin / Development & Technical Discussion / Re: Why is there a target field in block headers? on: March 31, 2014, 01:18:08 PM
Yes, I do not see why it should exist. With 293000 blocks so far, 293000*4=1.17MB is wasted. Not much, but I can't see why
1360  Local / 中文 (Chinese) / Re: BTC-e增加CHN离岸人民币交易币种,跟327事件有关? on: March 31, 2014, 10:43:14 AM
离岸人民币是什么意思?

http://baike.baidu.com/view/3421565.htm
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