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1221  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER C1 Discussion and Support Thread on: December 29, 2014, 04:28:10 PM
Oh I didn't have any specific cooling liquid so I am using distilled water at the moment?

You will have problems due to the mix of copper and aluminium in the loop. I have no idea over what timescale it will become a problem, but it would be advisable to add an additive or swap out to dedicated coolant which won't have the same problem.

So the provided cooling radiator is copper?   That's a surprise.

Because water carries 50% more heat than ethylene glycol, the basic ingredient in most antifreeze coolant,  I want to use distilled water (~.68 cents/gallon in Walmart) and perhaps rig up a PVC water filter with the guts from a quality water filter advertising removal of metal ions.

Beta-amyloid, the stuff implicated in causing Alzheimers Disease, is linked to two copper and a zinc molecule(s).  So, with copper piping in most  homes built last century, many are struggling to get the copper out of their water.  Copper removing filters are available.
1222  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER C1 Discussion and Support Thread on: December 29, 2014, 04:16:02 PM
I received my C1 today, on reading Doggie's guide and the cooling system notes I received, I concluded that I didn't want to power the cooling rig directly from the C1,
I bought 3 Molex pentuim fan cables, two for the Radiator fans and one for the pump. Although the pump is a 4 pin unit when I checked with the supplied harness,
only two pin's are used to power the pump in the same wiring setup as a fan. So with a bit of care you can plug the 3 pin fan connector into the 4 pin pump connector.

Now I could setup and test the water cooling without the main  C1 being powered. After getting most of the air bubbles out and testing for leaks for a few hours,
I applied all the PCIE connectors and started the unit up. I nice surprise is that with the C1 I can connected from my adsl modem network view page on the hostname which I
couldn't do with my S3's.

So far hashing at 990 GH/S in stock setup and running temps of 41/42 across all blades, room temp is about 25 C.

I am impressed with the noise I was running 4 S3's in my office holy cow that was a little noisy.
I will need to go though most of this thread seeing what pumps people are switching to, as I am not real sure I will get a long run out of the stock unit.

Oh I didn't have any specific cooling liquid so I am using distilled water at the moment?

Also I am running a Coolmaster V1000 gold psu seem to have all the right connectors and big single rail required for a C1.

Cheers

 

So no difficulty seeing air bubbles thru the clear tubing while getting the air out? 

Mine was suppose to arrive today but I screwed up and used my PO Box as a UPS shipping address.  It's out for delivery but will head back to the office after customer hours so am told I can't get it until tomorrow.

Was thinking of distilled water with food coloring but if the clear tubing stains that won't work well.
1223  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER C1 Discussion and Support Thread on: December 29, 2014, 09:52:08 AM
My pump died within 2 months of batch 2!

I've emailed bitmain for rma details...

Anyone else had this problem in batch 2??

May I ask if you were using tap water, distilled water or coolent?
1224  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER C1 Discussion and Support Thread on: December 28, 2014, 09:58:34 PM
i think it would have been a better idea to power this off molex from the factory, powering this off one of the blades is just a poor design to begin with

My C1 should arrive tomorrow so I have to ask.  The present stock design allows the C1 including pump to be run from 8 PCI-E 8 pin power?  That's all 12vdc.

And alternative wiring schemes have been shown to produce an equal hashrate with a reduction of power at the wall?  Anyone have any numbers on this last?  Or are the alternative wiring schemes for fan noise reduction?
1225  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER S3 Discussion and Support Thread. on: December 28, 2014, 06:18:37 PM
Hmmm, I have a 1300 SUPERNOVA G2 Running two aintminer S3's My electric service to my house is 120v 50 amp "MAIN BREAKER" My miners are on a 20 amp sub breaker by itself. I really need 100 amp service I Don't think Adequate Power is coming from the wall that's why this happens. I took them to my cousins house he has 100 amp 220v service I can oc them to 524 "262" and they work fine.


Have you tried on a different outlet not connected to the dedicated breaker? Somewhere else in the house


Yes Same issue.




I use cheap power supplies the output of which vary with line voltage fluctuations.  When the summer heat abated and AC's were shut down in the evening, my AC would jump to 125VAC or more and my one of my miner's  power supplies would go over 13vdc causing a shutdown.  The cheap power supplies have an output adjustment.  Lowering the voltage the miner was back up and running.  The next day was hot and AC's went back on in the neighborhood.  The AC went back to 120-122VAC.  The adjusted power supplies output dropped and the miner shut down for low voltage.  I readjusted and all was well.

For a lark, I'd suggest measuring your power supply output at home while the miner is running then again at your friend's home.



I note these cheap supplies aren't a good choice.  When the AC voltage rose a metal oxide varistor on the input voltage of one supply burned up.  No way to compensate for that kind of failure as the MOV sees the incoming voltage.  Also, another supply saw the bridge burn up.  So, I now add heatsinks to all the supplies bridge diodes.  Finally, I change out the 1 turn mismarked trim pot for a 25 turn so as to get the voltages as even as possible before applying a load.  I want the supplies at the 50% load so I need two per S3.

I also add a 6 amp line filter to the AC input.


Not all the supplies had the 1 turn trimpot swapped for a 25 turn.  I took the time to change out some today.  I found another supply with a damaged MOV but besides the MOV having a major crack, and fortunately I had purchased a number when end of summer one went completely bad as neighborhood AC shut down, there was a blown 35v cap.  Having a dead unit for parts came in handy as I didn't have that value on hand otherwise.  I knew the adjusted voltage output rose and fell with AC rise and fall, I just didn't expect that an internal voltage limit expectation would be violated.  That or it was just a cheap cap that blew when stressed with a higher than normal voltage.  Interestingly the S3 was running okay even tho that cap had been blown.
1226  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER C1 Discussion and Support Thread on: December 28, 2014, 03:51:38 AM
How are you getting the 7vdc?

The red on 12v and the black on 5v. The difference in voltage is 7v. Google it.


For any kids reading, tape up your open terminals Tongue

I think it's not dangerous if I only touch the terminals with my fingers. But I better not short with something conductive. That part was overlooked in the project. I just wrap the whole thing with electrical tape?

Ah yes.  Happy it works for you.   Personally I'd be hesitant with switching supplies.
1227  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER C1 Discussion and Support Thread on: December 28, 2014, 01:52:37 AM
Simple harness mod to control voltage for the radiator fans. The radiators fans makes too much noise on 12v. I want to run the pump on 12v and choose the voltage to power the fans between 12v, 8.7v, 7v and 5v!

I have a second batch harness with a 6-pin connector. I changed wires from the connectors with 4 18awg wires. The 4 wires are connected to 12v, 5v, 3.3v and ground from an aux connector on the power supply. I added a terminal strip to choose which voltage I want to use.  The best setting I found is to run the fans on 7v (12v-5v). At 7v I barely notice the noise and the temperature is only 1 or 2 degrees higher. At 5v I have to look to know if the fans are running but it is a little bit less efficient at cooling and the miner fan need to run faster to compensate.







How are you getting the 7vdc?
1228  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER S3 Discussion and Support Thread. on: December 28, 2014, 01:03:40 AM
Hmmm, I have a 1300 SUPERNOVA G2 Running two aintminer S3's My electric service to my house is 120v 50 amp "MAIN BREAKER" My miners are on a 20 amp sub breaker by itself. I really need 100 amp service I Don't think Adequate Power is coming from the wall that's why this happens. I took them to my cousins house he has 100 amp 220v service I can oc them to 524 "262" and they work fine.


Have you tried on a different outlet not connected to the dedicated breaker? Somewhere else in the house


Yes Same issue.




I use cheap power supplies the output of which vary with line voltage fluctuations.  When the summer heat abated and AC's were shut down in the evening, my AC would jump to 125VAC or more and my one of my miner's  power supplies would go over 13vdc causing a shutdown.  The cheap power supplies have an output adjustment.  Lowering the voltage the miner was back up and running.  The next day was hot and AC's went back on in the neighborhood.  The AC went back to 120-122VAC.  The adjusted power supplies output dropped and the miner shut down for low voltage.  I readjusted and all was well.

For a lark, I'd suggest measuring your power supply output at home while the miner is running then again at your friend's home.



I note these cheap supplies aren't a good choice.  When the AC voltage rose a metal oxide varistor on the input voltage of one supply burned up.  No way to compensate for that kind of failure as the MOV sees the incoming voltage.  Also, another supply saw the bridge burn up.  So, I now add heatsinks to all the supplies bridge diodes.  Finally, I change out the 1 turn mismarked trim pot for a 25 turn so as to get the voltages as even as possible before applying a load.  I want the supplies at the 50% load so I need two per S3.

I also add a 6 amp line filter to the AC input.






I use a line conditioner ON the AC input of the PSU then plug line conditioner into wall outlet. This should help your case because it keeps your ac voltage constant when it goes to high or to low.






Back in the early '80's I was an engineering aide with North Hills Electronics.  There were two products lines with which I was tasked.  An uninterruptable power supply in prototype development and line conditioners which were an existing product line of various sizes.  The line conditioners at their most simple were multi-output transformers with circuitry to shift between outputs to maintain the line out in a best window.

1229  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER C1 Discussion and Support Thread on: December 27, 2014, 07:16:46 PM
My C1 might arrive on Monday, day after tomorrow.  I'm looking forward to laying eyes on one of these machines.
1230  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER S3 Discussion and Support Thread. on: December 27, 2014, 05:52:16 PM
Hmmm, I have a 1300 SUPERNOVA G2 Running two aintminer S3's My electric service to my house is 120v 50 amp "MAIN BREAKER" My miners are on a 20 amp sub breaker by itself. I really need 100 amp service I Don't think Adequate Power is coming from the wall that's why this happens. I took them to my cousins house he has 100 amp 220v service I can oc them to 524 "262" and they work fine.


Have you tried on a different outlet not connected to the dedicated breaker? Somewhere else in the house


Yes Same issue.




I use cheap power supplies the output of which vary with line voltage fluctuations.  When the summer heat abated and AC's were shut down in the evening, my AC would jump to 125VAC or more and my one of my miner's  power supplies would go over 13vdc causing a shutdown.  The cheap power supplies have an output adjustment.  Lowering the voltage the miner was back up and running.  The next day was hot and AC's went back on in the neighborhood.  The AC went back to 120-122VAC.  The adjusted power supplies output dropped and the miner shut down for low voltage.  I readjusted and all was well.

For a lark, I'd suggest measuring your power supply output at home while the miner is running then again at your friend's home.



I note these cheap supplies aren't a good choice.  When the AC voltage rose a metal oxide varistor on the input voltage of one supply burned up.  No way to compensate for that kind of failure as the MOV sees the incoming voltage.  Also, another supply saw the bridge burn up.  So, I now add heatsinks to all the supplies bridge diodes.  Finally, I change out the 1 turn mismarked trim pot for a 25 turn so as to get the voltages as even as possible before applying a load.  I want the supplies at the 50% load so I need two per S3.

I also add a 6 amp line filter to the AC input.
1231  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER S3 Discussion and Support Thread. on: December 27, 2014, 05:23:17 PM
Hmmm, I have a 1300 SUPERNOVA G2 Running two aintminer S3's My electric service to my house is 120v 50 amp "MAIN BREAKER" My miners are on a 20 amp sub breaker by itself. I really need 100 amp service I Don't think Adequate Power is coming from the wall that's why this happens. I took them to my cousins house he has 100 amp 220v service I can oc them to 524 "262" and they work fine.


Have you tried on a different outlet not connected to the dedicated breaker? Somewhere else in the house


Yes Same issue.




I use cheap power supplies the output of which vary with line voltage fluctuations.  When the summer heat abated and AC's were shut down in the evening, my AC would jump to 125VAC or more and my one of my miner's  power supplies would go over 13vdc causing a shutdown.  The cheap power supplies have an output adjustment.  Lowering the voltage the miner was back up and running.  The next day was hot and AC's went back on in the neighborhood.  The AC went back to 120-122VAC.  The adjusted power supplies output dropped and the miner shut down for low voltage.  I readjusted and all was well.

For a lark, I'd suggest measuring your power supply output at home while the miner is running then again at your friend's home.

1232  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER S3 Discussion and Support Thread. on: December 27, 2014, 04:15:15 PM
Putting the 4 hashing boards from two S3+'s into a single box - one could mount a second controller board and remove the stick-on cover over the second RJ45 hole.  It would be as if running the two S3+'s, two ethernet cables, but the water or liquid cooling would be a plus especially taking advantage of putting the heat outside while the machine is inside.

Removing the sticker wouldn't be enough to allow the RJ45 access to be used as the controller boards would overlap.  Perhaps cutting away above the RJ45 access and putting the second controller board on standoffs would allow both to fit.
+1
1233  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER S3 Discussion and Support Thread. on: December 27, 2014, 04:07:45 PM
From BitmainWarranty: "C1 uses a similar looking PCB to S3 or S3+ hashing PCB, but it is little different, so Please DO NOT mix them as the connector even facing differently."

So the C1 boards are NOT S3 boards just a bit clocked up correct? Just for clarification please.

In terms of hashing power they are.

Wow now I do see what others are saying is true.

When I first started reading your review threads over a year ago I really got behind what you were providing to the community, they were both very helpful to most, and an enjoyment to read. I am not sure what happened but maybe you have spread yourself a little thin.

Your justification for the inaccurate answer you provided to the original question is childish at best I am sad to say. Please try to get back on point Doge.

Sorry, half my post is missing there (was on a phone). He is right, the PCB is not identical as there are some modifications to aid the use of waterblocks.

So, the water block required modifications made to the PCB?  Is it a case of physical interference or repositioned mounting holes so as not to tap into fluid channels? 

1234  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER C1 Discussion and Support Thread on: December 27, 2014, 02:13:36 AM
You could plug the pump directly to one of the hashing board headers

Has anyone tried this?  Could feedback response time be a problem?  Constantly running the pump at a set speed that would be less a problem but slow that fluid down and this could warm up quickly. 

I suspect I will absolutely need an outdoor pre-cooler once it gets warm this spring.  I have a thermostat circuit I use for a DIY egg incubator.  Less difficult controlling a 12vdc pump to put water onto an outdoor pre-cooler that will have air passing over it.  The system isn't pressurized so the sensor can be mounted in the water outflow of the pre-cooler.  I lived in Tuson back in the early 1970's and the place had a cooler on the roof.  A large box-like enclosure with the 4 sides having material much like air conditioning filter material.  Water would pass down thru the material and in the center air was sucked into the home.  It's very dry in Arizona so it worked there without the home becoming too humid.  Running water over an outdoor pre-cooler wouldn't raise the humidity of the home here.  Georgia is much more humid than Arizona.
1235  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER C1 Discussion and Support Thread on: December 26, 2014, 07:42:36 PM
I would think even with connecting a copper radiator to an aluminum heatsink if one used distilled water it would be okay for a while.  As the water accepted ions it would start to become conductive.

Even distilled water / distilled water mixes are going to contribute to the problem after a while. I personally would stick to a premix / non water base.

Ethylene Glycol has a heat carrying capacity only half of pure water.  It's also used as a desiccant (from the Wiki).   We aren't talking about sufficient heat to vaporize water in the miner heatsink so perhaps the Ethylene Glycol alone will be good enough.  Reduced heat carrying capacity would mean that some ASICs will be running hotter at the output.

Not having a C1 yet I wonder if the pump speed varies or simply runs continually.  I've read some posts about running the cooler fans from an unused fan connector on a C1 hashing board.

Pure water would carry the most heat away so if the pump runs constantly at a set volume per minute and if the fans are made to run relative to the mid-hashing board heat sensor, pure water means less fan usage, better hash rates, generally lower temps if the pump runs constantly.

Listening to my two S3+'s and two S3's in an unheated room with windows open, it gets very quiet at sub-65°F.

My pump at least is constant RPM and doesn't vary. The C1's fan does vary with chip temps, but is very conservative until things really start to heat up.

So do the fans on the cooler have a controller board that vary those fan rates?

It's been a warm winter the single polar vortex-like drop notwithstanding.    Outside in the shade right now this Dec. 26 is 55.6°.  If I go to an outdoor pre-cooler for summer heat, perhaps dripping water on the pre-cooler will help.

Maybe putting a de-ionizing sink water filter in the circuit of having a copper radiator and running pure distilled water.
1236  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER C1 Discussion and Support Thread on: December 26, 2014, 06:29:09 PM
I would think even with connecting a copper radiator to an aluminum heatsink if one used distilled water it would be okay for a while.  As the water accepted ions it would start to become conductive.

Even distilled water / distilled water mixes are going to contribute to the problem after a while. I personally would stick to a premix / non water base.

Ethylene Glycol has a heat carrying capacity only half of pure water.  It's also used as a desiccant (from the Wiki).   We aren't talking about sufficient heat to vaporize water in the miner heatsink so perhaps the Ethylene Glycol alone will be good enough.  Reduced heat carrying capacity would mean that some ASICs will be running hotter at the output.

Not having a C1 yet I wonder if the pump speed varies or simply runs continually.  I've read some posts about running the cooler fans from an unused fan connector on a C1 hashing board.

Pure water would carry the most heat away so if the pump runs constantly at a set volume per minute and if the fans are made to run relative to the mid-hashing board heat sensor, pure water means less fan usage, better hash rates, generally lower temps if the pump runs constantly.

Listening to my two S3+'s and two S3's in an unheated room with windows open, it gets very quiet at sub-65°F.

1237  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER C1 Discussion and Support Thread on: December 26, 2014, 05:08:33 PM
I would think even with connecting a copper radiator to an aluminum heatsink if one used distilled water it would be okay for a while.  As the water accepted ions it would start to become conductive.  One might find a Kleinschmidt tester from a WWII submarine and periodically test the fluid's conductivity and simply replace when it rises.  I wonder how auto antifreeze mixed 50/50 with distilled water tests for conductivity.  I think it's the use of tap water with its potentially high conductivity even mixed with auto antifreeze that might be damaging.  The lubricating properties of auto antifreeze is attractive for its pump life extension.  Down here in the south it's necessary to run 50% distilled water with the antifreeze in mid-summer as water has a better heat carrying capability then antifreeze.  Still, if one were adding an outdoor cooler in addition to the stock radiator perhaps pure auto antifreeze would be sufficient.  

Most newer auto radiators are aluminum core clamped to plastic tops and bottoms.  The plastic cracks in an accident but that could be repaired with epoxy as in our use the system isn't pressurized - leave the radiator cap loose outside.  A typical electric heater in a home might be 1200 watts.  A C1 putting out 850 watts is unreasonable indoors in the summer.  Putting the stock radiator facing out a window is an option but you'll be sucking in an equal amount of hot air from outside.  Putting the stock radiator completely outside will only cool to the outside ambient.  If instead one adds an outside car radiator to pre-cool, then with the stock radiator inside it would only need to cool down fluid that's at outside ambient and since the stock radiator will be inside it will drop the temp to whatever one has the room cooled to.  This leave most of the heat outside.

1238  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER S3 Discussion and Support Thread. on: December 26, 2014, 03:52:35 PM
Well maybe not.  Pricing aluminum stock online I see a piece 1/2"x6"x12" costs $79.99

Yes ...in USA... Huh

$7.99 in China... Grin

ZiG

Have a contact email address?
1239  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER S3 Discussion and Support Thread. on: December 26, 2014, 03:32:45 AM
Well maybe not.  Pricing aluminum stock online I see a piece 1/2"x6"x12" costs $79.99. 
1240  Bitcoin / Hardware / Re: ANTMINER S3 Discussion and Support Thread. on: December 26, 2014, 02:01:18 AM
Watch that condensation if you are going to use a Freon system.


look at the c1 slap pump Freon through it instead of water or anti-freeze mixed with water. hmmm lines are pressurized to 100 p.s.i  how would you put them on ?





If the freon is being used in the standard pump system of a C1, without it converting to gas and getting compressed back to liquid, I don't see it getting any cooler than the ambient at the radiator.  If it doesn't get colder than that ambient then there won't be condensation.
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