IM betting on KnC not including Psus... looks like we will need a minimum of 2x 1300w or higher to be safe.
This will be an important product line. If they design their own and build it in or if they design around specs of a single manufacturer's power supply perhaps having that company run a line of supplies specifically for the Neptune that KnC can install before shipping, they may feel more secure and realize fewer customer screw ups. Heck, an F.X.Boch deisgned the switching supply for a switching-servo-amplifier for PMI Motors back in the late 1970's a division of Kollmorgen so they could probably get licensing from Kollmorgen. It was an elegant approach. Your discounting the time and money needed for the certifications etc for shipping a miner with a PSU, vs sourcing a pre certified PSU like CT/HF Yes. So, a supply from an established manufacturer, installed. |
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IM betting on KnC not including Psus... looks like we will need a minimum of 2x 1300w or higher to be safe.
This will be an important product line. If they design their own and build it in or if they design around specs of a single manufacturer's power supply perhaps having that company run a line of supplies specifically for the Neptune that KnC can install before shipping, they may feel more secure and realize fewer customer screw ups. Heck, an F.X.Boch deisgned the switching supply for a switching-servo-amplifier for PMI Motors back in the late 1970's a division of Kollmorgen so they could probably get licensing from Kollmorgen. It was an elegant approach. |
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So are the Neptune's ever going to make ROI? I'm thinking about pre-ordering a batch 2/3 unit. (or whatever you want to call what is on their website currently)
Will I be able to plug one of these into my "normal" house? Will there be multiple PSU's?
I don't know. My pre-purchase assessment based on information I read a month before led me to believe it could but re-reading the specs, probably not. I'm guessing best case for 3000GH/s will be 2000 watts. That's 16.6 amps at 120VAC. Kitchens often have 12 gauge good for 20 amps but an office, bedroom or living room will more likely be wired with 14 gauge good for and having breakers rated at 15 amps. Run it in the kitchen, heat tea in the microwave and breaker will pop. And if the GHs is real good and well above 3000 then expect more wattage/current. One can wire a pair of 15 amp breakers from separate phases and get 230VAC then wire a 230VAC socket and add a 230VAC plug to the Neptune or Neptune power supply depending and draw only 8.7 amps on each line which I'll probably do. I say that's what I'll probably do as I had added a 15 amp breaker pair with a pair of 14 gauge romex for AC and whatnot in the living room. Should have gone with 12 gauge and 20 amp but this was before I had power hungry miners. The double breaker, as there are limited free breaker spaces in my box, are probably both from the same phase (or line if you prefer although if you put an oscilloscope probe on each line and they display out of phase as they will I'd call them phases) is most likely from a single phase. I'll have to go in, remove the double (two ˝ size breakers) and put in a double breaker that connects to both L1 and L2 (both phases) or leave the double ˝ size breaker in place with its two 14-2 gauge romex and add two 20 amp breakers and run two 12-2 romex adding two circuits to the living room. From those I can take out 230VAC to a plug or run a single Neptune on each. |
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BTW, the only people that will benefit from removing the blue power cables inside and going directly into the power supply are the ones that have a struggling power supply to begin with. If you power cables are warm to the touch like mine were with my 850 watt power supply I upgraded to a 1000 watt and the power cables are not warm to the touch anymore. Exact watt/amp readings with or without extra power cables.
Here in the US we all received our miners in October and going forward. The colder months were just starting. I don't think people realize how much trouble they are going to be in when the outside temps start to increase. It won't be a simple idea as paying for electric, but paying a lot extra and more for air conditioning to keep the rigs cool. When we had a few days if just 65 degrees out, I had to remove the top case of my Saturn, upgraded Jupiter to keep the temps in check. When people start receiving Neptunes in May/June or whatever it is, the hotter days are right around the corner and my god this thread is going to fill up just about heat related issues. It does get truly tiresome going through pages of nonsense in this thread. Maybe there should be a forked off thread called KNC-Technical or something. Since KNC doesn't even offer support via their own forum and refuse to participate in the online community we have to what we have to do. Strangely KNC has even indicated they would provide support on their forum but basically went silent after that. Why even say anything at all? The last post from kncminer was in September. What's their problem, they don't like the bitcoin community, only our money?
I think a lot of people pre-ordered a monster (Netptune) and have no idea what they are getting themselves into. By the time they actually receive that rig the difficulty will much higher, possibly and likely others will deliver something so just to even think about getting your original money back you'll need every hash power you can squeeze out of it. If not, then you'll be just chasing a high you'll never end up getting.
I'm in awe my Saturn/Jupiter is still making me money, and in Q2 that will eventually cease. Once people start to need to re-wire their homes with commercial wiring/amps and commercial equipment that kind of tells me I have to bow out of the picture. I can't afford to cool and power the rig itself.
Even last year anyone researching bitcoin mining probably came across photos of farms moved out to sheds with AC. It's perfectly obvious that two Jupiters will put out the heat of an electric space heater. Very little of the energy goes to physical movement of fans but is put off as heat produced in power supplies and in ICs when gates change state. So, two Jupiters will pretty much put out the heat one would expect from a 1500 watt heater. |
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Beware of BitPlastic
Yet more trouble with Bitplastic for me... BTC being literally stolen by the site owners after they admittedly saw it "Stuck" in the system... they did a "server upgrade" a few days ago, now they act as if the conversation we had never took place, and my BTC is gone. The amounts that DID eventually make it to the card (after depositing the btc about 2 weeks prior) was skimmed yet even more... well beyond and after they took their their "Fee" .6 is .53 after their fee. of which they loaded the card with $371.(fine) I was expecting more like what they advertised... 5%, not 5% plus whatever they can siphon from you...
ended up more like 50%
Totally a rip job.
out of the one whole btc I sent... $371.00!
Also beware of BTC-e if you are American. Although they advertise 24 hour USD Deposits... It does not exist! I have about 20+ emails to & from support on it, and they always act stupid, like they don't understand what I'm saying. They don't even accept US Bank International transfer!
So far, Bitstamp and CampBX are the only ones I have been able to successfully deal with, barring Gox in the old days when they had Dwolla... now that was a really sweet deal...
btc-e is a good exchange. They can handle volume, their API is quick, and I've made good money using them. Like DPoS said "if you need your hand held" then go somewhere else. Thanks for the heads up. Not so much for pointing me to trade on btc-e but in checking btc-e out on wikipedia I saw that the changing foutunes of MtGox, at least their difficulty in exporting dollars for sold btc, has caused the value of btc on MtGox to be inflated compared to other exchanges. The difficulty must be that FINCEN wants more information than they feel comfortable giving. Am I right or has it been made particularly difficult for MtGox, e.g. Bitcoin started there? I recall at the time of the crash MtGox was halting trades trying to stem the carnage. The US stock exchange does the same when stock trading is taking a bad turn. Other exchanges did allow the steep drop and still do. Maybe MtGox is seeing difficulties from US banks for just that reason. If US banks want to destabilize bitcoin they need to be able to manipulate the value, like the rise and fall the day before US Senate hearings on bitcoin. If MtGox was preventing that they needed to flex their muscle. just added a bit Since Bush the banks in this country have the game badly rigged. Like the legal means to convert CDs to bank stock if the bank is failing. They don't want an alternative. --------------- Sorry, it's been rigged since long before that. |
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Beware of BitPlastic
Yet more trouble with Bitplastic for me... BTC being literally stolen by the site owners after they admittedly saw it "Stuck" in the system... they did a "server upgrade" a few days ago, now they act as if the conversation we had never took place, and my BTC is gone. The amounts that DID eventually make it to the card (after depositing the btc about 2 weeks prior) was skimmed yet even more... well beyond and after they took their their "Fee" .6 is .53 after their fee. of which they loaded the card with $371.(fine) I was expecting more like what they advertised... 5%, not 5% plus whatever they can siphon from you...
ended up more like 50%
Totally a rip job.
out of the one whole btc I sent... $371.00!
Also beware of BTC-e if you are American. Although they advertise 24 hour USD Deposits... It does not exist! I have about 20+ emails to & from support on it, and they always act stupid, like they don't understand what I'm saying. They don't even accept US Bank International transfer!
So far, Bitstamp and CampBX are the only ones I have been able to successfully deal with, barring Gox in the old days when they had Dwolla... now that was a really sweet deal...
btc-e is a good exchange. They can handle volume, their API is quick, and I've made good money using them. Like DPoS said "if you need your hand held" then go somewhere else. Thanks for the heads up. Not so much for pointing me to trade on btc-e but in checking btc-e out on wikipedia I saw that the changing foutunes of MtGox, at least their difficulty in exporting dollars for sold btc, has caused the value of btc on MtGox to be inflated compared to other exchanges. The difficulty must be that FINCEN wants more information than they feel comfortable giving. Am I right or has it been made particularly difficult for MtGox, e.g. Bitcoin started there? I recall at the time of the crash MtGox was halting trades trying to stem the carnage. The US stock exchange does the same when stock trading is taking a bad turn. Other exchanges did allow the steep drop and still do. Maybe MtGox is seeing difficulties from US banks for just that reason. If US banks want to destabilize bitcoin they need to be able to manipulate the value, like the rise and fall the day before US Senate hearings on bitcoin. If MtGox was preventing that they needed to flex their muscle. |
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BTC is at 1014 (MtGox) and gold is at 1238. Lets see btc blast past gold and keep climbing.
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Beware of BitPlastic
Yet more trouble with Bitplastic for me... BTC being literally stolen by the site owners after they admittedly saw it "Stuck" in the system... they did a "server upgrade" a few days ago, now they act as if the conversation we had never took place, and my BTC is gone. The amounts that DID eventually make it to the card (after depositing the btc about 2 weeks prior) was skimmed yet even more... well beyond and after they took their their "Fee" .6 is .53 after their fee. of which they loaded the card with $371.(fine) I was expecting more like what they advertised... 5%, not 5% plus whatever they can siphon from you...
ended up more like 50%
Totally a rip job.
out of the one whole btc I sent... $371.00!
Also beware of BTC-e if you are American. Although they advertise 24 hour USD Deposits... It does not exist! I have about 20+ emails to & from support on it, and they always act stupid, like they don't understand what I'm saying. They don't even accept US Bank International transfer!
So far, Bitstamp and CampBX are the only ones I have been able to successfully deal with, barring Gox in the old days when they had Dwolla... now that was a really sweet deal...
Ahh, fond memories of buying my first bitcoins. I figured a round $25 slapped down at a Walmart with Zipzap to MtGox would be the way to go, found an extra charge so it was something like $27 or $28 and I got like 1.6btc as a result. Then Dwolla was much better but at the rate btc was rising in value I went with max ATM withdrawals directly to BOA and into a Bitfloor account, then when half my 401k was in, I drove home from the bank thinking, Okay now I just wait and no more buying until next year - that afternoon after getting home the crash happened. I held fast, not selling, and it hit a low of $56 or so. As it was coming back up I was thinking, damn that was a huge transfer of wealth to those lowlifes yelling SELL SELL on the forums and BFL chat (where reverse pump and dump seems well supported). It started down again and looking at another loss, I tried selling some, only some. When I did it was like they were out to get me, the price rose again and I bought back for a loss. I decided to ignore the day to day price fluctuations and focus on mining. I watch the price, true, but with the resolve I'd not sell in response to the manipulative highs and lows the speculators cause. In for a penny in for a pound, the Merc and upgrade module saved my bacon. I'm in for a Neptune and will decide how many Jups if and when they again become available. I know mining is probably causing darkhorse ASIC development and implementation. There will come a time that even the most efficient and best priced miners will turn out to have been bought at a loss. Maybe this year. Of course if our fantasies are realized and Bitcoin becomes impossibly high valued, like it replaces petrodollars, or Chile demands btc for copper ore, or Greenland wants btc for rare earths, or btc for bauxite, then not. But of course even with that, there will be a time that miner purchase btc won't be returned. Who knows, maybe 3M will decide to cover all the bases and start stockpiling BTC. |
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Here's a blatant divergence from the thread. What the author describes should be good for Bitcoin however. He get annoyed at Happy New Years wishes and decries disasters that might befall the world and the US in the coming year. When he gets to the US economy he postulates:
" But even sooner than a nuclear disaster, we may be facing an even more critical economic disaster -- the catastrophic loss of the dollar’s unique position as the international reserve currency. This is imminent, according to leading economic and political analysts, and would trigger a total collapse of the U.S. banking system, generating explosive financial panic as we are subjected – not only to massive inflation – but also the immediate seizure by failing banks of all our deposits: checking accounts, savings accounts, Certificates of Deposit (CDs), money market funds, pensions, and any other liquid assets. Can failing banks really seize our money “just like that”? Yep, just like that. It is perfectly legal; the enabling “bail-in” laws have already been put on the books in the U.S. and Europe (did you sleep through that?).
And don’t think the FDIC will protect your deposits up to the $250,000 limit promised by this agency. For when the failing banks seize your deposits, they will convert your money into stock in their failed institutions, rendering you “legally compensated” for your loss, and therefore not entitled to reimbursement by the FDIC. Not that it will matter because, by that time, the FDIC will be bankrupt, since it has reserves of only $25 billion, whereas the seized deposits requiring compensation would likely exceed $25 trillion. And even if the FDIC could lay its hands on $25 trillion (fat chance, since this is nearly twice the entire Gross Domestic Product of the United States), another statute now on the books, namely the Bankruptcy Reform Act of 2005, which was arm-twisted into law by Citigroup, JP Morgan, Chase, Wells Fargo and the rest of the usual suspects (bet you slept through that, too), compels the FDIC to give preference to derivatives counter-parties over mere depositors like yourself, whose claims for reimbursement could exceed $600 trillion – or more than the GDP of the entire world economy. "
And this is why I constantly cash my money out of my accounts and then trade that money for gold. Put the gold into a safe in my home that isn't going anywhere. I'd rather have gold any day over real money. Let the US banks fall and crash. This country really needs a good restart. It is the banking industry that is killing this country to being with. They'll stop at nothing to keep their profits high and when they start losing just a little bit or make a little less profit they go crying like babies and threaten the people with dooms day bullshit. This country unfortunately is ran by greed, not capitalism. But then again, both are the same. I look forward to the day. I'll just sit home with my Remington and watch some DVD's.  If the entire economy goes belly up I'm not sure what would have more value down here in the deep south, gold or $20 rolls of quarters. You could trade possum skins and tobaccy. Plenty of possum. Close up the coop at night as possum will rip the heads off chickens, at least that's what I'm told. Tobacacco? raised 20 or 30 plants some years ago. Still have the tobacco. Figured now that it's almost all grown elsewhere in the world, not here for the major cigarette companies, who know what kind of chemicals they use. Not using it tho. Yes, gold or twenty dollar rolls of quarters, reminds me of http://www.amazon.com/The-Crash-Paul-Emil-Erdman/dp/0671223658 The Crash of '79. Short term radiation nukes to take out the population of oil kingdoms, landlord nukes kill people leave the infrastructure, but it went tits up. |
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Here's a blatant divergence from the thread. What the author describes should be good for Bitcoin however. He get annoyed at Happy New Years wishes and decries disasters that might befall the world and the US in the coming year. When he gets to the US economy he postulates:
" But even sooner than a nuclear disaster, we may be facing an even more critical economic disaster -- the catastrophic loss of the dollar’s unique position as the international reserve currency. This is imminent, according to leading economic and political analysts, and would trigger a total collapse of the U.S. banking system, generating explosive financial panic as we are subjected – not only to massive inflation – but also the immediate seizure by failing banks of all our deposits: checking accounts, savings accounts, Certificates of Deposit (CDs), money market funds, pensions, and any other liquid assets. Can failing banks really seize our money “just like that”? Yep, just like that. It is perfectly legal; the enabling “bail-in” laws have already been put on the books in the U.S. and Europe (did you sleep through that?).
And don’t think the FDIC will protect your deposits up to the $250,000 limit promised by this agency. For when the failing banks seize your deposits, they will convert your money into stock in their failed institutions, rendering you “legally compensated” for your loss, and therefore not entitled to reimbursement by the FDIC. Not that it will matter because, by that time, the FDIC will be bankrupt, since it has reserves of only $25 billion, whereas the seized deposits requiring compensation would likely exceed $25 trillion. And even if the FDIC could lay its hands on $25 trillion (fat chance, since this is nearly twice the entire Gross Domestic Product of the United States), another statute now on the books, namely the Bankruptcy Reform Act of 2005, which was arm-twisted into law by Citigroup, JP Morgan, Chase, Wells Fargo and the rest of the usual suspects (bet you slept through that, too), compels the FDIC to give preference to derivatives counter-parties over mere depositors like yourself, whose claims for reimbursement could exceed $600 trillion – or more than the GDP of the entire world economy. "
And this is why I constantly cash my money out of my accounts and then trade that money for gold. Put the gold into a safe in my home that isn't going anywhere. I'd rather have gold any day over real money. Let the US banks fall and crash. This country really needs a good restart. It is the banking industry that is killing this country to being with. They'll stop at nothing to keep their profits high and when they start losing just a little bit or make a little less profit they go crying like babies and threaten the people with dooms day bullshit. This country unfortunately is ran by greed, not capitalism. But then again, both are the same. I look forward to the day. I'll just sit home with my Remington and watch some DVD's. If the entire economy goes belly up I'm not sure what would have more value down here in the deep south, gold or $20 rolls of quarters. |
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Here's a blatant divergence from the thread. What the author describes should be good for Bitcoin however. He get annoyed at Happy New Years wishes and decries disasters that might befall the world and the US in the coming year. When he gets to the US economy he postulates:
" But even sooner than a nuclear disaster, we may be facing an even more critical economic disaster -- the catastrophic loss of the dollar’s unique position as the international reserve currency. This is imminent, according to leading economic and political analysts, and would trigger a total collapse of the U.S. banking system, generating explosive financial panic as we are subjected – not only to massive inflation – but also the immediate seizure by failing banks of all our deposits: checking accounts, savings accounts, Certificates of Deposit (CDs), money market funds, pensions, and any other liquid assets. Can failing banks really seize our money “just like that”? Yep, just like that. It is perfectly legal; the enabling “bail-in” laws have already been put on the books in the U.S. and Europe (did you sleep through that?).
And don’t think the FDIC will protect your deposits up to the $250,000 limit promised by this agency. For when the failing banks seize your deposits, they will convert your money into stock in their failed institutions, rendering you “legally compensated” for your loss, and therefore not entitled to reimbursement by the FDIC. Not that it will matter because, by that time, the FDIC will be bankrupt, since it has reserves of only $25 billion, whereas the seized deposits requiring compensation would likely exceed $25 trillion. And even if the FDIC could lay its hands on $25 trillion (fat chance, since this is nearly twice the entire Gross Domestic Product of the United States), another statute now on the books, namely the Bankruptcy Reform Act of 2005, which was arm-twisted into law by Citigroup, JP Morgan, Chase, Wells Fargo and the rest of the usual suspects (bet you slept through that, too), compels the FDIC to give preference to derivatives counter-parties over mere depositors like yourself, whose claims for reimbursement could exceed $600 trillion – or more than the GDP of the entire world economy. "
And this is why I constantly cash my money out of my accounts and then trade that money for gold. Put the gold into a safe in my home that isn't going anywhere. I'd rather have gold any day over real money. Let the US banks fall and crash. This country really needs a good restart. It is the banking industry that is killing this country to being with. They'll stop at nothing to keep their profits high and when they start losing just a little bit or make a little less profit they go crying like babies and threaten the people with dooms day bullshit. This country unfortunately is ran by greed, not capitalism. But then again, both are the same. I look forward to the day. I'll just sit home with my Remington and watch some DVD's. Type a lot on those old machines do ya? |
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Anyone mining at Ghash.io? I switched from Bitminter and the payout system looks different. At Bitminter you can set a threshold amount and when you reach it you get a payment. I set mine at 1BTC as I try to avoid dust (very small payments) payments). But at Ghash.io you either have: a manual payment with a 0.001 BTC fee, which I would rather avoid. or auto payment with a 0.01 BTC threshold, which is considered dust. But then it says: When enabled - the system will auto-withdraw all funds according to the percentages, as soon as the balance reaches the threshold.
Auto-payouts are triggered once a day, at arbitrary time.
Payout threshold: 0.01 So maybe it will not send me 0.01 every time, but once a day whatever amount I have mined? I'll tell ya, my comfort threshold for $ is a lot less than 1BTC. |
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Interesting. I'd not previously looked at the ASIC selection offered on Amazon. Quite a few. This kind of changes my view of the miner population out there. So many more new miners slapping down dough for devices they'll have in a few days. No wonder the net hashrate has been climbing steadily.
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So, looking back the network protection statement is this:
KnCMiner Network Protection Statement
At KnCMiner we are aware of the service we are providing to our customers. We are also aware that we need our customers to have a return on their devices in order to purchase form us again. With the scale of the supply chains, agreements and factories we have access to, we need to be cautious we don’t ship too many devices and therefore reduce the return to our customers. So with that in mind our plan is to do as follows:
We will ship no devices in December 2013, January 2014 or February 2014. Meaning that once we have taken the difficulty up at the end of November we will not release any more hashing power for 3 months. We will then release our new generation of devices, which will begin shipping in March 2014. These devices will also have a much higher GH/$ rating than any of our current offerings.
We would like to state that If any of our competitors continues to add large amounts of hashing power to the network during December, January or February. We will continue to release our devices as competitively priced as we can to protect our customers share of the network.
Thanks
KnCMiner Team
follow on Twitter | friend on Facebook | forward to a friend
Copyright © 2013 KNCMiner, All rights reserved.
-------------------
I wonder what exactly constitutes "large amounts of hashing power". There's a constant increase - just look at increased difficulty - but one can't point to a large jump indicative of a single large addition.
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Suggested to have bitcoins on hand - burning a hole in my wallet.... So with nothing new today we wait until the 7th.
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"The largest industrial park in the US is located on Long Island - The Hauppauge Industrial Park which houses 1,300 companies and employs more than 55,000 people."
I'm surprised no bitcoin miner has come out of Hauppauge. Corporate attorneys likely nixed the idea opting not to piss off NY banks.
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Hashfast already failed majorly -
Have you a link to the Hashfast failure or are you going on network hashrate not showing a sharp rise? Go check the hashfast threads. Pls find me a happy customer with a piece of hardware in their hands. It's a super hot mess. I dont think hf will ship anything anytime soon if ever. Could they have deliberately signaled pending shipment then withheld to see if some darkhorse ASIC producer/facility would come online - that hoping to stay below the radar? |
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Hashfast already failed majorly -
Have you a link to the Hashfast failure or are you going on network hashrate not showing a sharp rise? |
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KnC can only stay ahead with 20nm
This doesn't really make sense.. if you are trying to scrape another $100 a month on each miner from lower power usage then you really have to rethink how much money you thought you were going to make in the first place. If KNC put their Neptune plans on hold, let those customers switch to newly made Jupiters (or take refund) and ship as many miners in Feb as they can make, they would do fine (and also stay on their word to wait before flooding market) Remember, Cointerra hasn't proved anything yet. Yeah - you are right. They had the choice. Optimizing 28nm and doing serious cash now or going for innovation with 20nm and doing maybe even more serious cash later. Safe (28nm) vs. Risky (20nm). Their business decision was going the (risky) innovative route and I like that. How will turn things out for them? No idea, I dont have a crystal ball at home - I dont know whether R&D expenses and unforeseen problems of 20nm justify the potential 30% power savings. My gut tells me it will be a significant advantage over compitition in 2014/ 2015. Maybe it turns out 20nm is not worth it - we will see. Captain hindsight will provide us the solution soon. My point is, they are still a small company - they decided to go risky 20nm - I decided to go with them. They made the decision, we tied up our money. Stopping that train is not an option any more. They have to put all effort on this now. KnC is all in. Hashfast already failed majorly - have the feeling Cointerra will not, they seem to have a different level of professionalims. My bet would be KnC and Cointerra are the big players in 2014. Others? Dunno, blackarrow seems lacking customer support, Bitmine seems capable but too small. Bfl - no comment. Small company or not, the development lab people wouldn't benefit from the production workers crowding into their lab asking for something to do. While we're sitting here waiting for KnC machines they have production workers with fewer and fewer make-stock-sub-assemblies-for-inventory chores to do. Paid vacation time was great I'm sure but now they're back drawing paychecks and 401k matching contributions. That has to be working toward a decision to get back into Jupiter production. The alternative? |
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