[ESHOP launched] Trezor: Bitcoin hardware wallet

[r3wt]

I would REALLY love it if you can use the device to sign messages as well! I could use it to verify my identity online securely as well. Like a secure pgp key but using Bitcoin private keys to sign the message.

so now all a thieves has to do is find someone with a huge bitcoin wallet. sniff out their ip, reverse lookup ther vpn to find there real address, narrow down your location, come and take you hostage at gun point and force you to give over your "hardware wallet" usb. this makes bitcoin no different than real money now in my opinion.

You would use an address with zero balance of course.

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The device signs things. If you reserve one key in the device for signing messages you have a device that can securely sign messages that can't be forged unless they have the device, no one could steal your identity online with viruses or corrupt sites.

whats stopping them from finding you online though, and coming and physically removing the device from your person?

[Binford 6100]

whats stopping them from finding you online though, and coming and physically removing the device from your person?

this threat is common to all hardware solutions

Cool project, was watching the Trezor Bitcoin Conference 2013 youtube video here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3t18a-wXBnw

finally the video uploaded in full length. I've been trying to watch it for a few days already. previously only partially available

[Ente]

I would REALLY love it if you can use the device to sign messages as well! I could use it to verify my identity online securely as well. Like a secure pgp key but using Bitcoin private keys to sign the message.

so now all a thieves has to do is find someone with a huge bitcoin wallet. sniff out their ip, reverse lookup ther vpn to find there real address, narrow down your location, come and take you hostage at gun point and force you to give over your "hardware wallet" usb. this makes bitcoin no different than real money now in my opinion.

1) You can't just find out the IP of some wallet (without asthonishing effort). You can't reverse-lookup the ip to a home adress (without the law on your side).
2) Explain me how you would give up your hardware wallet at gunpoint, but would refuse to give up your software wallet at gunpoint. As he already knows the balance you have.

The hardware thingie protects you from malicious software, no matter if its a trojan horse on your own computer, or a non-trusted, maybe public computer. That's all. For everything else there are different, better solutions.

Ente

[molecular]

I would REALLY love it if you can use the device to sign messages as well! I could use it to verify my identity online securely as well. Like a secure pgp key but using Bitcoin private keys to sign the message.

so now all a thieves has to do is find someone with a huge bitcoin wallet. sniff out their ip, reverse lookup ther vpn to find there real address, narrow down your location, come and take you hostage at gun point and force you to give over your "hardware wallet" usb. this makes bitcoin no different than real money now in my opinion.

I don't think trezor is meant as a solution for long-term secure wealth storage.

[thatbluedude]

I don't think trezor is meant as a solution for long-term secure wealth storage.

trezor uses an oled screen, don't those degradate over time even when not in use?
maybe they will do a special storage edition with normal lcd later 

[dillpicklechips]

I don't think trezor is meant as a solution for long-term secure wealth storage.

trezor uses an oled screen, don't those degradate over time even when not in use?
maybe they will do a special storage edition with normal lcd later  

I think you can back up the seed for the device and restore that seed in a new one if it fails.

[thatbluedude]

I think you can back up the seed for the device and restore that seed in a new one if it fails.

according to their bitcoin 2013 presentation the seed should be written down during first time setup, but recovery has to use software as you can't input a custom seed. I'm just not sure if using an oled was the best decision. For example, my sega gamegear still works after 20 years. Afaik the use of an oled puts a limitation on the lifespan of the device which could otherwise just last as long as it has no battery or moving parts.

[Ente]

I think you can back up the seed for the device and restore that seed in a new one if it fails.

according to their bitcoin 2013 presentation the seed should be written down during first time setup, but recovery has to use software as you can't input a custom seed. I'm just not sure if using an oled was the best decision. For example, my sega gamegear still works after 20 years. Afaik the use of an oled puts a limitation on the lifespan of the device which could otherwise just last as long as it has no battery or moving parts.

+1 for gamegear!

"Degrading" means that the color shifts because of different degradion of the individual sub-colors. Not nice for watching movies. No problem for reading letters. It's not like the whole display will be black and unreadable.

I insist on exporting/printing/backupping the individual, plain privkeys though. Who knows if there are new trezor' and compatible software in x years. But as long as Bitcoin exists, I will be able to do something with plain private keys.

Ente

[Binford 6100]

I insist on exporting/printing/backupping the individual, plain privkeys though.

I thought they use same seeding algo as electrum (or for this purpose any other deterministic wallet)
so if you're brave enough  you can start using trezor with a seed generated 'elsewhere' and your problem's solved
you'd have your keys anywhere where you'd restore the seed

adding some mathemagic, you could initiate your trezor with a seed derived from a master seed so that you do not even mix key/address pairs from trezor with the rest of your key/address space

[thatbluedude]

"Degrading" means that the color shifts because of different degradion of the individual sub-colors. Not nice for watching movies. No problem for reading letters. It's not like the whole display will be black and unreadable.

I hope so, but some of the pictures I have seen make me doubt that.

oled after 5 years mostly unused. I have seen pictures of one colour displays similar to the ones used by trezor that can't display readable text anymore , but I can't find them again right now.

[piit79]

I hope so, but some of the pictures I have seen make me doubt that.

oled after 5 years mostly unused. I have seen pictures of one colour displays similar to the ones used by trezor that can't display readable text anymore , but I can't find them again right now.

Wow, didn't think it would be that bad Is it possible this was one of the first OLED screens and that the technology has progressed since?

Anyway, I wouldn't expect the lifetime of the Trezor to be longer than 2 years - I'm sure there will be new models we will all want to upgrade to

[SpontaneousDisorder]

I hope so, but some of the pictures I have seen make me doubt that.

oled after 5 years mostly unused. I have seen pictures of one colour displays similar to the ones used by trezor that can't display readable text anymore , but I can't find them again right now.

Wow, didn't think it would be that bad Is it possible this was one of the first OLED screens and that the technology has progressed since?

Anyway, I wouldn't expect the lifetime of the Trezor to be longer than 2 years - I'm sure there will be new models we will all want to upgrade to

The degradation of blue OLEDs is much more of a problem than other colors. Since trezor is white it should perform much better.

[thatbluedude]

any news concerning this?
is there an estimate for when the kickstarter will go live?

[Binford 6100]

any news concerning this?

yup, rainy week, week and a half and floods in their (trezor makers) vicinity and no news from kickstarter.

[stick]

Hi everyone!

We have just launched the Pre-Sales of TREZOR at http://www.BitcoinTrezor.com/eshop/

Our goal is to have TREZOR ready for shipping in autumn but the announced estimates for delivery can change. By pre-ordering TREZOR you will help us start the production. Check out the two different case editions - the TREZOR Classic with a reinforced-plastic case and the TREZOR Metallic made of polished aluminium. No shipping costs for you in pre-sales!

You might want to opt-in to our Newsletter at http://www.BitcoinTrezor.com/ to get fresh updates on the development.

Enjoy and thank you!

[K1773R]

Hi everyone!

We have just launched the Pre-Sales of TREZOR at http://www.BitcoinTrezor.com/eshop/

Our goal is to have TREZOR ready for shipping in autumn but the announced estimates for delivery can change. By pre-ordering TREZOR you will help us start the production. Check out the two different case editions - the TREZOR Classic with a reinforced-plastic case and the TREZOR Metallic made of polished aluminium. No shipping costs for you in pre-sales!

You might want to opt-in to our Newsletter at http://www.BitcoinTrezor.com/ to get fresh updates on the development.

Enjoy and thank you!

are there pictures of prototype cases?

[dillpicklechips]

Hi everyone!

We have just launched the Pre-Sales of TREZOR at http://www.BitcoinTrezor.com/eshop/

Our goal is to have TREZOR ready for shipping in autumn but the announced estimates for delivery can change. By pre-ordering TREZOR you will help us start the production. Check out the two different case editions - the TREZOR Classic with a reinforced-plastic case and the TREZOR Metallic made of polished aluminium. No shipping costs for you in pre-sales!

You might want to opt-in to our Newsletter at http://www.BitcoinTrezor.com/ to get fresh updates on the development.

Enjoy and thank you!

Any chance the device can sign text too? It would be a killer feature.

[elendir]

Great job! Preordered the plastic one.

[piit79]

Also pre-ordered a few. Let's hope the development moves along without delays

[dillpicklechips]

Change the thread title to show trezor can be pre-ordered now. You might get more people checking the thread!