[ESHOP launched] Trezor: Bitcoin hardware wallet

[weaknesswaran]

IS it waterresistant?!

No, source: product comparison in post #902

[User101]

Is it possible to image it and brute force pin bypassing delays between retry ?

more on that please

[Carlton Banks]

What prevents someone from opening it up? Is the case epoxy so that it will self destroy if opened?

It is very hard to open the case without breaking the electronics inside. Also keys are encrypted in chip, so even if someone is able to dump the contents it does not help.

Are you using a 3D printing manufacturing process to achieve this with the plastic edition? (I realise that CNC is traditional subtractive manufacturing, so I guess not with the aluminium edition)

If no, then once you build some more momentum with these devices, please consider additive (3D printed) techniques for mark 2 or mark 3. You could make the shell from a single piece (even in a metal edition). The design of that case could be optimised further, and maybe make it 100% impossible to open without destroying your FLASH (or EEPROM?) memory chip.

[aquarat]

It looks like this point has been touched on before but :

I'd love to buy a Trezor... but a price of $ 697 for the plastic unit is far too high (according to Mt Gox the price of BTC is currently 697 USD and the plastic Trezor is 1 BTC).

Are the creators of this device intending on reducing the price ?

[stick]

Are you using a 3D printing manufacturing process to achieve this with the plastic edition?

No. We use mold casting. That's why the initial costs were quite high.

[StarfishPrime]

paper wallet support encryption, anti teft, disaster recovery if you are not dumb and duplicate them, waterproof with revlar paper

dont underestimate paper  
...

Yes, I was just looking at that chart with waterproof, encrypted revlar or teslin wallets in mind.. They come up ahead in just about every category and you can make multiple copies for backup.

Trezor still rocks, an EMP-hard backup is the only real backup though.

[crazydownloaded]

It looks like this point has been touched on before but :

I'd love to buy a Trezor... but a price of $ 697 for the plastic unit is far too high (according to Mt Gox the price of BTC is currently 697 USD and the plastic Trezor is 1 BTC).

Are the creators of this device intending on reducing the price ?

Absolutely agree with you. $800 (now) is just a "no way", you should definitively index your prices on a less volatile currency (ie fiat). A give us a way to pay either in fiat or in BTC.

[chrisrico]

Here's the thing that sucks about lowering the price... I preordered 6 of these things at 1 BTC each, not thinking that the price would increase so much before they would arrive (they were supposed to ship in October). I might be able to sell 5 of them to local people for 1 BTC each, but definitely not if they can buy them for less from Slush and Stick directly. So because I took a risk and supported this project, I will most likely get screwed to the tune of 5 BTC.

[thatbluedude]

Here's the thing that sucks about lowering the price... I preordered 6 of these things at 1 BTC each, not thinking that the price would increase so much before they would arrive (they were supposed to ship in October). I might be able to sell 5 of them to local people for 1 BTC each, but definitely not if they can buy them for less from Slush and Stick directly. So because I took a risk and supported this project, I will most likely get screwed to the tune of 5 BTC.

I, having a preorder, would request that early preorders get some form of compensation out off goodwill. For example sending preoders an additional trezor at cost or for free some time after release. It would be great if slush could say something in this regard and help release this build up tension as people find themselves much more charitable as they originally intendet.

[marcus_of_augustus]

We're having quite frequent questions about why is TREZOR better than "...".

So we prepared a table comparison of the main features of TREZOR with other tools that are being used as bitcoin storage.



Before posting it to our website, I'd like to ask you for your opinion, mainly to see if the comparison is:

• easy to understand (our english :-) as well as the logic)
• correct (because we intent no harm to anybody)

    
Please don't hesitate to post comments, suggestions or questions. Thanks!

I think without having one to test it is hard to know ... and somewhat speculative also, nice glossy brochure? meh ... hardware on the market, yeh.

[dillpicklechips]

For those who don't trust random number generators it would be nice if you released some type website that you can download and use offline and the page will take many dice rolls and convert it into a seed meant for the trezor.

[btc_uzr]

For those who don't trust random number generators it would be nice if you released some type website that you can download and use offline and the page will take many dice rolls and convert it into a seed meant for the trezor.

I like the idea of being able to change the random-number gen algo. Could be useful for those deeply involved in cryptography, but for all others it would be more a threat than helpful I guess  

[Red Emerald]

I'm not quite sure your comparison chart is fair to paper wallets.

With split keys (Armory) or encrypted keys (BIP38) they should be at least a "possible" in a couple more categories.

I'd also say "Phishing protection" is "n/a" for paper wallets since you have "no" for transaction signing.

And why is BIP32 not listed under paper backup?  You have the Trezor listed as "yes" for BIP32 and "yes" for disaster recovery saying it uses a paper wallet, so it seems like BIP32 should be "possible" for paper wallet.

And for usability, I think it should say "Fast use for Internet transactions."  I can hand you a paper wallet pretty quickly if we are next to each other

That said, I'm super excited for my Trezor!

[NewLiberty]

I'm not quite sure your comparison chart is fair to paper wallets.

With split keys (Armory) or encrypted keys (BIP38) they should be at least a "possible" in a couple more categories.

I'd also say "Phishing protection" is "n/a" for paper wallets since you have "no" for transaction signing.

And why is BIP32 not listed under paper backup?  You have the Trezor listed as "yes" for BIP32 and "yes" for disaster recovery saying it uses a paper wallet, so it seems like BIP32 should be "possible" for paper wallet.

And for usability, I think it should say "Fast use for Internet transactions."  I can hand you a paper wallet pretty quickly if we are next to each other

That said, I'm super excited for my Trezor!

I don't know.  Getting a paper wallet from someone doesn't seem transacted until the coins are removed from it.  Who knows who else may have seen it or have a copy of it.  Until exclusive control of the coins it contains is established, is it a completed transaction?

[Red Emerald]

And for usability, I think it should say "Fast use for Internet transactions."  I can hand you a paper wallet pretty quickly if we are next to each other

I don't know.  Getting a paper wallet from someone doesn't seem transacted until the coins are removed from it.  Who knows who else may have seen it or have a copy of it.  Until exclusive control of the coins it contains is established, is it a completed transaction?

That's reasonable.  Although it takes virtually no time to sweep a wallet, and then the transaction is completed.  The funds aren't in a paper wallet anymore, but the transaction is complete and it can be fast.  I still think this should say "Fast use for Internet transactions."

Also, what stops a USB Flash drive from being BIP 32?  Seems like it should be "possible"

[rammy2k2]

when will these toys be ready ?

[kkurtmann]

When I paid for my Trezor on the first of October, Bitcoin was valued at $140.00USD. I felt comfortable buying one for that much fiat, but I would not consider buying one for $800.00USD.

[FlappySocks]

Why is there so little information about what is going on?

A weekly progress report wouldn't hurt would it?  Is January still a realistic target?

[stick]

Why is there so little information about what is going on?

Because we are busy coding. :-)

A weekly progress report wouldn't hurt would it?

See answer #1.

Is January still a realistic target?

Yes. It is.

[dingrite]

This adds an additional attack surface. And if they make it open source like they claim finding a vulnerability in it might not be difficult, just takes an overflow somewhere.
Hard to implement ASLR well on a device so simple, afaik no one even bothers.

But this would only apply to a compromised system and many tricks are possible with such a system, such as moitoring wallet process memory and getting the private keys or downright making it send all your bitcoins to someone else.

If it comes down to it I'm sure someone will try to make the client give forged requests to the device when you legitimately ask it to sign something and I wonder how many people will read the small screen before hitting the accept button, not many I bet.

This device is security theater. Use an offline old laptop to sign everything. Nothing beats an airgap computer. This device interacts with an online computer directly... really bad theater.