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Author Topic: Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com  (Read 3006577 times)
stoechi
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June 03, 2013, 05:14:06 PM
 #1681

..and yes - to cope with the strange development. Why didnt they wait another 2 weeks for the people to get confident? Hmm..
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June 03, 2013, 05:17:38 PM
 #1682

48 Hours and get in on the lottery. Seriously! They know damn well about Sonny at BFL, yet opt to use a lottery as a marketing ploy.

I'm now guessing that somehow either the meeting(s) will be called off or not all five dudes will be in attendance.

All this has now turned into a money grab ASAP game. Sadly, they'll get the money. Sadly, the product line will be delayed. 28nm--SERIOUSLY!

I have a feeling that you're going to be right about much of this. I don't think that KNC has any malicious intentions, but there are so many things that could go wrong between now and their estimated ship date. With that said, I would never underestimate the hope and greed for those that missed out on AM shares, Avalon batch 1 units, etc.

So, Phinneas, shall we take your post to mean that you definitely won't be placing an order? Wink

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June 03, 2013, 05:26:37 PM
 #1683

From the KNCMiner Email:
Quote
We know a lot of people have ordered the device simply to gain a queue placement for Jupiter and quite a few people have asked us not to send them the device but to charge them and just allow them to use the queue placement.

So given all of the above we have decided that we will remove Mars in its current form from sale.

All I can say is WOW.This is taking the BFL Model to the next level.

Their logic is WE want to GIVE them money, and WE DON'T WANT a product in return (Mars), but WE INSIST on forking over money to them so that in return we might see a product (Saturn, Jupiter) some time in the near future.

Amazing.
Bitcoinorama
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June 03, 2013, 05:27:46 PM
 #1684

48 Hours and get in on the lottery. Seriously! They know damn well about Sonny at BFL, yet opt to use a lottery as a marketing ploy.

I'm now guessing that somehow either the meeting(s) will be called off or not all five dudes will be in attendance.

All this has now turned into a money grab ASAP game. Sadly, they'll get the money. Sadly, the product line will be delayed. 28nm--SERIOUSLY!

I have a feeling that you're going to be right about much of this. I don't think that KNC has any malicious intentions, but there are so many things that could go wrong between now and their estimated ship date. With that said, I would never underestimate the hope and greed for those that missed out on AM shares, Avalon batch 1 units, etc.

So, Phinneas, shall we take your post to mean that you definitely won't be placing an order? Wink

Didn't Phinneas want Sam and a guy from or ORSoC to add a picture of themselves together? Roll Eyes

And probably they don't know about Sonny from BFL, and lottery scams, they would have had to read and followed your posts in other threads.

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stoechi
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June 03, 2013, 05:28:18 PM
 #1685

pfhhheww!! Why do they make it so hard for us to decide?!
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June 03, 2013, 05:32:18 PM
 #1686

This is puzzling.

They say in the newsletter they wouldn't be taking money before showing a working prototype... But then they cancel the "Mars" product, which is the only existing working prototype (and it's a FPGA, not an ASIC!!!!!), while they open payments for the Jupiters and Saturn (ASICs), for which a prototype is yet to be seen, and we have to pay in the next 7 days or we lose your spot in the queue? Plus, they make a lottery in order to get as many customers paying in the next 48 hours, starting from now?

I'm the only one reading some contradictions in all this?

It's called "bait and switch".

I had high hopes for this company, so it's really a shame that they're pulling the same stunts as all the other ASIC manufacturers. FPGA miners have been available for months, so it's really not that impressive to demonstrate a working FPGA miner.

Giving a company pre-order money in hopes of getting a working ASIC miner months later reminds me a lot of betting on a horse race. If you bet on the right horse, you can make a lot of money (Avalon or ASICMiner stock). If you bet on the wrong horse (BFL), you could be left with nothing.

I really hope a very large semiconductor company recognizes the potential of bitcoin mining in the near future and enters the market so we can put an end to all these shenanigans once and for all.
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June 03, 2013, 05:34:07 PM
 #1687

Somebody know something about wire transfer and invoice?

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  So cut, cut, cut me up and fuck, fuck, fuck me up"
mat542
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June 03, 2013, 05:35:23 PM
 #1688

Giving a company pre-order money in hopes of getting a working ASIC miner months later reminds me a lot of betting on a horse race. If you bet on the right horse, you can make a lot of money (Avalon or ASICMiner stock). If you bet on the wrong horse (BFL), you could be left with nothing.

Well, don't know what to think about this company ... I hope it's the right horse.
Anyways I ordered, if anything goes wrong I still have 45 days with Paypal to get my money back.

The order confirmation is partially written in Russian :
navidos
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June 03, 2013, 05:36:46 PM
 #1689

Since i'm in Sweden, I'm waiting for their bank details and perhaps invoice option.
Invoice/Faktura should work only inside Sweden I assume.
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June 03, 2013, 05:37:14 PM
 #1690

This is puzzling.

They say in the newsletter they wouldn't be taking money before showing a working prototype... But then they cancel the "Mars" product, which is the only existing working prototype (and it's a FPGA, not an ASIC!!!!!), while they open payments for the Jupiters and Saturn (ASICs), for which a prototype is yet to be seen, and we have to pay in the next 7 days or we lose your spot in the queue? Plus, they make a lottery in order to get as many customers paying in the next 48 hours, starting from now?

I'm the only one reading some contradictions in all this?

It's called "bait and switch".

I had high hopes for this company, so it's really a shame that they're pulling the same stunts as all the other ASIC manufacturers. FPGA miners have been available for months, so it's really not that impressive to demonstrate a working FPGA miner.

Giving a company pre-order money in hopes of getting a working ASIC miner months later reminds me a lot of betting on a horse race. If you bet on the right horse, you can make a lot of money (Avalon or ASICMiner stock). If you bet on the wrong horse (BFL), you could be left with nothing.

I really hope a very large semiconductor company recognizes the potential of bitcoin mining in the near future and enters the market so we can put an end to all these shenanigans once and for all.

Yep - it forces us to bet significant sums of money in several places at the same time or else risk betting on the losing horse. On the other hand, the risk/reward ratio seems to be high enough for plenty of customers to accept sending large sums of money to unproven firms. Despite all the delays, poor customer service, the new pre-orders at BFL never seemed to cease.

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June 03, 2013, 05:38:52 PM
 #1691

You guys are hard to please.  

a) The mars product was just to show that they could set a target and actually deliver somewhat on time.  They delivered.  There is no need to actually bring that product to market.  It will only lose you money and cost them time.  I applaud their decision to drop it.
b) They are nothing like BFL.  BFL would have taken money day 1 and would have insulted you for questioning their time frame or progress.  Comparing the two just makes you sound ignorant.
c) Nobody else is even talking about 28nm technology, these units will be hashing long after others have been turned off due to electricity costs.

I have ordered using Paypal and a CC, there is roughly a %0 chance that I will lose my money from fraud or non-shipment.  I love bitcoin, but this is one of those instances where using bitcoin increases your risk by an infinite amount.  Pay with Paypal and stop all the FUD.

I don't even know why I'm posting this as the less of you that pull the trigger, the better my chances of winning the lotto.
Twh
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June 03, 2013, 05:41:32 PM
 #1692

I had high hopes for this company, so it's really a shame that they're pulling the same stunts as all the other ASIC manufacturers. FPGA miners have been available for months, so it's really not that impressive to demonstrate a working FPGA miner.

Giving a company pre-order money in hopes of getting a working ASIC miner months later reminds me a lot of betting on a horse race. If you bet on the right horse, you can make a lot of money (Avalon or ASICMiner stock). If you bet on the wrong horse (BFL), you could be left with nothing.

I really hope a very large semiconductor company recognizes the potential of bitcoin mining in the near future and enters the market so we can put an end to all these shenanigans once and for all.
The point of the FPGA was to prove that they can develop a product quickly and produce it in large quantities. The first they did actually achieve, the latter they did not; I'm not particularly upset that they aren't going to deliver the FPGA since it really was useless. Whether or not I order is entirely dependent on whether my bank covers the purchase, if they do, there isn't really much to lose, and as such I don't really see what's everyone getting upset about either.
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June 03, 2013, 05:43:00 PM
 #1693

You guys are hard to please.  

a) The mars product was just to show that they could set a target and actually deliver somewhat on time.  They delivered.  There is no need to actually bring that product to market.  It will only lose you money and cost them time.  I applaud their decision to drop it.
b) They are nothing like BFL.  BFL would have taken money day 1 and would have insulted you for questioning their time frame or progress.  Comparing the two just makes you sound ignorant.
c) Nobody else is even talking about 28nm technology, these units will be hashing long after others have been turned off due to electricity costs.

I have ordered using Paypal and a CC, there is roughly a %0 chance that I will lose my money from fraud or non-shipment.  I love bitcoin, but this is one of those instances where using bitcoin increases your risk by an infinite amount.  Pay with Paypal and stop all the FUD.

I don't even know why I'm posting this as the less of you that pull the trigger, the better my chances of winning the lotto.

If Paypal covers your purchase for 45 days, how are you protected if the earliest this product will ship is September?
Bitcoinorama
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June 03, 2013, 05:46:42 PM
 #1694

You guys are hard to please.  

a) The mars product was just to show that they could set a target and actually deliver somewhat on time.  They delivered.  There is no need to actually bring that product to market.  It will only lose you money and cost them time.  I applaud their decision to drop it.
b) They are nothing like BFL.  BFL would have taken money day 1 and would have insulted you for questioning their time frame or progress.  Comparing the two just makes you sound ignorant.
c) Nobody else is even talking about 28nm technology, these units will be hashing long after others have been turned off due to electricity costs.

I have ordered using Paypal and a CC, there is roughly a %0 chance that I will lose my money from fraud or non-shipment.  I love bitcoin, but this is one of those instances where using bitcoin increases your risk by an infinite amount.  Pay with Paypal and stop all the FUD.

I don't even know why I'm posting this as the less of you that pull the trigger, the better my chances of winning the lotto.

If Paypal covers your purchase for 45 days, how are you protected if the earliest this product will ship is September?

Call your Credit Card company explain the September/October(in case) time of delivery and see if you are still covered after Paypal's 45 days buyer protection finishes. I was surprised they do. That was UK Barclaycard. I rang earlier today and the fraud protection lady said they would. I actually recorded her too! There's actually instances in the past that would have been useful to know...

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June 03, 2013, 05:53:39 PM
 #1695

My confidence in these guys has dropped to zero. Their infrequent news updates invalidates the last.

Why would you be working day & night on a FPGA product you have no intention of shipping?
They were clearly no way near full production of the Mars.  

At least with the Mars you were getting something for your money. Now we are being asked to fund the ASIC development, with all the risks.

BFL all over again.  I'm out.  Open to offers for my place in the queue.
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June 03, 2013, 06:04:27 PM
 #1696

Guys, do you know if with "Gold mastercard" we're having a sort of extended warranty with Paypal ?
Like more than 45 days ?

Call them. Their number is on your "Gold mastercard" Roll Eyes
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June 03, 2013, 06:32:18 PM
 #1697

bump
Flying Hellfish
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June 03, 2013, 06:33:12 PM
 #1698

This is puzzling.

They say in the newsletter they wouldn't be taking money before showing a working prototype... But then they cancel the "Mars" product, which is the only existing working prototype (and it's a FPGA, not an ASIC!!!!!), while they open payments for the Jupiters and Saturn (ASICs), for which a prototype is yet to be seen, and we have to pay in the next 7 days or we lose your spot in the queue? Plus, they make a lottery in order to get as many customers paying in the next 48 hours, starting from now?

I'm the only one reading some contradictions in all this?

It's called "bait and switch".

I had high hopes for this company, so it's really a shame that they're pulling the same stunts as all the other ASIC manufacturers. FPGA miners have been available for months, so it's really not that impressive to demonstrate a working FPGA miner.

Giving a company pre-order money in hopes of getting a working ASIC miner months later reminds me a lot of betting on a horse race. If you bet on the right horse, you can make a lot of money (Avalon or ASICMiner stock). If you bet on the wrong horse (BFL), you could be left with nothing.

I really hope a very large semiconductor company recognizes the potential of bitcoin mining in the near future and enters the market so we can put an end to all these shenanigans once and for all.


+1000

This wild west cowboy pre-order horse shit is getting old FAST.  Long term (at least in bitcoin terms) interest free loans (which is what I consider all this pre-order BS) are a stone cold gamble on the lenders (purchasers) part and a wet fucking dream come true for the developing company.

So good luck to all the gamblers pre-ordering enjoy shouldering the majority of the risk for yet another start up ASIC manufacture.
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June 03, 2013, 06:35:17 PM
 #1699

Heh. You should start a ASIC-dream manufacturing company. They nearly all end up being successful, from the seller's POV.

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June 03, 2013, 06:37:49 PM
 #1700

  Roll Eyes

Quote
8. Delivery Terms

8.1  The Products are delivered EXW (Incoterms 2010) to the delivery address specified by the Purchaser, unless otherwise agreed. The delivery date is provided for information purposes only and shall not be binding on KnCMiner. The Purchaser is not entitled to refuse acceptance of the Products, withdraw, cancel or revoke the order or make claims for compensation due to any delayed delivery.

8.2  Where delivery is delayed due to any of the circumstances constituting force majeure in accordance with 11 below or due to any act or omission by the Purchaser, the delivery period shall be extended by such a period as is reasonable in light of the circumstances.  The delivery period shall also be extended where the cause of the delay arises after the expiry of the originally agreed delivery period.

8.3  If the delivery is prevented due to the Purchaser’s negligent acts or omissions, the risk for the Products shall pass to the Purchaser on the date when the Products were ready for delivery. In case of any damage to delivered Products and/or its packaging, the Purchaser is solely responsible for making any reservation or claim for compensation in relation to the relevant appropriate logistics/freight company.
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