Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[jbreher]

So you cede that these issues exist. Great.

Did my reply imply as much? I don't think they are issues - that's why I was asking. After bitserve, fluidjax too pointed out the meaninglessness of focusing on 51% attacks as segwit-specific attack vectors.

Fungibility isn't a real issue, either - still IMHO. As SW transactions become the majority, only old or newborn coins will be left in your Type 1 (coins that were never touched by a SW transaction). Besides, LN acts as a kind of giant mega-tumbler. If/when LN really gets into widespread use, it will only help fungibility rather than undermine it.

Segwit isn't flawed all of Jbrehere arguments are all flawed 

Typical Bcasher's echo chamber.

Haha. D^4, you have all the arguing skills of a precocious seven year old.

kampai!

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[qwizzie]

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/06/18/bitcoin-jumps-after-new-york-approves-squares-cash-app-for-crypto-trading.html

New York's Department of Financial Services granted Square a virtual currency license, allowing users of the Cash app in the state to trade bitcoin.
Cash has 7 million monthly active users, the company said in its first quarter earnings call.

Looks like New York is getting a little bit more crypto friendly.

[jbreher]

As I posted between there and here, Segwit creates three classes of Bitcoins. Each with distinctly different exposure to security vulnerabilities. 
1) Those that are completely free of any Segwit taint all the way back to their constituent coinbase transactions;
2) Those that are not currently output from a Segwit transaction, but have Segwit taint between here and their constituent coinbase transactions; and
3) Those that are the output of a Segwit transaction.

now trying to pervert the concept of fungibility.

Just because a coin is being used in a specific way that does not make such coin more or less fungible than if such coin is used in another way.

Geeze, JJG - you need to look up the definition of 'fungible'.

Geez jbreher... I see no reason for me to look up anything related to fungibility.  You are trying to make some kind of assertion that lack of fungibility is an issue, and seems that you are just making shit up.

Absolutely false. I am merely saying that Segwit creates a triple-classed asset. And that this is by definition a lack of fungibility. You said that I am "now trying to pervert the concept of fungibility". You were 100% wrong. Own it.

That is definitively a lack of fungibility. A lack of fungibility is in no way limited to some sort of centralized blacklisting.

O.k.  Fungibility issues would exist if some coins were easier to spend then others or if I could not get my coins sent because of some issue with them being tainted in some kind of way.  Again, where is the evidence of this seemingly fabricated issue  (and if it is not completely fabricated it is surely greatly exaggerated)?

The evidence is already given. Segwit creates a triple-classed asset. And that this is by definition a lack of fungibility.

Sure some BIG BLOCKER nutjobs are going to continue to exaggerate negative speculation, like you seem to be doing, and to spread disinformation about supposed catastrophes of lightning network in order to pump their stupid-ass and largely non-substantiated negative talking points.

If you want to argue the facts of the matter, step up. I made some assertions of fact.

Assertions of facts do not make facts,

true

if you don't show evidence.

but I did.

Pony up some counter-arguments. If what I said is 'disinformation', then it should be a simple matter for you to put forth proof that they are false.

I have no burden to put forth facts to rebut your bare assertions, because I have not seen anything rising to the level of meaningful facts (beyond assertions about what could happen ... not something that is actually happening)

Facts about what could happen. Exactly.

[jbreher]

-edited-

Might have some relevance.

Speaking of relevance little bear..


Is this really about bitcoin and bitcoin cash fighting it out? or is this about a community that stands together against the status quo of fiat and centralized banking? Seems to me there is much effort wasted in this dialogue worrying about "future problems" when we are surrounded on all sides.

Agreed.

One might note that I am playing defense here.

That is bullshit.  You are not playing defense unless you actually present non-speculative facts.  If there is some innocent claim here, then I will be open to hear it.  Your framing the matter as if you are "playing defense" is to attempt to assert that you have already presented valid facts and logic and I doubt that is the case, unless I am missing something.

Not only are you missing something, you are conflating two distinctly different discussions within a single thread.

Flail away, JJG - flail away.

[Ibian]

' Bitcoin is not centralised so per definition not stable'

I love stuff like this.

Define centralised. Define stable. Explain how one follows the other by definition. What's that shitcake? You can't? Well then fuck you.

Also shitcake is now a word, spellchecker.

[El duderino_]

Bitmex is a bucketshop you noobs.  It does not matter who gets liquidated or longs or shorts there.  Bitmex positions don't drive the market; people would manipulate the real market to blow up Bitmex positions, not vice versa.  But what type of serious money would actually trade on a fucking bucketshop scam site in the first place?  If people were manipulating the real bitcoin market solely to try and sway positions on some tiny bucket shop nobody sane would actually trade on, it means the bitcoin market is far more pitiful than anyone could imagine.

[JayJuanGee]

This discussion is lame. I have ALL of what you are suggesting men can’t have. I’ve had it all.

Virgins, models, women richer than me, women poorer than me, marriage, beautiful long term monogamous relationships, threesomes, and variations of the above.  Out of over 100 women exactly 2 broke up with me and only 1 because she was trying to climb some stability ladder.

You guys that don’t get this, you need more charisma, confidence, self knowledge and personal responsibility.

I'm not seeing a stable life on your list.

What the fuck is a stable life?

I’ve lived a full rich meaningful life full of love. And I’m not even half way through with it. Stable? I don’t even know what that’s supposed to mean.

Right. A hard r-type. Good for you, but the problem is that the more people like you we have the closer we get to a large percentage of the population dying.

What the fuck is your problem? The point I was trying to make that was completely LOST on you, is stop complaining about your life and lack of female resources available to you and stop making excuses blaming women or blaming the internet or blaming whatever and MAN THE FUCK UP. Thats why I love decentralized crypto. It forces people to take responsibility for themselves. To be totally self accountable.

Its the same with every other aspect of life. When you stop seeing yourself as a VICTIM and start realizing that you are responsible for 99.9% of the shit that happens to you, then you make the first step to actually having the life you want.

Do you have kids?

My fiancee is due literally any day now.

I thought that you were a player? 

Now you have a pregnant fiancee?   

Can there be both?  You must have to dump the fiancee, when?  soon^tm, right?   

[Paashaas]

Haha. D^4, you have all the arguing skills of a precocious seven year old.

kampai!

Straight from the Bcash handbook: accuse your opponent of what you are doing.

Nice try Jonald Fyookball.

[Paashaas]

' Bitcoin is not centralised so per definition not stable'

I love stuff like this.

Define centralised. Define stable. Explain how one follows the other by definition. What's that shitcake? You can't? Well then fuck you.

Also shitcake is now a word, spellchecker.

Here is a download link link to the primary source PDF on that BIS hit piece from the other day

https://www.bis.org/publ/arpdf/ar2018e5.htm

Jojo69 made a link to a 24 page report. Go read it just like i did.

To lazy to click you idiot?

[regent4]

hourly
https://i.imgur.com/G7QnQnG.png

daily
https://i.imgur.com/IQQeRZo.png

3 day analysis
http://blockchainshowdown.blogspot.com/2018/06/btc-usd-19th-june-2018.html

[Ibian]

' Bitcoin is not centralised so per definition not stable'

I love stuff like this.

Define centralised. Define stable. Explain how one follows the other by definition. What's that shitcake? You can't? Well then fuck you.

Also shitcake is now a word, spellchecker.

Here is a download link link to the primary source PDF on that BIS hit piece from the other day

https://www.bis.org/publ/arpdf/ar2018e5.htm

Jojo69 made a link to a 24 page report. Go read it just like i dit.

To lazy to click you idiot?

That... wasn't aimed at you. Just commenting.

[kromer]

Nothing stirs up a debate quite like talking about women. Better to ignore them. That's what they want, right? 

MGIOW is the answer. Bitcoin = MGIOW: Money Going It's Own Way.

[becoin]

Well, thank you for the cheap coins. 2018 bottom confirmed. Up we go!

[El duderino_]

Well, thank you for the cheap coins. 2018 bottom confirmed. Up we go!

it would be nice if this would be the real bottom hope youre right
let there be some new long term hodlers be to join the community , few friends of me also got in on this DIP or bought a little more so whatever i am happy for the LONG term believers that got a nice oppertunity of increasing there amount of BTC's

[CookieFactory]

As I posted between there and here, Segwit creates three classes of Bitcoins. Each with distinctly different exposure to security vulnerabilities. 
1) Those that are completely free of any Segwit taint all the way back to their constituent coinbase transactions;
2) Those that are not currently output from a Segwit transaction, but have Segwit taint between here and their constituent coinbase transactions; and
3) Those that are the output of a Segwit transaction.

now trying to pervert the concept of fungibility.

Just because a coin is being used in a specific way that does not make such coin more or less fungible than if such coin is used in another way.

Geeze, JJG - you need to look up the definition of 'fungible'.

Geez jbreher... I see no reason for me to look up anything related to fungibility.  You are trying to make some kind of assertion that lack of fungibility is an issue, and seems that you are just making shit up.

Absolutely false. I am merely saying that Segwit creates a triple-classed asset. And that this is by definition a lack of fungibility. You said that I am "now trying to pervert the concept of fungibility". You were 100% wrong. Own it.

That is definitively a lack of fungibility. A lack of fungibility is in no way limited to some sort of centralized blacklisting.

O.k.  Fungibility issues would exist if some coins were easier to spend then others or if I could not get my coins sent because of some issue with them being tainted in some kind of way.  Again, where is the evidence of this seemingly fabricated issue  (and if it is not completely fabricated it is surely greatly exaggerated)?

The evidence is already given. Segwit creates a triple-classed asset. And that this is by definition a lack of fungibility.

Sure some BIG BLOCKER nutjobs are going to continue to exaggerate negative speculation, like you seem to be doing, and to spread disinformation about supposed catastrophes of lightning network in order to pump their stupid-ass and largely non-substantiated negative talking points.

If you want to argue the facts of the matter, step up. I made some assertions of fact.

Assertions of facts do not make facts,

true

if you don't show evidence.

but I did.

Pony up some counter-arguments. If what I said is 'disinformation', then it should be a simple matter for you to put forth proof that they are false.

I have no burden to put forth facts to rebut your bare assertions, because I have not seen anything rising to the level of meaningful facts (beyond assertions about what could happen ... not something that is actually happening)

Facts about what could happen. Exactly.

Curious, are dollars (USD) fungible? Are physical dollar bills and dollars which only exist in a bank ledger separate asset classes? What about dollar bills that have been marked in some way?

[Raja_MBZ]

Credits: shippr021

[jojo69]

Curious, are dollars (USD) fungible? Are physical dollar bills and dollars which only exist in a bank ledger separate asset classes? What about dollar bills that have been marked in some way?

they can certainly become non fungible

like when they called in the silver certificates

[RayX12]

Good memories!  

[Vin]

Good memories!  

Just wait a bit

[RayX12]

Good memories!  

Just wait a bit

Or this one!