Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[infofront]

So: topic swerve.

All y'all may recall I've been looking to Puerto Rico as a means of reducing capital gains taxes owed (I'm 'Merkin). But I've just learned of another (legitimate - according to IRS) potential route out of the system that may be as interesting:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/forbesdigitalcovers/2018/07/17/an-unlikely-group-of-billionaires-and-politicians-has-created-the-most-unbelievable-tax-break-ever/

Anyone interested in forming a study group? Or is there some other subforum here in BCT that might be better for such a discussion?

Thank you for the link. Extremely interesting.

North Charleston, South Carolina, might be the most misnamed place in America, a path through a weedy, desolate neighborhood with 20% unemployment and a 40% poverty rate.

Can I invest in meth labs?

Grr. Be serious for a moment, dammit! This is potentially useful to a good number of us here. Boblawblaw? Where you at? I know you've got me on ignore, but this should be very interesting to you too.

 This could be an opportunity for a seasteading Bitcoinist.  Set up shop in an o-zone (numa numa) to build components for the steads.  Dodge some tax money, employ a few people who need it and help to build your new community in the equatorial zone.  Win win win.

FryePondering.png "Not sure if serious...or trolling me".

No. The tax advantage bestowed by this program is only for investment in specially designated Opportunity Zones - all within the US, and in areas deemed economically disadvantaged in relation to surrounding locale. Unsuitable in the least for seasteading.

I think he meant that you could manufacture the platforms and other components for the seastead in an opportunity zone. Then transport them someplace.

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[Anon136]

Bcashers.....lol.



https://thundermessage.com/

I don't understand bcashers. You can not scale on chain. It's complete madness. The math is so simple. Are they completely math illiterate or do I misunderstand their movement and ideas in some way?

[Rosewater Foundation]

Bcashers.....lol.



https://thundermessage.com/

I don't understand bcashers. You can not scale on chain. It's complete madness. The math is so simple. Are they completely math illiterate or do I misunderstand their movement and ideas in some way?

Have you considered the possibility that some people don't want babies to die for no good reason?

[Elwar]

Bcashers.....lol.



https://thundermessage.com/

I don't understand bcashers. You can not scale on chain. It's complete madness. The math is so simple. Are they completely math illiterate or do I misunderstand their movement and ideas in some way?

Even if bcash is better, look at IPv4 and IPv6. IPv6 is objectively the better standard. It has enough IP addresses that you could have one for every electronic device in your home.

IPv6 has been around since the late 90s. And yet we still use IPv4. Why? Everything has been built on IPv4. It's established. Getting everyone on the Internet to migrate to IPv6 just never happened. Could it? Should it? Maybe. But it didn't.

With limited IP addresses the Internet stopped working right? No. They just adapted and used various layers to represent the various devices you use every day. You may have one router in your home which then assigns a local IP to your computers and phones. Most people have dynamic IP addresses so that when someone's no longer using an IP address it doesn't just sit there, it can be used by someone else. The Internet adapted. The end of the world did not happen as the IPv6 advocates proclaimed would happen once we ran out of IP addresses.

So work with the current Bitcoin protocol and do what you can to make that work because that's what we've got.

IPv6 is used for some LANs and other things within businesses. Maybe bcash can go that route. Who knows.

[jbreher]

I don't understand bcashers. You can not scale on chain. It's complete madness. The math is so simple. Are they completely math illiterate or do I misunderstand their movement and ideas in some way?

You merely misunderstand the ratio of the time derivative of adoption to the time derivative of technology's capacity for transactions.

[Anon136]

I don't understand bcashers. You can not scale on chain. It's complete madness. The math is so simple. Are they completely math illiterate or do I misunderstand their movement and ideas in some way?

You merely misunderstand the ratio of the time derivative of adoption to the time derivative of technology's capacity for transactions.

Yeaaaaa no I don't.

Average bitcoin transaction 0.00000025gb
Half the people on earth use bitcoin 3.5billion
Each person does about 5 transactions a day
144 blocks in a day
 
0.00000025*3.5billion*5/144=30gb blocks. 30 gb every 10 minutes people would need to download. Do you have any clue just how far away from that we are? Moore's law or not? That would be 1.5petabytes per year. That's ~16 yeas IF Moore's law holds. Which, by the way, it hasn't been lately. And even then, that's only regular transactions. That's at best only replacing traditional finance. No innovation there. No pay as you go. No IOT markets. No decentralizing the internet. No micro transactions. It's a piss poor vision for the future.

[marcus_of_augustus]

I don't understand bcashers. You can not scale on chain. It's complete madness. The math is so simple. Are they completely math illiterate or do I misunderstand their movement and ideas in some way?

You merely misunderstand the ratio of the time derivative of adoption to the time derivative of technology's capacity for transactions.

... or you do?

Why don't you just write down this ever-so-simple equation that explains where everybody else fucked up and shows simply why Bcash is the embodiment of the time derivative ratio of adoption to technology?

You are so full of shit ... isn't it time you got the fuck outta here with your Bcash shilling and pumping?

[Karartma1]

Bcashers.....lol.



https://thundermessage.com/

I don't understand bcashers. You can not scale on chain. It's complete madness. The math is so simple. Are they completely math illiterate or do I misunderstand their movement and ideas in some way?

Even if bcash is better, look at IPv4 and IPv6. IPv6 is objectively the better standard. It has enough IP addresses that you could have one for every electronic device in your home.

IPv6 has been around since the late 90s. And yet we still use IPv4. Why? Everything has been built on IPv4. It's established. Getting everyone on the Internet to migrate to IPv6 just never happened. Could it? Should it? Maybe. But it didn't.

With limited IP addresses the Internet stopped working right? No. They just adapted and used various layers to represent the various devices you use every day. You may have one router in your home which then assigns a local IP to your computers and phones. Most people have dynamic IP addresses so that when someone's no longer using an IP address it doesn't just sit there, it can be used by someone else. The Internet adapted. The end of the world did not happen as the IPv6 advocates proclaimed would happen once we ran out of IP addresses.

So work with the current Bitcoin protocol and do what you can to make that work because that's what we've got.

IPv6 is used for some LANs and other things within businesses. Maybe bcash can go that route. Who knows.

Reasonable enough for me. Excellent comparison

[Phil_S]

New from Masterluc:

I like this early February stuff, the graph is freaky:

https://vk.com/bitcoin_vanga?w=wall-130254204_9481

[JayJuanGee]

Bcashers.....lol.



https://thundermessage.com/

I don't understand bcashers. You can not scale on chain. It's complete madness. The math is so simple. Are they completely math illiterate or do I misunderstand their movement and ideas in some way?

Even if bcash is better, look at IPv4 and IPv6. IPv6 is objectively the better standard. It has enough IP addresses that you could have one for every electronic device in your home.

IPv6 has been around since the late 90s. And yet we still use IPv4. Why? Everything has been built on IPv4. It's established. Getting everyone on the Internet to migrate to IPv6 just never happened. Could it? Should it? Maybe. But it didn't.

With limited IP addresses the Internet stopped working right? No. They just adapted and used various layers to represent the various devices you use every day. You may have one router in your home which then assigns a local IP to your computers and phones. Most people have dynamic IP addresses so that when someone's no longer using an IP address it doesn't just sit there, it can be used by someone else. The Internet adapted. The end of the world did not happen as the IPv6 advocates proclaimed would happen once we ran out of IP addresses.

So work with the current Bitcoin protocol and do what you can to make that work because that's what we've got.

IPv6 is used for some LANs and other things within businesses. Maybe bcash can go that route. Who knows.

You seem to be giving bcashers too much benefit of the doubt, that they really believe their own bullshit about supposed on-chain scaling and that on-chain scaling is preferred.  They probably could not code their way out of a wet paper bag, so, I doubt that any of their technology is superior, which seems to be the hypothesized presumption that you are presenting.

[ivomm]

From Max Keiser tweet (https://twitter.com/maxkeiser/status/1022257638283857922)
Jamie Dimon checks Bitcoin price

[jbreher]

I don't understand bcashers. You can not scale on chain. It's complete madness. The math is so simple. Are they completely math illiterate or do I misunderstand their movement and ideas in some way?

You merely misunderstand the ratio of the time derivative of adoption to the time derivative of technology's capacity for transactions.

Yeaaaaa no I don't.

Average bitcoin transaction 0.00000025gb
Half the people on earth use bitcoin 3.5billion
Each person does about 5 transactions a day
144 blocks in a day
 
0.00000025*3.5billion*5/144=30gb blocks. 30 gb every 10 minutes people would need to download. Do you have any clue just how far away from that we are? Moore's law or not? That would be 1.5petabytes per year. That's ~16 yeas IF Moore's law holds. Which, by the way, it hasn't been lately. And even then, that's only regular transactions. That's at best only replacing traditional finance. No innovation there. No pay as you go. No IOT markets. No decentralizing the internet. No micro transactions. It's a piss poor vision for the future.

With all due respect, blah blah blah.

You explain to me how 9 billion people are able to merely open a single Lightning Network channel in under three decades, and we have the start of a conversation*. Otherwise, you're just blowing smoke. AAR, you are certainly not responding to the ratio of the time derivative of adoption to the time derivative of technology's capacity for transactions.

*and then we can move on to the more interesting topic of how permissionless, pseudonymous routing can be done in a network where participants can come and go as they please

[jbreher]

They probably could not code their way out of a wet paper bag

Haha. There's a better than 50-50 chance that your computer -- yes the very one on which you are writing your ignorant missive -- is utterly dependent upon my code. What have you coded, JJG?

In the interest of full disclosure, it should be admitted that I have not contributed code to any cryptocurrency project.

[ChinkyEyes]

Good Vid on current situation.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mH87sZxg-98

A small dump ,enough to see tera coming back ??

that was nice to see.

Can someone with knowledge of the ETF markets comment on this? It reads to me like the market manipulation safeguards are not in place for an ETF to be passed YET but are being implemented now (Coinbase/Goldman-Sachs) and that the futures (CME/Cboe) are not adequate for acceptance.

https://www.sec.gov/comments/sr-nysearca-2018-02/nysearca201802-3676326-162451.pdf

Sorry trying to quote out of a pdf is a pain and I'm not going to reformat by hand (if anyone has a tool that will do this please link).

You can convert pdfs to word documents, just google it it's very easy. Use to do it quite often in college when I was plagiarizing things.

On topic, I personally think ETF's are coming just not on 10th of August. We will probably see a small drop when they delay it on the 10th. Most likely a bear trap, after that I think we will moon. All the news coming out and the price going up doesn't look like a coincidence to me. But then again what do I know I am a random stranger on the interwebz dyor.

[JayJuanGee]

They probably could not code their way out of a wet paper bag

Haha. There's a better than 50-50 chance that your computer -- yes the very one on which you are writing your ignorant missive -- is utterly dependent upon my code. What have you coded, JJG?

Get the fuck out of here with your attempt at pulling technical status rank, jbreher, because I could give a ratt's ass about your supposed technical skills as compared to mine.

Furthermore the topic that I was responding to was concerning the technical skills of the bcash team as compared to the bitcoin team, and don't be trying to imply that there is any kind of level of equivalency there.. because my main point was that the whole bcash shit show remains a scam rather than a real project, and it is also used as a vehicle to attack bitcoin rather than to provide any meaningful or useful value to the world....

To the extent that bcash might happen to contribute value will likely be incidental rather than any kind of meaningful innovation or even collaborative seriousness about it (in place of feigning seriousness in order to continue scamming folks to the extent that they can get away with it - especially engaging in deception to make themselves appear as if they were the real bitcoin).

In the interest of full disclosure, it should be admitted that I have not contributed code to any cryptocurrency project.

fair enough about that disclosure, to the extent that there is any need to discuss personal contributions, beyond your having had brought it up here.

[Robin,Hood]

What is the net result of the mob style introduction of lightning.

1.) shifted the only alternative from litecoin to bitcoin cash
2.) created numerous forks all (most) share the same deflation aspect making bitcoin weaker in the process
3.) created disharmony, lawsuits, confusion and personal insults

I could not care less about Roger or Dr. whats his name. I care about the technical aspect and generally myself.
Isn't there some old saying, Better the Devil you know that the one not known.

Is the forced deviation for pure personal gains/interests by a bunch of individuals of which Lee was one of the main characters (and now wants unlimited bitcoin because of security issues) and had to venture several times to china to convince the miners (and probably forget a suitcase full of coins in the office) in the process or is there a deeper reason?

It is plain stupid to tell someone to buy some money. Bitcoin is an investment. Far better tools exist or can be used to pay for a coffee....
Money has no value it is just a tool. To add the bill of the coffee to my phone bill is just fine at the same time i would not top the phone up with life savings or some crazy amount.

Lighting is akin to ripple tech, no-one with sound mind sinks so low.

[JayJuanGee]

What is the net result of the mob style introduction of lightning.

1.) shifted the only alternative from litecoin to bitcoin cash
2.) created numerous forks all (most) share the same deflation aspect making bitcoin weaker in the process
3.) created disharmony, lawsuits, confusion and personal insults

I could not care less about Roger or Dr. whats his name. I care about the technical aspect and generally myself.
Isn't there some old saying, Better the Devil you know that the one not known.

Is the forced deviation for pure personal gains/interests by a bunch of individuals of which Lee was one of the main characters (and now wants unlimited bitcoin because of security issues) and had to venture several times to china to convince the miners (and probably forget a suitcase full of coins in the office) in the process or is there a deeper reason?

It is plain stupid to tell someone to buy some money. Bitcoin is an investment. Far better tools exist or can be used to pay for a coffee....
Money has no value it is just a tool. To add the bill of the coffee to my phone bill is just fine at the same time i would not top the phone up with life savings or some crazy amount.

Lighting is akin to ripple tech, no-one with sound mind sinks so low.

I don't claim to have a lot of technical skills, but I fail to understand the jist of your supposed concern about lightning...   From what I understand, lighting is in a testing phase that is getting a lot of increased usage, use of lightning is voluntary, lightning is largely pegged to bitcoin, so I have no idea how it could reasonably in any way be related to a centralized supply scam, such as ripple.

[Last of the V8s]

They probably could not code their way out of a wet paper bag

Haha. There's a better than 50-50 chance that your computer -- yes the very one on which you are writing your ignorant missive -- is utterly dependent upon my code. What have you coded, JJG?

In the interest of full disclosure, it should be admitted that I have not contributed code to any cryptocurrency project.

What code did you write?

[jbreher]

They probably could not code their way out of a wet paper bag

Haha. There's a better than 50-50 chance that your computer -- yes the very one on which you are writing your ignorant missive -- is utterly dependent upon my code. What have you coded, JJG?

In the interest of full disclosure, it should be admitted that I have not contributed code to any cryptocurrency project.

What code did you write?

Figure it out. Others (presumably) lesser than you have had no problem in discerning.

[criptix]

Someone of you guys holding facebook stocks?