[BTC-TC] Deprived Mining Speculation (DMS)

[HowlingMad]

There are people on this thread whose shares in DMS.* are worth a significant amount. Some of us may be interested in doing our own detective work sooner than next month. Is there any reason you can't divulge his real name here? Whatever has happened, we are due the opportunity to find out so we can work out what to do next.

The guy has been away for three months without explanation; I think he's waived his right to pseudonymity.

I am still looking into seeing what everyone at CT knew of him before I can really make many statements, because my interactions were a few internal E-mails from him - nothing that would allow you to track him down. Let me try to discuss Deprived's identity with the rest of the board, and if I can find out anything more, share it with you.

Having said this, the last communication I had with him was 11/15/2013.

OK, thanks for doing this.

+1

+2, some of us have VERY significant amounts invested in DMS!

Also, I looked into the B.Mine and B.Sell thing at Havelock, my apologies but it is a Ponzi scheme.  The provider brings nothing to the table other than taking the fees.  Both B.sell and B.mine DECREASED in dividend prices today.  Fortunately, I was logged into Havelock, waiting for the dividends, and was able to sell immediately without too much loss.  

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[Rannasha]

There are people on this thread whose shares in DMS.* are worth a significant amount. Some of us may be interested in doing our own detective work sooner than next month. Is there any reason you can't divulge his real name here? Whatever has happened, we are due the opportunity to find out so we can work out what to do next.

The guy has been away for three months without explanation; I think he's waived his right to pseudonymity.

I am still looking into seeing what everyone at CT knew of him before I can really make many statements, because my interactions were a few internal E-mails from him - nothing that would allow you to track him down. Let me try to discuss Deprived's identity with the rest of the board, and if I can find out anything more, share it with you.

Having said this, the last communication I had with him was 11/15/2013.

OK, thanks for doing this.

+1

+2, some of us have VERY significant amounts invested in DMS!

Also, I looked into the B.Mine and B.Sell thing at Havelock, my apologies but it is a Ponzi scheme.  The provider brings nothing to the table other than taking the fees.  Both B.sell and B.mine DECREASED in dividend prices today.  Fortunately, I was logged into Havelock, waiting for the dividends, and was able to sell immediately without too much loss. 

B.MINE/B.SELL is almost exactly the same as DMS. Sure, there are some details that are different, but the concept is identical. Neither BDD nor DMS even remotely resembles a Ponzi scheme.

[twentyseventy]

There are people on this thread whose shares in DMS.* are worth a significant amount. Some of us may be interested in doing our own detective work sooner than next month. Is there any reason you can't divulge his real name here? Whatever has happened, we are due the opportunity to find out so we can work out what to do next.

The guy has been away for three months without explanation; I think he's waived his right to pseudonymity.

I am still looking into seeing what everyone at CT knew of him before I can really make many statements, because my interactions were a few internal E-mails from him - nothing that would allow you to track him down. Let me try to discuss Deprived's identity with the rest of the board, and if I can find out anything more, share it with you.

Having said this, the last communication I had with him was 11/15/2013.

OK, thanks for doing this.

+1

+2, some of us have VERY significant amounts invested in DMS!

Also, I looked into the B.Mine and B.Sell thing at Havelock, my apologies but it is a Ponzi scheme.  The provider brings nothing to the table other than taking the fees.  Both B.sell and B.mine DECREASED in dividend prices today.  Fortunately, I was logged into Havelock, waiting for the dividends, and was able to sell immediately without too much loss. 

B.MINE/B.SELL is almost exactly the same as DMS. Sure, there are some details that are different, but the concept is identical. Neither BDD nor DMS even remotely resembles a Ponzi scheme.

Thanks for the vote of confidence, Rannasha.

HowlingMad, BDD functions very similarly to DMS with the main exception that the funds' capital is not invested, but simply held in escrow by Havelock.

If the Difficulty increases, MINE's dividends will decrease as well because the dividend formula emulates a 5GH/s miner, which would now be paying out less due to the increased Difficulty.

SELL returns excess capital to shareholders - since the Difficulty increased, the capital needed on hand for 200 days of dividends decreased, and a dividend was issued to SELL holders. This is functionally the same way that DMS operated, so I'm not sure why this was any surprise to you.

[Lohoris]

Also, I looked into the B.Mine and B.Sell thing at Havelock, my apologies but it is a Ponzi scheme.  The provider brings nothing to the table other than taking the fees.  Both B.sell and B.mine DECREASED in dividend prices today.  Fortunately, I was logged into Havelock, waiting for the dividends, and was able to sell immediately without too much loss.  

This is insane.

What's your agenda?
Or are you just randomly mad?

[matt4054]

Also, I looked into the B.Mine and B.Sell thing at Havelock, my apologies but it is a Ponzi scheme.  The provider brings nothing to the table other than taking the fees.  Both B.sell and B.mine DECREASED in dividend prices today.  Fortunately, I was logged into Havelock, waiting for the dividends, and was able to sell immediately without too much loss.  

This is insane.

What's your agenda?
Or are you just randomly mad?

Ponzis seem to have become as acceptable as fashionable right now anyway. Insane, you said?

[Rannasha]

Also, I looked into the B.Mine and B.Sell thing at Havelock, my apologies but it is a Ponzi scheme.  The provider brings nothing to the table other than taking the fees.  Both B.sell and B.mine DECREASED in dividend prices today.  Fortunately, I was logged into Havelock, waiting for the dividends, and was able to sell immediately without too much loss. 

This is insane.

What's your agenda?
Or are you just randomly mad?

Ponzis seem to have become as acceptable as fashionable right now anyway. Insane, you said?

It is insane for people that have invested in DMS to claim that BDD is a Ponzi scheme, since both funds operate exactly the same. You'd think that DMS-investors would have at least some clue as to who the whole thing worked and were able to recognize when something with identical functionality is started elsewhere.

[Lohoris]

Also, I looked into the B.Mine and B.Sell thing at Havelock, my apologies but it is a Ponzi scheme.  The provider brings nothing to the table other than taking the fees.  Both B.sell and B.mine DECREASED in dividend prices today.  Fortunately, I was logged into Havelock, waiting for the dividends, and was able to sell immediately without too much loss. 

This is insane.

What's your agenda?
Or are you just randomly mad?

Ponzis seem to have become as acceptable as fashionable right now anyway. Insane, you said?

It is insane for people that have invested in DMS to claim that BDD is a Ponzi scheme, since both funds operate exactly the same. You'd think that DMS-investors would have at least some clue as to who the whole thing worked and were able to recognize when something with identical functionality is started elsewhere.

Exactly.
No clue why matt gave this answer, I'm not sure what to make of it.

[matt4054]

It is insane for people that have invested in DMS to claim that BDD is a Ponzi scheme, since both funds operate exactly the same. You'd think that DMS-investors would have at least some clue as to who the whole thing worked and were able to recognize when something with identical functionality is started elsewhere.

Exactly.
No clue why matt gave this answer, I'm not sure what to make of it.

Of course it is insane to compare DMS or BDD with a Ponzi.

What I meant is that if you look around hot topics popping up these days, stupid people seem so desperate to gamble their money that they are actually sending out their BTC to - literally - Ponzi schemes that dare to call themselves exactly that. And yet some of them genuinely seem surprised to see the site vanish within three days. Insane...

The trend is growing so far as to have competing Ponzis outbidding each other. Over the last few days, I've seen the alleged returns inflating from 110% to 115% to 120% and now 200%...

[Justin00]

can't believe Deprived has done a runner.... or something happened.

His posts were always filled with so much useful information.... and he was a very smart fellow, always wiling to help someone out with there 'offering' or help expose scammers or people being dishonest.  He was basically the one person I trusted here (based on what he wrote).. I never had any interaction with him.

quite shocked by the hole thing. Its not looking good at all. Generally I dont give 2 shits, but I really hope Deprived is Ok and just hasnt been online due to some personal issues, which again, I hope are all resolved and good.
If deprived has done a runner... well... he was basically the last of the good

[stripykitteh]

There are people on this thread whose shares in DMS.* are worth a significant amount. Some of us may be interested in doing our own detective work sooner than next month. Is there any reason you can't divulge his real name here? Whatever has happened, we are due the opportunity to find out so we can work out what to do next.

The guy has been away for three months without explanation; I think he's waived his right to pseudonymity.

I am still looking into seeing what everyone at CT knew of him before I can really make many statements, because my interactions were a few internal E-mails from him - nothing that would allow you to track him down. Let me try to discuss Deprived's identity with the rest of the board, and if I can find out anything more, share it with you.

Having said this, the last communication I had with him was 11/15/2013.

Any news?

Kate must at least have an external email address for him. Even if it doesn't identify him of itself it could be the basis of looking for him.

[ThickAsThieves]

I checked with Burnside, who happened to not have any personal info on Deprived other than that he goes by Jon and is in the UK, which I already knew.

[matt4054]

I checked with Burnside, who happened to not have any personal info on Deprived other than that he goes by Jon and is in the UK, which I already knew.

I presume Theymos and Burnside both have logs with the IP addresses used by Deprived last year. This could be used to find his real identity, since I doubt that he used Tor and/or proxies. Now I understand that both of them would not want to give out that info without what I guess would be a subpoena, to avoid litigation from Deprived for disclosing the info if he's really done a runner.

On the other hand, as long as DMS funds remain untouched, I will favor the "personal issues" hypothesis rather than the runner one. Unlike creativex who obviously ran away with the funds and is now living off them, according to the blockchain.

[stripykitteh]

I've just PM'ed hazek, who is the Moderator of the Economics board for bitcointalk. Deprived has a hidden email address. I've asked hazek whether bitcointalk would be open to divulging it. It might be another blind alley but there's no harm in asking.

[stripykitteh]

I checked with Burnside, who happened to not have any personal info on Deprived other than that he goes by Jon and is in the UK, which I already knew.

I presume Theymos and Burnside both have logs with the IP addresses used by Deprived last year. This could be used to find his real identity, since I doubt that he used Tor and/or proxies. Now I understand that both of them would not want to give out that info without what I guess would be a subpoena, to avoid litigation from Deprived for disclosing the info if he's really done a runner.

On the other hand, as long as DMS funds remain untouched, I will favor the "personal issues" hypothesis rather than the runner one. Unlike creativex who obviously ran away with the funds and is now living off them, according to the blockchain.

I wonder what the terms of use of btct.co were. There might be nothing stopping them from handing over IP addresses (though they might choose not to for other reasons). Did you want to ask them about it so we don't double up?

[ThickAsThieves]

I have an email for Deprived and it is of no use. Just a gmail throwaway.

[matt4054]

I wonder what the terms of use of btct.co were. There might be nothing stopping them from handing over IP addresses (though they might choose not to for other reasons). Did you want to ask them about it so we don't double up?

I have conflicting thoughts about it:

• On the one hand, until BTC reaches high enough prices to cover the expenses and justify it, I do not intend to finance complex, international legal actions to engage a discovery procedure to identify him. IP addresses and/or e-mail addresses probably wouldn't be of any use to me in light of this
• On the other hand, the logs could be gone for good if I come to them with my requests in, say, 2 years or so

My idea right now is to PM them about this, mentioning that it's low priority (as a sysadmin I know it's not always trivial to dig info from old, massive, archived logs), and that I would understand their refusal if they are barred from doing it for ToS/legal reasons.

[stripykitteh]

I wonder what the terms of use of btct.co were. There might be nothing stopping them from handing over IP addresses (though they might choose not to for other reasons). Did you want to ask them about it so we don't double up?

I have conflicting thoughts about it:

• On the one hand, until BTC reaches high enough prices to cover the expenses and justify it, I do not intend to finance complex, international legal actions to engage a discovery procedure to identify him. IP addresses and/or e-mail addresses probably wouldn't be of any use to me in light of this
• On the other hand, the logs could be gone for good if I come to them with my requests in, say, 2 years or so

My idea right now is to PM them about this, mentioning that it's low priority (as a sysadmin I know it's not always trivial to dig info from old, massive, archived logs), and that I would understand their refusal if they are barred from doing it for ToS/legal reasons.

Yeah, fair enough. As a start we just guage their feelings about digging up the info. If it's easy to do and they're eager to help, all well and good. If not, at least we know.

[BitThink]

I believe that Kate knows much more about Deprived than us. I don't understand why she kept quiet and ignore all our PMs this time.

[stripykitteh]

I believe that Kate knows much more about Deprived than us. I don't understand why she kept quiet and ignore all our PMs this time.

I tried asking one of the Ciphermine people if they knew Deprived (not knew where he was, just *knew* him) but never got a reply. Have you asked Kate that?

[Sydboy]

he's gone
:/