[BTC-TC] Deprived Mining Speculation (DMS)

[Deprived]

BTC Balance (BTC-TC)   17.66232086
CIPHERMINE Bonds    260.56000000
BTC Balance (Wallet)    328.21586392
TOTAL ASSETS    606.43818478
   
Outstanding MINING   152575
Outstanding SELLING   152575
Outstanding PURCHASE   10479
Effective Units   163054
   
Block reward   25
Difficulty   267,731,250
Hashes per MINING   5000000
   
Daily Dividend    0.00000939
50 days (Min Liquid)    0.00046960
100 days (Forced Close)    0.00093920
365 days (Buyback)    0.00342808
405 days (IPO)    0.00380376
400 days (Post SELLING div)    0.00375680
410 days (Pre SELLING div)    0.00385072
   
NAV Post MINING Div    604.90678119
NAV/U Post MINING Div    0.00370986
Days Dividend Post Div   395.00
SELLING Dividend    -         
NAV Post SELLING Div    604.90678119
NAV/U Post Selling Div    0.00370986

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[stripykitteh]

Looking forwards to a move. I wanna re-invest my dividends. I'm too much of a girl's blouse to try to day-trade BTC and I don't want to attract CGT doing so.

[Deprived]

BTC Balance (BTC-TC)   16.1312438
CIPHERMINE Bonds    260.56000000
BTC Balance (Wallet)    328.21586392
TOTAL ASSETS    604.90710772
   
Outstanding MINING   152575
Outstanding SELLING   152575
Outstanding PURCHASE   10479
Effective Units   163054
   
Block reward   25
Difficulty   267,731,250
Hashes per MINING   5000000
   
Daily Dividend    0.00000939
50 days (Min Liquid)    0.00046960
100 days (Forced Close)    0.00093920
365 days (Buyback)    0.00342808
405 days (IPO)    0.00380376
400 days (Post SELLING div)    0.00375680
410 days (Pre SELLING div)    0.00385072
   
NAV Post MINING Div    603.37570413
NAV/U Post MINING Div    0.00370047
Days Dividend Post Div   394.00
SELLING Dividend    -         
NAV Post SELLING Div    603.37570413
NAV/U Post Selling Div    0.00370047

[Rannasha]

The fraction of the funds assets that consists of Ciphermine bonds is increasing at a considerable rate. Currently they make up over 40% of the NAV, but with the next SELLING dividend likely to be rather large, this fraction will go up considerably, over 50%.

Is there a plan to reduce the number of Ciphermine bonds held to ensure enough liquid BTC remains available? Or in the worst case, a contingency plan for when the fund is out of BTC to pay dividends and Ciphermine has not yet relisted on an exchange or has otherwise become liquid enough to sell without major losses?

[Deprived]

The fraction of the funds assets that consists of Ciphermine bonds is increasing at a considerable rate. Currently they make up over 40% of the NAV, but with the next SELLING dividend likely to be rather large, this fraction will go up considerably, over 50%.

Is there a plan to reduce the number of Ciphermine bonds held to ensure enough liquid BTC remains available? Or in the worst case, a contingency plan for when the fund is out of BTC to pay dividends and Ciphermine has not yet relisted on an exchange or has otherwise become liquid enough to sell without major losses?

The options to reduce the CIPHERMINE bonds are very limited:

1.  I could give 3 months notice to sell some - I discounted this idea simply because it wouldn't help anything much.  Any crunch hits well before then.
2.  Sell privately.  I prefer this route - but, if at all possible, want to wait for it to be relisted first so we get a much better price.

I also have to be very careful not to run into a situation where we run out of cash to pay MINING dividends.  Potentially that could mean suspending SELLING dividends until the CIPHERMINE become liquid (at which stage there'd immediately be a catch-up dividend).  MINING have never received benefits for the various dividends etc we've received from investment and so shouldnt suffer any loss from investment.  My personal holdings remain somewhere around 15k SELLING and a handful (under 100) MINING - so taking that route would obviously not be something I'd be doing for my personal benefit.

Next SELLING dividend will go out same as usual - after that I'll have to reconsider the situation depending on how various things develop (in particular the plans for the CIPHERMINE bond to relist - I'm confident it will but not sure exactly when).

I haven't updated on relisting recently - we're still very likely to be relisted somewhere before very long (I can't say where - not least because there's still 3 live possibilities that I haven't ruled out or reached agreement with).  The CIPHERMINE.B1 situation makes relisting less of a priority than it otherwise would have been - as until those are liquid we can't realistically expect to sell more PURCHASE (as I can't value the bonds below face value when selling) and everyone who wanted cash urgently already should have sold.

On a further small point, whenever next SELLING dividend gos out I intend right afterwards to pay a lump dividend for the rest of the month's MINING dividends - so no MINING investors get stuck with tiny dividends received on the last day or two of BTC-TC being open.  Obviously I'll only do that to the extent that I can do it whilst being sure I'm not paying for a period after which difficulty would have changed (i.e. OVER-paying in advance) - if I do happen to overpay because of that then I'd personally refund the extra into capital.

[HowlingMad]

So what is the 'face' on CIPHERMINE?  Although Kate missed the last dividend with her custom utility, I would be willing to trade CIPHERMINE for the next SELLING dividend or a month of MINING/PURCHASE dividends depending.

[Deprived]

So what is the 'face' on CIPHERMINE?  Although Kate missed the last dividend with her custom utility, I would be willing to trade CIPHERMINE for the next SELLING dividend or a month of MINING/PURCHASE dividends depending.

Face value on CIPHERMINE.B1 is .01 BTC each - they can be redeemed for that with 3 months' notice (and you sacrifice all dividends for those 3 months).  After 1 year they can be redeemed at face without any notice needing to be given.

Kate's on her honeymoon - looks like she forgot to pay last week's dividend before going (which is bad form - but not a cause to fear default).

Problem at my end is that at a certain point I have to mark them down on the books (thus stopping SELLING dividends) to avoid running out of cash to pay MINING dividends.  That's because where it reaches a point where I MUST sell them I either have to sell them at a massive discount or mark them down so as to remove the immediate need to sell them.  That may sound silly - after all, surely their value doesn't change?  But in fact their value DOES change - if I need to sell them right now then their value is only what I can get for them right now : whilst if I can delay selling them for a few months then I can value them at what they'll sell for then (IF I'm sure I can get it then).

It's a shame as they were doing nicely for us up until BTC-TC going down - we were slowly selling them off at a profit to what we paid for them AND getting dividends.  And we were selling at the rate we needed to (to keep the percentage in target range) without any difficulty.

[Deprived]

BTC Balance (BTC-TC)   14.60016674
CIPHERMINE Bonds    260.56000000
BTC Balance (Wallet)    328.21586392
TOTAL ASSETS    603.37603066
   
Outstanding MINING   152575
Outstanding SELLING   152575
Outstanding PURCHASE   10479
Effective Units   163054
   
Block reward   25
Difficulty   267,731,250
Hashes per MINING   5000000
   
Daily Dividend    0.00000939
50 days (Min Liquid)    0.00046960
100 days (Forced Close)    0.00093920
365 days (Buyback)    0.00342808
405 days (IPO)    0.00380376
400 days (Post SELLING div)    0.00375680
410 days (Pre SELLING div)    0.00385072
   
NAV Post MINING Div    601.84462707
NAV/U Post MINING Div    0.00369108
Days Dividend Post Div   393.00
SELLING Dividend    -         
NAV Post SELLING Div    601.84462707
NAV/U Post Selling Div    0.00369108

[odolvlobo]

Kate's on her honeymoon - looks like she forgot to pay last week's dividend before going (which is bad form - but not a cause to fear default).

Technically, that is a default.

[twentyseventy]

Is anyone currently looking to sell their MINING/SELLING shares. I'm looking to get back into some investing and could come up with a price if anyone's interested.

Deprived, would you be agreeable to this, or would you rather wait until the new exchange is set up?

[HowlingMad]

Face value on CIPHERMINE.B1 is .01 BTC each - they can be redeemed for that with 3 months' notice (and you sacrifice all dividends for those 3 months).  After 1 year they can be redeemed at face without any notice needing to be given.

Well, let me know if you would like to sell some.  My dividends are going to Coinlenders at the moment, and I was buying CIPHERMINE at only a modest discount from face before.  I am looking for something I can hold for a couple of years.  

[FloatesMcgoates]

Is anyone currently looking to sell their MINING/SELLING shares. I'm looking to get back into some investing and could come up with a price if anyone's interested.

Deprived, would you be agreeable to this, or would you rather wait until the new exchange is set up?

Haha, I was actually thinking the same thing. I got out a few weeks back but with these 40%+ difficulty increases I suddenly find myself wishing I could still play around with DMS.

[stripykitteh]

Is anyone currently looking to sell their MINING/SELLING shares. I'm looking to get back into some investing and could come up with a price if anyone's interested.

Deprived, would you be agreeable to this, or would you rather wait until the new exchange is set up?

While I would like to buy more too I would imagine it's something that would quickly spiral into an unmanageable mess.

[Equilux]

Just a quick question; are there any options to sell or transfer Purchase/Selling securities? I'd like to liquidize my holdings.

I was hoping to find the answer to such a basic question in one of the first posts, maybe this would be a good thing to add?

Thanks in advance!

[LiteBit]

Just a quick question; are there any options to sell or transfer Purchase/Selling securities? I'd like to liquidize my holdings.

I was hoping to find the answer to such a basic question in one of the first posts, maybe this would be a good thing to add?

Thanks in advance!

ATM the open market is your only choice. The auctions or marketplace sections would be a place to start.

[Lohoris]

Just a quick question; are there any options to sell or transfer Purchase/Selling securities? I'd like to liquidize my holdings.

I was hoping to find the answer to such a basic question in one of the first posts, maybe this would be a good thing to add?

Thanks in advance!

ATM the open market is your only choice. The auctions or marketplace sections would be a place to start.

Unless deprived allows transfers, I don't see how reaching an agreement with someone could help.

[Deprived]

Just a quick question; are there any options to sell or transfer Purchase/Selling securities? I'd like to liquidize my holdings.

I was hoping to find the answer to such a basic question in one of the first posts, maybe this would be a good thing to add?

Thanks in advance!

ATM the open market is your only choice. The auctions or marketplace sections would be a place to start.

Unless deprived allows transfers, I don't see how reaching an agreement with someone could help.

If anyone arranges a private sale I'd facilitate it.

I can turn transfers on - but if I do so, they'll only work to and from the issuer.  So if person X sells to person Y you'd have to:

1.  Do the transfer of BTC for payment off-site (no way to transfer BTC).
2.  X send the shares back to me and PM me to send them on to user name Y.

I'm fine with doing #2 - but don't want to end up dragged into arguments over trades that didn't go smoothly.  Reason I haven't turned transfers on is really simple : I KNOW that if I do I'll end up getting sent unsolicited shares then receiving mails/PMs asking where their BTC for them is.  Some people just don't read the forums at all.

[Deprived]

BTC Balance (BTC-TC)   13.06908968
CIPHERMINE Bonds    260.56000000
BTC Balance (Wallet)    328.21586392
TOTAL ASSETS    601.84495360
   
Outstanding MINING   152575
Outstanding SELLING   152575
Outstanding PURCHASE   10479
Effective Units   163054
   
Block reward   25
Difficulty   267,731,250
Hashes per MINING   5000000
   
Daily Dividend    0.00000939
50 days (Min Liquid)    0.00046960
100 days (Forced Close)    0.00093920
365 days (Buyback)    0.00342808
405 days (IPO)    0.00380376
400 days (Post SELLING div)    0.00375680
410 days (Pre SELLING div)    0.00385072
   
NAV Post MINING Div    600.31355001
NAV/U Post MINING Div    0.00368169
Days Dividend Post Div   392.00
SELLING Dividend    -         
NAV Post SELLING Div    600.31355001
NAV/U Post Selling Div    0.00368169

[Tafelpoot]

DMS.Selling dividend is going to be around 0.001093, isn't it?

[Rannasha]

DMS.Selling dividend is going to be around 0.001093, isn't it?

That's the number I'm getting as well.