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Author Topic: NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information  (Read 2752712 times)
mkmen
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February 07, 2014, 05:34:50 PM
 #30861

Critical bug disclosure

Few days ago the guy who found a vulnerability in Blockchain.Info and picked the secret phrase of Nxt genesis account found a security flaw in NRS cryptographic algorithm.

...

I can't explain details of the flaw, coz it's out of my area of expertise. U can contact him directly via nextcoin.org forum.

I'm the guy.  I just created a thread providing more technical details https://nextcoin.org/index.php/topic,3884.0.html and to answer questions.  I don't really check this forum/thread so posting there is the best way to reach me.

Huge respect to you. I'm gonna send some NXT to your "ransom" account once I'm comfortable running the client. Thank you for this.
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February 07, 2014, 05:36:52 PM
 #30862

Below is the message doctorevil sent to inform captain picard, cfb, and opticalc!

We must get this guy to join us as dev!


The disclosure CfB recently announced on the BCT thread might leave some with questions regarding the exact details.  Here's what I sent CfB, Jean-Luc, and OpticalC earlier:

-Gentlemen-

All versions of NXT are currently vulnerable to a transaction replay attack.

I've tested this exploit successfully (TXs 16383865633576457223 and 6120913904145250080).

This message has only been sent to you 3 (Jean-Luc, opticalc and CfB); however, I plan to eventually make a public disclosure.

Specifics:

Anyone on the network can create 15 replicas of a transaction that verify OK but which have distinct transaction ids.  This has to do with a phenomenon called signature malleability.  Given a valid signature X0, anyone (not just the original signer) can create 15 additional distinct signatures X1, X2 ... X15 which all verify correctly. 

The only circumstances in which a transaction can not be replayed are if:

(1) the sender's balance is too low or
(2) the transaction deadline has expired

Example exploit scenario:

BTER currently has a 40M+ NXT wallet it sends withdrawals from.  If I was evil, I could transfer 100k NXT back and forth between myself and BTER.  Lets say I do this 10 times.  A few hours later I could create 15 replays of each withdrawal transaction, netting 1.5M NXT.  If I was super evil I could send the replays immediately after each withdrawal, redepositing the new NXT and growing the heist exponentially.  One could drain their entire 40M wallet in 3 round trips starting with just 12500 NXT.  Eviler still, one could also replay recent transactions flowing into BTER from depositors in order to steal their funds as well, swelling the total catch beyond 40M.

Several possible fixes come to mind:

(1) define a canonical signature representation (bitcoin's approach)
(2) exclude the signature field when calculating the transaction id (probably too sweeping a change at this point)
(3) explicitly check for replays in processTransactions (a bit of a kludge)

The math:

The output of Curve25519.sign is v.  This value essentially acts like an element in a finite field who's order is the same as the curve group order (2252+2124).  So for any v, you can add 2252+2124 and arrive at a value that is equivalent as far as the underlying field math is concerned.  NXT encodes v using 256 bits (32 bytes).  Since 2256 is significantly larger than the group order, there are ~16 distinct 256-bit encodings of each field element.  Because everyone knows the group order and v is part of the signature, anyone can generate the other encodings to perform this attack.

In closing, I just want to say that it hurts my evil heart not to exploit this.

-Dr. Evil-

This was quickly followed up with some back and forth with CfB where I provided him actual code for the exploit (which I'll elide here for obvious reasons) and a discussion of the plan for how to rollout a fix (which they implemented within hours of initially communicating with them).

He also threw me 10 BTC, which I didn't really expect but greatly appreciated.  I got all of jack shit (other than a warm fuzzy) when I privately revealed to blockchain.info a RNG bug that had already lead to multiple documented thefts.

I'm happy to answer in this thread any remaining technical questions the community might have about the nature of the flaw.
quoted.

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FINANCING, PROPERTY LISTING AND
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ChuckOne
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February 07, 2014, 05:37:34 PM
 #30863

NXT Vote on Transaction Fees seems no longer discussed.  So... my final tally:

Fee AmountVotes
0.0000011
0.0012
0.0110
0.051
0.0552
0.137
0.252
0.17

Mean: 0.184870983870968
Median: 0.1
Mode: 0.1

Should be:

1.07
timmyd
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February 07, 2014, 05:37:53 PM
 #30864


thats bullshit.. your money so you can withdraw what ever you want! id have a shit attack if my bank said i couldnt withdraw my own money in person in the bank.. id understand a few hundred thou or a million but not just a couple thou... there all goin buyin bitcoin from zipzap lol

Yeah, it's scary.  If a well capitalised bank like HSBC is not letting customers withdrawal 7,000, then the finance world is in a really bad state!

That's not a conspiracy theorist article either--- it's BBC!
Unless it states in the banks terms and conditions that "on deposit of funds into the bank. The bank then own your deposit , they cannot stop you withdrawing your money for any purpose"
Its basically theft. I suggest that anyone who trys to withdraw their own money from a bank and they refuse to call the police. Its theft they cannot hold your money hostage. Unless like i said the deposit becomes property of the bank. And if it does say this in any banks terms then it must be hidden and i reckon people would like to know abou this.

Monthly profits from Www.Banxcapital.com
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ChuckOne
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February 07, 2014, 05:38:53 PM
 #30865

NXT Vote on Transaction Fees seems no longer discussed.  So... my final tally:

Fee AmountVotes
0.0000011
0.0012
0.0110
0.051
0.0552
0.137
0.252
0.17

Mean: 0.184870983870968
Median: 0.1
Mode: 0.1



Google Doc:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Akjrt0LTBXgcdFFkSGMwXzd4Q2NPU21yU2NOYWVldlE&usp=sharing

This marks the end of my tally.  If someone else wants to continue, I can give permissions on the google doc.  Send me a PM.

Cheers!


I didn't see the announcement to vote.


What's you opinion on that?
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February 07, 2014, 05:41:53 PM
 #30866

you know guys. we could cut out the dollar by tying our main token that we trade with to something extremely liquid but lacking other properties of money. the nxt token representation of the object will give it its strong money characteristics and the high liquidity of the item its tied to could give a stable and recognizable price.

so just as an offhand example, the basic pricing could be done by having the main medium of exchange be a token that represents 1 egg. say i am an egg farmer, i issue 1 million grade a egg colored tokens. the nxt/egg cross becomes the deepest and most liquid token in the market and so then nxt becomes priced in eggs. if you want to know what the value of a nxt is in dollars then you go to the supermarket and check out the price of eggs and just do the conversion. if you want eggs than you just trade 1 token for 1 egg to the egg farmer.

eggs probably bag example. ill try to think of something better.

Rep Thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=381041
If one can not confer upon another a right which he does not himself first possess, by what means does the state derive the right to engage in behaviors from which the public is prohibited?
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February 07, 2014, 05:42:08 PM
 #30867

Critical bug disclosure

Few days ago the guy who found a vulnerability in Blockchain.Info and picked the secret phrase of Nxt genesis account found a security flaw in NRS cryptographic algorithm.

...

I can't explain details of the flaw, coz it's out of my area of expertise. U can contact him directly via nextcoin.org forum.

I'm the guy.  I just created a thread providing more technical details https://nextcoin.org/index.php/topic,3884.0.html and to answer questions.  I don't really check this forum/thread so posting there is the best way to reach me.

Let's get this guy on board, Klee is in charge of the infrastructure team, so perhaps Klee can get him on board and a good chunk of Nxt from unclaimed.
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February 07, 2014, 05:44:39 PM
 #30868

Below is the message doctorevil sent to inform captain picard, cfb, and opticalc!

We must get this guy to join us as dev!
+1

+1


Btc : 12LMdyWoyjJ1BZxfWmaZMWjTXn7S9y5EdK
ChuckOne
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February 07, 2014, 05:49:45 PM
 #30869

you know guys. we could cut out the dollar by tying our main token that we trade with to something extremely liquid but lacking other properties of money. the nxt token representation of the object will give it its strong money characteristics and the high liquidity of the item its tied to could give a stable and recognizable price.

so just as an offhand example, the basic pricing could be done by having the main medium of exchange be a token that represents 1 egg. say i am an egg farmer, i issue 1 million grade a egg colored tokens. the nxt/egg cross becomes the deepest and most liquid token in the market and so then nxt becomes priced in eggs. if you want to know what the value of a nxt is in dollars then you go to the supermarket and check out the price of eggs and just do the conversion. if you want eggs than you just trade 1 token for 1 egg to the egg farmer.

eggs probably bag example. ill try to think of something better.

Don't see how this should convert to real egg prices? If we cut out the dollar and the supermarket only accepts dollars then there's no link between real eggs and nxt eggs.

Supermarket should accept NXTs then we get the price real.
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February 07, 2014, 05:51:10 PM
 #30870

Critical bug disclosure

Few days ago the guy who found a vulnerability in Blockchain.Info and picked the secret phrase of Nxt genesis account found a security flaw in NRS cryptographic algorithm. The flaw allowed to replay transactions that would lead to double-triple-etc amounts sent. In fact, by finding this flaw he conducted an audit of Crypto class and won the bounty that we collected specially for such a case.

I can't explain details of the flaw, coz it's out of my area of expertise. U can contact him directly via nextcoin.org forum.

The flaw has been fixed and all who updated to 0.6.0+ are safe now. Users of older versions are safe too as long as they are connected to nodes with 0.6.0+.

PS: The community should collect 10 BTC again coz we still need to do the audit of the code.

so next is broken al ready and they have to paid ransom to a guy for stopping attacks.   Why r people still buying this broken piece of shitcoin

and main dev don't know nothing about if you have to ask the attacker self.

0.000003
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February 07, 2014, 05:52:49 PM
 #30871

Let's get this guy on board, Klee is in charge of the infrastructure team, so perhaps Klee can get him on board and a good chunk of Nxt from unclaimed.

+1

big panic he can earn more by exploiting the flaw and sell it.
ChuckOne
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February 07, 2014, 05:52:50 PM
 #30872

Critical bug disclosure

Few days ago the guy who found a vulnerability in Blockchain.Info and picked the secret phrase of Nxt genesis account found a security flaw in NRS cryptographic algorithm. The flaw allowed to replay transactions that would lead to double-triple-etc amounts sent. In fact, by finding this flaw he conducted an audit of Crypto class and won the bounty that we collected specially for such a case.

I can't explain details of the flaw, coz it's out of my area of expertise. U can contact him directly via nextcoin.org forum.

The flaw has been fixed and all who updated to 0.6.0+ are safe now. Users of older versions are safe too as long as they are connected to nodes with 0.6.0+.

PS: The community should collect 10 BTC again coz we still need to do the audit of the code.

so next is broken al ready and they have to paid ransom to a guy for stopping attacks.   Why r people still buying this broken piece of shitcoin

and main dev don't know nothing about if you have to ask the attacker self.

0.000003

We're still waiting for you dumping. Wink
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February 07, 2014, 05:53:04 PM
 #30873

Critical bug disclosure

Few days ago the guy who found a vulnerability in Blockchain.Info and picked the secret phrase of Nxt genesis account found a security flaw in NRS cryptographic algorithm. The flaw allowed to replay transactions that would lead to double-triple-etc amounts sent. In fact, by finding this flaw he conducted an audit of Crypto class and won the bounty that we collected specially for such a case.

I can't explain details of the flaw, coz it's out of my area of expertise. U can contact him directly via nextcoin.org forum.

The flaw has been fixed and all who updated to 0.6.0+ are safe now. Users of older versions are safe too as long as they are connected to nodes with 0.6.0+.

PS: The community should collect 10 BTC again coz we still need to do the audit of the code.

so next is broken al ready and they have to paid ransom to a guy for stopping attacks.   Why r people still buying this broken piece of shitcoin

and main dev don't know nothing about if you have to ask the attacker self.

0.000003

Emule, please PM me is you are selling your Nxt.  I'm buying.
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February 07, 2014, 05:53:48 PM
 #30874

@Emule: So, the priest did bad things with you, when you were young? I'm so sorry.
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February 07, 2014, 05:54:25 PM
 #30875

Critical bug disclosure

Few days ago the guy who found a vulnerability in Blockchain.Info and picked the secret phrase of Nxt genesis account found a security flaw in NRS cryptographic algorithm. The flaw allowed to replay transactions that would lead to double-triple-etc amounts sent. In fact, by finding this flaw he conducted an audit of Crypto class and won the bounty that we collected specially for such a case.

I can't explain details of the flaw, coz it's out of my area of expertise. U can contact him directly via nextcoin.org forum.

The flaw has been fixed and all who updated to 0.6.0+ are safe now. Users of older versions are safe too as long as they are connected to nodes with 0.6.0+.

PS: The community should collect 10 BTC again coz we still need to do the audit of the code.

so next is broken al ready and they have to paid ransom to a guy for stopping attacks.   Why r people still buying this broken piece of shitcoin

and main dev don't know nothing about if you have to ask the attacker self.

0.000003


Btc : 12LMdyWoyjJ1BZxfWmaZMWjTXn7S9y5EdK
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February 07, 2014, 05:56:25 PM
 #30876

you know guys. we could cut out the dollar by tying our main token that we trade with to something extremely liquid but lacking other properties of money. the nxt token representation of the object will give it its strong money characteristics and the high liquidity of the item its tied to could give a stable and recognizable price.

so just as an offhand example, the basic pricing could be done by having the main medium of exchange be a token that represents 1 egg. say i am an egg farmer, i issue 1 million grade a egg colored tokens. the nxt/egg cross becomes the deepest and most liquid token in the market and so then nxt becomes priced in eggs. if you want to know what the value of a nxt is in dollars then you go to the supermarket and check out the price of eggs and just do the conversion. if you want eggs than you just trade 1 token for 1 egg to the egg farmer.

eggs probably bag example. ill try to think of something better.

Very good idea! I have a profitable forex bot and I am thinking of assets based on it. It be very easy to value them and nxt as well. It is making 3-4% monthly profit..
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February 07, 2014, 06:08:14 PM
 #30877

rofl. i completely missed that thread where i was mentioned like a dozen times

U should monetize ur reputation. If u were a fiat gateway operator for Asset Exchange, u would help the community a lot. I would accept dollars issued by u without any doubt. Think of such a business plz...

Anon136,

If you do consider fiat gateway, iDeal might be something to look into for accepting Euros. 

http://www.ideal.nl/banken/?lang=eng-GB

I had asked in this thread earlier if anyone had any experience with it, and a member did PM me to tell me that he used it and that it was awesome.  If you're interested, I can ask him to PM you, also, to get an idea of how it is used.

He gave me this link:

http://www.bitcoinvergelijker.nl/

But I don't speak Dutch so I only got a vague idea of what is said there.


That was me....what do you need to know about iDeal ?
It's way simple: direct money transfer (via a web interface), from your account to merchant account using your accounts internet banking access system. As easy as Bitcoin, but from the banksters....
AFAIK, it's only in NL at the moment, but your first link hints that they want to take it Europe-wide.
Most BTC merchants in NL use it (as well as all NL online shops/pizza delivery/etc) and u can go from "want Bitcoin" to having the BTC on your wallet in 10 minutes.



Gotta run, some other NL members can mybe explain more.
Try Google translate, btw, give u an idea of whats going on....and try the iDeal interface out, see how it works.

Nulli Dei, nulli Reges, solum NXT
Love your money: www.nxt.org  www.ardorplatform.org
www.nxter.org  www.nxtfoundation.org
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February 07, 2014, 06:10:10 PM
 #30878

Critical bug disclosure

Few days ago the guy who found a vulnerability in Blockchain.Info and picked the secret phrase of Nxt genesis account found a security flaw in NRS cryptographic algorithm.

Can someone explain how he found out the passphrase of the genesis account?

    "It was a bright cold day in April, and the clocks were striking thirteen."

It has 14 words and some punctuation. Ignoring the punctuation and using a simple 2000 words long dictionary (and this is tiny! There are 1013913 words in the English language) we get 2000^14 possible passphrases, or about 10^46 possibilities, if we go by characters from the alphabet, it has 26^72 ~ 10^101 possibilities. A password written in base 58 and 26 characters long is also about 10^46 possibilities. In comparison, a random 8 character long password takes 3 hours to crack on a desktop pc. 9 char -> 3days, 10 char -> 1 year, 11 char -> 48 years. 26 char -> An octillion years.

Now it is a given that the entropy of a random password is much higher than that of a phrase from a novel, but I still can't see how he could crack the passphrase unless the entire thing was already in his dictionary! Let's not forget he was using a python script which is notably slow!
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February 07, 2014, 06:13:27 PM
 #30879

Can someone explain how he found out the passphrase of the genesis account?

http://security.stackexchange.com/questions/22717/how-secure-are-passwords-made-of-whole-english-sentences
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February 07, 2014, 06:13:49 PM
Last edit: February 07, 2014, 06:34:43 PM by EvilDave
 #30880

Guys, sorry for the super silly question. I read every post here but when i saw that FC was promoting NEM i ignored every post in which i see "NEM". Now i see that Utopianfuture is responsible for NEM and most of the active people here are in the staheholders' list of NEM (are they really? Anon? Come-from-beyond?). Will NEM have the same features like Nxt (especially transparent forging)? And the only difference will be the community and developers? I know I gotta be missing something and i sound silly but i have to ask. Thank you for the response!

FC promoting NEM ?  I think u may be suffering from some confusion here.

OI !, Frictionless, r u promoting NEM ?

And why do u and eMule seem to be joined at the hip ?

Nulli Dei, nulli Reges, solum NXT
Love your money: www.nxt.org  www.ardorplatform.org
www.nxter.org  www.nxtfoundation.org
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