[ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency

[afbitcoins]

On subject of contracts maybe i need to give some time to ponder it but my instinctive reaction is that its not going to work. Dash is too volatile. Neither on Dash side or on contractors side should there be so much currency value risk. Easiest solution might be more of a 'pay as you go' deal for Dash where proposals can only last one budget then have to be renegotiated. If the contractor doesn't like it, find another one who does.

[alex-ru]

Hey, let me present my new DASH video:



Thanks to TanteStefana and Tungfa for their help with script and sound editing.

It'll be nice if Dash community help me to cover direct production expenses - on my DASH: XxG6WRPA5ef767m37eEbGjK8T1UPAVGdCq
I have lots of additional promo-ideas but can't sponsor them by myself. Thanks!

Please spread the word, everybody - distribute this nice video.

Bump, and wanted to say this was really cool.  That a member can put out such great videos is so awesome!  Sorry I'm not up to par today, I'll have to catch up with the forum when I'm feeling better and the screen isn't making me feel like my head is gonna explode, LOL  Laters!

Its a nice idea but not really professional standard. Hope you don't mind my sharing opinion. My main criticism is that its a bit unbalanced in terms of (just about) everyone is female. Whats the story is Dash only for women? Thats main thing that stuck out to me.

Thanks for you response!
I understand that it is impossible to make a video that will appeal to 100% (especially when it is mixed in 11 people) - this is normal.

Yes - this video was just an experiment and not the easy one for me (too many people to manage, too low budget for everything, too different videos to mix).
But finally we got the result - something that we can use as "proof of concept". Now somebody can use this concept to make something better on next level of perfection.

"90% - girls" is the main part of the concept!  :
1. The main target audience of this video - men. And of these, on average 90% - heterosexuals. Ie at the same time I would like to make it pleasant for them (and mobilizing their attention/emotions).
2. Well, to keep the attention of 4 minutes by pure "talking heads" - is is very hard task, and these girls with "short messages" were very helpful.

[ddink7]

With respect to paying our service providers with Dash rather than fiat, I'm surprised at all the opposition. I think people are letting hindsight dictate how they feel. Yes, in hindsight, the price of Dash has increased by over 2/3 since the start of some of these initiatives. In retrospect, that may seem like a bad deal, since the PR firm will receive more (fiat) than they would have otherwise. But how quickly we forget that for the last 18 months we've been playing limbo ("How low can you go?") with the price of Dash. Other than a few brief spikes, the price of Dash has spent a great many months either languishing or slowly declining. Everybody gets all excited (me too) when it briefly hits .0245 BTC, but then it begins a 9 months slide to a low of .005. I do believe that our future price growth will be explosive, but that's in the future. Also, the people who make our price explode deserve to share in the bounty.

We try to distance ourselves from the world of centralized corporations, but it is helpful to look at some of the things they do well. Corporations, at least in the U.S., usually structure executive compensation in such a way that if the value of the company's stock increases, executives are rewarded with greater compensation. This is done in the form of stock options and grants. In that way, the people who create additional value for the company (in theory) are incentivized to do so. Yes, there are some problems with this system, such as the focus on short- versus long-term growth, but it does tend to motivate people quite well to create value.

I also think it's disingenuous to tell service providers "Hey, we are creating a new form of money. But we would rather pay you in 'old' money (fiat)." That sends entirely the wrong message, making it seem as though our form of money is too unstable to serve as money. It's like owning a GM dealership but driving a Ford to work everyday!

[toknormal]

...This means that if Dash owes someone money in the future, because we signed a contract in Dash, we have to pay it, at the cost of what those funds could have otherwise done for us.

We can't see the future.

Tante -

I don't know if you realise it but you just fired the starting gun on demand for a Dash derivatives market. The way companies usually address this risk in "the real world" is by means of hedging derivatives such as futures contracts or currency swaps.

Maybe the blockchain could purchase dollar futures contracts and hold these for the purpose of allocating long term funds. Those contracts would hedge the fund against fluctuations in the Dash exchange rate while at the same time supporting successful applicants with predictable budgets.

(That's what a financial derivative is supposed to do when it's not busy blowing up the world economy).

[ddink7]

The more I think about it, the stronger I feel. Are we trying to ultimately replace fiat, or just supplement it? Because if you say that you want to replace fiat with crypto, then you can't say that you want to deny people payment in crypto. How can you tell someone "Digital currency is the wave of the future, but right now we want to just keep using the old broken form of money"

[spatula]

The more I think about it, the stronger I feel. Are we trying to ultimately replace fiat, or just supplement it? Because if you say that you want to replace fiat with crypto, then you can't say that you want to deny people payment in crypto. How can you tell someone "Digital currency is the wave of the future, but right now we want to just keep using the old broken form of money"

I agree 100%

Our budgets should be paid in DASH whenever possible. I understand if the budget owner wants to subcontract in fiat, but that is a risk that the budget proposal originator should take on, not the network.

[GhostPlayer]

The more I think about it, the stronger I feel. Are we trying to ultimately replace fiat, or just supplement it? Because if you say that you want to replace fiat with crypto, then you can't say that you want to deny people payment in crypto. How can you tell someone "Digital currency is the wave of the future, but right now we want to just keep using the old broken form of money"

 Fiat = established money by governmental regulatory statutes. What you're essentially saying is you want to replace government by a self-regulatory decentralised entity that is capable of maintaining social order. That is utopia to the power of dreams.

 Crypto technology certainly can substitute paper money, but that will be the worse nightmare ever. Having a traceable digital footprint to all transactions ever made. spooky.

 Decentralised currencies will only defeat Fiat if and when they become bigger than several major governmental currencies. Until then, you're chained. Like I exposed before with Maslow's pyramid, until you can widely and readily buy basic essential goods (food, housing, health, clothing, etc), crypto has no power to change anything.

 Why would anyone want to be payed in Dash if they have to sell it off to buy rice?

 Then you have the other secondary non-essential goods like books, music, transport, cellphones, cable TV etc - Equally, in this day and time, can't be done by he same reason. It's a chain of capital flux.

 Where you DO see bitcoin and Dash used is in the tertiary sector. Luxury goods, exquisite things like fine wine (shout out to bigrcanada1), luxury cars (remember the Tesla?), luxury boats (in BTC yes), exclusive products, exclusive food (there is a Dash store that sells extremely hot pepper-souce out there).

 Where can I buy a banana, with Dash, today? Or a loaf of bread?

 You have the great mediatic story of the 100,000 USD, or whatever, pizza sold back in 2009... how many pizzarias accept bitcoin today ?

 Don't shoot me! I am in this for the revolution. But realistically, if we fight, we must fight with our minds and let our passions fuel actions, not reactions. We must collectively grow and kickstart the the network-effect.

 It's like email vs snails mail. How many Amazon goods have you ever shipped through email? Only digital ones.

 Fiat, be it crypto or paper money, is here to stay for a very very very LONG time. That doesn't mean there can't be alternatives! But to think we are going to destroy the ruling bodies of this world with such novel technology is unrealistic. What we can do, is claim back some of our stolen freedom. Have a tool to oppose oppression. And yes, take enormous amounts of power back from government back into the hands of the people. We must build that.

 How? We solve problems people have with Fiat (essentially done, but ongoing), and thus create a need.

 How to create a need? Simple, incentivise people enough to "bother" to go out of their ways an acquire Dash.

[GhostPlayer]

The more I think about it, the stronger I feel. Are we trying to ultimately replace fiat, or just supplement it? Because if you say that you want to replace fiat with crypto, then you can't say that you want to deny people payment in crypto. How can you tell someone "Digital currency is the wave of the future, but right now we want to just keep using the old broken form of money"

I agree 100%

Our budgets should be paid in DASH whenever possible. I understand if the budget owner wants to subcontract in fiat, but that is a risk that the budget proposal originator should take on, not the network.

 1) So, if price plummets the originator either

a) pays out of his own pocket
b) does not pay the stipulated amount, leaves the contractor hanging, giving Dash a horrible rep in the "real" world.

 2) But if the price rises

a) pays the contractor and keep the excess
b) pays the contractor and burns the excess coins

Actually, 2b) this second one kind of makes sense. If the originator doesn't comply, his reputation is stained. But what about all of item 1?

[ddink7]

The more I think about it, the stronger I feel. Are we trying to ultimately replace fiat, or just supplement it? Because if you say that you want to replace fiat with crypto, then you can't say that you want to deny people payment in crypto. How can you tell someone "Digital currency is the wave of the future, but right now we want to just keep using the old broken form of money"

I agree 100%

Our budgets should be paid in DASH whenever possible. I understand if the budget owner wants to subcontract in fiat, but that is a risk that the budget proposal originator should take on, not the network.

 1) So, if price plummets the originator either

a) pays out of his own pocket
b) does not pay the stipulated amount, leaves the contractor hanging, giving Dash a horrible rep in the "real" world.

 2) But if the price rises

a) pays the contractor and keep the excess
b) pays the contractor and burns the excess coins

Actually, 2b) this second one kind of makes sense. If the originator doesn't comply, his reputation is stained. But what about all of item 1?

Very good point. Anyone who receives blockchain funding would hopefully discuss and agree upon terms with their counterparties before the service is performed. Paying in fiat doesn't necessarily eliminate this problem either, though. What if an unethical person receives blockchain funding but refuses to pay his subcontractor once the work is done. This looks bad for Dash too, even though we didn't do anything!

I don't know the answer to this dilemma. The same problem is present in politics and religion, too. Extremists who don't represent the views of the majority end up poisoning public opinion. This is most obvious in religion: people using their religion to try and cover up the vilest of atrocities. Does that mean that's what the religion stands for? Not at all.

It's also present in politics. I've been listening to the news and all of the sudden hear a sound byte where the president of the U.S. says "The United States opposes the actions of <insert country here>." I always want to reply "No, the United States doesn't...the president does." It's just like with the lifting of Iranian sanctions--Iran better be praying for us to elect a Democrat, because if a Republican goes into office, they are going right back into effect.

So I agree...community members short-changing vendors on the exchange rate would be really bad. In reality, though, community members already can do (and occasionally have done) things that don't necessarily represent the views of the entire network.

[semajjames]

edit : and check if your debug.log on the hot wallet (server) has not grown too large..

So qwizzie this "debug log" you talk about that lives on my MN's vultr server yeah ?

Correct. It can be found in your .dash directory

how big is "to big" and how long does this take to happen ?

my current debug.log is about 2.5 MB, people have reported in the past that their debug.log got into the gigabytes i think.
i normally delete it between version upgrades (a new one gets created automatically upon restart).
There are also commands available to "auto-shrink" your debug.log

would .....

debug=0

turn off the file?


Or - can't it be dumped into 'no-where'?
[not actually creating the file?]

Well I needed to use Tao's guide to set up my MN so i'm going to have to find out how to locate this debug file, I guess it will involve using "Putty"

[spatula]

The more I think about it, the stronger I feel. Are we trying to ultimately replace fiat, or just supplement it? Because if you say that you want to replace fiat with crypto, then you can't say that you want to deny people payment in crypto. How can you tell someone "Digital currency is the wave of the future, but right now we want to just keep using the old broken form of money"

I agree 100%

Our budgets should be paid in DASH whenever possible. I understand if the budget owner wants to subcontract in fiat, but that is a risk that the budget proposal originator should take on, not the network.

 1) So, if price plummets the originator either

a) pays out of his own pocket
b) does not pay the stipulated amount, leaves the contractor hanging, giving Dash a horrible rep in the "real" world.

 2) But if the price rises

a) pays the contractor and keep the excess
b) pays the contractor and burns the excess coins

Actually, 2b) this second one kind of makes sense. If the originator doesn't comply, his reputation is stained. But what about all of item 1?

1 Dash = 1 Dash. The price in Dash cannot go up or down. I understand a lot of people want to work in fiat, but if the proposal is good, they believe in Dash, I don't see why they can't accept Dash as payment for services.

It may be limiting in some ways, but I think there will be plenty of people who are willing to work for Dash instead of fiat.

Dash has value, if a proposal would add to the value of Dash, then that is only to the benefit of the proposal originator (and the currency as a whole)

[tungfa]

New Tatiana Show live in 1hr @ 12pm EST (on Liberty.me & The LTB Network ) w/ Josh of Vaultoro.com & Daniel Diaz of Dash
 
https://liberty.me/live/the-tatiana-show-dash-digital-currency/

[GhostPlayer]

Well I needed to use Tao's guide to set up my MN so i'm going to have to find out how to locate this debug file, I guess it will involve using "Putty"

 why don't you use Node40.com ?

[GhostPlayer]

1 Dash = 1 Dash. The price in Dash cannot go up or down. I understand a lot of people want to work in fiat, but if the proposal is good, they believe in Dash, I don't see why they can't accept Dash as payment for services.

It may be limiting in some ways, but I think there will be plenty of people who are willing to work for Dash instead of fiat.

Dash has value, if a proposal would add to the value of Dash, then that is only to the benefit of the proposal originator (and the currency as a whole)

spatula, get real... Try the following experiment. Order a pizza and convince them to pay in Dash... What do you think the outcome will be?

 If we contract outside work, people get payed in whatever terms THEY see fit. If could be dollars, it could be bananas. The Miami BTC conference was tagged in USD, not for us, for everyone.

 If, before hand, they accept Dash, brilliant! The core team gets payed in Dash and no one complains.

 Otherwise we have a conundrum.

[semajjames]

Well I needed to use Tao's guide to set up my MN so i'm going to have to find out how to locate this debug file, I guess it will involve using "Putty"

 why don't you use Node40.com ?

What for as a VPN ?

 I know why anyway ,,, I used Tao's guide because I knew nothing at all about what I was doing and need a step by step guide, having just looked at node4 I was completly lost again ,, lol

[GhostPlayer]

So I agree...community members short-changing vendors on the exchange rate would be really bad. In reality, though, community members already can do (and occasionally have done) things that don't necessarily represent the views of the entire network.

 Good points indeed, and a side-effect of decentralisation, and why the DGbB is brilliant at it's core. The MN network is not a true democracy, thank goodness, and the biggest stakeholders have a very high incentive to curate the ballots.

 Sh!t can happen, this is all very experimental, no biggie there. I dont even care if XYZ runs away with the money. That will not be representative in the long run.

[GhostPlayer]

What for as a VPN ?

 click me -> http://www.node40.com

EDIT: the link is redirecting to the /blog sub-page automatically. Remove it from the address

[spatula]

1 Dash = 1 Dash. The price in Dash cannot go up or down. I understand a lot of people want to work in fiat, but if the proposal is good, they believe in Dash, I don't see why they can't accept Dash as payment for services.

It may be limiting in some ways, but I think there will be plenty of people who are willing to work for Dash instead of fiat.

Dash has value, if a proposal would add to the value of Dash, then that is only to the benefit of the proposal originator (and the currency as a whole)

spatula, get real... Try the following experiment. Order a pizza and convince them to pay in Dash... What do you think the outcome will be?

 If we contract outside work, people get payed in whatever terms THEY see fit. If could be dollars, it could be bananas. The Miami BTC conference was tagged in USD, not for us, for everyone.

 If, before hand, they accept Dash, brilliant! The core team gets payed in Dash and no one complains.

 Otherwise we have a conundrum.

Pizza is a terrible example as there would be no reason for the blockchain to fund pizza. It is more likely that the blockchain funds technical projects and marketing projects, both of which there should be people willing to accept Dash as payment and incur any market volatility. If it is an extreme case where the price crashes and they have extensive outstanding debts then they can submit a proposal asking for addtional funds and let the network decide.

[bigrcanada1]

With respect to paying our service providers with Dash rather than fiat, I'm surprised at all the opposition. I think people are letting hindsight dictate how they feel. Yes, in hindsight, the price of Dash has increased by over 2/3 since the start of some of these initiatives. In retrospect, that may seem like a bad deal, since the PR firm will receive more (fiat) than they would have otherwise. But how quickly we forget that for the last 18 months we've been playing limbo ("How low can you go?") with the price of Dash. Other than a few brief spikes, the price of Dash has spent a great many months either languishing or slowly declining. Everybody gets all excited (me too) when it briefly hits .0245 BTC, but then it begins a 9 months slide to a low of .005. I do believe that our future price growth will be explosive, but that's in the future. Also, the people who make our price explode deserve to share in the bounty.

We try to distance ourselves from the world of centralized corporations, but it is helpful to look at some of the things they do well. Corporations, at least in the U.S., usually structure executive compensation in such a way that if the value of the company's stock increases, executives are rewarded with greater compensation. This is done in the form of stock options and grants. In that way, the people who create additional value for the company (in theory) are incentivized to do so. Yes, there are some problems with this system, such as the focus on short- versus long-term growth, but it does tend to motivate people quite well to create value.

I also think it's disingenuous to tell service providers "Hey, we are creating a new form of money. But we would rather pay you in 'old' money (fiat)." That sends entirely the wrong message, making it seem as though our form of money is too unstable to serve as money. It's like owning a GM dealership but driving a Ford to work everyday!

Exactly my thoughts!

[GhostPlayer]

Pizza is a terrible example as there would be no reason for the blockchain to fund pizza. It is more likely that the blockchain funds technical projects and marketing projects, both of which there should be people willing to accept Dash as payment and incur any market volatility. If it is an extreme case where the price crashes and they have extensive outstanding debts then they can submit a proposal asking for addtional funds and let the network decide.

No it's perfect example. You order pizza from your phone, and want to pay with Dash. You send the pizza over and insist in paying with Dash. Not gonna happen. The pizza place has to pay for electricity, employees, bough, tomato, cheese... is USD, not Dash.

 You want to build an underwater nuclear proof full-node to save Dash from holocaust. You win a proposal and want to sub-contract marine engineers, titanium shielding and aluminium foil against aliens. You want to pay in Dash. Not gonna happen, they have a chain down the line they'd need to convert to Fiat.

 Hire an independent web-dev to do his own thing... now THAT I do see happening. An extremely forward thinking tech business? I do see it happening.

 All I am saying is to be realistic about things. Sure I'd love to have my pizza deliveries anonymous, but we must build the foundations for it, not argue why it's not happening.