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Author Topic: 1GH/s, 20w, $500 — Butterflylabs, is it a scam?  (Read 116489 times)
CanaryInTheMine
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between a rock and a block!


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November 08, 2011, 01:46:46 PM
 #261

Yeah, I wouldnt bet $20.000 there either (or anywhere else for that matter), but Id be surprised Goat would actually put up 100 BTC, let alone 1000 or 10000 and I suspect the butterfly lab guys will gladly match a few 100. Well worth the risk IMO.

Anyway, Ill formulate a bet. How is this as bet:

The Butterfly Labs "Bitforce miner" shown here:
http://butterflylabs.com/
is just a scam, not a real product under development.

Butterfly Labs will not ship a single self designed bitcoin mining "bitforce 256" product in the next 6 months to paying customers

If they ship a single BitForce SHA256 board to a paying customer within this time, and its verified to produce more than 500MH/s while consuming less than 50 Watt, the above statement is deemed false, and Butterfly labs is not a scam.

Butterfly labs will also not let anyone independently verify their custom hardware is real and works. If they do let someone independent, recommended by bitcointalk forum, test and verify their claims, and this person acknowledges the hardware is real and produces results that are roughly inline with the performance claims made on Butterfly's website, it is also not considered a scam and this statement is considered false.


Yes, i cut their projections by half, underdelivering on promises is not the same as being a scam.

I will take this bet with the butterfly labs guy if it is done with in the next 10 days and Inaba holds the money. Cutting the projections in half seems fair to me. Butterfly willing to put down $300 that you are not a scam??? I highly doubt it.

Inaba if this guy is willing to do this please post an address in this thread so everyone can see that we both pay you. Thanks.


Goat, nothing is stopping you from finding an escrow and depositing a $10,000 bounty.  The onus is on you to put up or shut up.

Your next post should be showing which escrow you deposited 10K with.

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Gerald Davis


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November 08, 2011, 01:55:57 PM
 #262

Why not let everyone have some fun betting this? Im creating the bet, and as a start Ill bet a whopping one bitcoin on this being legit Wink
You will earn more if you bet early, so Im sure you will gladly put 100 BTC against mine and others are free to join if they are certain this is a scam (or isnt)
.
IF BFL is unwilling to match those bets, I think you will have proven your point and whatever you bet ought to be a safe win.

Ill post the bet when my transaction clears. Since I cant vouch for the betting site being safe, I recommend people not bet large sums of money. Lets keep it fun.

Where is the link?  I will bet against.  Honestly if i lost I would be happy.  Sadly I don't think I will lose. 

Reminds me of when I was deployed to Iraq.  The over/under for getting relieved (going home) was Jan 14.  Obviously I took over.  Worst case scenario I win $100, best case scenario I got out of that shit hole early than I planned.  Turned out I lost the best.  We left Jan 1.  Best bet I ever lost.
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between a rock and a block!


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November 08, 2011, 01:59:47 PM
 #263

I said I would make a bet, it takes two people to have a bet. I will not be sending money unless a second party will. I will be happy to use Inaba to hold the money. It seems silly to send him the money if no one is willing to bet that this is not a scam. If anyone is interested in a bet with the expectations listed cut in half even I am more than willing to make the bet.

Anyone interested?


put up the money first.  you might get more than one person to take your bet if you put up the dough.

until you put up the money, this is all you're doing: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WL8jpPHJFAA

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CanaryInTheMine
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November 08, 2011, 02:08:57 PM
 #264

I don't see why I need to send someone money if no one will take the bet. The bet is an offer that so far no one has interest in.

I will be willing to bet with more than one person. Please post in this thread if you are interested.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WL8jpPHJFAA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WL8jpPHJFAA

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WL8jpPHJFAA

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November 08, 2011, 02:17:48 PM
 #265

I don't see why I need to send someone money if no one will take the bet. The bet is an offer that so far no one has interest in.

I will be willing to bet with more than one person. Please post in this thread if you are interested.
  No need to send anyone money...   What 'spread' are you willing to take.  Right now BFL claim 1050MHs fromt heir dual chip Bitforce1. Are you willing to give a +-10% spread on it?  If so, I got 12 BTC 'in Favor' of their claims.....

  HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA   Cry

  best noise I heard all day!

If you're not excited by the idea of being an early adopter 'now', then you should come back in three or four years and either tell us "Told you it'd never work!" or join what should, by then, be a much more stable and easier-to-use system. - GA
It is being worked on by smart people. -DamienBlack
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November 08, 2011, 02:43:23 PM
 #266

Where is the link?  I will bet against.  Honestly if i lost I would be happy.  Sadly I don't think I will lose. 

Its not up yet. Bets apparently have to be reviewed and accepted, I will post the link when its up.

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November 08, 2011, 02:46:48 PM
 #267

   Yep, Inaba is fine for escorw. As long as he is down for it.  The only thing I would like BFL to verify is that it is 1 or 2 boards in their rig they are claiming 1050MHs with. I do not want to get caught in a textual error due to poor Engrish skills by finding out they have 2 boards(4 chips) in there and just did not convey that properly. My bet would be for the speed of the unit they advertised with whatever is in it, just to be clear.

  As for 'time frame', it would be nice if BFL would make a solid date agreement with sending someone one of the 1050 units so we can set one.  Right now, there really isn't a good time to go by. :/  It would seem they should have everything in order to do it now. I am more than willing to commit to the bet now, without a time frame if we can agree to call it a draw if there is no unit available to test within, say, 2 weeks?  Don't want even my miniscule amount of BTC tied up because a third party is slow.. ;p


   BFL, please come on and send a unit to someone already!



     Cheers,
       Derek

If you're not excited by the idea of being an early adopter 'now', then you should come back in three or four years and either tell us "Told you it'd never work!" or join what should, by then, be a much more stable and easier-to-use system. - GA
It is being worked on by smart people. -DamienBlack
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Gerald Davis


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November 08, 2011, 02:51:28 PM
 #268

Where is the link?  I will bet against.  Honestly if i lost I would be happy.  Sadly I don't think I will lose. 

Its not up yet. Bets apparently have to be reviewed and accepted, I will post the link when its up.

Sounds good.  I will throw some coins on it.  Having a single public and open "bet" can be predictive.  (i.e. Intrade tends to do better than professional pollsters).
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November 08, 2011, 05:10:07 PM
 #269

I will setup a couple escrow addresses when I get home tonight on my secure client and post them here.  Before anyone sends money/makes a bet, the escrow conditions must be laid out pretty rigidly so everyone knows what to expect as far as conditions go for the money to be released or returned as appropriate.

 

If you're searching these lines for a point, you've probably missed it.  There was never anything there in the first place.
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November 08, 2011, 06:14:04 PM
 #270

We will also do our best to accomodate your betting needs. Just let us know. There is already one bet opened:

http://betsofbitco.in/item?id=141

And I know people opening a bet with different conditions.

Bets of Bitcoin
http://betsofbitco.in/
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November 08, 2011, 06:28:46 PM
 #271

following discussion

BTC: 1CDCLDBHbAzHyYUkk1wYHPYmrtDZNhk8zf
LTC: LMS7SqZJnqzxo76iDSEua33WCyYZdjaQoE
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November 08, 2011, 06:30:52 PM
 #272

Hi guys,

Just a quick note.  

BF Labs Inc. will not be involving itself in any wagers.  If our generous friend would follow through on their promise of a $10,000 bounty for producing a unit with performance as described, we'll be happy to claim that amount in the name of a charity of the board's choice.  However, no such bounty has been placed in escrow and I don't think anyone truly expects our generous friend to follow through.

Regarding your individual wagers, I would be careful to allow for some upside flexibility in the performance claims.  It would be unfortunate if you were to loose a wager should the unit exceed expectations, due to a badly worded bet definition.  

I'm not saying the units perform differently than our purchase guarantee as stated on the site.  Just choose your words carefully.

Kind regards,
BFL


Butterfly Labs  -  www.butterflylabs.com  -  Bitcoin Mining Hardware
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November 08, 2011, 06:42:18 PM
 #273

Hi guys,

Just a quick note.  

BF Labs Inc. will not be involving itself in any wagers.  If our generous friend would follow through on their promise of a $10,000 bounty for producing a unit with performance as described, we'll be happy to claim that amount in the name of a charity of the board's choice.  However, no such bounty has been placed in escrow and I don't think anyone truly expects our generous friend to follow through.

Regarding your individual wagers, I would be careful to allow for some upside flexibility in the performance claims.  It would be unfortunate if you were to loose a wager should the unit exceed expectations, due to a badly worded bet definition.  

I'm not saying the units perform differently than our purchase guarantee as stated on the site.  Just choose your words carefully.

Kind regards,
BFL

   While you're here..

  1. Did you receive my PM a few days ago?
  2. Can you verify the board density in the 1050MHs unit. I.e. is it 1-dual chip board, or 2-dual chip boards? or what?


     Cheers,
         Derek

If you're not excited by the idea of being an early adopter 'now', then you should come back in three or four years and either tell us "Told you it'd never work!" or join what should, by then, be a much more stable and easier-to-use system. - GA
It is being worked on by smart people. -DamienBlack
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November 08, 2011, 06:42:31 PM
 #274

Hi guys,
Hi there, is this where you work? http://maps.google.com/maps?q=25E+12th+Street+Kansas+City,+Missouri+64106&hl=en&ll=39.099352,-94.581792&spn=0.006927,0.013937&sll=39.099854,-94.582433&layer=c&cbp=13,182.5,,0,-18.13&cbll=39.099928,-94.58243&hnear=25+E+12+St,+Kansas+City,+Jackson,+Missouri+64106&t=m&z=17&vpsrc=0&panoid=lhf4bpBBG1xVb51eihmWyA

BTC: 1CDCLDBHbAzHyYUkk1wYHPYmrtDZNhk8zf
LTC: LMS7SqZJnqzxo76iDSEua33WCyYZdjaQoE
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November 08, 2011, 06:45:48 PM
 #275

BF Labs Inc. will not be involving itself ...
Sorry for the stupid question... what state is Butterfly Labs incorporated in?

BTC: 1CDCLDBHbAzHyYUkk1wYHPYmrtDZNhk8zf
LTC: LMS7SqZJnqzxo76iDSEua33WCyYZdjaQoE
CanaryInTheMine
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between a rock and a block!


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November 08, 2011, 06:47:11 PM
 #276

BF Labs Inc. will not be involving itself ...
Sorry for the stupid question... what state is Butterfly Labs incorporated in?

read the entire thread before asking duplicate questions and making duplicate posts

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DeathAndTaxes
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November 08, 2011, 06:50:06 PM
 #277

BF Labs Inc. will not be involving itself ...
Sorry for the stupid question... what state is Butterfly Labs incorporated in?

read the entire thread before asking duplicate questions and making duplicate posts

Wouldn't it have been faster to just answer the question?

There is a BF Labs incorporated in WY in August of this year.
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November 08, 2011, 06:51:04 PM
 #278

Hi guys,

Just a quick note.  

BF Labs Inc. will not be involving itself in any wagers.  If our generous friend would follow through on their promise of a $10,000 bounty for producing a unit with performance as described, we'll be happy to claim that amount in the name of a charity of the board's choice.  However, no such bounty has been placed in escrow and I don't think anyone truly expects our generous friend to follow through.

Regarding your individual wagers, I would be careful to allow for some upside flexibility in the performance claims.  It would be unfortunate if you were to loose a wager should the unit exceed expectations, due to a badly worded bet definition.  

I'm not saying the units perform differently than our purchase guarantee as stated on the site.  Just choose your words carefully.

Kind regards,
BFL

   While you're here..

  1. Did you receive my PM a few days ago?
  2. Can you verify the board density in the 1050MHs unit. I.e. is it 1-dual chip board, or 2-dual chip boards? or what?


     Cheers,
         Derek

Hi.  Yes, I received your PM and I will respond.  I apologize for the delay, but I don't check the PM's frequently.  I'll reply with my company email and we can continue that discussion there.

Regarding the board density, what you see is what you get.  The posted photos are of the units we are preparing.  

I understand speculation is rampant, and I sincerely wish we would have made it to release before someone mentioned us on this forum.  Please be patient and allow us the time we need to finish our work.  All questions will be answered to full satisfaction during our live demo event.

Thanks,
BFL

Butterfly Labs  -  www.butterflylabs.com  -  Bitcoin Mining Hardware
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November 08, 2011, 07:24:58 PM
 #279

BF Labs Inc. will not be involving itself ...
Sorry for the stupid question... what state is Butterfly Labs incorporated in?

read the entire thread before asking duplicate questions and making duplicate posts

Wouldn't it have been faster to just answer the question?

There is a BF Labs incorporated in WY in August of this year.
Thanks.

What we need is a "search in thread" feature.

BTC: 1CDCLDBHbAzHyYUkk1wYHPYmrtDZNhk8zf
LTC: LMS7SqZJnqzxo76iDSEua33WCyYZdjaQoE
DeathAndTaxes
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Gerald Davis


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November 08, 2011, 07:27:27 PM
 #280

What we need is a "search in thread" feature.

We have one.   Grin  Just use the search box while in a thread.
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