Scientific proof that God exists?

[BADecker]

Once you understand that we're living on a flat earth underneath artificially constructed dome, this whole thread becomes an exercise in foolishness.

Now you are really talking silly.

What do you think the whole universe is? It is an artificial construct made by God. The Heaven of Heavens is the reality.

[BADecker]

...

Nowhere in the Bible does Jesus say that the way to goodness and life is "through me, Jesus". In fact, he says that "God's Kingdom is not here (i.e. within Jesus), and it is not there (i.e. somewhere else); GOD'S KINGDOM IS WITHIN YOU". So repentance and forgiveness must begin within self, for that is where God resides--within YOU!

Since you ignore the Bible explanations that show how Jesus says that He is the way, the truth, and the life... and you ignore that the Kingdom of God is within the people that believe Jesus salvation... you are simply of a different religion. If you happen to use the term Christian regarding yourself, it is with reference to a tainted meaning.

[notbatman]

Once you understand that we're living on a flat earth underneath artificially constructed dome, this whole thread becomes an exercise in foolishness.

Now you are really talking silly.

What do you think the whole universe is? It is an artificial construct made by God. The Heaven of Heavens is the reality.

Based on hard evidence i.e. blocks of pure water that fell from the sky I'd say the whole universe is mostly water.

[1aguar]

Since you like to play with the Bible so much, why don't you repent by becoming a believer of it?

I do not wish to surrender my discernment to any one set of texts, that is totally irrational.
I would FAR rather READ IT ALL and judge in wisdom of knowledge. That is called "using God's gift of reason".

According to YOU, ANYTHING could be in the Bible and it is still valid, even if it is a LIE added by man:

Scholars didn't get into God's mind to see that He wanted that ending in there, so He had it added later.

Wow, how convenient! No need to think critically or even rationally, just use post-hoc reasoning and believe that ALL of history aligns to your worldview and your magical thinking. There must be some kind of magic in that book you call Bible!

Since you like to study the Bible so much, why don't YOU stop being SO NARROW in your "studies" and read the 24 other Gospels that you missed? Oh, I see that you won't accept anything from those other books because the Church of Rome did not accept them into the official canon of "inerrant ancient writings" and declared them to be heresies? Wow! You will get nowhere in your studies with that attitude.

You are an intellectual child, BADecker. At least MMH has enough critical thinking to realize that the Bible has been tampered with. You are totally into magical thinking and using post-hoc reasoning to justify your "perfect book" which is actually full of LIES added by man. Jesus tried to tell you that God's kingdom is within YOU, but you choose to think that God's kingdom of perfection is within the Bible. What folly! You are just like those scientists who search for consciousness within the structures of the brain; you seek out the radio announcer inside the radio; what part of "God's kingdom is within YOU" is so hard to understand? Your narrow-mindedness will not EVER lead you to KNOWLEDGE, and your faith in GOD'S WORD is in error if you think that the BIBLE is inerrant. It is NOT, and you are promoting a horrible lie that does not stand up to reason nor even basic moral scrutiny (the Binding of Isaac is an OT story that has God terrorizing a child; how could that story be true if God is morally good?).

No need to post your irrational opinion in this thread until you have faced the facts about your narrow-minded and fallacious claims about the Bible. God intervened to make that book perfect? NO WAY, THE QUALITY OF ANY ISOLATED MESSAGE DECREASES OVER TIME, AND THAT IS A LAW OF NATURE.

[BADecker]

Since you like to play with the Bible so much, why don't you repent by becoming a believer of it?

I do not wish to surrender my discernment to any one set of texts, that is totally irrational.
I would FAR rather READ IT ALL and judge in wisdom of knowledge. That is called "using God's gift of reason".

According to YOU, ANYTHING could be in the Bible and it is still valid, even if it is a LIE added by man:

That's more or less correct, since it wouldn't be a lie added by man if it were in the Bible. If it were in only a copy or two, it might be a lie. But if it were in the vast majority of copies, it would not be a lie. It would be, as it is, God's Word.

Scholars didn't get into God's mind to see that He wanted that ending in there, so He had it added later.

Wow, how convenient! No need to think critically or even rationally, just use post-hoc reasoning and believe that ALL of history aligns to your worldview and your magical thinking. There must be some kind of magic in that book you call Bible!

You are wrong. There isn't any magic in the Bible. There is only God's Word. When you happen to become so great that you understand and are able to use enough logic and knowledge to keep yourself alive much longer than 100 years - like 1,000 years - then you might have enough reasoning ability to determine that your logic is a bit better than that of someone else. (BTW, Satan does have a lot of knowledge, and has kept himself alive for thousands of years. Aren't you going to ask him how? After all, wouldn't your good buddy, Satan, offer some of that knowledge to you?)

Until that time, recognize that your logic is flawed if you don't accept Bible logic. Why? Because Bible logic has proven itself over and over to be the truth down through the ages.

Since you like to study the Bible so much, why don't YOU stop being SO NARROW in your "studies" and read the 24 other Gospels that you missed? Oh, I see that you won't accept anything from those other books because the Church of Rome did not accept them into the official canon of "inerrant ancient writings" and declared them to be heresies? Wow! You will get nowhere in your studies with that attitude.

No matter who left other books out of the Bible, it was because those books were flawed with regard to the uniform knowledge that the Bible contains - the teaching of God that is in the Bible. This is available for anyone to examine.

Thus, why play around with things not needed? The Bible is self-sufficient, no matter if you repeat the same things over and over with multitudes of additional books. The point is salvation through Jesus, and the Bible is well sufficient for that as it is.

You are an intellectual child, BADecker. At least MMH has enough critical thinking to realize that the Bible has been tampered with.

Well, what does this have to do with Bible tampering? You seem to like the idea of tampering with the Bible. You would even mess up the teachings of salvation by making your stupid Phoenix Journals that teach works righteousness into the way of salvation.

If the Bible happened to be flawed a little, you want to go all the way into that which is false by getting rid of the truth of the Bible.

You are totally into magical thinking and using post-hoc reasoning to justify your "perfect book" which is actually full of LIES added by man. Jesus tried to tell you that God's kingdom is within YOU, but you choose to think that God's kingdom of perfection is within the Bible.

Of course the Kingdom of God within you is true... if you are a Bible-believing Christian. Jesus even said such. You repeat this over and over all the time. The fact that you do this is that you are constantly trying to corrupt the way of salvation for people. How big of a cut on Phoenix Journals that you sell are you getting?

Since it is the Bible that shows salvation, thereby making the Kingdom of God to be in those who are saved by Bible salvation, the Kingdom of God is in the Bible as well. The Bible has no saying that says it is not.

The beginning of the Book of John shows that Jesus is the Word of God. So, when you get into the Bible, and get some of the Word into yourself, you are getting into the Word, and are getting some of the Word into yourself. That is how the Kingdom of God is in you as well as you being in the Kingdom of God.

The funny part is, since you have read some of the Bible, the Kingdom of God is working in you to convert you to the salvation of Jesus, the Word. Ha, ha, ha. You can't fight it. Either convert, or you will die.

What folly! You are just like those scientists who search for consciousness within the structures of the brain;

Huh? I have constantly said that there is a greater body than the physical body, a spiritual body, and that it is even possible that our memories are stored there. Why are you attempting to slander me in some silly way that is backfiring on you? It's probably because you don't have any foundation for the things that you tout.

you seek out the radio announcer inside the radio; what part of "God's kingdom is within YOU" is so hard to understand? Your narrow-mindedness will not EVER lead you to KNOWLEDGE, and your faith in GOD'S WORD is in error if you think that the BIBLE is inerrant. It is NOT, and you are promoting a horrible lie that does not stand up to reason nor even basic moral scrutiny (the Binding of Isaac is an OT story that has God terrorizing a child; how could that story be true if God is morally good?).

God is the One Who controls the Bible and what is written therein. Thus the Bible is inerrant even if it changes 100%. But, because God wants stability, the Bible has not changed. There simply are additional books and stories that are trying tho do the same thing that you do to some extent... ad themselves to the Bible.

Neither your false claims of salvation by works righteousness, nor your works righteousness will ever save you. You aren't good enough. You need the proffered perfection of Jesus for salvation. Every day you wait, you are coming closer to losing yourself forever.

No need to post your irrational opinion in this thread until you have faced the facts about your narrow-minded and fallacious claims about the Bible. God intervened to make that book perfect? NO WAY, THE QUALITY OF ANY ISOLATED MESSAGE DECREASES OVER TIME, AND THAT IS A LAW OF NATURE.

Whew! How much time is it going to take for the minimal quality of the Phoenix Journals to dissipate completely? The more of them that are written, the crazier they become.

You don't have anything that can stand up to the good works of Islam. With the coming Armageddon between Islam and the free world - in particular, with Christianity - when your buddy, Satan, takes over for a little while, then my Jesus will return and destroy Satan, Islam, and all good-works religions at the same time.

You really need to convert to Christianity now, while you have a chance. If you wait until after the return of Jesus, it will be too late for you.

[1aguar]

No matter who left other books out of the Bible, it was because those books were flawed with regard to the uniform knowledge that the Bible contains - the teaching of God that is in the Bible. This is available for anyone to examine.

This is more post-hoc reasoning. Your argument is like so:
These books are in the Bible because they are the true teaching of God.
Thus, whoever left out those other books must have done so because they are not as true.

You do not examine the possibility that the true cause of those books being in the Bible is that the Church of Rome wanted them in there. Satan is not my buddy because I RECOGNIZE that these books are promoted by the adversary. Do you?

Thus, why play around with things not needed?

How would you know that some knowledge is not needed if you have not read it and dismiss it offhand?
You would have to be respecting someone else's OPINION in not reading knowledge.
So you are just accepting the Church of Rome's authority for what should go in the Bible, you have done no independent thinking or study to determine that something is not needed because it does not fit, you just assume that what you have in front of you is 100% true because the Church of Rome authorities never allowed you a look at any other material. No way can you come to a conclusion about a book by NOT READING IT.

You would even mess up the teachings of salvation by making your stupid Phoenix Journals that teach works righteousness into the way of salvation.

If the Bible happened to be flawed a little, you want to go all the way into that which is false by getting rid of the truth of the Bible.

I am obligated to use reason. If the Bible is flawed, then it is NOT INERRANT. It is obviously tampered and totally incomplete with only 4 of 28 gospels, therefore it is flawed and NOT INERRANT. How could GOD terrorize a child??

You should start to doubt the claim that GOD RE-WROTE the Bible to make it perfect. Nothing of this world is perfect, BADecker.

There is no such thing as "Jesus salvation".

Nowhere in the Bible does Jesus say that the way to goodness and life is "through me, Jesus". In fact, he says that "God's Kingdom is not here (i.e. within Jesus), and it is not there (i.e. somewhere else); GOD'S KINGDOM IS WITHIN YOU". So repentance and forgiveness must begin within self, for that is where God resides--within YOU! Furthermore, if you read the other gospels, you will get the message, but the Church authorities picked only a few gospels to mislead you. You probably already know that the biggest lies are 90% truth!

[BADecker]

No matter who left other books out of the Bible, it was because those books were flawed with regard to the uniform knowledge that the Bible contains - the teaching of God that is in the Bible. This is available for anyone to examine.

This is more post-hoc reasoning. Your argument is like so:
These books are in the Bible because they are the true teaching of God.
Thus, whoever left out those other books must have done so because they are not as true.

You do not examine the possibility that the true cause of those books being in the Bible is that the Church of Rome wanted them in there. Satan is not my buddy because I RECOGNIZE that these books are promoted by the adversary. Do you?

Thus, why play around with things not needed?

How would you know that some knowledge is not needed if you have not read it and dismiss it offhand?
You would have to be respecting someone else's OPINION in not reading knowledge.
So you are just accepting the Church of Rome's authority for what should go in the Bible, you have done no independent thinking or study to determine that something is not needed because it does not fit, you just assume that what you have in front of you is 100% true because the Church of Rome authorities never allowed you a look at any other material. No way can you come to a conclusion about a book by NOT READING IT.

You would even mess up the teachings of salvation by making your stupid Phoenix Journals that teach works righteousness into the way of salvation.

If the Bible happened to be flawed a little, you want to go all the way into that which is false by getting rid of the truth of the Bible.

I am obligated to use reason. If the Bible is flawed, then it is NOT INERRANT. It is obviously tampered and totally incomplete with only 4 of 28 gospels, therefore it is flawed and NOT INERRANT. How could GOD terrorize a child??

You should start to doubt the claim that GOD RE-WROTE the Bible to make it perfect. Nothing of this world is perfect, BADecker.

There is no such thing as "Jesus salvation".

Nowhere in the Bible does Jesus say that the way to goodness and life is "through me, Jesus". In fact, he says that "God's Kingdom is not here (i.e. within Jesus), and it is not there (i.e. somewhere else); GOD'S KINGDOM IS WITHIN YOU". So repentance and forgiveness must begin within self, for that is where God resides--within YOU! Furthermore, if you read the other gospels, you will get the message, but the Church authorities picked only a few gospels to mislead you. You probably already know that the biggest lies are 90% truth!

Well, the proof is in the pudding, so to speak.

The Bible and Christianity are acknowledged worldwide, even in may Islamic and other religious cultures. The Phoenix Journals can't seem to get off the ground.

Just because you won't acknowledge the words of John in the Bible, that show that Jesus expressly taught salvation through Himself - even though that teaching was often in parable form - doesn't mean those words aren't there.

Your religion. Jesus holds the choice open for you.

[1aguar]

The Bible and Christianity are acknowledged worldwide, even in may Islamic and other religious cultures. The Phoenix Journals can't seem to get off the ground.

Is your world in chaos? Maybe your way and wisdom didn't work? So what gives you the right to pound and pounce on mine? You never even read any of the other gospels and still you insist that you have the complete Bible, which is ironically the same Bible that is promoted by the Church of Rome since ancient times.

Also: GOD TERRORIZES A CHILD IN THE BINDING OF ISAAC AND YOU BLINDLY CALL IT GOOD?
THAT is one of the reasons why atheists hate religion.

Just because you won't acknowledge the words of John in the Bible, that show that Jesus expressly taught salvation through Himself - even though that teaching was often in parable form - doesn't mean those words aren't there.

OK, you have one gospel where it seems like Jesus is savior. Why should we pick that gospel and ignore all the others? Because the Church of Rome approved it??

The facts of the miracles that He did, along with His resurrection and ascension show that He is God as well as man. That is why only He can offer salvation. If we could do it ourselves, we would. But we don't because we can't.

Actually, Jesus urged you not to worship him.
Did you never read any of the 24 gospels that were left out of the Bible?

[QuestionAuthority]

[PrikiNo.1]

Play with Yoga all you want. Learn all the knowledge of the secrets of the universe that you can find. But in you learning, remember to rely on the things of the Bible, or you will lose everything.

Mate, I have a question for you... Did you read and analyze the whole Bible?

Because, if you did it I am sure that you will not wrote this things about Yoga. Everything that is mentioned in the Yoga you can find in the Bible. In the New Testament, when Christ rose from the dead he send the apostles in the different area of the world to spread The Holy Scripture. Do you know which apostle was send in India?

How many chakras are in the body? How many commandments there are? How many apostles are? The answer of the three question is 12! Everything that is is mention in the Bible is always connected with the number 12! Do you think that there isn't some logic here?

I am sure that any person who will first read about the Yoga and then start to read the Bible (New Testament) will understand the acts of the apostles.

Again, the Bible is NOT basically meant to be a history book. Nor is meant to be a book of things like Yoga.

Simply because the Bible has laws it, doesn't mean that some of these laws cannot be found in places like Yoga. Good laws and understandings are found all over the world, in all kinds of writings, and in all kinds of societies.

The point of the Bible is that God made all the laws, and set them in peoples' hearts, and then re-gave the best of them through Moses because people were forgetting them. The whole idea behind doing this was to prepare the setting for the Savior, Jesus Christ.

In other words, the laws for living can be found in many places. But the law for eternal life can only be found from one source, the Bible. You, yourself, said above that Jesus sent apostles to India. Why not honor the Bible, the only source that tells about Jesus Christ, the only salvation, even though there have been many books written about Him.

Yoga and its writings have been around a long time. Yoga existed long before Jesus came... even before the time of Moses. Yet it never had any exact information about Jesus. The best it had was some symbolism about how there might come a time of salvation. If there are writings in Yoga that have incorporated Jesus into Yoga, written at a time following the time of Jesus, great. Now, get into the Bible and find the details.

Laws and wisdom of earth and science - like how many Chakras are in the body - don't have anything to do with salvation. They exist with or without salvation. Jesus is the only way of salvation. In fact, one of the old meanings of the word, "Nicolaitans," in the Revelation is, the people who combine Christianity with Eastern religions. People who practice Yoga regularly, have essentially turned it into an eastern religion.

Keep Yoga separate from Christianity, because it IS separate from Christianity. Yoga teaches good living in this life. Christianity teach the only way to everlasting life, through Jesus.

Now I am sure that you never read the whole Bible and also you don't know anything about Yoga...

Because if you do, you will know that the Bible is one of the biggest books in the world where you can find anything you need like books of Law, History, Wisdom, Prophets, History of the Christ, Acts of Apostles and The Revelation.

Now, I must remind you a few things that you forgot in our discussion. The evidences from where the Bible originated are found in ancient Mesopotamia, where actually the whole things have happened. And according to new research that period is now dating for 10 to 14.000 years b.c.e. Christ was born in the New Era and Yoga was show for the first time in 1000 years before Christ. The founder of Yoga is Patanjali!

So tell me know, how can YOGA be much older then the Bible when the facts and the stories are talking about period long before there was a life on EARTH!?

Another thing that is mentioned in Yoga and Christ do the same thing is: I am the LIGHT! So, actually Christ before came to Earth has visited the Vedas and ask them about what is the LIGHT!?

Mate, instead of giving me no sense things, why don't try to think in terms of energy and try to understand what Christ and the Apostles where talking about it?.. I hope now that you realize in what I believe...

And one more thing. You mention the word religion, so please give me your definition about what is religion and what is spirituality?

[BADecker]

Now I am sure that you never read the whole Bible and also you don't know anything about Yoga...

Because if you do, you will know that the Bible is one of the biggest books in the world where you can find anything you need like books of Law, History, Wisdom, Prophets, History of the Christ, Acts of Apostles and The Revelation.

Now, I must remind you a few things that you forgot in our discussion. The evidences from where the Bible originated are found in ancient Mesopotamia, where actually the whole things have happened. And according to new research that period is now dating for 10 to 14.000 years b.c.e. Christ was born in the New Era and Yoga was show for the first time in 1000 years before Christ. The founder of Yoga is Patanjali!

So tell me know, how can YOGA be much older then the Bible when the facts and the stories are talking about period long before there was a life on EARTH!?

Another thing that is mentioned in Yoga and Christ do the same thing is: I am the LIGHT! So, actually Christ before came to Earth has visited the Vedas and ask them about what is the LIGHT!?

Mate, instead of giving me no sense things, why don't try to think in terms of energy and try to understand what Christ and the Apostles where talking about it?.. I hope now that you realize in what I believe...

And one more thing. You mention the word religion, so please give me your definition about what is religion and what is spirituality?

Hi! We are having an interesting discussion here. I wonder what it is all about. I agree with much of what you say. Neither of us knows everything. So, what are we really discussing?

I am saying that God is His own "person," just like we are our own person... only more so.

I am I. I think my thoughts. I feel the things that I feel. Nobody else is me. Nobody else feels what I feel. Some people may empathize with me if they see my condition. A few sensitive people may feel my vibes even though they don't know me. But they are not me. I am me.

The same goes for you. The same goes for God, except that He may be more Himself than we are we, and, He knows all about everything. He does more than empathize with us, though we don't realize it very easily.

Is this what we are discussing? Are you saying that God is simply unfeeling energy? What are we really talking about here?

[XinXan]

Listen at the end of the day you can belive whatever you want but don't force it on the rest of us if it's not regulated by the government or the laws that we are actually using in real life.

[BADecker]

Listen at the end of the day you can belive whatever you want but don't force it on the rest of us if it's not regulated by the government or the laws that we are actually using in real life.

You are forced into my religion. I force it on you. Here's how I do it: force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force, force.

Got it? You are now forced. Don't you feel better now?

If it bothers you so much, maybe you should check out and see if what you believe in your religion, be it atheism or anything else, is correct. If it isn't, maybe you should find out what is correct.

[farrukh]

no he doesnt exist for many and yes he does for many,better we dont discuss of someone who mad eus.

[BADecker]

no he doesnt exist for many and yes he does for many,better we dont discuss of someone who mad eus.

But God exists for Himself, as science has proven.

[QuestionAuthority]

God gave me ringworm for my sins.

[sartorpc]

It is clear that there is no scientific proof yet, but I think it will come someday, maybe in 1000 years.

[1aguar]

Neither of us knows everything. So, what are we really discussing?

Hi BADecker,
We were discussing how you are so narrow that you make every effort not to read any more than the 4 gospels that the Church of Rome approved for your indoctrination. That is the only reason that you believe in the so-called "Jesus salvation"--you are indoctrinated!

If it bothers you so much, maybe you should check out and see if what you believe in your religion, be it atheism or anything else, is correct. If it isn't, maybe you should find out what is correct.

Good advice. I suggest that you do some reading; perhaps start with Phoenix Journal #2, it is a valid gospel.

[BADecker]

Neither of us knows everything. So, what are we really discussing?

Hi BADecker,
We were discussing how you are so narrow that you make every effort not to read any more than the 4 gospels that the Church of Rome approved for your indoctrination. That is the only reason that you believe in the so-called "Jesus salvation"--you are indoctrinated!

If it bothers you so much, maybe you should check out and see if what you believe in your religion, be it atheism or anything else, is correct. If it isn't, maybe you should find out what is correct.

Good advice. I suggest that you do some reading; perhaps start with Phoenix Journal #2, it is a valid gospel.

There are hundreds of thousands - maybe millions - of books. Because of this, I don't have time to read them all. Besides, I wouldn't want to.

Somebody called those other so-called gospels, "gospels." This doesn't mean that they are. I don't need them. John in the Bible tells us that the books in the Bible are written that we might be saved. If there were a salvation advantage in other so-called gospels, they would be in the Bible. The fact that they are not in the Bible, shows that there is probably disadvantage in them regarding salvation. At best, they are not needed.

You have shown by the things that you have spoken about the Phoenix Journals, that the PJs are a false religion. Thanks for explaining this to all of us. (Remember? I almost had to drag your simple explanation out of you. You wanted us to read all that garbage just to find out that it was garbage. Thanks for this.) Because of it, we don't need the PJs. Certainly you are welcome to consider them your religion or whatever you want to call it.

[1aguar]

If there were a salvation advantage in other so-called gospels, they would be in the Bible.

I do not wish to surrender my discernment to any one set of texts, that is totally irrational.
I would FAR rather READ IT ALL and judge in wisdom of knowledge. That is called "using God's gift of reason".

According to YOU, ANYTHING could be in the Bible and it is still valid, even if it is a LIE added by man.

You are using fallacious thinking known as post-hoc reasoning. You have faith in something (i.e. that the Bible is inerrant) and it clouds your reasoning, so you make false claims/arguments without first seeing if the premises are correct (they are not).

You do not examine the possibility that the true cause of those books being in the Bible is that the Church of Rome wanted them in there. Satan is not MY buddy because I RECOGNIZE that these books are promoted by the adversary. Do you?