HASHNEST Discussion and Support Thread

[DebitMe]

This sucks big time. Hope the price recovers in the meantime for owners of Umisoo.

On the other hand, if these get turned off, would this affect diff?

There is no guarantee that they will be turned off, or that S2's are currently hashing for the UMISOO contract.  If Bitmain has gone in and upgraded all S2's to S5's already, then they can provide the hashrate for the UMISOO and S2 contracts for cheaper than what they are selling it for.  It also means they will probably continue to mine with them or resell them as S5's now.

I also always bet that they had cheaper than .098 kw/h electricity rates, but charged us that amount.  So they could still run them for themselves if it makes sense.

[cryptojumper]

At what BTC price do they stop that pacmic contract which I was saving for... Maybe it's good I still haven't bought it..

[DebitMe]

At what BTC price do they stop that pacmic contract which I was saving for... Maybe it's good I still haven't bought it..

Depends on difficulty.  Use a calculator to find when 1 TH/s produces negative revenue today using 590 watts of power at .098 cents a kw/h.

[TracerX]

At what BTC price do they stop that pacmic contract which I was saving for... Maybe it's good I still haven't bought it..

I believe the PACMICs will run 120 days from the contract start date before they determine if the unit is turning a profit, then the ten-day grace period kicks in.  I may be incorrect, however.

Needless to say, I kicked everything over from compounding interest to paying out today....

[crazyivan]

This sucks big time. Hope the price recovers in the meantime for owners of Umisoo.

On the other hand, if these get turned off, would this affect diff?

There is no guarantee that they will be turned off, or that S2's are currently hashing for the UMISOO contract.  If Bitmain has gone in and upgraded all S2's to S5's already, then they can provide the hashrate for the UMISOO and S2 contracts for cheaper than what they are selling it for.  It also means they will probably continue to mine with them or resell them as S5's now.

I also always bet that they had cheaper than .098 kw/h electricity rates, but charged us that amount.  So they could still run them for themselves if it makes sense.

So you are saying Bitmain might claim to shut them off and would not actually do that?

[flyingplows]

This sucks big time. Hope the price recovers in the meantime for owners of Umisoo.

On the other hand, if these get turned off, would this affect diff?

There is no guarantee that they will be turned off, or that S2's are currently hashing for the UMISOO contract.  If Bitmain has gone in and upgraded all S2's to S5's already, then they can provide the hashrate for the UMISOO and S2 contracts for cheaper than what they are selling it for.  It also means they will probably continue to mine with them or resell them as S5's now.

I also always bet that they had cheaper than .098 kw/h electricity rates, but charged us that amount.  So they could still run them for themselves if it makes sense.

So you are saying Bitmain might claim to shut them off and would not actually do that?

Isn't that's what cex.io did? Or at least was suspected to do so with so easily switchable miners to ''mining mode'' from being shut down...
Well Bitmain is of course a lot more trustable, but still.. I guess it's the same thing from the point of the customers, maybe just that hashrate would be a little bit higher (bad for difficulty).
All in all the way btc price goes nowadays you just hold... Then buy at the bottom and then..maybe..after rebounding..sometime..you know

[DebitMe]

This sucks big time. Hope the price recovers in the meantime for owners of Umisoo.

On the other hand, if these get turned off, would this affect diff?

There is no guarantee that they will be turned off, or that S2's are currently hashing for the UMISOO contract.  If Bitmain has gone in and upgraded all S2's to S5's already, then they can provide the hashrate for the UMISOO and S2 contracts for cheaper than what they are selling it for.  It also means they will probably continue to mine with them or resell them as S5's now.

I also always bet that they had cheaper than .098 kw/h electricity rates, but charged us that amount.  So they could still run them for themselves if it makes sense.

So you are saying Bitmain might claim to shut them off and would not actually do that?

Sure why not?  Whats the contract really mean anyway?  They can have any type of hashpower they want backing up all the hashpower that they sell, and can make the power rate anything they want.  If I really wanted to, I could sell you hashpower from an S5, only sell you 1 TH/s of power, and claim power is .15 cents per kilowatt hour.  Then, when that point is not profitable, I tell you the contract is over, then I keep running the machines for myself until it hits a point where it really isn't profitable anymore.

Not saying this is what is happening.  But it is a possibility.  They could be making more money if they had switched out all S2's and S3's with S5's and then continued your hashing power as if they were the lower model and banked the difference.

[Bitkrieg]

This sucks big time. Hope the price recovers in the meantime for owners of Umisoo.

On the other hand, if these get turned off, would this affect diff?

There is no guarantee that they will be turned off, or that S2's are currently hashing for the UMISOO contract.  If Bitmain has gone in and upgraded all S2's to S5's already, then they can provide the hashrate for the UMISOO and S2 contracts for cheaper than what they are selling it for.  It also means they will probably continue to mine with them or resell them as S5's now.

I also always bet that they had cheaper than .098 kw/h electricity rates, but charged us that amount.  So they could still run them for themselves if it makes sense.

So you are saying Bitmain might claim to shut them off and would not actually do that?

Sure why not?  Whats the contract really mean anyway?  They can have any type of hashpower they want backing up all the hashpower that they sell, and can make the power rate anything they want.  If I really wanted to, I could sell you hashpower from an S5, only sell you 1 TH/s of power, and claim power is .15 cents per kilowatt hour.  Then, when that point is not profitable, I tell you the contract is over, then I keep running the machines for myself until it hits a point where it really isn't profitable anymore.

Not saying this is what is happening.  But it is a possibility.  They could be making more money if they had switched out all S2's and S3's with S5's and then continued your hashing power as if they were the lower model and banked the difference.

And as with any business that wants to avoid regulation and prosecution they're in China. WTF can anyone here do to a business in China that rips them off? Sue em? Good luck. It's a gamble as is pretty much anything BTC related. So far I haven't seen hashnest doing anything really sketchy to indicate them ripping customers off, but anything is possible and if they were really savvy we would never even know it, just like you illustrated.

[DebitMe]

This sucks big time. Hope the price recovers in the meantime for owners of Umisoo.

On the other hand, if these get turned off, would this affect diff?

There is no guarantee that they will be turned off, or that S2's are currently hashing for the UMISOO contract.  If Bitmain has gone in and upgraded all S2's to S5's already, then they can provide the hashrate for the UMISOO and S2 contracts for cheaper than what they are selling it for.  It also means they will probably continue to mine with them or resell them as S5's now.

I also always bet that they had cheaper than .098 kw/h electricity rates, but charged us that amount.  So they could still run them for themselves if it makes sense.

So you are saying Bitmain might claim to shut them off and would not actually do that?

Sure why not?  Whats the contract really mean anyway?  They can have any type of hashpower they want backing up all the hashpower that they sell, and can make the power rate anything they want.  If I really wanted to, I could sell you hashpower from an S5, only sell you 1 TH/s of power, and claim power is .15 cents per kilowatt hour.  Then, when that point is not profitable, I tell you the contract is over, then I keep running the machines for myself until it hits a point where it really isn't profitable anymore.

Not saying this is what is happening.  But it is a possibility.  They could be making more money if they had switched out all S2's and S3's with S5's and then continued your hashing power as if they were the lower model and banked the difference.

And as with any business that wants to avoid regulation and prosecution they're in China. WTF can anyone here do to a business in China that rips them off? Sue em? Good luck. It's a gamble as is pretty much anything BTC related. So far I haven't seen hashnest doing anything really sketchy to indicate them ripping customers off, but anything is possible and if they were really savvy we would never even know it, just like you illustrated.

exactly, not that I care.  I agreed to the contracts that I have with them when I purchased. I don't care what goes on behind the scenes and if they make more money, as long as I continue to get paid based on the contract they entered into with me.  If they were to give back at all, and reduce fees or whatever, I would probably invest more, but I don't see that happening.

I guess my whole point was to the person saying hashrate could go down when those contracts end, and I was saying that they could possibly not be turning off the miners.

[crazyivan]

This BTC price drop changes the picture again. It s going to prolong ROI significantly and reduce prices of contracts as well. Cloud mining s become a really tough business to participate in but I still have no major complains about Hashnest. I would like to pay fixed amount per day, like Genesis Mining for example. This good/bad luck s really discouraging.

[Wings1987]

Umisoo was slightly profitable for most of the day yesterday. The coindesk price was above the threshold until after 1:30 Bejing time and is currently below.

Based on how Bitmain stated the redemption period works. There should have been small PPS payouts and it should have switched to PPLNS for the day. Assuming the price stays below it would have switched back in 24hrs and the 10 days redemption period wold start again.

Can someone from Bitmain clarify?

[BITMAIN_Janet]

Umisoo was slightly profitable for most of the day yesterday. The coindesk price was above the threshold until after 1:30 Bejing time and is currently below.

Based on how Bitmain stated the redemption period works. There should have been small PPS payouts and it should have switched to PPLNS for the day. Assuming the price stays below it would have switched back in 24hrs and the 10 days redemption period wold start again.

Can someone from Bitmain clarify?

Hi
Here is the terms of "Miner Redemption":

1.    If due to falling bitcoin exchange rate or increase in mining difficulty, the electricity fee is greater than 90% of mining revenues, mining contracts on Hashnest will enter a “redemption waiting period”.

2.    As we do our best to keep mining contracts profitable, during this waiting period, revenues will be paid out according to the PPS method.

3.    If owing to a rising exchange rate, the ratio of electricity fees to PPS payout is lower than 90% for a period of ten continuous days, then mining contracts will revert back to the PPLNS method.

4.    During this waiting period, if electricity fees are greater than revenues for a sustained period of ten continuous days, Hashnest reserves the right to retire the machines. When machines are retired, a user’s contract will then enter into the “hardware redemption period”.

5.    Prior to a machine entering into this hardware redemption period, Hashnest will not accept any requests for hardware redemption.

6.    During the hardware redemption period, users are given a period of fifteen days during which requests for hardware redemption must be made.

7.    Customers holding enough GH/s to constitute an entire machine of the associated type (e.g., 1155 GH/s of Antminer S5) are eligible to convert that amount of GH/s into the used unit of the associated type. If a user does not have enough GH/s of the associated kind to exchange for actual hardware, then this user is not eligible for hardware redemption.

[crazyivan]

The price went again under 226 so Umisoo is unprofitable again.

[Wings1987]

Umisoo was slightly profitable for most of the day yesterday. The coindesk price was above the threshold until after 1:30 Bejing time and is currently below.

Based on how Bitmain stated the redemption period works. There should have been small PPS payouts and it should have switched to PPLNS for the day. Assuming the price stays below it would have switched back in 24hrs and the 10 days redemption period wold start again.

Can someone from Bitmain clarify?

Hi
Here is the terms of "Miner Redemption":

1.    If due to falling bitcoin exchange rate or increase in mining difficulty, the electricity fee is greater than 90% of mining revenues, mining contracts on Hashnest will enter a “redemption waiting period”.

2.    As we do our best to keep mining contracts profitable, during this waiting period, revenues will be paid out according to the PPS method.

3.    If owing to a rising exchange rate, the ratio of electricity fees to PPS payout is lower than 90% for a period of ten continuous days, then mining contracts will revert back to the PPLNS method.

4.    During this waiting period, if electricity fees are greater than revenues for a sustained period of ten continuous days, Hashnest reserves the right to retire the machines. When machines are retired, a user’s contract will then enter into the “hardware redemption period”.

5.    Prior to a machine entering into this hardware redemption period, Hashnest will not accept any requests for hardware redemption.

6.    During the hardware redemption period, users are given a period of fifteen days during which requests for hardware redemption must be made.

7.    Customers holding enough GH/s to constitute an entire machine of the associated type (e.g., 1155 GH/s of Antminer S5) are eligible to convert that amount of GH/s into the used unit of the associated type. If a user does not have enough GH/s of the associated kind to exchange for actual hardware, then this user is not eligible for hardware redemption.

Janet - Thanks for the reply but my question had to do with why the 10 days did not reset today. According to the official message sent out - Coindesk price will be used and calculation will be done every day between 12-1 Beijing time. Today between 12-1 Beijing time Umisoo and S2 were profitable. (slightly)

It looks like the calculations and payments were processed several hours later once the price had dropped. Yes I understand that currently it is not profitable. I believe that we are not going to stay at these price levels forever so every day is important.

Please clarify.

[chunkyjunkie]

Hashnest payouts a little behind again 5 hours.

Edit - Caught up...

[crazyivan]

Hashnest payouts a little behind again 5 hours.

The usual weekend glitch. They ll fix this in a couple of hours. This tends to take place from time to time.

[BITMAIN_Janet]

Umisoo was slightly profitable for most of the day yesterday. The coindesk price was above the threshold until after 1:30 Bejing time and is currently below.

Based on how Bitmain stated the redemption period works. There should have been small PPS payouts and it should have switched to PPLNS for the day. Assuming the price stays below it would have switched back in 24hrs and the 10 days redemption period wold start again.

Can someone from Bitmain clarify?

Hi
Here is the terms of "Miner Redemption":

1.    If due to falling bitcoin exchange rate or increase in mining difficulty, the electricity fee is greater than 90% of mining revenues, mining contracts on Hashnest will enter a “redemption waiting period”.

2.    As we do our best to keep mining contracts profitable, during this waiting period, revenues will be paid out according to the PPS method.

3.    If owing to a rising exchange rate, the ratio of electricity fees to PPS payout is lower than 90% for a period of ten continuous days, then mining contracts will revert back to the PPLNS method.

4.    During this waiting period, if electricity fees are greater than revenues for a sustained period of ten continuous days, Hashnest reserves the right to retire the machines. When machines are retired, a user’s contract will then enter into the “hardware redemption period”.

5.    Prior to a machine entering into this hardware redemption period, Hashnest will not accept any requests for hardware redemption.

6.    During the hardware redemption period, users are given a period of fifteen days during which requests for hardware redemption must be made.

7.    Customers holding enough GH/s to constitute an entire machine of the associated type (e.g., 1155 GH/s of Antminer S5) are eligible to convert that amount of GH/s into the used unit of the associated type. If a user does not have enough GH/s of the associated kind to exchange for actual hardware, then this user is not eligible for hardware redemption.

Janet - Thanks for the reply but my question had to do with why the 10 days did not reset today. According to the official message sent out - Coindesk price will be used and calculation will be done every day between 12-1 Beijing time. Today between 12-1 Beijing time Umisoo and S2 were profitable. (slightly)

It looks like the calculations and payments were processed several hours later once the price had dropped. Yes I understand that currently it is not profitable. I believe that we are not going to stay at these price levels forever so every day is important.

Please clarify.

Hi,

Before we announce "a user’s contract enter into the “hardware redemption period”", Hashnest will pay you by PPS mode instead of frequently changing between PPS and PPLNS mode due to the fluctuant BTC price. It is the best way to reduce user's loss under current conditons.

why the 10 days did not reset today

It is the term that PPS payout is being processed before we announce "end 'redemption waiting period' " or "enter into 'hardware redemption period' "

Janet

[ajw7989]

Wow hashnest has some luck recently very quick blocks. Relief from all those long ones the past week

[Wings1987]

Umisoo was slightly profitable for most of the day yesterday. The coindesk price was above the threshold until after 1:30 Bejing time and is currently below.

Based on how Bitmain stated the redemption period works. There should have been small PPS payouts and it should have switched to PPLNS for the day. Assuming the price stays below it would have switched back in 24hrs and the 10 days redemption period wold start again.

Can someone from Bitmain clarify?

Hi
Here is the terms of "Miner Redemption":

1.    If due to falling bitcoin exchange rate or increase in mining difficulty, the electricity fee is greater than 90% of mining revenues, mining contracts on Hashnest will enter a “redemption waiting period”.

2.    As we do our best to keep mining contracts profitable, during this waiting period, revenues will be paid out according to the PPS method.

3.    If owing to a rising exchange rate, the ratio of electricity fees to PPS payout is lower than 90% for a period of ten continuous days, then mining contracts will revert back to the PPLNS method.

4.    During this waiting period, if electricity fees are greater than revenues for a sustained period of ten continuous days, Hashnest reserves the right to retire the machines. When machines are retired, a user’s contract will then enter into the “hardware redemption period”.

5.    Prior to a machine entering into this hardware redemption period, Hashnest will not accept any requests for hardware redemption.

6.    During the hardware redemption period, users are given a period of fifteen days during which requests for hardware redemption must be made.

7.    Customers holding enough GH/s to constitute an entire machine of the associated type (e.g., 1155 GH/s of Antminer S5) are eligible to convert that amount of GH/s into the used unit of the associated type. If a user does not have enough GH/s of the associated kind to exchange for actual hardware, then this user is not eligible for hardware redemption.

Janet - Thanks for the reply but my question had to do with why the 10 days did not reset today. According to the official message sent out - Coindesk price will be used and calculation will be done every day between 12-1 Beijing time. Today between 12-1 Beijing time Umisoo and S2 were profitable. (slightly)

It looks like the calculations and payments were processed several hours later once the price had dropped. Yes I understand that currently it is not profitable. I believe that we are not going to stay at these price levels forever so every day is important.

Please clarify.

Hi,

Before we announce "a user’s contract enter into the “hardware redemption period”", Hashnest will pay you by PPS mode instead of frequently changing between PPS and PPLNS mode due to the fluctuant BTC price. It is the best way to reduce user's loss under current conditons.

why the 10 days did not reset today

It is the term that PPS payout is being processed before we announce "end 'redemption waiting period' " or "enter into 'hardware redemption period' "

Janet

Janet,

The official message gave a price $226.54 (or close to that) and a time of day the payout would be calculated. It seemed pretty clear that if the price was over $226.54 that Umisoo/S2 would be switched back to PPLNS and if it dropped below the next day that the 10 redemption waiting period would start.

If that is not the case under what conditions will payouts restart? As I write this the Coindesk BPI is $225.91. If the difficulty goes down slightly as expected Umisoo/S2 should be slightly profitable. What else has to happen for it to be turned back on?

[BITMAIN_Janet]

Here is the whole official announce:

Hi all - Due to the falling bitcoin price this week, ANTS2 and UMISOO contracts currently have higher maintenance fees than they do revenues.

From April 14th, 2015 (Beijing time, GMT+8), Hashnest will calculate once daily ANTS2 and UMISOO expected revenues on a PPS basis. This calculation will be performed between 12:00 and 13:00 Beijing time each day. If this calculation returns a negative result, the losses will not be deducted from your remaining balance.

If negative income conditions persist for ten days in a row, ANTS2 and UMISOO contracts will be terminated.
Currently, theoretical PPS return per terahash should be 0.01017BTC, and the daily electricity cost per terahash of ANTS2 and UMISOO is $2.304 USD. As long as BTC price is lower than $226.54 (2.304/0.01017), the electricity fee will exceed the mining rewards.
The bitcoin price used will be the CoinDesk BPI USD price.

When we wrote  $226.54, we used it to calculate the situation "ANTS2 and UMISOO contracts will be terminated". BTC price used to calculate will change along with difficulty increasing.
Hashnest will pay you by PPS mode instead of frequently changing between PPS and PPLNS mode due to the fluctuant BTC price.
It is the best way to reduce user's loss under current conditons.