GAW / Josh Garza discussion Paycoin XPY xpy.io ION ionomy. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :)

[sobitcoin]

Just pondering ... the "paycoin foundation" is run by someone who apparently lost a lot of money (personal money? his church's money?) on paycoin. If the same sort of claims were made to him that were made to the guy in Mumbai, fake "insider" information about deals with paypal and so on, then I wonder if this might have been a hostile takeover. Maybe he thinks he'll recover more of the money by trying to make a success of paycoin, than he would by legal recourse.

With control over the paycoin/paybase code they might try to turn it into a viable coin. Getting Josh out of the picture would be a positive step. Getting rid of the hyper-inflation and burning the excess coins would be a show of good faith that would be easy to do.

But then what? The problem is, without major funding what can they do that would even justify the current market cap of over ten million? Even if you had a significant development budget, which doesn't seem to be the case, what could they do?

Getting rid of the bad stuff in the code just takes you back to having a peercoin clone. Even if they could scrub the stench of scam from it there's nothing about it that would appeal to major retailers. The original whitepaper was junk. The zincsave browser plugin failed before they bought it, but it's probably the best thing they've got to work with.

As things stand it has less going for it than a lot of clone coins with market caps one tenth the size of xpy's market cap. For what it currently is, it's massively over priced.

The problem is, that paycoin just needs to go away. It is claiming to be the peoples money, better than bitcoin, but it rides bicoin's coat-tales the whole way. No success will come to a brand that is surrounding by negative publicity 24 hours a day. There is like 20 people who are behind this coin. It's been a proven waste of time and money for a lot of people.  People need to get it through their heads that your little alternative currency is not the new bitcoin, you might like it, doesn't mean the world finds utility in it. No coin will reach bitcoins merchant integration, no coin will be globally acepted the same it is just not going to happen, at least not for a long time. All pay coin does is confuse people and put money in Garzas pocket.

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[Fargo]

Are there any talks of what happens to the premine during this passing of the torch?

[bananafana]

The problem is, that paycoin just needs to go away. It is claiming to be the peoples money, better than bitcoin, but it rides bicoin's coat-tales the whole way. No success will come to a brand that is surrounding by negative publicity 24 hours a day. There is like 20 people who are behind this coin. It's been a proven waste of time and money for a lot of people.  People need to get it through their heads that your little alternative currency is not the new bitcoin, you might like it, doesn't mean the world finds utility in it. No coin will reach bitcoins merchant integration, no coin will be globally acepted the same it is just not going to happen, at least not for a long time. All pay coin does is confuse people and put money in Garzas pocket.

Here's an analogy to the world of video recording technology. Bitcoin is like VHS back some years back. Thoroughly entrenched, huge capital investments depending on it, but it's aging technology.

There are some better algorithms being developed in some of the alt coins. These are like prototypes for DVD recording, video streaming, etc. Next-generation technology, still being developed. It's coming along, though.

Paycoin is like one of those flip-books that some kid in the back row doodles on the pages of his math book.

You could count on one hand the number of people who are actually confused about whether or not paycoin is a threat to bitcoin. It's just too silly to take seriously.

[NuShrike]

This, using simple math, means that everyone's wallet will not inflate equally and, therefore, will create exponentially increasing downward pressure on the non-favored wallets' value.

Preferred shares renamed. Tasty.

[vancefox]

Are there any talks of what happens to the premine during this passing of the torch?

It stakes and stakes and stakes?

[bitpop]

Are there any talks of what happens to the premine during this passing of the torch?

It stakes and stakes and stakes?

There will shortly be a new update with more staking keys of course. Double the dumping. The pastor has to give the money back to the church before he gets arrested.

[strangerdanger101]

Are there any talks of what happens to the premine during this passing of the torch?

It stakes and stakes and stakes?

There will shortly be a new update with more staking keys of course. Double the dumping. The pastor has to give the money back to the church before he gets arrested.

hallelujah

[IAMCRAZY]

Has anyone given GAW a call? Call #1866-554-5861 and speak to Amanda.

Who is that again?

[SDRebel]

So I have decided to open up a dispute with my credit card company against the hashlet primes I bought some time ago.

What would be my arguing points I would make (references etc. lol)?

I sent this in response to someone else, you might find it useful:

Here are the original TOS from August:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=720844.msg8605520#msg8605520

Here is the updated version from November:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=720844.msg9401341#msg9401341

Original hashlet webpage:
http://web.archive.org/web/20140826012706/http://gawminers.com/pages/hashlet

Hashlet Prime:

http://web.archive.org/web/20141125221337/http://gawminers.com/pages/hashlet-prime/

Hashlet Solo:

http://web.archive.org/web/20140904175538/http://gawminers.com/pages/hashlet-solo/

More Hashlet info:

http://web.archive.org/web/20141030211928/http://www.gawminers.com/pages/hashlet

Hashstaker:

http://web.archive.org/web/20150103223938/https://www.gawminers.com/pages/buy-hashstaker

Hashlet announcement on HT:

https://hashtalk.org/topic/1963/hashlet-mining-has-finally-evolved

Hashstaker announcement on HT:

https://archive.today/JBpro

I think you can state that hashlets are not as described and have been terminated without compensation and you can use the website marketing claims to support your case. I would not send the TOS as supporting documentation to your bank, because the TOS clearly states GAW can terminate the services at any time. It's possible GAW wouldn't even dispute your chargeback, but if they do they will likely use their TOS to justify their claim. At that point you may need to tell your bank that the TOS were not disclosed during the checkout process (which was true until recently AFAIK). Not sure how to deal with Paycoin and Hashstakers, it might be harder to explain.

That's just my opinion, you might want to ask around for more advice. I'm certainly not a credit card chargeback expert so take it with a grain of salt. Good luck.

Quoting for extreme usefulness

[Paul Revere]

Has anyone given GAW a call? Call #1866-554-5861 and speak to Amanda.

Who is that again?

[Mr Felt]

Has anyone given GAW a call? Call #1866-554-5861 and speak to Amanda.

Who is that again?

Would be interested to know if the phones are even on. Recall:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=857670.msg10316133#msg10316133

[IAMCRAZY]

So I have decided to open up a dispute with my credit card company against the hashlet primes I bought some time ago.

What would be my arguing points I would make (references etc. lol)?

I sent this in response to someone else, you might find it useful:

Here are the original TOS from August:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=720844.msg8605520#msg8605520

Here is the updated version from November:

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=720844.msg9401341#msg9401341

Original hashlet webpage:
http://web.archive.org/web/20140826012706/http://gawminers.com/pages/hashlet

Hashlet Prime:

http://web.archive.org/web/20141125221337/http://gawminers.com/pages/hashlet-prime/

Hashlet Solo:

http://web.archive.org/web/20140904175538/http://gawminers.com/pages/hashlet-solo/

More Hashlet info:

http://web.archive.org/web/20141030211928/http://www.gawminers.com/pages/hashlet

Hashstaker:

http://web.archive.org/web/20150103223938/https://www.gawminers.com/pages/buy-hashstaker

Hashlet announcement on HT:

https://hashtalk.org/topic/1963/hashlet-mining-has-finally-evolved

Hashstaker announcement on HT:

https://archive.today/JBpro

I think you can state that hashlets are not as described and have been terminated without compensation and you can use the website marketing claims to support your case. I would not send the TOS as supporting documentation to your bank, because the TOS clearly states GAW can terminate the services at any time. It's possible GAW wouldn't even dispute your chargeback, but if they do they will likely use their TOS to justify their claim. At that point you may need to tell your bank that the TOS were not disclosed during the checkout process (which was true until recently AFAIK). Not sure how to deal with Paycoin and Hashstakers, it might be harder to explain.

That's just my opinion, you might want to ask around for more advice. I'm certainly not a credit card chargeback expert so take it with a grain of salt. Good luck.

Quoting for extreme usefulness

So, I just called my bank..and was told that since the product (hashlet prime) was received even though the 'value' was not as promised then that specifically I can not dispute.

However I can dispute the fact that I did not receive the product in the first place..

Any advice?

[vancefox]

So, I just called my bank..and was told that since the product (hashlet prime) was received even though the 'value' was not as promised then that specifically I can not dispute.

However I can dispute the fact that I did not receive the product in the first place..

Any advice?

I wouldn't dispute not receiving something I received, but that's me.  I'd claim it on my tax return as a loss and just walk away from GAW... while filing a BBB complaint and complaint with the CoC and AG while copying said complaints to SEC.

[cryptofunk]

So, I just called my bank..and was told that since the product (hashlet prime) was received even though the 'value' was not as promised then that specifically I can not dispute.

However I can dispute the fact that I did not receive the product in the first place..

Any advice?

Can't you just say significantly not as described?  I wouldn't talk about value at all beside that you bought something that was supposed to never turned off and they pulled the plug on it.  

[KC6TTR]

http://paycoinfoundation.org/press/
anyone else read this announcement?
at least they ran it trough a spellchecker but the structure is scattered and hard to read. every other sentence starts with "the foundation"

also its encouraging in-group/out-group set up ("Us Vs Them"  mentality) by saying rest of the crypto is corrupt to the core and seen in bad light by the public. exactly what Mr. Ganza has done from day 1. its easy to push for conformity once you have such group setup running with hard censorship. good example is HT forums

theres a mention of dev apis. apis for what? and where are they? i cant find anything

This is a fundamental problem with the industry and why so many honest people are now jaded to get involved to better the collective crypto arena moving forward. In this one statement, you get a new "foundation" that states their goal is to better the entire industry while at the same time ignoring the fact they are a derivative of a for-profit (although failing) venture with an obvious yet purposely hidden agenda to benefit, or hopefully resurrect, that failing venture. It just doesn't stop... and is sooooOOOOoooo LAST YEAR ~


If there is to be a TRUE representative body for the industry, it CANNOT be made up of any one company, coin, or group. In fact, those who facilitate the management of the representative body should not be tied to ANY venture(s) that could bias and/or financially influence any of their actions in fulfilling their role(s) for that body. Why this simple and ethically correct concept is so hard to gasp for some leaves me dumbfounded. 

At any rate, back to work...

Scott-

[KC6TTR]

So, I just called my bank..and was told that since the product (hashlet prime) was received even though the 'value' was not as promised then that specifically I can not dispute.

However I can dispute the fact that I did not receive the product in the first place..

Any advice?

Can't you just say significantly not as described?  I wouldn't talk about value at all beside that you bought something that was supposed to never turned off and they pulled the plug on it.  

You did not RECEIEVE nor SIGN FOR any physical product as it was originally advertised (and pictured). Likewise, you did not physically sign anything stating you legally agreed to received a non-tangible "service" in place of the physical product you were sold with the false promises that were never realized.

Bottom line:
You were simply charged for a bogus list of delayed promises that were never delivered upon.

You are entitled to all your money back less what you earned mining. Nothing less, nothing more.

Now, back to work for me...

Scott-

[not.you]

Looks like the new web admin is getting up to speed.  http://www.gawminers.com/collections/all/products/test

Probably another teenager from Europe getting paid in XPY.

[jonsi]

Some of vlad famous predictions:

...

Acuma ma gandesc ca uitanduma la toate variables dar Mai ales liquidity atunci Bitcoin in urmatorii 12-24 luni are trebuii sa ajunga la minimum $5,000 si chiar posibil si $10,000.
..


Good luck!

Translation from romanian:

Now I think, loocking at all variables but especialy at the liquidity, then Bitcoin in the next 12-24 months should be at minimum $5,000 and maybe $10,000.

Oameni buni.

Nu Mai este mult timp.  Bitcoin o sa Moara incurand (30-60 Zile) fara warning si o sa mearga la zero.

Cumparati Ceva ixCoin cat timp Mai puteti.


Godspeed!

.........

Translation from romanian:

Good people.
There isn't much time left. Bitcoin will be deat soon (30-60 days) without warning and it will drop to 0.
Buy ixCoin while you can.
Godspeed!

[Vlad2Vlad]

Are there any talks of what happens to the premine during this passing of the torch?

It stakes and stakes and stakes?

So the 10% inflation, the 1.2 million new coins per month don't come from hashlets mining but probably 90% is from interest on existing coins.

So those who hold a lot of XPY get most of those 1.2 million new XPY.

If that's the case then I now see what's going on.

And you can bet Garza and any smart whale has been buying up all the XPY possible at these prices.

[vancefox]

Are there any talks of what happens to the premine during this passing of the torch?

It stakes and stakes and stakes?

So the 10% inflation, the 1.2 million new coins per month don't come from hashlets mining but probably 90% is from interest on existing coins.

So those who hold a lot of XPY get most of those 1.2 million new XPY.

If that's the case then I now see what's going on.

And you can bet Garza and any smart whale has been buying up all the XPY possible at these prices.

You're funny... not really.

EDIT Are you covered under a non-disclosure agreement with Gaw/Josh/etc?  If so, just say so.  If not, how many XPY were you paid for your current services/exploits/hype?

My opinion: Either you're paid to shill or you were given a substantial quantity of that shitcoin to shut up and move on that you feel you need to hype as much as possible to get as much as possible for it.