GAW / Josh Garza discussion Paycoin XPY xpy.io ION ionomy. ALWAYS MAKE MONEY :)

[Honeycutt22]

Has anyone notified CoinFire about the selling of pre-mined coins?

[alienesb]

Do the math. Sale outlet suffers the same trick to reveal max quantities that KNC had before:

2 TH/s - AntMiner S4  @ 806 max units
453+ GH/s - AntMiner S3  @ 811 max units

Bitmain was here last week or the week before offering a package of used machines close to this total hash power, can't find it write now:  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=904554.0  149.  Of course same day delivery can mean ex-China as well.

Seems Homero is desparate for cold hard cash, juggling CC's and peddling used hardware for 20 dollar commissions.

This is around 2 PH/s total. They have also been selling the S4 on oneminer.com for about 2 months now. Looks like the 5 PH/s purchase paid for with our hashlet money is being sold back to us. Nice work.

We can't have it both ways. Are they selling the 5ph or did they only rent it from Bitmain which has been looking to get rid of the US-based warehouse full of miners since December? Which is it?

[vancefox]

Has anyone notified CoinFire about the selling of pre-mined coins?

Hey, CoinFire!!!!!  Look what we found!!!  Another questionable activity by GAW!!!!!  They might get tired of writing the same shit with just different action words...

[Honeycutt22]

Has anyone notified CoinFire about the selling of pre-mined coins?

Hey, CoinFire!!!!!  Look what we found!!!  Another questionable activity by GAW!!!!!  They might get tired of writing the same shit with just different action words...

I sent him a PM

[jackbox]

Do the math. Sale outlet suffers the same trick to reveal max quantities that KNC had before:

2 TH/s - AntMiner S4  @ 806 max units
453+ GH/s - AntMiner S3  @ 811 max units

Bitmain was here last week or the week before offering a package of used machines close to this total hash power, can't find it write now:  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=904554.0  149.  Of course same day delivery can mean ex-China as well.

Seems Homero is desparate for cold hard cash, juggling CC's and peddling used hardware for 20 dollar commissions.

This is around 2 PH/s total. They have also been selling the S4 on oneminer.com for about 2 months now. Looks like the 5 PH/s purchase paid for with our hashlet money is being sold back to us. Nice work.

We can't have it both ways. Are they selling the 5ph or did they only rent it from Bitmain which has been looking to get rid of the US-based warehouse full of miners since December? Which is it?

I say they are selling the just what we saw in the so-called proof of mining video.

[suchmoon]

Based on what I see and how I understand it:  Yes.  These coins that were purchased through PayBase with a credit card did not come from an exchange but instead came from the pre-mined coins that were still in GAW's possession.

I'll let someone else disprove me if they'd like.  Unlike "gawd", I'm not infallible.

EDIT:

http://media.coindesk.com/2015/01/Hash-Talk-4.png

Also this:
https://hashtalk.org/topic/22975

About 60% of the 12 million coins are going to customers, 40% are going to investors.

Doesn't mention "credit card sales" as far as I can see.

[bananafana]

Notice how vague that is. It reminds me of this:  
http://media.coindesk.com/2015/01/Hash-Talk-4.png

But what it *doesn't* say is that when you buy on paybase, they buy the same number of shares off of an exchange. It doesn't say that at all.

Eh... I'm just the messenger here.

If what you're saying is that these quotes are why the GAW fans got the idea that their buys on paybase translate into buys on the exchanges, then it shows they're seeing what they want to see. After everything that's happened they're still giving Josh the benefit of the doubt, and assuming he'll do what's good for them rather than what's good for him, even when the terms of use say exactly the opposite of what they're assuming.

Third, it makes little sense. They don't need to "refill the coffers" to serve customer's needs. It was over 96% premined. They have more coins (at zero cost) than they could ever use.  And there's ZERO evidence that they're buying to "maintain the target price" for any target at all.

96% premined yes... but the vast vast majority of all those coins got staked or went into customers' hands to cloud stake, personal wallet stake, or sell off.  I don't know how many they had in their coffers, but it's reasonable to say they would have to go to the exchanges every now and then.  I don't know if there is any evidence of this happening yet.

I don't think it's true, even according to the official GAW story, that the vast vast majority of those coins got staked or went into customer's hands. The claim is that "investors" bought a lot of them, and Josh has said he "bought" some himself.

With 96% premine a huge percentage could have gone into stakers and into customer's hands via hashpoints or whatever, and GAW could still have many times more premine coins in their pockets than are actually trading on the exchange.

You say "it's reasonable to say they would have to go to the exchanges every now and then" but why? The numbers would argue that it's extremely unlikely that they would ever *need* to go to the exchanges. They're not going to run out of premine coins, ever.

[suchmoon]

Do the math. Sale outlet suffers the same trick to reveal max quantities that KNC had before:

2 TH/s - AntMiner S4  @ 806 max units
453+ GH/s - AntMiner S3  @ 811 max units

Bitmain was here last week or the week before offering a package of used machines close to this total hash power, can't find it write now:  https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=904554.0  149.  Of course same day delivery can mean ex-China as well.

Seems Homero is desparate for cold hard cash, juggling CC's and peddling used hardware for 20 dollar commissions.

This is around 2 PH/s total. They have also been selling the S4 on oneminer.com for about 2 months now. Looks like the 5 PH/s purchase paid for with our hashlet money is being sold back to us. Nice work.

We can't have it both ways. Are they selling the 5ph or did they only rent it from Bitmain which has been looking to get rid of the US-based warehouse full of miners since December? Which is it?

They are still trying:
https://www.bitmaintech.com/productDetail.htm?pid=000201412171033028658LE40FU705ED

That's another 2 PH/s.

[wdl1908]

And... that's how we prove they're using pre-mined coins to fulfill their PayBase orders...

The blockchain never lies.

So basically you're saying those coins never visited any exchange? Could it be possible that one of those 740 or 370 addresses was an exchange deposit address? I know it's unlikely because it looks to be a fairly neat halving pattern, so it would be an extremely odd coincidence that e.g. a Hashpoint customer moved 740 coins to an exchange then GAW purchased 370 coins and the exchange just happened to send them out from the same deposit wallet. Am I thinking about this right?

The split to almost equal parts to the same address are staking transactions.

If you follow the chain you see where they are broken into batches being sold, these are likely credit card purchases, note the date is today(not pictured here but viewable in link to chain posted earlier).



link to this block transaction: https://chainz.cryptoid.info/xpy/tx.dws?a80127b3756b88c4f9e3fb594fd99d7f0c3f7d8598b3e42a2e2bf43404c4cb18.htm

Face it Daffy, you have been Paycoined!

Yes they are. But that was not I was answering to. I was saying that the few transactions that are split in half and to the same address are the staking transactions. The other are indeed sales or transfers to other user owned wallets.

[wdl1908]

I got a perfectly logical explanation for the blockchain activity. I doubt anyone will believe me but here goes.

They receive fiat from the CC transactions and it takes time to transfer fiat to any exchange so for speedy transactions they use their own reserve then transfer the fiat to an exchange to buy BTC and buy XPY with BTC. The XPY/USD market is almost non existent so it makes no sense to buy XPY with fiat.

This may be far fetched but that is the way I would set it up.

[Honeycutt22]

I got a perfectly logical explanation for the blockchain activity. I doubt anyone will believe me but here goes.

They receive fiat from the CC transactions and it takes time to transfer fiat to any exchange so for speedy transactions they use their own reserve then transfer the fiat to an exchange to buy BTC and buy XPY with BTC. The XPY/USD market is almost non existent so it makes no sense to buy XPY with fiat.

This may be far fetched but that is the way I would set it up.

If it was anyone other than GAW I would say maybe, but highly unlikely... But since it's GAW and they have a horrible past performance and business ethics issue - I'd so absolutely no.

[Paul Revere]

And... that's how we prove they're using pre-mined coins to fulfill their PayBase orders...

The blockchain never lies.

So basically you're saying those coins never visited any exchange? Could it be possible that one of those 740 or 370 addresses was an exchange deposit address? I know it's unlikely because it looks to be a fairly neat halving pattern, so it would be an extremely odd coincidence that e.g. a Hashpoint customer moved 740 coins to an exchange then GAW purchased 370 coins and the exchange just happened to send them out from the same deposit wallet. Am I thinking about this right?

The split to almost equal parts to the same address are staking transactions.

If you follow the chain you see where they are broken into batches being sold, these are likely credit card purchases, note the date is today(not pictured here but viewable in link to chain posted earlier).



link to this block transaction: https://chainz.cryptoid.info/xpy/tx.dws?a80127b3756b88c4f9e3fb594fd99d7f0c3f7d8598b3e42a2e2bf43404c4cb18.htm

Face it Daffy, you have been Paycoined!

Yes they are. But that was not I was answering to. I was saying that the few transactions that are split in half and to the same address are the staking transactions. The other are indeed sales or transfers to other user owned wallets.

So, what part of Josh &Co are selling pre mined (FREE) coins do you not understand? Do you also believe that NONE of these pre mined coins have been dumped into the open market? How about the Tooth Fairy? You believe in that, too?  Fools like you are why these scammers are able to keep  repeating this same scam with a new coat of paint on the same turdwagon over and over.

[wdl1908]

Yes they are. But that was not I was answering to. I was saying that the few transactions that are split in half and to the same address are the staking transactions. The other are indeed sales or transfers to other user owned wallets.

So, what part of Josh &Co are selling pre mined (FREE) coins do you not understand? Do you also believe that NONE of these pre mined coins have been dumped into the open market? How about the Tooth Fairy? You believe in that, too?  Fools like you are why these scammers are able to keep  repeating this same scam with a new coat of paint on the same turdwagon over and over.

What part of sales do you not understand?

[coinmaster222]

@candor Something the federal trade commission said about fixing prices on markets can make the company responsible blah blah jargon. Pretty much they were going to, did it for ~30 min, then couldn't hold it because of people "exploiting" the trade limit with multiple accounts. Floor broke, they found rules saying they shouldn't have done it in the first place, and well that pretty much brings us to here and now with a $4 coin lol.

Paybase is not an exchange as such so there is no legal problem if paybase buys your xpy at $20.Just another excuse to not do it.

[Paul Revere]

Yes they are. But that was not I was answering to. I was saying that the few transactions that are split in half and to the same address are the staking transactions. The other are indeed sales or transfers to other user owned wallets.

So, what part of Josh &Co are selling pre mined (FREE) coins do you not understand? Do you also believe that NONE of these pre mined coins have been dumped into the open market? How about the Tooth Fairy? You believe in that, too?  Fools like you are why these scammers are able to keep  repeating this same scam with a new coat of paint on the same turdwagon over and over.

What part of sales do you not understand?

I understand sales quite well. What part of "you have given a lot of money to a dirty, stinking, rotten, lying con man and now you are making yourself into an even bigger fool by defending him" do you not understand?

Also: I would like to ask you a question. WHY are you posting here? The dumbest of the dumb could figure out that you are not going to make a believer out of anyone who has read the proof of scam presented here, so WHY are you posting here?

[coinmaster222]

With one of the directors of Amazon involved with the Ziftr coin think they will have a better chance with Amazon than paycoin

[puwaha]

If what you're saying is that these quotes are why the GAW fans got the idea that their buys on paybase translate into buys on the exchanges, then it shows they're seeing what they want to see. After everything that's happened they're still giving Josh the benefit of the doubt, and assuming he'll do what's good for them rather than what's good for him, even when the terms of use say exactly the opposite of what they're assuming.

What do you expect them to think.  The posts either insinuate... or outright say they will purchase from the market the coins sold on Paybase.... as in this post that was already known:  http://media.coindesk.com/2015/01/Hash-Talk-4.png

It specifically says "Plus, all the coins purchased on Paybase will be purchased from the market!"

So how could anyone not see that.


Now, I'm not a blockchain expert, but is the proof offered up in this thread definitive?  How does anyone know who owns what wallets and where through that chain of transactions?  Suspicious... yes it definitely looks that way just because of the weird halving structure... but is it definitive?

If it's definitive... who will be be brave soul to sacrifice their HT "burner" account to post it first?  

You say "it's reasonable to say they would have to go to the exchanges every now and then" but why? The numbers would argue that it's extremely unlikely that they would ever *need* to go to the exchanges. They're not going to run out of premine coins, ever.

It was estimated that 60% went to hashpoint conversions, and 40% to investors.  Is GAW one of the investors?  You bet.  But they had to stake some of their own coins in their prime controllers.  Would that account for all of their coins?  I don't know.  I guess they could also just be selling their newly minted coins from their primes/stakers.

[cryptofunk]

What I don't understand from the analysis is the fact that it is so deep yet we say it is from the premine.  The only way this would be daming is if we could prove it hasn't been in anyone's possession between origination and the final wallet.

Considering %95 of the coins originate from premine, 40% of which were distributed to users and roughly another 500K POW coins it only make sense that the vast majority of transaction go back to a premine address.

With the number of hops in the transaction analysis chain, how do we go about knowing that GAW owned the "hop addresses" in the middle?  That it isn't me getting my ICO, using Bittrex and transfering it back to Paybase?

Edit: Fixed lapsus.. Bitcoin -> Bittrex

[wdl1908]

Yes they are. But that was not I was answering to. I was saying that the few transactions that are split in half and to the same address are the staking transactions. The other are indeed sales or transfers to other user owned wallets.

So, what part of Josh &Co are selling pre mined (FREE) coins do you not understand? Do you also believe that NONE of these pre mined coins have been dumped into the open market? How about the Tooth Fairy? You believe in that, too?  Fools like you are why these scammers are able to keep  repeating this same scam with a new coat of paint on the same turdwagon over and over.

What part of sales do you not understand?

I understand sales quite well. What part of "you have given a lot of money to a dirty, stinking, rotten, lying con man and now you are making yourself into an even bigger fool by defending him" do you not understand?

Also: I would like to ask you a question. WHY are you posting here? The dumbest of the dumb could figure out that you are not going to make a believer out of anyone who has read the proof of scam presented here, so WHY are you posting here?

So even when I agree with you you don't accept it? Why do I post here i'm really beginning to wonder that because even the simplest sentence are misunderstood.

[demonz]

With one of the directors of Amazon involved with the Ziftr coin think they will have a better chance with Amazon than paycoin

C Kindle isn't a director. He worked in software development for amazon and he's listed as a consultant for ziftr. He confirmed it via twitter  https://twitter.com/ckindel/status/552530083047800834

ziftr is leaps and bound more "legit" than paycoin is or ever will be.

*edit*

I guess he is a director based on his linked in https://www.linkedin.com/in/ckindel , Director Consumer Products - Amazon Wallet, P2P, and Local Commerce. but not listed here http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=97664&p=irol-govmanage. Oh well.. im sure u get my point