ASICMINER: Entering the Future of ASIC Mining by Inventing It

[supert]

what just happened to labcoin again

and activemining just imploded (board resigned and liquidated all shares).

[VolanicEruptor]

bought back in with 50 shares below 1.80.  nice to be back. 

[Vycid]

what just happened to labcoin again

and activemining just imploded (board resigned and liquidated all shares).

And NEOBEE is trying to pull off the biggest IPO in Bitcoin history. It'a a big week for Bitcoin securities.

In other news,  this is the ASICMiner thread.

[Puppet]

But then everyone stops mining, difficulty drops and after a time it becomes profitable to mine again. Until everyone starts mining again and then the cycle repeats. There will be a limit to the amount of energy used. It won't rise "to the moon".

Of course there is a limit. That limit is profitability:
Total mining reward == total electricity cost + hardware write off.

IOW,

total electricity use per hour ==  ~3600 BTC  / (Price Kw/H + hardware write off per hour).

Add any mining fees to that 3600 if you want, and divide by 2 for each  block reward halving.

In reality over time hardware write off will become a non factor, and average electricity cost in BTC will be the only variable  that will determine  the overall electricity use of the bitcoin network.
No cycles or moons involved unless both electricity and hardware would be free, in which case you get div/0 or infinity.

[SebastianJu]

Now where did I see a comparison that said that one major bank central office used probably more electricity than all the bitcoin mining in the world ...

That can't be true, I would be surprised

OK lets try a wild estimate

I use less than 1KW to do well over 100GH/s
So lets go with 1KW for 100GH/s
That's a way over-estimate for some of the high hashing devices and a way under-estimate for any of the old devices anyone is silly enough to keep mining with

The bitcoin network is ~1PH/s
So that's like 10,000KW

That seem too high for a big bank's main data centre head office?
If it is then say how about 10 of them? Certainly not too high for 10 of them.

All guesses, but certainly makes that argument above seem far from certain.

Since wind mills have a power production of 4 to 7.5MW nowadays that means 2 wind mills alone could run the whole bitcoins network power usage world wide. I think its a good comparision.

[Puppet]

Since wind mills have a power production of 4 to 7.5MW nowadays that means 2 wind mills alone could run the whole bitcoins network power usage world wide. I think its a good comparision.

Its a good sound bite for now, and certainly an acceptable reality, but this is  only because currently the biggest cost is still by far the hardware.

Over time that will evaporate and we will be left only with electricty cost.
~3600 BTC/hr * $130/BTC  / $0.1 Kw/H = 4680000KW or 4680MW

Not sure if your argument will still be as convincing if you have to say bitcoin even in its current infancy at  just $130 would require ~1000  large windmills and possibly close to 5x as much with russian electricy prices.

[SebastianJu]

Since wind mills have a power production of 4 to 7.5MW nowadays that means 2 wind mills alone could run the whole bitcoins network power usage world wide. I think its a good comparision.

Its a good sound bite for now, and certainly an acceptable reality, but this is  only because currently the biggest cost is still by far the hardware.

Over time that will evaporate and we will be left only with electricty cost.
~3600 BTC/hr * $130/BTC  / $0.1 Kw/H = 4680000KW or 4680MW

Not sure if your argument will still be as convincing if you have to say bitcoin even in its current infancy at  just $130 would require ~1000  large windmills and possibly close to 5x as much with russian electricy prices.

When i think about its correct when not taking the asicprice into account... even when the bitcoin reward is halved again and again... the bitcoin exchange price has to rise when bitcoin will be a worldwide currency at one time. That means the reward is again higher then and more power can be bought with it. So only a low bitcoin exchange price could lower the power usage.
On the other hand... the price for asics will settle at some point. That will be the newest and fastest asic with the best speed and low power usage. The production cost then will be the biggest limiting factor since all miners plan to get their investment back. I wonder if there is a problem then.

[stslimited]

so with Asicminer at 3% of the network, is the promise of some next generation chips really holding the share price up where it is?

[adamstgBit]

so with Asicminer at 3% of the network, is the promise of some next generation chips really holding the share price up where it is?

idk whats going on, i hope that they are proceeding with all their might.

is their a capital problem? can we just give them more money so they hire more chip builders!

we need to start pumping out the gen 2 chips yesterday!

 

[Vycid]

so with Asicminer at 3% of the network, is the promise of some next generation chips really holding the share price up where it is?

I don't know, but this is the thinnest I've seen the bid order book in months. Less than 600 BTC on bids.

[Endlessa]

so with Asicminer at 3% of the network, is the promise of some next generation chips really holding the share price up where it is?

I don't know, but this is the thinnest I've seen the bid order book in months. Less than 600 BTC on bids.

Welcome to being the one holding the bag

[Vycid]

so with Asicminer at 3% of the network, is the promise of some next generation chips really holding the share price up where it is?

I don't know, but this is the thinnest I've seen the bid order book in months. Less than 600 BTC on bids.

Welcome to being the one holding the bag

You must be new here.

[empoweoqwj]

I went through old friedcat posts and realized that last three updates in this thread were posted month apart. And now it's around one month since last one. I guess we should expect update any day now. (last posts were june 21st, july 23rd and august 22nd)

yeah, another imaginery bitcoin for me (I get one every time someone says "FC is about to post")

[BitHub]

"i dreamed a dream" - Morpheus.....RIP ASICMINER.

[empoweoqwj]

what just happened to labcoin again

and activemining just imploded (board resigned and liquidated all shares).

there's a shock. I said at the time Ken couldn't organize a piss up in a brewery let alone create a mining company.

[lophie]

"i dreamed a dream" - Morpheus.....RIP ASICMINER.

Sell all shares and watch from a distance. Thank you.

[Strange Vlad]

Of course there is a limit. That limit is profitability:
Total mining reward == total electricity cost + hardware write off.

IOW,

total electricity use per hour ==  ~3600 BTC  / (Price Kw/H + hardware write off per hour).

Add any mining fees to that 3600 if you want, and divide by 2 for each  block reward halving.

In reality over time hardware write off will become a non factor, and average electricity cost in BTC will be the only variable  that will determine  the overall electricity use of the bitcoin network.
No cycles or moons involved unless both electricity and hardware would be free, in which case you get div/0 or infinity.

Dude why are you always using wring numbers? Only 250 BTC per hour are generated, a bit more if the network speed is on the rise, slightly more because of fees, okay let it be 300 BTC/hour, so for power price of 1BTC/MWh it would be just 300 Megawatts.

M2 money supply = $10,789B
Bitcoin market cap = $1.576B

10786/1.576 ~ 6846x
Today's price ~ $120

6846 * $120 = $821,543

Assuming (incorrectly) that the only fiat that can be displaced is the US dollar.

Times 1.36M a year, divided by avg $0.10/kW (It'd be much cheaper if you put the bitcoin hardware at the powerplant to avoid transmission losses)

1.36M * 821543 / .1 =1.117 e13 kW-h per year

About 8766 hours a year

1.117 e13 / 8766 = 1274582135 kW = 1.274 TW

That is an ecological disaster. Not to mention dirty, nasty sources of electricity will be used in an attempt to bring down the cost per kW-h (which will result in an increase in the total watts needed for equilibrium).

And you, why are you comparing market supply with market capitalisation? You should either compare BTC money supply with $ money supply (but with BTC the money supply works differently so hard to compare), or BTC market cap to $ market cap (that's what I did).

But then even if whatever you say is ridiculously true then nobody really cares, the green ecocentric scum uses leftist governments every day to slow progress and raise costs for everyone, maybe at least with BTC they will suck because governments cannot defend them and their phony propaganda.

We'll use as much energy as we can afford, and we'll generate as much as we need, no way to change that.

[conv3rsion]

Dude why are you always using wring numbers? Only 250 BTC per hour are generated, a bit more if the network speed is on the rise, slightly more because of fees, okay let it be 300 BTC/hour,

I hate to be that guy, but since you corrected his numbers:

150 BTC are generated each hour (6 blocks per hour * 25 btc per block) non adjusted.

At a difficulty increase of roughly 33% average per period, we are closer to 200 BTC per hour in actual inflation.

[Puppet]

Dude why are you always using wring numbers? Only 250 BTC per hour are generated

Clearly I had a brainfart. Just like you (its 150 not 250), only a bit bigger

[robix]

... the human race takes John Kerry seriously and wipes its self out etc. ect.

Friedcat already wiped himself out (of this thread).