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1281  Other / Off-topic / Re: Who controls the Bitcoins? on: February 28, 2017, 07:56:51 AM
I'd say no one really. It's decentralized but as for it's value that could be determined from a large range of factors: miners and the market. On another point, however, while you technically can do whatever with your Bitcoins, if they're in an exchange or wallet or whatever that's been ceased, hacked, or shut down, your control tapers off as what happened with Mt. Gox and China exchanges right now.
it is decentralized indeed , but how about the 51% attack?
do you think it will still make bitcoin uncontrollable?
i don't think so , at this point it was bitcoin weakness ,
and it could happened anytime , some people can control bitcoin.

I don't you have to worry about 51% attack at all. Mining farms nowadays cost billions of dollars. I don't think someone will invest much more than the best mining farms just to attack bitcoins. It would be much better if he's just going to mine bitcoins as well instead of attacking the network since attacking the network will decrease the price of bitcoins[1]. When bitcoin goes mainstream, there would be investors that will invest even more than the best mining farms of today

You seem to be confusing billions with millions

The whole market cap of Bitcoin is below 20B dollars at present, so there is no way some miner (or even all miners combined) could have invested that much in the mining equipment. Apart from that, there may still be a viable reason to perform (or make an attempt at performing) a 51% attack. If miners have already earned decent profits, they may collude to try this attack (basically, pretend to attack) to bring Bitcoin prices down to buy up cheap bitcoins (again). Besides, this is what we could well expect next from the Chinese authorities in the their ruthless fight with Bitcoin in China (and a lot more)

Oh, sorry. Grin Anyway, you were right that after these miners have made profit or at least have got their ROI back, they might attack the bitcoin for that strategy or maybe it was their ulterior motive right from the start. We don't see anyone doing it right now (because if so there would be floods of articles about the 51% attacker). Maybe the ones that have invested the most haven't got his ROI yet or simply mining more bitcoins would be a far better move than attacking the network to lower the price and buy at low price or they simply don't have any intention to attack bitcoins at all. Regardless, if someone big does 51% attack, other miners will be aware of these (along with other attacks) and use it as a part of their strategy.
1282  Economy / Economics / Re: Loans too risky? on: February 28, 2017, 07:40:16 AM
Trusting your own funds to someone, it always difficult. Even if you trust that person or he have a high rank on forum. We all know that people do scamy things, because of money value, also we can protect our selfs with different services or even our country laws. That companies, which allows people, to protect them selfs like escrow, make that process more eathier and safer for two oposit sides

That's why you should always require a collateral unless if the person is trusted in this place since he's not going to ruin his reputation over some bitcoins. Just think of it, you can't ask for the person's personal information and whereabouts. Even if he give it to you, you can't confirm if it's legit or if it's someone else unless you video call on Skype. The process of asking the person's whereabouts alone is a lot of process, doing video call is much more.

Having a valid collateral is not enough. You should only choose the one that you know how to sell. For example, if someone's using a website domain as collateral, you shouldn't accept it if you don't even know what to do with it. You probably don't even know the actual value of that website domain. Thus, you can be tricked to thinking that the site worth's a lot when it's actually worth not much.
1283  Economy / Economics / Re: Where can i invest my money? on: February 26, 2017, 06:19:57 AM
Probably not everyone here is thinking the same with me but if you have tons of money, you better invest in hiring the best tutor ever. With tons of money, even if you change sails a lot it would be okay since you can just hire a different tutor. For example, initially you wanted to learn photography but you realized that you're actually more of a Mathematics guy. What I'm saying here is that you should be a master of at least one field before you invest your money. People don't care about you if you only have money and nothing else.

With tons of money, you can also invest in relationships with other rich people. That way, you will learn by talking to them about their experiences and whatnot, basically things that you will not learn from school.

OP here has 2 million dollars yet he doesn't know how to use it. Pathetic, I should say. He has 2 million but he's not an expert of a certain field[1]. He most probably just inherited it or the money came from something that doesn't require any knowledge at all (probably something illegal) but of course I don't know that for sure. Grin

[1] He wouldn't be asking here how to invest it in if he has better things to do or to invest on.
1284  Other / Off-topic / Re: Who controls the Bitcoins? on: February 26, 2017, 06:06:00 AM
I'd say no one really. It's decentralized but as for it's value that could be determined from a large range of factors: miners and the market. On another point, however, while you technically can do whatever with your Bitcoins, if they're in an exchange or wallet or whatever that's been ceased, hacked, or shut down, your control tapers off as what happened with Mt. Gox and China exchanges right now.
it is decentralized indeed , but how about the 51% attack?
do you think it will still make bitcoin uncontrollable?
i don't think so , at this point it was bitcoin weakness ,
and it could happened anytime , some people can control bitcoin.

I don't you have to worry about 51% attack at all. Mining farms nowadays cost billions of dollars. I don't think someone will invest much more than the best mining farms just to attack bitcoins. It would be much better if he's just going to mine bitcoins as well instead of attacking the network since attacking the network will decrease the price of bitcoins[1]. When bitcoin goes mainstream, there would be investors that will invest even more than the best mining farms of today.

[1] It will decrease the price of bitcoins because the investors will see that it's under attack. Thus, selling their coins.
1285  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Where to Invest BTC? on: February 26, 2017, 05:55:48 AM
If you study the current prices critically then you should keep your BTC and don't invest in any thing else because you stand a chance in profiting from investing in  so why take it out and invest somewhere else. There are good times ahead people. Cheers!
yeah i think you are right as current price is keeps on increasing day by it doesn't needs any investment. you just have to keeps it in your wallet and it will you profit after some times.
This wallet if there are a sufficient number of bitcoin, which after years of expectations will turn you into a wealthy man. And if they are few, it is necessary to do everything to increase the number of bitcoin. And that means one investment.

In investments will give any guaranty that it will increase forever. Because if any bad news comes out against bitcoins or if some other new system which is better than bitcoins then bitcoin demand will go down and prices may come down. So one should always find ways to grow their money in different ways to avoid any issues in the future. Also don't don't keep all your money in only one or two products.
[1]In investment, there is no guaranty that wour money would grow. In investing, you may lose money of the market of your investment goes down, that's disappointing. Part of it, some investment program tend to scam its investors, thou must keep away from that. If you're affraid that bitcoin would go down, [2]then convert it into foat money, don't force or look any other investment just to save your money from dumping. [3]Investment should be doubted often times.

[1] That's why fake investment sites say that you are guaranteed to grow your money. You simply have to invest and then wait for months and Voila! profit $$$. It's a good advertising strategy but investments that use this for advertising is obviously a scam. There are also fake investment sites that say "Invest only what you can afford." because they know that they are eventually going to run away.

[2] Why, though? The price of bitcoin will pick up eventually. It goes down, of course. But it will recover in no time. Converting in fiat just because you're scared that bitcoin will go down is such a pussy move. Only convert your bitcoins to fiat if you need fiat.

[3] Depends on what type of investment you're doing. If you're investing in trading, then doubting investment would mean that you're questioning your trading skill. On the other hand, investing on some investment site should not only be doubted often but should be avoided at any cost.
1286  Economy / Service Discussion / Re: The best cloud mining site !!! on: February 26, 2017, 04:54:07 AM
The best cloud mining sites should be those that show proof of a physical crypto mining site and have a support team to offer help to avoid the ponzi label.
Only Invest in cloud mining if you not in a hurry ,and I have seen pow8 offering CM services just might be among the best,goodluck.

Those proofs of mining farm can be faked as well. Some people have their own mining farm but don't post it or don't let other people mine with them by renting a particular mining power. These cloud mining sites can just ask for an owner of a mining farm to have a picture of it and that's what they are going to use on their website. It will be a unique photo since the mining farm owner has never uploaded a photo of his mining farm. There are some cloud mining sites that just google "mining farms" and then use that on their website. A simple google search of that photo can reveal that it belongs to someone else.

I've seen cloud mining sites like this and there's no wonder if a cloud mining site shows actual proof of mining farm but eventually turns out as secretly a ponzi site.
1287  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Is 1000 btc Possible on: February 26, 2017, 04:43:28 AM
Buy byteball. It's very new & total new algorithm DAG. It has a huge potentiality to be successful  Grin

Almost every altcoin has a potential to become successful. There are coins that are far better than bitcoins. On the other hand, these coins aren't hyped up at all. Some coins don't even have a purpose or a target market but still get their price increase more than the better coins. Why? Nothing, that's just how it works. People buy your coin because they think its a good trade, not because it's a good coin.

So yeah, if you're aiming for 1000BTC from trading, look up what coins are being hyped in the altcoin market. Don't expect huge returns, though, because trading is not an every day thing. There are days when the coins don't even move but that's kind of unusual to happen since there's tons of coins in the market.
1288  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Is Holding Bitcoin a long time good way to make money? on: February 25, 2017, 09:53:12 AM
If you bought Bitcoins at 200-300$ Level then holding to them would be the most profitable way..
Of course you would generate with wins with selling it before it falls and buying it afterwards, but for the overall profit
i would hold onto them until you need them or they should get dumped.

When you look back at the price of bitcoins years ago, you would say that you should've bought bitcoins at that time and holding bitcoin for a long time is really great if you bought at that price. Today, we can look back for a couple of months when the price of bitcoin was just around $600. You can say that it's a good trade. Apparently, at the time that $600 was the current price of bitcoin, we're all doubting bitcoins because we thought it would be much better to wait. The $200-$300 price level is already gone, so is the $600.

Do you see the pattern here? Whenever we look back, we regret not buying bitcoin and/or selling our bitcoins at a price that's so low compared to what we have now. After a couple of months, you would have the same thinking about why didn't you buy today, February 25, 2017.

"It could've been a good buy but I was waiting for a lower price."
"If only I bought bitcoins back then..."

These will be the thoughts that you will be having for not buying now and holding for a long time.
1289  Economy / Economics / Re: Why You Should Never Sell Your Bitcoins Ever on: February 25, 2017, 09:42:18 AM
Why telling to folks to never sell their bitcoin ? Bitcoin is a currency and shall be used as it is. If everyone were holding the bitcoin and never sell, then the situation would be different from how we know bitcoin

Yes it would be different because the price would be much higher. Since no one's selling their coin, the price can only go up because of the buyers. So we should be thankful to those people that hold tens of thousands of bitcoins but decided to hold their bitcoins for a really really long time.



Why telling to folks to never sell their bitcoin ? Bitcoin is a currency and shall be used as it is. If everyone were holding the bitcoin and never sell, then the situation would be different from how we know bitcoin
LOL yeah what do you expect people to do with their btcs then? Hold it until ww3 makes bitcoin useless? I think if you feel that its already the right time and you've held your btcs long enough sell it. As for now, with how the prices are moving, its advisable to hold it while observing the movement of btc but definitely you have to sell it one time or another

You don't "have" to sell it since you can do whatever you want with your coins. It's absurd to assume that long term holders are waiting for the world war III to happen. That's completely out of nowhere. I think that most long term holders (like me) are very faithful to bitcoin's potential.

This price ($1200) is nothing compared to how much the bitcoin's price will be in the future.
1290  Economy / Economics / Re: Soo, I'm planning on buying €1000 in bitcoins. Yes or no? on: February 25, 2017, 09:31:40 AM
I think nowdays people should invest more than ever.
Microsof accepting BTC now, Japan using it soon?

It is true that you can add money to your Mircosoft account using Bitcoins. But the second statement is just a rumor. The Japanese government is not going to use Bitcoins anytime in the near future, because BTC is a direct competitor to the JPY.

Under what rock have you been hiding? Explain these:

Countdown: Bitcoin Will Be a Legal Method of Payment in Japan in Two Months
Bitcoin Accepting Shops in Japan Increase Drastically, by 4.5x
20 000 merchants accepting Bitcoin in Japan

Please don't be, like, ".. but they are not using it as a currency." because no government ever will. It will just be a legal payment method but it will not replace their fiat currency. Fiat currency is very essential to the government and there's no reason for them to replace their fiat currency with bitcoin since bitcoin isn't mainstream yet. But certainly they are starting to accept or already accepting bitcoins now.
1291  Economy / Economics / Re: The future of the paper money on: February 25, 2017, 09:22:40 AM
In the future, paper money will disappear, it will be replaced by another currency. In other words, paper money will become worthless because many countries print more money to stimulate the economy, the value of paper money will decrease serious. And i think electronic money will be the main currency in the future because it safe, fast and ensure transparency
No big difference. Any physical object that will replace the money will bring the same problems. In the digital money is not for the problem. Paper money will be a very long time.

One major problem with digital money is that the government can just add more funds on their wallet whenever they want. They own all of those money, then of course they can do whatever they want. It's basically the same thing as what they do with paper money. The only difference is that it's much easier to do in digital money. They only have to add some numbers, then Voila! instant billions worth of your fiat. The value of your fiat will decrease accordingly as well.

That is why digital money should have a limit on its supply just like what we have in bitcoins or any other altcoins. Any currency that can increase in number anytime the government wanted to do so will keep devaluating because the government would want more and more money so they would print/add more quantity in their fiat money.
1292  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: When do you plan to sell? on: February 25, 2017, 09:12:23 AM
Its really ideal to sell off our bitcoin as of now since the price is on its all time high and a good point but remember to sell a portion of your bitcoin and wait again for bitcoins price to drop again and thats the time we do buy again cheap bitcoin. Rinse and repeat= profits.
Yeah that's what is known as trading but I don't think anytime soon bitcoin's price is actually gonna drop because if you see this time it reached $1200+ through a stable way so I would recommend you to sell when the price is $1500-$1600+. Selling now will just be a regret in future.

Selling around $1500-$1600 can also be a regret in the future. To be honest, there's no price of bitcoin that we might not regret someday. I sold some of my coins when the price was still $585 and I should regret it but I don't. I needed money by that time so I withdrew some of my coins. If I sold all my coins by that time for no valid reason or for the reason that I want to buy again at a lower price, I would be devastated.

That's the reason why I agree with people that don't want to sell their coins at all. They only sell by the time that they really need fiat. Otherwise, we would continue holding it. If you sell now, you'd lose the chance of selling at a much higher price (i.e. 10k$).
1293  Economy / Economics / Re: Tell me your predictions about Bitcoin on: February 24, 2017, 03:21:06 PM
Today bitcoin is a very serious situation. Many countries have already banned cryptocurrency. But we still hope that bitcoin will take a leading position in the financial world. While there is no international recognition, it will be seen.

What's up with today? How come yesterday bitcoin was not in a very serious situation? What countries are you talking about? Only thing that's near "banning cryptocurrency" that I've heard about in the previous weeks is the PBoC encounter but we're past that. China was the most powerful/influential country before the PBoC thing. After the major price decreased, we got up pretty quickly. It proves that bitcoins can't be destroyed by simply banning it in a country. Maybe if all of the government bans it, there would be another major price decrease. But there would still be people that are not going to leave bitcoins just because their government said so.
1294  Economy / Economics / Re: Do You Think Bitcoin Will Replace Dollar Soon? on: February 24, 2017, 03:02:54 PM
I'm still believing in the power of the dollar and all currencies in the world. I don't think so that it will replace dollar soon, there's a lot of reason to be considered like the regulations and laws.

In the coming years, I am sure that dollar and all the local currencies will never be defeated by bitcoin at its features. The use of dollar is easier compared to bitcoin specially in real life. Not to mention the delays that keeps on happening when there is something happening, and maybe when there are a lot of user sends bitcoin[1].

Also, the transaction fee[2]. If the price of bitcoin keeps on increasing, lots of transaction will be made and of course, if you pay small tx fee, then you'll experience being in the network unconfirmed[3].  Smiley

[1] To be honest, I've only experienced that once or twice in my entire bitcoin journey. People here are all ranting about how long did their transaction took to get confirmed. Uhmm, how about paying that very little transaction fee? That's not going to bankrupt you, right. And even without transaction fee, I've never experienced that. Actually, it's not that the bitcoin network is slow or the transaction time is always slow. It's only people are all ranting about that one time that their transaction didn't get confirmed as quickly as they thought it would.

[2] I never thought of the transaction fee as something big because most of us here are earning much much more than that. Like I said, it wouldn't lead to bankruptcy.

[3] Maybe, but not really. People that pay higher fees would be processed first. You simply get what you paid for. You would have to wait more than those people that paid higher fees but that doesn't mean that your transaction will never get confirmed eventually.
1295  Economy / Economics / Re: Can we Manipulate Bitcoin price? on: February 24, 2017, 02:29:11 PM
I know there are many big players who manipulate bitcoin price and make huge profits but can we the bitcointalk members also form a cartel and let bitcoin price never fall?is it possible that we manipulate price as I am sure most of bitcoin users visit this forum

We cannot manipulate bitcoin price individually, that is insane. Only the big whalers has a capacity to do that or the biggest exchange site where they get a huge volume of bitcoin.
The information we had is we know there are whales who can manipulate the price but we will not know who exactly these people are and where they are right now. Also, we are not sure if whales do visit bitcointalk or they are active here, what we have is just a mere speculation and we live to that speculation the same with what we are doing in predicting how the price move.

Probably not but it doesn't matter. Say that there's a whale that's active here on bitcointalk, he wouldn't post stuffs saying that he's a whale. He's just making himself a target from the hackers and he can be mistakenly took as a troll until he posts a signature by an address that holds thousands of bitcoins.

Even if we find out the whereabouts of these whales, it wouldn't help us prevent any future manipulation that's going to happen. You also can't blame a whale if he chose to dump thousands of coins all at once because he's just a human like us and he might needed fiat at that time. His action can be looked at a manipulation when he simply sold his coins because he need money.
1296  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Is Holding Bitcoin a long time good way to make money? on: February 24, 2017, 02:12:23 PM
Yes, holding bitcoin for a long duration of time is a very good investing option as Bitcoins show a very healthy growth rate

It is true that holding Bitcoin for a long term is a great investment, but it is not that easy, the fluctuations will make you change your emotions in a second. You need to have patience and you should not react to small fluctuations of the day to day market.

I see people converting all of their coins because we reached $1200. There's no explanation why they should do that unless they know that $1200 was the peak of the price. In the long run, bitcoins would be even greater than that. Personally, I'm just holding my coins. I don't care anymore if the price of bitcoins fluctuates again, because I don't need fiat at all. There's no need for me to convert. I don't want to trade bitcoins because 98% of traders lose money (I might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure). In my experience, you should hold your bitcoins and then cash out if and only if you need fiat money.

Eventually, we will reach an age that we don't have to sell our coins because bitcoins will be accepted almost everywhere.
1297  Economy / Economics / Re: Tell me a secret: any way to earn 0.1 BTC per week? on: February 24, 2017, 02:02:18 PM
For people who only started learning about bitcoin world it's more complicated to get a new information how to earn bitcoins. But I agree, earning 0.1 btc weekly is impossible without any investments it's really hard. With that current rank you can join, a really good paid signature campaigns which pays more then 0.04 btc per week. You can also do some Offer various services, freelancing, buying, selling altcoins

I don't think investments make your earn this much at all. Unless you've invested a huge amount of money, investments wouldn't help you that much. It can help you in the long run, but most of the time the payment per week of an investment is really low. 0.1BTC can be achieved by having a job, doing tasks for others, etc. You don't need an investment at all.

Just like you said, he/she can earn 0.04BTC per week in a signature campaign. There was no investment required on that and it pays much more than an investment. A little more 0.06BTC worth of work will enable you to reach the 0.1BTC. That 0.06BTC can be consists of freelancing, buying and selling, photoshopping, creating a logo, managing a signature campaign, etc. No matter what it is, you would most probably have to add two or more tasks to reach 0.1BTC per week.
1298  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Can Bitcoin make Banks disappear? on: February 23, 2017, 04:57:41 PM
Bitcoin cannot make the banks to disappear,
But I think if bitcoin become much more popular in the future the banks should do something,
Maybe adopt this crypto currency or support it in any way that they can.

I agree banks are too powerful. But both can join or cooperate and perhaps work together to make and offer a global fast payment option for the masses. If banks offer bitcoin deposits withdrawals for let's say 50 cent. I think it will be a win win situation for consumers.

Win-win situation for us, users, but for the government, they are swallowing their pride. Fiat has always been the money of the world. Seeing banks adding bitcoins to their deposit/withdrawal methods would mean that the number of users of bitcoin has blown up so much that the government just accepted their defeat.

I still doubt that this will happen because they would start defending their money once we're starting to slowly grow in population so they can prevent future losses of the people's trust on them. If people realized that fiat has no value at all because it's not backed by gold anymore, they would start asking questions to their government which might wake up the majority of fiat slaves. That's something that the banks don't want to happen.
1299  Economy / Economics / Re: Bitcoin is Freedom on: February 23, 2017, 04:45:06 PM
i believe if the goverment will open the door for bitcoin to sign on his community. But all of them are still need a process dude.
Governments are never ever going to allow bitcoin to become something that is used by everyone and I think that is due to the fact that bitcoin is decentralized and it has no control over not so ever and the fact that it is not stable it could go and go down at any time, and honestly if people start using bitcoin more and more it will become not cool.

In other words, you think that the government will not allow bitcoins simply because of the features that it has. Bitcoin is decentralized, and no one's controlling it. Look at it as a palace that has no King, in fact, there's not even a throne. No one can control bitcoins. There's no way the government can control bitcoins because there's just no way to do so. You can buy all the coins, alright, then you can control it by holding all of them and not selling it ever. But that would just make bitcoin users even happier because they would be millionaires without any effort at all.

The government wouldn't spend that much fund just to prove a point that they are more in control than the simple idea of bitcoins.


There is a way that bitcoin will be controlled and that will be controlled by groups of people thst holding the most bitcoin. Thst is not possible that only one people that hold huge amount of bitcoin, there must be a group or many groups that hold huge amount to make change it's price. The higher amount they have the easier they can control the market. And for low holder this will not become free because they can't do anything except holding more and more coin

Apparently, the whales don't think like that. Why would they team up to manipulate the price? Other whales that weren't able to join their manipulation will lose. They are not here to compete with other traders. They invested a lot of money because they want to use bitcoins to buy from a merchant or to avail a service using bitcoins one day. Some are also here because they want to become a millionaire in fiat one day when the price of bitcoin has gone to the moon. Nevertheless, these traders wouldn't compete with each other.

They would simply let the price of bitcoin move by itself by having mass adoption and decrease by itself when the governments decided to ban bitcoins and/or desperately spread rumors about it.
1300  Economy / Economics / Re: Passive Income on: February 23, 2017, 04:34:01 PM
what investments in gambling sites could be profitable

There are a lot of reputable casino's where you can trust and invest your bitcoins like bitvest, safedice and kingdice.

But the possible profit you can get there will depend also on how much you are going to invest, so if you will invest higher.

The higher profit you can get and vice versa.

You could try with bitdice casino, just join the chat room and collect the ideas and you can win. Just use your profits n gambling because personally i won't prefer gambling with our own earnings. Sometime we might feel due to failure. Hope for the good luck on it.
i think gambling or casino sites are very risky there is a lot of people lose their bitcoin in huge amount through gambling you should invest your bitcoin in other project or in trading i think trading in bitcoin or altcoin is much more profitable than gambling. 

He is pointing out about using the profit into something reasonable. And he is pointing out that investing in casino's not gambling in them.

ICO's are good but they are not passive because what will happen after the project and the devs decided to stop supporting that project.

There are a lot of projects that are doing that.

It's because these "devs" are just here to pretend that they're doing something about their coin. They pretend like they are doing their best to promote the coin after the ICO blah blah blah but in reality, they are ready to get out of the scene any time that they wanted. They are just letting the coin die slowly just so they can say "Oh, the coin was a failure" or some other lame comments that doesn't help at all revive their coin. They've already gotten the profit that they wanted, so they are too busy enjoying it instead of empowering the coin that they created.

ICOs are actually a passive income, but it's only for the devs. Sad but it's the truth nowadays. I'm not even going to be surprised if an ICO dev will run away all the funds right after the collection has finished.
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