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1021  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Great way to make Bitcoin! on: April 28, 2017, 06:18:57 PM
Well, lots of us agree that trading (if we are knowledgeable of it) can give us boundless earning of Bitcoin.  It is the place to take advantage of trades and its fluctuation.  If we can predict the next price precisely then we will know when to sell and buy BTC and the most profitable would be trading in BTC-altcoin market.

The predictions don't have to be precise and I don't think that anyone can do that. Imagine someone saying "ETH will be $129.32 each in 30 days." Sounds too good to be true to me. The only thing that's necessary is that you can predict if the market is going down or up. It doesn't have to be accurate, it should only increase or decrease enough for you to earn some money.

Knowledge in trading isn't enough to have "boundless" earnings and no one's has had "boundless" earnings ever since. Even if you've been trading for quite long, you're still going to lose sometimes and your earnings are not always going to be a lot.
1022  Economy / Marketplace / Re: How can we encourage local businesses to accept BTC? on: April 28, 2017, 06:08:39 PM
I think if there were a lot of people that simply ask "do you accept bitcoin" this would make the business think to themselves everyone is asking about this bitcoin thing let me find out what it is and then once they look into it they may adopt it or even come back to you to ask for more information.

Other larger companies with an online space would have systems where they log support queries so over time if they keep getting the same query they will no doubt look into it or already be looking into it.

It seems to me that it is very difficult for local businessmen to get bitcoin. At once it will be necessary for many people to explain what bitcoin is. And then already try to implement this method of payment

It depends on how badly they want to learn about bitcoins. Someone can have basic economic knowledge but still not be able to learn about bitcoins when he don't really do some research. There are necessary stuffs to learn like the law of supply and demand but that's nothing if you want to learn about how bitcoin works and its market.

We're not some sort of professional that took a course in college just to learn about bitcoins. If someone was able to establish his own business, then he's probably capable enough of understanding something that even low class people understood.
1023  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: How to make governments accept bitcoin? on: April 28, 2017, 05:37:15 PM
Best way is to destroy scams. Having scammy exchanges, scammy people running away, this is what make the trust to do not come. Little by little, by not funding them will make them disappear, and a trust will be contructed over the time.

Destroying scams is a very hard task, they are everywhere. What the government or us should do is to raise awareness. If we will raise awareness to the people and to the government about those technique of scams then it will be possible that the government will accept bitcoin and will accept the fact that bitcoin is good for the economy.

Once government finds a way to control or manipulate the bitcoin users surely they will let people know it for their people can earn and be benefited from it same with they can get taxes through the users once they find a way how to put taxes on each user.

Yes it is a sure thing that they are going to manipulate us because the government is always for the tax or profit for the government. Each of the local exchange that has been based on your country will be taxing each of your receiving or sending transactions. I hope that is not going to happen so that we can still pay smaller fees.

That would be the obvious scenario if ever the government finds a way in manipulating bitcoin. First is the additional fees for every transaction. Since the government is able to control bitcoin in their territory then additional fee will exist for the additional gain of the government. Second is implementation of tax. Since bitcoin is a form of investment on other people, tax will be included in the picture. Also, if bitcoin is used in businesses, tax is highly expected. Finally, that particular country will be full of businesses and shops that are accepting bitcoin as a mode of payment. This is a good side if ever they, the government, will be able to manage bitcoin. High rate of transaction will occur and more and more people will be attracted to bitcoin.

I think the increase in additional fees will come in when the amount of people using bitcoins has also increased. I don't think the government will add fees by themselves for every transaction being done, because we see in fiat that we can transact it all without fees.

I still doubt that people wouldn't leave bitcoin when the government were able to have control of it. There's just no point in the government taking the time and effort to get control over bitcoins because it will only affect a million of people which in a global scale is considered as small.
1024  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Speculation (Altcoins) / Re: Do you see alts have chances against Bitcoins? on: April 27, 2017, 08:07:33 PM
What is good with alt is they can correct what bitcoin lacks in their implementation. I think, if there is an altcoin that can avoid the problems that bitcoin is facing right now, that coin can become the next bitcoin.
It would take a lot of years for any altcoin to gain what Bitcoin has now (reputation, adoption, price, etc.). I admit that there are quite a lot of great altcoins, but for me, if Bitcoin were gone for good, I would lose any interest in the digital crypto currency world.

You can't say that for sure because we don't know yet the reason why bitcoin disappeared. If it was because of another cryptocurrency that's more interesting than bitcoins, then I think people will start having even more interest in the cryptocurrency world. This whole thing is not just about trust wherein when bitcoin has disappointed you, you'd forever shut down the whole crypto-currency world. This is about being disappointed in a failed coin and be able to gain your loss from other investments. Basically about how you go up once you fall down.
1025  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Trading Newbie on: April 27, 2017, 07:57:27 PM
Just try to hold when you are in panic - that's a rule of thumb. Don't sell if you are already late.

But there are also times when panic selling is a better choice because it allows you to re-buy at the lowest of the dip. And of course this also has risks involved just like how you're risking your bitcoins even more when you continue holding your bitcoins instead of panic selling them. There's no guarantee that the price will pick up again at some point and at the same time, there's no guarantee that the price will go even lower than the price that you sold your bitcoin at. But the latter is more likely since it's quite unlikely for the market to go to the opposite direction all of a sudden.
1026  Economy / Economics / Re: Loans too risky? on: April 27, 2017, 07:47:37 PM
Obviously loans are risky because you give to person who is totally unknown to you with a collateral which may not be of your use generally . So instead of you trade that much with Btc you will earn more then it's interest part .

If that's the only problem then just stop accepting fiat that wouldn't be of use to you in case you get it in return. You can always be picky and the borrower can't say anything about your decision, because after all, the final decision will always be from you -- the lender himself. Take a quick peek in the loaning section and you'll see that tons of people gets their application denied even when there seems a valid collateral.

You also don't have to worry about doing transactions with strangers when you're going to hold his collateral. Just think that you bought the item in a lower price when he defaults on his loan.
1027  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: Is Holding Bitcoin a long time good way to make money? on: April 27, 2017, 07:37:41 PM
If the Bitcoin's price increase with time as expected so holding Bitcoin a long time worth this, but if the prices get down for any reason we will lose,. i think its depending in the future prices..

but isn't bitcoin is currency so 1 btc will be always 1 btc, unfortunately we don't look in that way, we just want fiat currency so we calculate profit and loss in fiat currency only. so bitcoin became an investment for many

One thing is very important, when the price is going down, you will not lose anything. You just need to make sure you don't sell your coins. As long as you don't sell them, you won't lose anything. It may feel like you are losing, but it's not the case.

YOu said was right mate, as long as your not selling your coins you will never be lose, because it maybe drop the price but it can recover sonner or later. Like what happen on ETF if you remember, bitcoin dropped into below 900$ after being denied by the SEC and now look at the price value we are already resume at more than 1300$. So, holding bitcoin is very profitable.

First of all, the price didn't go down because the ETF was denied by the SEC. Because if it was the actual reason, people pulling out their investments because of ETF disapproval, it should have happened almost right away when the decision was announced. But it didn't. It happened days after.

If you don't sell your coins, you've basically lost the coins already. It's still there and it's still yours but you can't use it at all because you want to wait more. Hence, you can consider that money gone for quite some more time. It's a loss at that moment but it will return once you decided to sell it. In simpler terms, what's money if you're not allowed to spend it.
1028  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: What do you think are the biggest disadvantages of Bitcoin? on: April 27, 2017, 07:27:18 PM
The Biggest disadvantage of bitcoins is his price nobody know when the price increase and decrease. its good for investor but to sometimes its become to much risky, like trading, but much risky much money yeahh
That's what happen when a currency's price is truly based on the demands of the market and the ratio of supply:demand is really affecting the price and the whole currency's economic. What I've seen is that majority of people who join bitcoin recently are attracted to its potential of giving decent profit and they consider bitcoin as an investment and not a currency, that's right that normal people who use bitcoin as ordinary currency struggling to keep their value stay at its point.

Let get real for a minute

Bitcoin price has nothing to do with demand..
Are you going to tell me that demand was the same 3 years ago when we were at the same price levels?

We won;t see the real value of bitcoin in less than 10 years when finally normal usage not speculation will kick in.


The real value of bitcoin is its current price. We don't have any other way to determine it. Even though the population back then that pumped the price up to $1,200 was quite little compared to the population today, the demand surely was there.

If 50 people bought one candy each, and one guy bought 50 candies, how is the demand different? The only difference is the amount of people that were involved, which has nothing to do with demand. There can literally be just 10 people out there and when they decide to buy something in bulk, then the demand for that certain product has already increased.
1029  Economy / Economics / Re: If Bitcoin had a stable price, would it still be as popular? on: April 27, 2017, 07:18:48 PM
I think if Bitcoin has a stable price, it is still used by many users and will even become more popular. It will attract more people. Stable prices will make it more bold to invest in Bitcoin because when bitcoin prices fluctuate, few people dare to invest because they fear that Bitcoin will go down, they will lose profits. However, traders would not like it because they would have little profit in trading Bitcoins if Bitcoin prices were stable.

And the majority of huge bitcoin investors are traders. So, do you still think that bitcoin will continue to be popular when it has a stable price? How is bitcoin even different from fiat when it has a stable price? Sure there's anonymity feature, low transaction cost, etc. But you also already have that when you're transacting fiat. When you pay with paper fiat, they don't have the logs of that coin to see the people that once held the coin. Transaction cost is even free.

Only ones that will be happy about bitcoin having a stable price are those people that are too coward to try something new like bitcoin and we aren't in need of that type of people.
1030  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Difference between Bitcoin and real money? on: April 27, 2017, 07:07:20 PM
I think between bitcoin and real money there is not much difference because bitcoin is also money, exactly is a virtual currency and the value of bitcoin can be exchanged for real money. The nature of bitcoin and real money is the same, it only differs in how the transaction, storage and value of bitcoin can increase in the future, real money is not. Bitcoin is the most commonly used virtual currency on the internet, real money is commonly used in the real world and real money is legal but bitcoin is not, here are some differences that I see

I doubt that. Paypal user base is far greater than bitcoin's. Almost everyone has a bank account and almost everyone loves to do online shopping. They need Paypal for that. We are nothing compared to the amount of people that don't know about bitcoins, too busy to care about bitcoins, or haven't even heard of bitcoins. Fiat money is the King in both the real world and digital/virtual world. I don't see any reason why would you think that bitcoin is except if you're limiting your choices on cryptocurrencies only (which is obviously not the case).
1031  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Great way to make Bitcoin! on: April 27, 2017, 06:57:17 PM
I don't think this thread is useless as some members have mentioned already. What OP is trying to say is that Bitcoin for some users is free money from the Internet but as we all know there is no free lunch and we have to work hard for our cash be it digital or physical. You would earn way more money if you have a high-paying job and convert a portion of it into Bitcoin as per your needs. Time is money so we need to spend it wisely and maximize our earnings.
Yes you have a point having a topic like this could convince everyone to find a way to earn bitcoin through hard work. Because of the user of bitcoin before always think that bitcoin is somewhat realted to fast money where they can earn on the internet through mining, but that is wrong the best way to earn and to make bitcoin is when you will work hard for it. Like a real job where you need to do specific thing to earn. For me the best way to make bitcoin is through signature campaign where you will need to post to earn, and as you post you can also educate yourself on finding ways to earn bitcoin through trading and investing.

People assume that earning bitcoins is fairly easy because they see you just using the computer as usual. Like, what's hard with typing keys and clicking your mouse? But the truth is, before you get to your level where you can earn money by just doing very little tasks, you had tons of failures and experiences. They never see that part of people's success. They only see you doing bare minimal and think that it's easy money. The thing is, you can only do it that easily because you're already knowledgeable about the necessary stuffs and you've been through a lot enough to know the solutions on your problem. This is applicable to almost every job and not just bitcoins (but of course there will always be jobs where hard labor is needed).
1032  Economy / Trading Discussion / Re: When do you plan to sell? on: April 27, 2017, 06:47:16 PM
I planned to sell 40% of my bitcoin in the term of two years from the day i first bought it. That two years will end on mid of next year. I think I would have made a decent profit till then. Whenever I invest in something, I am in the habit of setting a time limit. This way I dont do panic selling and I don't have any worries. But if I encounter loss after that time frame. Then I don't withdraw my money. I tend to wait then. As soon as I get some profit I withdraw my money.

You technically can't encounter any loss after you've withdrawn your bitcoins because your coins are already converted in fiat. If you're going to say you're referring to "loss" as in you could have sold your coins in a much better price, then you'll be forever waiting. There will always be a point in time when the peak of the market will be overcome and the price will be higher.

You're right, panic selling will be eliminated since there will be no pressure to you. But if you constantly check the charts, then you'll be tensed and always think about of selling out your coins whenever the price goes up. Otherwise, the only relevant details of your journey will be the price when you bought your coins and the price of bitcoin at the time frame that you set.
1033  Economy / Economics / Re: The dream of getting rich with bitcoins on: April 27, 2017, 06:37:43 PM
Op has got a nice dream of getting rich with bitcoins. If you have so many bitcoins, definitely will become rich. But my question is from where do we get bitcoins. Bitcoin is not a thing that we get for free. Its just like other currencies out there. The only shortcut to earn bitcoin or usd or whatever it may be, is hardwork.
You should convert your dreams into a plan, without a plan on how to accumulate a good number of bitcoins will
make it remain as dreams. Nothing will happen if we will not move and face the risk, we should do it based on our plan.
I am sure it's not impossible although it is hard, we must be inspired, it will help us.

You're right. To be rich especially with btc you should have guts. If we'd all have been gutsy when btc first came, and bought ourselves a lot years ago, that dream would alrrady have been realized. I kniw therr arr people who actually did that and are enjoying the rrwards now. We can try to check upcoming alts today that have a very low price and hope it would be the same as btc but of course it would beed guts, same vuts as those who got rich niw with their btcs from then

Please get your keyboard fixed. Those typo errors are hilarious. Anyway, stop hoping that an altcoin will prevail and show the same market as bitcoin had. Bitcoin is the first crypto-currency, and we should expect that its market will be much better than most crypto-currencies when they don't have that much difference.

Altcoins are just there for us to trade. We're basically playing with each others where the ones that gets out of the market last will suffer from loss. While the better timing you had, the better profit you will have.

Take note, we weren't into the Internet back then. And most people didn't even heard about bitcoin until now that the internet and online jobs are booming.
1034  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: Difference between Bitcoin and real money? on: April 25, 2017, 01:54:21 PM
Bitcoin is unlike real momey since it's not controlled by the goverment. Tha value of bitcoin depends on the sell/buy order of bitcoin in trading sites. Bitcoin can be only use online while real money can be use online/offline. Bitcoin's developer are anonymous where in the fiat/real money, there is no developer but  there are people who regulates it which it the goverent.

Which makes the whole concept of fiat obsolete. This monetary system was thought by someone centuries ago. Think about how much we have evolved. Think about how much our imagination has grown so far. Back then, there's no technology so people really needed to exchange coins. But today, there's an Internet connection to almost everywhere. We should have a revolution and free ourselves from the slavery of fiat money.

Centralized money makes us work for the government. And even if you think you don't, you actually do. With all these taxes, you're giving the government a huge part of your salary. You worked hard for that money and then a huge chunk of it will only go to your corrupt government.
1035  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: What do you think are the biggest disadvantages of Bitcoin? on: April 25, 2017, 12:26:48 PM
For me one of its greatest weaknesses is that you can lose your bitcoins by sending it to a wrong address. Any address should have a number to identify it, just as phone number, that people could remember. That would be a true revolution.

Your negligence (or arrogance) isn't a disadvantage of bitcoin. It's not even in bitcoin's side. It's fully your fault. Thinking about remembering an address? Remember the first characters and the ending characters. It's very rare to an address that has the same first and last couple of characters. Putting your phone number to identify your bitcoin address will just reveal some of your whereabouts. I don't see any reason as to why would it be hard to compare the address that you're sending to and the address that you're supposed to send to.

I'm sure you don't have to enter the address manually, you just have to copy paste it. Seriously, every address is very unique, how dumb someone could be to send money to the wrong address.
1036  Economy / Economics / Re: Can we Manipulate Bitcoin price? on: April 25, 2017, 11:47:43 AM
It's possible if we as community team up and form a massive amount of buy support, but the fact is that the majority of the people here are small holders and have barely a reasonable amount of money to have an impact on the price, even not with plenty of these people.

I can remember that it happened with certain altcoins back in 2014 where the whole community of that altcoin used to give a certain coin a massive pump. I think a good example of that is BlackCoin. It got pumped like there is no tomorrow, and it fell down again like there is no tomorrow at some point.
As we uses bitcoin for our daily basis needs. We can help the developers of bitcoin to strengthen and to develops it transaction and security. If this will happened more businesses are going to be open on accepting bitcoin for their transaction instead of the usual papermoney or fiat. Because we all know that there is more investment on bitcoin compare to money because its price is always dependent on the law of stock and demand where if more people uses bitcoin that is the time bitcoin price changes or pump. And for me it is very attractive to people nowadays  because we are using technology always on our life so it will not be so hard for us to accept and change our way on transaction.

Actually, literally all fiat money is invested on fiat money. And, what is that reasoning? Tons of things are depending on the law of supply and demand but it's obvious that all of them have less investors than the fiat currency. It's totally possible that we will come to the point where the majority of fiat money is invested in bitcoin but it is not the case today and even in the foreseeable future. Bitcoin has about 21 billion dollar market cap, and that's like nothing in a global scale.
1037  Economy / Economics / Re: Loans too risky? on: April 24, 2017, 03:12:42 PM
The loan is risky because here begins the problem especially when you have not paid for the time that you said. Especially when the monthly interest is considerably difficult to pay until it increases. Here you will feel hard to make debt.

Loans are too risky both for the lender and the accepter of the loan. Both have a fear of loss in case the loan taken is not return or the collateral taken is not handed back. Trusted escrow can solve these problems.

I see no point why would you use a collateral that you can't afford to lose. You're at a desperate time so you chose to get a loan, so you shouldn't have had the confidence that you'll get the collateral easily. I don't think that you're risking anything at all since a lender wouldn't choose to run away with your collateral. A lender has to gain reputation so he can have even better business opportunities.

Especially in this forum where your account has a value. You're basically ruining your account by scamming someone. You can never join a signature campaign when you have a negative trust and signature campaigns are far more profitable and stable.
1038  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: The future of Bitcoin on: April 24, 2017, 02:41:16 PM
Quite good story, I agree that nothing lasts forever, and someday a new cryptocurrency will come that will be better than Bitcoin.
It's not gonna happen if we will continue to support bitcoin, it is the original and the crypto world is getting popular because of bitcoin.
We have to support what is the strongest but it always good as well to have other options, so saving alts is a good idea as well.

I'd rather have one strong coin than have a couple of weak ones with just some gimmick "features", tbh.



Quite good story, I agree that nothing lasts forever, and someday a new cryptocurrency will come that will be better than Bitcoin.
Actually, there are many altcoins which are greater than Bitcoin. Look at ethereum, dash and other coins are doing, you can see that they are more fantastic and can provide many useful functions for other people

What they are doing is that they take part from the total investments in cryptocurrencies. If there's only bitcoin, then bitcoin might already have a much higher market cap by now. Regardless, all these "fantastic" coins are just traders' way to earn more bitcoins. In the end, everyone would want more bitcoin rather than these coins.

Btw, if these coins are so great, how come they haven't gone near bitcoin's price? These coins only excel at some field and has some unique feature, but other than that? Nothing. These coins should have some revolutionary feature on them to beat bitcoins.
1039  Bitcoin / Bitcoin Discussion / Re: What do you think are the biggest disadvantages of Bitcoin? on: April 24, 2017, 02:30:47 PM
For me, the fact that it is still not accepted in other countries and people still not knowing about it is the biggest disadvantages of bitcoin. If only bitcoin will be widely accepted and people start using it, I'm sure other problems regarding bitcoin will surely have a solution that will benefit all of us.

The number of people using bitcoins is increasing but do you see any improvements in the bitcoin transaction time and fee? Because I don't. I don't see the correlation of bitcoins going mainstream to the solutions of bitcoin's problems. Sure when bitcoin becomes popular, there will be new IT people or even better one. But if there's a guy that can solve bitcoin's problems, he should've informed blockchain already about it and negotiate the price of his idea.

My theory is that the cryptocurrencies would be just like the means of transportation that we have. If a train station gets overcrowded, other companies create other ways to transport and other people use those instead. Meaning to say, when the bitcoin transaction time and fee didn't get solved in due time, people will stop crowding themselves in bitcoin's queue and just use a different cryptocurrency. But of course it comes with risk like the coin going down all of a sudden.
1040  Economy / Economics / Re: Can we Manipulate Bitcoin price? on: April 24, 2017, 02:15:54 PM
I know there are many big players who manipulate bitcoin price and make huge profits but can we the bitcointalk members also form a cartel and let bitcoin price never fall?is it possible that we manipulate price as I am sure most of bitcoin users visit this forum
Every time you buy and sell you are manipulating the market but since you don’t have a lot of bitcoin your influence over the price is very small but there are other ways to manipulate the price like those that use FUD do but you could also manipulate the price by spreading good news.

The movement will be so little that if you would wish to buy again with the new price, you'll lose some money. Remember that the buy order and the sell order have a difference. I wouldn't call it manipulation at all since you can't make it move that much. You simply affected the price of bitcoin but you're not manipulating it. Thinking that you've manipulated the market just because you caused the price to decrease by 1$ is totally absurd IMO.

FUD wouldn't do that much if you're just an average turd. People will think that you're just a troll especially if it's obvious and when you have a low standing in the bitcoin community. You need to have connections and be kind-of popular first before your FUD starts having an actual effect. Posting FUDs here and then would only victimized mindless newbies who don't even have a dollar worth of bitcoins.
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