I wonder if team monero realise that now the currency is associated with the dark markets (which is by no means exclusive anyway), they have precluded the currency from mainstream adoption, which dash is aiming for. No one will touch a currency associated with the sale of guns, drugs and child pornography. I think when people realise this, the steam in monero's recent will run will all but disappear. This is something dash will now not have to deal with  I disagree with this statement completely. Dash is medium for exchange, thats it. End of story right there. What is exchanged is not a concern of Dash. That is concern for law enforcement potentially but not Dash or cash or bitcoin. I also agree in that DASHs function is that of a medium of exchange. That being said, there are negative implications on a community and it's developers when actively marketing to deep/dark web thus aligning themselves and the currency with those activities. IMHO. I think differently from you, I'm speculating deep/dark web will ignite a paradigm shift to monero once it proved to be completely private and fungible in real world use while dash is striding on the path of being a centralized high-yield investment program (HYIP) scheme with a shiny GUI. |
|
|
|
The majority of discussion has been using facts to base claims about Dash and Monero. "Bashing" is the term used when the opposing side of the discussion does not like how the discussion is going so they play the victim card. A lot of people appear to have missed the point in my original post asking both communities to be more cooperative. They can still compete and use that competition to innovate and they can still critique the other technology. What I believe needs to happen though for cryptos in general to succeed is to do this in a more professional and jovial manner. You are correct that some of the discussions have used facts and have been productive but a lot of the conversations have also been without facts and very childish. Here is just one of many examples that I do believe is "bashing" as it does not reference facts, evidence or data of any kind and instead uses verbiage like "scam" and "snakeoil".  Here is another example where "DashHole" is used.  It is a known problem that members of the Monero community actively make aggressive claims about other technology without providing evidence to back these claims up. In the last example, one of the Monero team is quoted in stating they cannot control members of their community. That is true and I believe stifling free speech always leads to bad outcomes so that is not something I am advocating for in anyway. The one thing that can be done is for someone from the Monero team to make a statement that they do not support members of their community making claims without providing evidence. They could make that post in this thread and it won't have to be mentioned again. That way at least myself and others in the Monero community, including the aggressors, will know that the Monero team does not support this behavior and then hopefully we can move forward together in advocating for the adoption of cryptos. By remaining silent, they are endorsing this behavior and it is off putting and unprofessional. I have been investing and watching both Monero and Dash for over two years and am continuously embarrassed to be part of a community that acts so childish when so much is at stake. I have been vocal as of late as I am becoming increasingly worried at the direction our society is moving and believe that cooperation is more necessary now than it ever has been. Speaking of stifling free speech, I was extremely disappointed that my plea to the Monero and Dash communities was censored on the Monero subreddit: http://imgur.com/a/Cqnz1My plea is still on the bitcointalk Monero thread which is great but I'm not sure I understand why it was removed on the Monero subreddit. It is a little hypocritical that the Monero team believes it cannot control certain members of its community but then actively censors other members of that same community that are only trying to bring a stop to the unproductive hostility. I believe both communities should let the past be the past and open a new door towards cooperation but we cannot do that without the leaders setting an example for others to follow. As the topic of why masternode owners are likely long term investors was brought up, I'm happy to chime in.
During the day I'm a derivatives trader. I really don't trust our markets so I never hold futures contracts for very long and whenever I do invest in something for the long term, I am always looking for the most yield with the least amount of risk.
Currently, I could park my money in treasuries, bonds, dividend paying stocks or even write my own options. What becomes fairly apparent when looking into all of these though is that the yield on both the safer and riskier investments is so low right now that at this point in time, they don't make a lot of sense unless those are your only options.
While Dash is not the only crypto I hold, it is currently the only one that does offer an inviting yield on your investment. On my masternodes I currently make 10% annual ROI. About 1.75% of that does get taken away whenever I convert masternode payments back to fiat due to various exchange fees but the remaining 8.25% is still a fantastic return.
While I know this is anecdotal evidence, I do think its safe to assume that a good portion of other masternode owners have performed a similar assessment of what will offer the greatest "guaranteed" ROI and chose to invest in Dash and its masternodes because of this. All investments have risks and your initial investment could go down in value. Dash is no exception but considering that I actually have voting power as to the direction of my investment, I feel comfortable holding Dash for the long term over lets say Intel or Apple stock where I could be earning a much smaller dividend with lower risk but would not have the same voting power.
Without incentivized nodes, I am beginning to doubt the long term viability of other currencies as I think they will eventually face the same problems that bitcoin is now. I really hope more currencies begin to incorporate incentivized nodes and I know there are several that are.
 i know you have investments in dash masternodes..and threats to dash is also a threat to your investment...i understand that. BUT..you cannot strip humans of their emotions.. i recommend putting on your "dash t-shirt" and drink your coffee from "dash mug" and let's have some fun  I have made it clear from the beginning that most of my cash worth is spread between Monero and Dash. More recently, I've been making a whole lot more money in Monero than I have Dash but making money has never been the point. The ROI that Dash masternodes offer is just a bonus, as is the money I have been making in Monero, both of which I still plan to hold long term. I do not want a "dash t-shirt" or a "dash mug". I just want everyone to expand their scope of thinking and see everyone in the crypto space as being part of the same group and begin to treat each other with respect. While it is impossible to strip humans of their emotions and would be counter-productive to do so, I think we can hold everyone to a higher standard. I believe in both currencies and the point that everyone continues to miss, including you, is that this is much larger than "my" investments. This is about changing the way our species makes transactions and about giving everyone freedom which I really do not think we have been able to experience in our entire history. Decentralization was not technically feasible until just recently and now we have a chance to change the underlying systems of our civilization. But in order to do this, we have to overcome a lot of barriers and will have to engage with a lot of organizations that have billions of dollars at stake if the status quo was to change. They are not going to give up easily and quite frankly have not even started to fight us. The combined marketcap of the top 100 cryptos is only 12 billion. Do you know what that is to Goldman Sachs? 3 months worth of earnings. Do you know what that is to Apple? 1 / 50th of their market cap. They have not started to fight us because we are barely a threat. We will be though and that is when the real battle will begin and I believe that is right around the corner. We need to get our ducks in a row and stop our in fighting so we can get organized for what lies ahead. Constructive criticism is great. Name calling, unsubstantiated claims and posts without links to evidence or that are phrased in an aggressive or childish way only serve to widen our divisions when we need to be doing the exact opposite. Would any of this behavior be tolerated in the business world? Would any of this be tolerated at any reputable firm? The answer is clearly no and these are the very entrenched systems that we are up against. They will walk all over us as we try to push adoption if we do not change the way we present ourselves. There is nothing "fun" about the direction our world is heading nor is there anything "fun" about the way that millions of people suffer under the existing monopolies of banks and remittance companies. I believe that each persons life is inherently meaningless and that it is up to the individual to give meaning to their own life through their actions. We, as supporters of cryptos have an opportunity to make a real change and I urge everyone to think of the big picture and act accordingly. i have a different vision, i prefer fighting/competition..it makes each other stronger and innovative.. i even like attacks, i wanted monero attacked, DASH attacked, Bitcoin attacked... attack everywhere.. we don't want to release a crypto currency to the whole world that will fail and bring billions of $ down with it.. think of crypto like a bitcoin dojo with satoshi nakamoto as sensei monero and dash are sparring partners, include zcash too..after they toughen up they will leave the bitcoin dojo and find their path in the world. regarding shills, they are my favorites..i neutralize their lies and deception...i also have fun along the way regarding speculators, they are part of the ecosystem...people gamble, trade, invest, make a few bucks etc.. that's life. |
|
|
|
The majority of discussion has been using facts to base claims about Dash and Monero. "Bashing" is the term used when the opposing side of the discussion does not like how the discussion is going so they play the victim card. A lot of people appear to have missed the point in my original post asking both communities to be more cooperative. They can still compete and use that competition to innovate and they can still critique the other technology. What I believe needs to happen though for cryptos in general to succeed is to do this in a more professional and jovial manner. You are correct that some of the discussions have used facts and have been productive but a lot of the conversations have also been without facts and very childish. Here is just one of many examples that I do believe is "bashing" as it does not reference facts, evidence or data of any kind and instead uses verbiage like "scam" and "snakeoil". Here is another example where "DashHole" is used. It is a known problem that members of the Monero community actively make aggressive claims about other technology without providing evidence to back these claims up. In the last example, one of the Monero team is quoted in stating they cannot control members of their community. That is true and I believe stifling free speech always leads to bad outcomes so that is not something I am advocating for in anyway. The one thing that can be done is for someone from the Monero team to make a statement that they do not support members of their community making claims without providing evidence. They could make that post in this thread and it won't have to be mentioned again. That way at least myself and others in the Monero community, including the aggressors, will know that the Monero team does not support this behavior and then hopefully we can move forward together in advocating for the adoption of cryptos. By remaining silent, they are endorsing this behavior and it is off putting and unprofessional. I have been investing and watching both Monero and Dash for over two years and am continuously embarrassed to be part of a community that acts so childish when so much is at stake. I have been vocal as of late as I am becoming increasingly worried at the direction our society is moving and believe that cooperation is more necessary now than it ever has been. Speaking of stifling free speech, I was extremely disappointed that my plea to the Monero and Dash communities was censored on the Monero subreddit: http://imgur.com/a/Cqnz1My plea is still on the bitcointalk Monero thread which is great but I'm not sure I understand why it was removed on the Monero subreddit. It is a little hypocritical that the Monero team believes it cannot control certain members of its community but then actively censors other members of that same community that are only trying to bring a stop to the unproductive hostility. I believe both communities should let the past be the past and open a new door towards cooperation but we cannot do that without the leaders setting an example for others to follow. As the topic of why masternode owners are likely long term investors was brought up, I'm happy to chime in.
During the day I'm a derivatives trader. I really don't trust our markets so I never hold futures contracts for very long and whenever I do invest in something for the long term, I am always looking for the most yield with the least amount of risk.
Currently, I could park my money in treasuries, bonds, dividend paying stocks or even write my own options. What becomes fairly apparent when looking into all of these though is that the yield on both the safer and riskier investments is so low right now that at this point in time, they don't make a lot of sense unless those are your only options.
While Dash is not the only crypto I hold, it is currently the only one that does offer an inviting yield on your investment. On my masternodes I currently make 10% annual ROI. About 1.75% of that does get taken away whenever I convert masternode payments back to fiat due to various exchange fees but the remaining 8.25% is still a fantastic return.
While I know this is anecdotal evidence, I do think its safe to assume that a good portion of other masternode owners have performed a similar assessment of what will offer the greatest "guaranteed" ROI and chose to invest in Dash and its masternodes because of this. All investments have risks and your initial investment could go down in value. Dash is no exception but considering that I actually have voting power as to the direction of my investment, I feel comfortable holding Dash for the long term over lets say Intel or Apple stock where I could be earning a much smaller dividend with lower risk but would not have the same voting power.
Without incentivized nodes, I am beginning to doubt the long term viability of other currencies as I think they will eventually face the same problems that bitcoin is now. I really hope more currencies begin to incorporate incentivized nodes and I know there are several that are.
i know you have investments in dash masternodes..and threats to dash is also a threat to your investment...i understand that. BUT..you cannot strip humans of their emotions.. i recommend putting on your "dash t-shirt" and drink your coffee from "dash mug" and let's have some fun |
|
|
|
dash "partly private" blockchain is a security hole itself Ariel, I'm going to be polite.
You do not consider that the Monero block chain is unverifiable because it is completely opaque. If you want to "trust the math" and believe no loop hole will ever exist allowing coins to be inserted, changing the supply of coins, or that "the math" will never have an unforeseen hole where transactions will be detangled, something that can't happen with private send, that is fine.
However, an open blockchain, with inputs and outputs that can be seen with the naked eye, and verified is one of the cornerstones of Bitcoin's brilliance. And Dash kept that while also providing privacy.
Because of that, I personally think Dash's privacy feature is far superior to Monero's. Dash is solid. You know where everything stands at any time.
And yet, once again, Dash's superior privacy, fungibility and verifiable blockchain is only one of the many features Dash provides in creating a world class currency that will be used by a majority of the human population in only half a generation's time. But good luck with Monero, but if you want to use your funds for illegal purposes, please use a minimum 8 rounds of mixing in Dash, and leave the Monero at home. I really don't trust it, and fear for your safety.
You think you know it all, you think you can trust "the math" but these cryptographic proofs have weaknesses that can be exploited. Some have been discovered, as in secp256r1, and there could be other weaknesses that have yet to be revealed.
If you want to "trust the math" yes, we want to trust the math. that is what cryptography is for..is what crypto currency is for. back to privacy.. i can compare dash blockchain now to the internet, at first you thought that the internet is private but then it is not...then tor was created, it made the internet "PARTLY PRIVATE" ... didn't we heard of government being able to successfully trace in tor? yes it did happen and it is in the news. |
|
|
|
Please note, I say this with much love to the Dash community as I have witnessed you taking the brunt of the attacks so much of this does not apply directly to you. As this is a plea for both communities and is also posted in the Monero thread, I feel the need to post it here as well. I am a long time lurker and holder of both Monero and Dash. I have made a lot of money holding both but making money has never been the goal. 80% of my cash worth is spread between both currencies because I do not like the direction in which our world is moving and I want to ensure that myself and the people I care about are well taken care of when the facade that now envelopes our society is finally lifted. I have a plea for both the Monero and Dash communities. The world markets are at all time highs, standing on a cliff, held steady only by increasingly desperate central banks and supported by governments that have yet to realize that neo-classical economics has failed. Well-intentioned but poorly executed ideas such as the ACA and Eurozone Refugee Policy continue to disintegrate and the media conglomerates appear dedicated to perpetuating fear so they can pad their margins. Our elected leaders are now preying upon this fear to usurp our freedoms and those campaigning for office are using this fear to manipulate their way into power. It is clear that the status quo will not change willingly and will turn to increasingly extreme measures to maintain their control. Our world is in a precarious situation but our involvement in Monero and Dash does allow us to do something about it. I believe that until recently, true freedom and democracy has not been possible. It is only now, due to advances in technology and novel ideas such as the blockchain and DAO's, that we finally have the tools to ensure our freedom, regardless of what legislation our corrupt and misguided governments decide to pass in the public's "best interest". The only way to solve many of the problems we face is to create technology that is impervious to government intervention. Where the people get to choose how they wish to transact and what they choose to purchase in complete privacy. I know there is continuous debate regarding which technology is more secure, or scalable, or a multitude of other things but I think the one thing both communities can agree on is they are both vast improvements over fiat transactions and even bitcoin. The announcement from Jaxx regarding the required removal of Dash from their iOS wallet is a perfect example of the uphill battle anonymous currencies are facing. https://twitter.com/diiorioanthony/status/771017555930705920https://twitter.com/diiorioanthony/status/771033721881362432While both technologies are taking different approaches to creating a digital equivalent of cash, the greatest hurdle they face will be adoption and this will not happen if the current powers that be continue to discriminate against them. This hurdle becomes a lot smaller if both communities work together. Right now, the combined marketcap of Monero and Dash is ~200 mil which is miniscule compared to the entrenched systems. In fact, the entire marketcap of the top 100 crypto's is only 11 billion. I trade the S&P eMini during the day and on average, in the last minute of regular market trading, 50+ billion dollars worth of contracts will change hands. In one minute, five times more money changes hands than the top 100 cryptos combined marketcap. Monero and Dash are currently the two rats in the corner fighting over a crumb while the corrupt banks and remittance companies sit at the table and feast on the entire pie. If we work together, we can have a real shot at taking a larger slice of the pie (while actually benefiting society) and believe me, there is more than enough to go around. If you are just in Monero or Dash to make a quick buck, I imagine you stopped reading some time ago. If you are still here, I urge you to expand your scope of thinking and imagine what could be accomplished if both currencies were to cooperate. If I dare to dream, I would envision a future where there are XMR and DASH trading pairs on exchanges, where we encourage others to use both networks, where the communities help test each others releases, where they combine forces to help both get added as payment options for major services and where ideas on how to improve both currencies are openly shared and discussed. If anyone is open to creating a new bitcointalk thread for mutual and friendly discussion of both cryptos, I think that would be a great first step. We are all in this battle together and I believe the only way we can fail is by remaining divided. The real enemy is the entrenched systems that dictate our lives. Please do your part to help create a more cooperative environment, regardless of your opinion on which technology is superior. well said.. but you should consider the element of competition..it is healthy overall, each side pointing flaws and making/innovating to outclass each other. i dont see a way to make them work together since they have different blockchain tech, dash is from bitcoin and monero is cryptonote. and i like you to think if there is a winner, i mean there is only one anon coin used by people, the development and capitalization will also become concentrated to one. the weaker tech should be discarded because it will be just pulling down crypto advancement in general. |
|
|
|
so much whining here makes me wonder... when darkcoin took/stole dashcoin's name, darkcoin should have migrated to dashcoin's superior cryptonote blockchain instead of just taking the name...maybe darkcoin aka dash now might still have a chance against monero haha it's over RIP xcoin/darkcoin/dash... back to 5 million market cap  . Why are you still hanging round here? Because he (and many others in the crypto-space) want to see the DASH network destroyed. It's just the fighting fase... you know what's next yeah keep fighting..and oh, dream on guys .... here's another song for you. Every time I look in the forum
All these lines on my thread getting clearer
The past is gone
It went by like dusk to dawn
Isn't that the way?
Everybody's got their dues in life to pay
Yeah, I know nobody knows
Where it comes and where it goes
I know it's everybody's sin
You got to lose to know how to win
Half my life's in DASH' written pages
Live and learn from trolls and from mermaids
You know it's true
All the things come back to you
DASH with me, DASH for the year
DASH for the laughter, DASH for the tear
DASH with me if it's just for today
Maybe tomorrow the good Lord will take you away
Yeah, DASH with me, DASH for the year
DASH for the laughter, DASH for the tear
DASH with me if it's just for today
Maybe tomorrow the good Lord will take you away
Dream on, dream on, dream on,
Dream yourself a dream come true
Dream on, dream on, dream on,
Dream until your dreams come true
Dream on, dream on, dream on,
Dream on, dream on,
Dream on, dream on, ah
DASH with me, DASH for the year
DASH for the laughter, DASH for the tear
DASH with me if it's just for today
Maybe tomorrow, the good Lord will take you away
DASH with me, DASH for the year
DASH for the laughter, DASH for the tear
DASH with me just for today
Maybe tomorrow, the good Lord will take you away... |
|
|
|
can we please just put volyova on ignore, he already proven to be a troll and he is cluttering up this forum
with his troll posts and the replies he get.
thank you.
Thanks for the heads up, done! Nice catch here, very interesting, it would partialy explain some of the recent exit pumps. On another note what's up with BTC? Any guesses? I have said it many times... We should never court or market to the darknet or Deep Web. That is not where our future lies. Let others cater to that market if they wish. you must have a new variety in your vineyard called "sour grapes" LOL i bet it is the darknet or deep web who wanted the technology, so they must be the one doing the courting hehe anyway, if darknet people wanted to use dash they will use it if they want to, there's nothing you can do about it. so if you don't want people to be anonymous/private, why not remove private send and stop your masternodes from mixing coins?.. and then dash will become just like any other shitcoin out there with fast coin transfers and shiny GUI? haha |
|
|
|
Interesting article, could have huge implications for a certain cryptocurrency that just got added as currency on darknet. Direct association with darknet = Full attention of the FBI Its a good thing Dash moved away from darknet... sour grapes? or losers and quitters..didn't even have the chance to perform. XMR cryptonote technology is on stage now...we will see if it can hold its defenses...go anonymous crypto currency! go monero! |
|
|
|
can we please just put volyova on ignore, he already proven to be a troll and he is cluttering up this forum
with his troll posts and the replies he get.
thank you.
Thanks for the heads up, done! Nice catch here, very interesting, it would partialy explain some of the recent exit pumps. On another note what's up with BTC? Any guesses? I have said it many times... We should never court or market to the darknet or Deep Web. That is not where our future lies. Let others cater to that market if they wish. you must have a new variety in your vineyard called "sour grapes" LOL i bet it is the darknet or deep web who wanted the technology, so they must be the one doing the courting hehe anyway, if darknet people wanted to use dash they will use it if they want to, there's nothing you can do about it. so if you don't want people to be anonymous/private, why not remove private send and stop your masternodes from mixing coins?.. and then dash will become just like any other shitcoin out there with fast coin transfers and shiny GUI? haha |
|
|
|
SELL ORDERS Total: 662390.65984673 DSH
A lot of DSH are still on Poloniex. Withdraws are slow and there are a errors sometimes. Withdraw while you still can, guys.
This coin is not dead. Minergate, Hitbtc, Democats and Forknote are still supporting it.
In the next version we will have RocksDB implemented. Only Monero and Bytecoin(beta) have a database implemented so far.
this newb acct knows more than i do  ...what is RocksDB? Why withdraw from Poloniex? Poloniex plans to delist these coins On 9/5/2016, the following markets will be delisted: ABY, ADN, BITUSD, CNMT, DAO, DSH, FIBRE, FLT, GAP, GRS, HYP, IFC, LQD, MCN, MINT, MMC, MNTA, PIGGY, PTS, SILK, SWARM, WDC, XC, XCR, XPB, XUSD, YACC. |
|
|
|
|
mr. claymore, this cryptonight algo can be dual mined?
|
|
|
|
so much whining here makes me wonder... when darkcoin took/stole dashcoin's name, darkcoin should have migrated to dashcoin's superior cryptonote blockchain instead of just taking the name...maybe darkcoin aka dash now might still have a chance against monero haha it's over RIP xcoin/darkcoin/dash... back to 5 million market cap |
|
|
|
SELL ORDERS Total: 662390.65984673 DSH
A lot of DSH are still on Poloniex. Withdraws are slow and there are a errors sometimes. Withdraw while you still can, guys.
This coin is not dead. Minergate, Hitbtc, Democats and Forknote are still supporting it.
In the next version we will have RocksDB implemented. Only Monero and Bytecoin(beta) have a database implemented so far.
this newb acct knows more than i do ...what is RocksDB? |
|
|
|
an attacker will probably use a "zero-day" exploit...meaning, a vulnerability that nobody knows except him/them.. why would an attacker focus on a well known attack and people already know how to defend against it? the transaction malleability that happened in bitcoin exchanges back then is an example... this is just another advertising thread for dash |
|
|
|
this will give you folks a different angle on the instamine (crosspost from why dash instamine matters thread) dash's first month Ok I get it now. So it is no good. But can anyone explain why the price is rising? It's rising because it's one of the most coherent monetary assets on coinmarketcap, being that it retains bitcoin's blokchain transparency while improving massively on its fungibility to the point that distinguishing characteristics between addresses are effectively eliminated. Further, Dash has established a balanced approach between reserve and currency markets thats almost unmatched by any other cryptocurrency asset. That's to say that while some proportion of the coin supply is made available by holders on exchanges for trading, a significant proportion of the rest of it is deployed on the network and earns a return for its holders. This is in fact not really true. The coins held in Master nodes are not production investment that earns interest as in a normal currency reserve system, where "saving" is in fact (delegated) investment in production capital. In other words, "saved" money in a normal monetary economy are not "put in a box" but are again actively used by entrepreneurs to buy production capital. That money keeps flowing, in other words, it is not locked up in a box as is the case in a Master node. The "interest earning" in Master nodes is nothing else but a re-distribution of seigniorage by mining ; in other words, a tax on every currency holder, that goes in the pockets of Master node holders: a transfer of wealth from active users to "passive possessors". In a normal economy, the interest earned comes from the risk taken. A master node locked up doesn't take the slightest bit of risk but earns 45% of the seigniorage. You can say that in bitcoin too, there is inflation because of mining. However, because in bitcoin, the full seigniorage goes to the miner, that miner will also be pushed by competition to BURN most of the seigniorage in PoW. In DASH, because the miner will only receive 45% of the seigniorage, competition will only make him burn 45% of the seigniorage in PoW, and the rest goes in the pockets of Master nodes and the "gouvernors". Now, that is EXTREMELY SIMILAR to central banking and their interest rates on issued currency feeding a whole bunch of elite with free money, taxed by inflation on all the others. In bitcoin, at least, this "tax" is entirely (or almost entirely) burned by PoW, so there is not really a self-accumulation of wealth without risk by the "richies of the first hour(s)". Also because of this lucrative locking up of a large part of the money supply in master nodes, the ACTUAL available market cap of DASH is way lower than is calculated, because the available coin supply is seriously lower than the total number of coins existing. But all this is not to point out that DASH is a kind of rip off. There is simply no other way to do some form of automated secured coinjoin mixing with bitcoin technology: you need "trusted parties", and so you need to provide them with sufficient incentive to do so (the master nodes). This implies re-centralisation, governance, and hence, taxes and lucrative happenings for the elite which get richer.
The remaining question is how many master nodes are under independent control. If that number is too small, then the anonymity of the mixing becomes compromised too.masternodes are already in plan even before they launched dash....hence the importance of the instamine to grab an astounding amount of dash This is another lie (a lie you like to repeat again and again). I know because I was there. Anyone can read the Dash thread from day one to check. here goes... get ready for some ass whoopin! and check the datesGreat, now that everything is stable, I'll be posting later about the vision of this project and milestones! Time to move on to actually implementing what I set out to do.
this is posted after the 48hr instamine ka ching! Evan and his friends pocketed a lot of coins.... great indeed very great Evan *clap* *clap* aaaaannd before he posted this (quote below) Evan already forked DASH from 84 Million supply to about 21 Million and you can see him posting, WTB 20,000 and WTB 10,000 DASH <------ the greed of this guy knows no boundary and then this! (the vision of this project and milestones)In reply to: http://www.reddit.com/r/DRKCoin/comments/1yit1a/using_coinjoin_for_anonymity_is_errorprone/I'm posting this here, for everyone's benefit. Thanks! Hi, I am Gnosis, the Anoncoin developer working on implementing Zerocoin. First of all, I think it is excellent that there is so much interest in developing a fully anonymous currency. I am not just a developer but also a user, or I will be when an anonymous currency exists! When coin creators compete, the coin users win! However, CoinJoin has been around for a while, and it has not seen much use for anonymity. There's a good reason for that: it's not very anonymous. Quoting my bitcointalk post: CoinJoin has questionable anonymity compared to Zerocoin. The reason is that with CoinJoin, two or more users must somehow partner up and forge a transaction together. They communicate over a secure channel to do this. The coins are only mixed among these "partners." Picking partners you can trust is a significant obstacle: how can you know that your partners will "forget" the mixing that happened? One may try to repeat this 10 times with randomly chosen partners, but how can you know that your partners are not all just sock puppets of one malicious entity (on an anonymous network, it is trivial to create as many fake users as you want )? If that is the case, then your efforts are in vain.
Compare this with Zerocoin, where you put your coins in an accumulator, and they are mixed with the coins of all users who have put coins into that accumulator, since the beginning of Zerocoin. There would be a different accumulator for different denominations of Anoncoins (1, 5, 10, 50 ANC, etc.).
To put it simply, the more users' coins your coins are mixed with, the more anonymity you have.
I cannot speak to Darkcoin's implementation (or planned implementation) of CoinJoin since I cannot seem to find any specs or code on their Github or their site. If anyone knows, please point me to them. I look forward to a practical and secure solution for anonymity from the DarkCoin devs!  First off, these are fantastic questions. The answer to implementing this in such a way where it is very difficulty to exploit is by adding cost and verification. Here’s the gist of how I envision DarkSend to work in the long run. Some of what I’m going to mention is done, some of it I’m working on currently. I’d love some ideas on possible attack vectors on my implementation, so we can make it as bulletproof as possible. PoolsDarkSend adds various extensions to the Bitcoin protocol for implementing transaction pooling. Like normal Coinjoin the pools take transactions in stages. The stages currently are: POOL_STATUS_IDLE POOL_STATUS_ACCEPTING_INPUTS POOL_STATUS_ACCEPTING_OUTPUTS POOL_STATUS_SIGNING POOL_STATUS_TRANSMISSION So the users relay these items throughout the network as the stages happen. After all items are gathered into the pool, the transactions are merged together into one, remotely signed and then broadcasted. Masters
To defeat propagation problems, master nodes are elected each new block. They are responsible for being the authority of what goes into the joined transaction each session. This is done in a tamperproof way, but I think it’s not important to the discussion. So what is the cost? There must be a cost to using this anonymous network, otherwise like you say there will be issues with millions of accounts popping up. I’m not dead set on which solution(s) to implement, but here’s a couple ideas: Burnt IdentitiesHigher difficulty shares to the current block would be mined and then stored in the blockchain permanently. Multiple of these would be used for each transaction and would be “burnt” when misused, causing the attacker to have to mine them again. Verification? To use the pools it will require unique unspend outputs, someone that wants to mess with the system would have to have a large pool of funds in many addresses. So to attack a pool with 100 slots, you would require funds dispersed to 99 addresses, on 99 nodes working in common. Other possible fee-less solutions? There is interesting research on protecting against sybil attacks that lends itself really well to a decentralized ledger, such as this paper: http://dimacs.rutgers.edu/Workshops/InformationSecurity/slides/gamesandreputation.pdfThe idea is to build a social graph of the inputs and outputs of each entry and they should all know different people. If 99 of them all have the same “friends” that they associate with, then they’ll have to enter a different pool. Which will ensure the pool is not full of the nodes belonging to the attacker. An application for machine learning? I’m been making models for trading equities for over 7 years now. I ran a financial firm that sold the signals for a few years and I have experience with natural language processing using classifiers. So, I could make a classifier and actually embed it into Darkcoin to determine which pool a node should use, to separate out nodes that seem to be in common. Other ideas? I’m open to ideas on how to provide the best security to the network. I would love to hear what people have in mind. I’ve been working on DarkSend about a month and we’ve already fixed the decentralization and propagation issues, this is just another bridge to cross in the future. Thanks! BOOM! a month after the launch date (instamine), accumulation and forking the coin...GREAT indeed Evan *clap* *clap* postlude...  it is not about just bugs in the code, its about how sneaky and untrustworthy dash beginnings is. |
|
|
|
|
people should make a fast "move on" now
|
|
|
|
Please note, I say this with much love to the Dash community as I have witnessed you taking the brunt of the attacks so much of this does not apply directly to you. As this is a plea for both communities and is also posted in the Monero thread, I feel the need to post it here as well. I am a long time lurker and holder of both Monero and Dash. I have made a lot of money holding both but making money has never been the goal. 80% of my cash worth is spread between both currencies because I do not like the direction in which our world is moving and I want to ensure that myself and the people I care about are well taken care of when the facade that now envelopes our society is finally lifted. I have a plea for both the Monero and Dash communities. The world markets are at all time highs, standing on a cliff, held steady only by increasingly desperate central banks and supported by governments that have yet to realize that neo-classical economics has failed. Well-intentioned but poorly executed ideas such as the ACA and Eurozone Refugee Policy continue to disintegrate and the media conglomerates appear dedicated to perpetuating fear so they can pad their margins. Our elected leaders are now preying upon this fear to usurp our freedoms and those campaigning for office are using this fear to manipulate their way into power. It is clear that the status quo will not change willingly and will turn to increasingly extreme measures to maintain their control. Our world is in a precarious situation but our involvement in Monero and Dash does allow us to do something about it. I believe that until recently, true freedom and democracy has not been possible. It is only now, due to advances in technology and novel ideas such as the blockchain and DAO's, that we finally have the tools to ensure our freedom, regardless of what legislation our corrupt and misguided governments decide to pass in the public's "best interest". The only way to solve many of the problems we face is to create technology that is impervious to government intervention. Where the people get to choose how they wish to transact and what they choose to purchase in complete privacy. I know there is continuous debate regarding which technology is more secure, or scalable, or a multitude of other things but I think the one thing both communities can agree on is they are both vast improvements over fiat transactions and even bitcoin. The announcement from Jaxx regarding the required removal of Dash from their iOS wallet is a perfect example of the uphill battle anonymous currencies are facing. https://twitter.com/diiorioanthony/status/771017555930705920https://twitter.com/diiorioanthony/status/771033721881362432While both technologies are taking different approaches to creating a digital equivalent of cash, the greatest hurdle they face will be adoption and this will not happen if the current powers that be continue to discriminate against them. This hurdle becomes a lot smaller if both communities work together. Right now, the combined marketcap of Monero and Dash is ~200 mil which is miniscule compared to the entrenched systems. In fact, the entire marketcap of the top 100 crypto's is only 11 billion. I trade the S&P eMini during the day and on average, in the last minute of regular market trading, 50+ billion dollars worth of contracts will change hands. In one minute, five times more money changes hands than the top 100 cryptos combined marketcap. Monero and Dash are currently the two rats in the corner fighting over a crumb while the corrupt banks and remittance companies sit at the table and feast on the entire pie. If we work together, we can have a real shot at taking a larger slice of the pie (while actually benefiting society) and believe me, there is more than enough to go around. If you are just in Monero or Dash to make a quick buck, I imagine you stopped reading some time ago. If you are still here, I urge you to expand your scope of thinking and imagine what could be accomplished if both currencies were to cooperate. If I dare to dream, I would envision a future where there are XMR and DASH trading pairs on exchanges, where we encourage others to use both networks, where the communities help test each others releases, where they combine forces to help both get added as payment options for major services and where ideas on how to improve both currencies are openly shared and discussed. If anyone is open to creating a new bitcointalk thread for mutual and friendly discussion of both cryptos, I think that would be a great first step. We are all in this battle together and I believe the only way we can fail is by remaining divided. The real enemy is the entrenched systems that dictate our lives. Please do your part to help create a more cooperative environment, regardless of your opinion on which technology is superior. well said.. but you should consider the element of competition..it is healthy overall, each side pointing flaws and making/innovating to outclass each other. i dont see a way to make them work together since they have different blockchain tech, dash is from bitcoin and monero is cryptonote. and i like you to think if there is a winner, i mean there is only one anon coin used by people, the development and capitalization will also become concentrated to one. the weaker tech should be discarded because it will be just pulling down crypto advancement in general. |
|
|
|
sapphire rx 480 nitro 4gb here is about $70 cheaper than the 8gb model.
any thoughts if i should choose the 4gb over the 8gb model?
will the 4gb suffer the same fate as the 3gb 280x on dagger algo in the near future?
You'll be fine in the short to mid term. The DAG increases roughly 0.7GB per year knowing that 3gb 280x are about 25mhs last year, these 4gb might decrease hashrate a bit more than 8gb models for a year of mining. its 8gb then. based on the link you provided its 2018 for the 3gb models, but 280x already lost about 30% of its hashrate compared to about 15% loss on 8gb 390.. |
|
|
|
|
sapphire rx 480 nitro 4gb here is about $70 cheaper than the 8gb model.
any thoughts if i should choose the 4gb over the 8gb model?
will the 4gb suffer the same fate as the 3gb 280x on dagger algo in the near future?
|
|
|
|
|
sapphire rx 480 nitro 4gb here is about 71$ cheaper than 8gb model of sapphire rx 480 nitro
any thoughts? will 4gb will take a hit in dagger algos like 3gb 280xs in the near future?
|
|
|
|
|
Show Posts
