I've been trying out PayServices over the past few days, and I like it, although some of the features haven't been implemented yet. I'm really looking forward to trying out the various features as they roll out.
The question I have about BFB is this: If the coin is 100% premined, where are you getting the coins to have one coin per block indefinitely?
@wiser, POW Blocks with one coin per block generated by the ButterflyBits Network every minute would be left in place with no halving in order to provide incentive for as many miners as possible to set up nodes and mine ButterflyBits. This would help further secure the Network and guarantee fast transactions. Since PayServices is rich in features, including ones that are not fully implemented yet along with features that are yet to come in the future, the amount of uses for these coins could be massive. This would make mining for a share of the 1440 coins a day that the Network produces worth mining in order to gain as many as possible. Currently with its distribution as rewards in increments of 10 to 125 ButterflyBits that come with the Butterfly Effect CitizenCards when purchased at $10 USD to $125 USD. Those ButterflyBits come directly out of the pre-mine which is viewable through any Block Explorer with a rich list or in the Butterfly Central Reserve. Compared to most the Bitcoin 2.0 projects along with ripple, leaving in the ability to mine ButterflyBits for the single coin blocks keeps ButterflyBits DeCentralized which is an important part of why CryptoCurrencies such as Bitcoin and Litecoin have been extremely successful. This and other components and features that make up PayServices are all a big learning lesson which we will be learning together as this grows into something that all of us will have built together and that works. ButterflyBits is just one of many components that are a part of PayServices. Thanks for answering the question, although it would seem that as long as there are BFB's tied up for miners, then the premine wasn't entirely 100%, maybe 95%, but you would have had to have left some for the miners to unlock. Or, do those BFB's come from somewhere else? I'm just trying to understand. As far as accessing BFB's now, I know of two ways: mining it and buying a Butterfly card through PayServices.com. Are there any other ways to acquire or purchase BFB's? Do any exchanges currently carry it? I understand PayServices will have its own exchange and marketplace in about a month. Will BFB then be for sale? I would love to get my hands on some. . "Will BFB then be for sale?"Most likely yes, of course. Thanks so much for this! No worries about the length. Sometimes it just takes a lot of words to adequately explain something. I now understand the premine vs. one coin per block indefinitely conundrum. The part I was missing was that 100 BFB was not a final number, but that this amount would be added to gradually over time. So slightly inflationary, but at 0.5% annually not excessively so  I'm enjoying the development of PayServices and look forward to the launch of the trading platform/marketplace. I will probably buy some BFB at that point, depending on what the market does. Thanks again for the thorough explanations! |
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I've been trying out PayServices over the past few days, and I like it, although some of the features haven't been implemented yet. I'm really looking forward to trying out the various features as they roll out.
The question I have about BFB is this: If the coin is 100% premined, where are you getting the coins to have one coin per block indefinitely?
@wiser, POW Blocks with one coin per block generated by the ButterflyBits Network every minute would be left in place with no halving in order to provide incentive for as many miners as possible to set up nodes and mine ButterflyBits. This would help further secure the Network and guarantee fast transactions. Since PayServices is rich in features, including ones that are not fully implemented yet along with features that are yet to come in the future, the amount of uses for these coins could be massive. This would make mining for a share of the 1440 coins a day that the Network produces worth mining in order to gain as many as possible. Currently with its distribution as rewards in increments of 10 to 125 ButterflyBits that come with the Butterfly Effect CitizenCards when purchased at $10 USD to $125 USD. Those ButterflyBits come directly out of the pre-mine which is viewable through any Block Explorer with a rich list or in the Butterfly Central Reserve. Compared to most the Bitcoin 2.0 projects along with ripple, leaving in the ability to mine ButterflyBits for the single coin blocks keeps ButterflyBits DeCentralized which is an important part of why CryptoCurrencies such as Bitcoin and Litecoin have been extremely successful. This and other components and features that make up PayServices are all a big learning lesson which we will be learning together as this grows into something that all of us will have built together and that works. ButterflyBits is just one of many components that are a part of PayServices. Thanks for answering the question, although it would seem that as long as there are BFB's tied up for miners, then the premine wasn't entirely 100%, maybe 95%, but you would have had to have left some for the miners to unlock. Or, do those BFB's come from somewhere else? I'm just trying to understand. As far as accessing BFB's now, I know of two ways: mining it and buying a Butterfly card through PayServices.com. Are there any other ways to acquire or purchase BFB's? Do any exchanges currently carry it? I understand PayServices will have its own exchange and marketplace in about a month. Will BFB then be for sale? I would love to get my hands on some. |
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I would like XEM on Margin trading at poloniex soon for adding liquidity.
I would love to see that too, and I would wholeheartedly participate by lending out my XEM to margin traders at interest |
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Whatever trading strategy we would implement would be open and public. As with all bots.
If you are building a bot to have a positive impact on the market, a couple things are unavoidable, at least as far as I can figure in thinking it through.
1) It will eventually get 'stuck' if the DNotes price does not go up. (So price drag won't be able to profit from our bot)
2) It won't adjust it's sell orders once they have been set automatically. (The bot can't be manipulated into a sell / dump position, that is just not an option for this type of trading strategy)
3) We will have to program it to avoid rapid price increases. (So humans can't pump and dump us.)
4) The trading timeframe will have to be elongated. For instance, if you have 1 bitcoin to use for this trading bot, and you will want to limit the amount it can potentially trade in a given day. If you want to ensure you can trade for 30 days, the bot can only spend .034 daily. It may have a higher daily trading volume though.
So all in all, I'm not too worried about manipulation trading against the bots. One of the key vulnerabilities in trading bots is it will constantly be swapping between buy and sell positions and readjusting it's strategy to attempt to make a profit. I won't say a positive market trading bot would be impervious to manipulation, but it just seems very unlikely.
As always, I want to hear everyone's opinion, if I am wrong, let me know.
Just to make sure I'm understanding this correctly, would the bot help an individual trader make a profit while also helping to support the DNotes price? If so, how would that work? |
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It's funny to see how the terms of the computer game trying to get value through the crypto coin. Now we can see in one place a aliens and knights and heroes of the cartoon  A little cross promotion is great. You just never know what you might learn that way. So... thanks for sharing |
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All, I've been considering putting together a trading bot that would have a positive influence on coin price over an extended period of time. It can be a profit creating bot, for example, if you believe the DNotes price is going up over time, it could try to profit in DNotes while maintaining an amount of bitcoin. I have some ideas for the algorithm but first I would like to gauge interest in such a bot and your thoughts on trading strategies that make sense while having a positive impact on the coins price and help maintain the market.
1) Who is interested? I need everyone who would be on board to speak up.
2) What type of trading strategies would think to be useful?
Disclaimer, the trading bot would be written in dotnet, very little effort would go into ease of use and design. IE it won't be pretty, just functional.
Today bots work against the market and against each other, we need to think in terms of a symbiotic relationship with the market and other users of this bot. Of course we can include a profit model, and slow accumulation strategy as well.
If we wind up with something useful, we can always request new functionality with Sampey (CAT).
I honestly do not know how to use trading bots, but I would be interested in learning. I probably would have to start by selling some DNotes (so that I'd have Bitcoin). Is this trading back and forth, like selling higher and buying lower? |
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Payservices has developed an excellent platform, that can help integrate many different currencies into point of sale systems that are used by a large majority of consumer based businesses. I see this as potential to bring large amounts of mainstream cashflow into the industry.
That sounds like a good summary. I think Payservices itself is having a hard time adequately expressing all they want to accomplish. I personally am hoping it will be a one stop shop where I can send all my various cryptos that I want to designate as "spending money" and that I can eventually get their debit card and then actually spend my cryptos on things like groceries and so forth. CoinBase has the shift card (though I don't think it's available in my state yet) where you can spend Bitcoin anywhere Visa is accepted, but I'd actually like to be able to spend all my cryptos, in whatever order I designate without having to first convert them to BTC. |
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Why the **** is Paycoin there . Its a major ***** scam. I even lost my microprime keys to the new developers who took over.
Paycoin is not the same thing as Josh Garza or GAW Miners. It's a legitimate coin. If you lost your microprime keys, it's not automatically the fault of the new developers. They had a limited time for people to access them for security reasons. In any case, this isn't the place to vent about PayServices' selection of coins. They are trying to carry as many of them as possible, so not all of them are going to be top of the line. |
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I've been trying out PayServices over the past few days, and I like it, although some of the features haven't been implemented yet. I'm really looking forward to trying out the various features as they roll out.
The question I have about BFB is this: If the coin is 100% premined, where are you getting the coins to have one coin per block indefinitely?
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This post on the Devcoin thread by a long time holder and supporter of Devcoin does a great job of illustrating the great need for a truly ethical exchange. At this point exchanges are by definition centralized, although I know that there is work being done to create truly decentralized ones. Some primitive models include the NXT asset exchange and other asset exchanges on coin platforms that run on similar principles as NXT. At this point the decentralized ones still have their problems, but one central entity losing or stealing all the funds isn't one of them. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=233997.msg13702343#msg13702343Good points Wiser. Are any of the decentralized exchanges gaining traction in terms of volume? I don't know for sure, but I doubt it, based on the way they work. For example, the NXT asset exchange allows people to issue an asset which then has a market value in NXT. Sometimes those assets represent other coins, but they aren't the actual coins. Let's say I hold 100,000 DNotes, and I decide I want to see them traded on the NXT exchange. I would issue 100,000 assets, each one representing one DNote. Then people are free to buy and sell them in NXT. When someone wants to trade their asset for actual DNotes, they would have to contact me and they transfer their assets to me, and I send them actual DNotes. Some coins do trade this way, but as you can see it's very clunky. What is missing (as of my current understanding) is a way to put actual coins on such a decentralized exchange. I believe the NEM platform is geared to allow for that, but it's still in development and I don't understand the technical details. Right now the exchanges that are functional are run on a centralized platform, which means that when you send coins to it, they're not actually *your* coins any longer, but technically belong to the exchange. Of course the honest ones hold them for your use, but the reality is that at any time they can take them away from you as long as you keep them there. One possible intermediate solution would be if whenever a user is issued an address on an exchange, that address comes with its private key. This would enable the user to access his funds in the event that he can't access the exchange (website down or whatever). I don't know of any exchanges that do this, but online Bitcoin wallet provider BitGo and online Neucoin wallet provider MyNeuCoin both issue private keys with their wallets and strongly encourage users to keep them backed up in a secure place. It seems to me it would be feasible for an exchange to do this, but I could be missing some difficulty or expense concerning this. The idealized reason for government regulation is to keep these financial companies honest, specifically because whether they are a bank or an exchange, we are entrusting them with our funds or assets and expect our funds and assets to be kept safe. Insurance (such as FDIC) is supposed to protect the users in the event of a theft, and the other regulations are supposed to ensure the financial entity is actually keeping those funds and assets safe on behalf of their customers. But all the regulations and insurance in the world don't make up for lack of ethics on the part of the financial institution owners. And although I think trustless systems are definitely worth exploring, I'm not sure they can make up for lack of ethics among the humans either. In my opinion this is an unnecessary over complication, and contrary to your claim about trustlessness, would require trust in the central authority (NXT, NEM or whatever). You would have to trust that the main coin is a good one, but I believe the way it is set up, you own your coins and your assets at all times, in the sense that no one can come and take them away from you. They would have to have access to your wallet and private keys to do so, which they don't on those asset exchanges. So I think it is accurate to call them "decentralized" but the real issue is that they are very limited in use, and trying to expand that use results in a lot of complicated steps. |
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This post on the Devcoin thread by a long time holder and supporter of Devcoin does a great job of illustrating the great need for a truly ethical exchange. At this point exchanges are by definition centralized, although I know that there is work being done to create truly decentralized ones. Some primitive models include the NXT asset exchange and other asset exchanges on coin platforms that run on similar principles as NXT. At this point the decentralized ones still have their problems, but one central entity losing or stealing all the funds isn't one of them. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=233997.msg13702343#msg13702343Good points Wiser. Are any of the decentralized exchanges gaining traction in terms of volume? I don't know for sure, but I doubt it, based on the way they work. For example, the NXT asset exchange allows people to issue an asset which then has a market value in NXT. Sometimes those assets represent other coins, but they aren't the actual coins. Let's say I hold 100,000 DNotes, and I decide I want to see them traded on the NXT exchange. I would issue 100,000 assets, each one representing one DNote. Then people are free to buy and sell them in NXT. When someone wants to trade their asset for actual DNotes, they would have to contact me and they transfer their assets to me, and I send them actual DNotes. Some coins do trade this way, but as you can see it's very clunky. What is missing (as of my current understanding) is a way to put actual coins on such a decentralized exchange. I believe the NEM platform is geared to allow for that, but it's still in development and I don't understand the technical details. Right now the exchanges that are functional are run on a centralized platform, which means that when you send coins to it, they're not actually *your* coins any longer, but technically belong to the exchange. Of course the honest ones hold them for your use, but the reality is that at any time they can take them away from you as long as you keep them there. One possible intermediate solution would be if whenever a user is issued an address on an exchange, that address comes with its private key. This would enable the user to access his funds in the event that he can't access the exchange (website down or whatever). I don't know of any exchanges that do this, but online Bitcoin wallet provider BitGo and online Neucoin wallet provider MyNeuCoin both issue private keys with their wallets and strongly encourage users to keep them backed up in a secure place. It seems to me it would be feasible for an exchange to do this, but I could be missing some difficulty or expense concerning this. The idealized reason for government regulation is to keep these financial companies honest, specifically because whether they are a bank or an exchange, we are entrusting them with our funds or assets and expect our funds and assets to be kept safe. Insurance (such as FDIC) is supposed to protect the users in the event of a theft, and the other regulations are supposed to ensure the financial entity is actually keeping those funds and assets safe on behalf of their customers. But all the regulations and insurance in the world don't make up for lack of ethics on the part of the financial institution owners. And although I think trustless systems are definitely worth exploring, I'm not sure they can make up for lack of ethics among the humans either. |
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This post on the Devcoin thread by a long time holder and supporter of Devcoin does a great job of illustrating the great need for a truly ethical exchange. At this point exchanges are by definition centralized, although I know that there is work being done to create truly decentralized ones. Some primitive models include the NXT asset exchange and other asset exchanges on coin platforms that run on similar principles as NXT. At this point the decentralized ones still have their problems, but one central entity losing or stealing all the funds isn't one of them. https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=233997.msg13702343#msg13702343 |
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Hey everyone,
RJF here. Tried to change my password on the "RJF" account and got locked out. No response from requests to unlock the "Hero" account so I guess i'm a newbie again. Really sucks. It's stuff like this that makes folks loose interest in these forums.
RJF, that is unfortunate, and very frustrating. There have been a couple of incidents where our forum members took months to recover their original status. To a certain extent we are all "customers" It is unbelievable why customer support, customer satisfaction, and great customer experience are not a high priority to top management. Customers are the final link connecting to business success. Once that link is broken, as in the case of Cryptsy, the company is gone for good. I just had a bad experience with Coinbase. Most likely due to third party software upgrade I lost my "Instant Buy". They must have tightened their address match and I have one address line with ... Rd and one without. It took me six weeks and countless hours to finally recovered my instantly buy. For sure customer support do not work on Saturday or Sunday at Coinbase. For those who managing your own business or those who are planning to start a business, that note of this, " What is your business? At the most fundamental level, it is the customer. Your business is not defined by your credential, name of your company, or how much publicity you received for your exciting innovative ideas. It is defined by successfully satisfying the customer’s want for the product or service purchased. Consequently, the fundamental mission and purpose of every business is to satisfy the customer." Alan Yong, The Four Pillars of Business Success, 2016 On the bright side, Payservices.com's support is very, very responsive. I hope they keep that a priority as they grow. |
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I just said all the relevant links were in the top post. I can send them a link to this specific message too. But like I said, a dev should probably reach out as well. |
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One of the devs might want to get in touch with Payservices.com about having them list XEM. I opened an account yesterday and asked them to add XEM, and they replied saying the coin was unfamiliar to them and could I send them more info. I sent them the link to this thread, which has all the info they could need, but maybe if one of the devs just reached out and made themselves available to answer any questions that come up along the way. You could start the conversation by opening an account and filling out a support ticket--support is very responsive. Here's an article about Payservices.com: http://dcebrief.com/the-launch-of-payservices-com-has-come/ |
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From what I understand, essentially you will be able to purchase one of their butterfly cards, which comes in the mail initially, and use that balance to exchange for DNotes. It is still in early launch phase. I'm working with their team through the process so I can provide more detail on how it works.
Glad to know you are working with them. I opened an account and am testing out features. Interface is a bit clunky, and I have some deposits tied up somewhere, which support is trying to figure out. I like the idea, anyway, of being able to keep a bunch of different cryptos in one place (that is not strictly an exchange) and to at some point be able to trade them back and forth, or into fiat. I think it's trying to be a glorified shapeshifter, among other things. |
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Informative article about payservices. I'm going to seriously look into this. Here's another interesting one. Calling the research a "study" is a bit of a stretch. I mean, it's barely a pilot study, as they only interviewed 20 people. But the interesting initial finding is that non Bitcoin users feel that they can't use Bitcoin because they don't understand the technical aspects of how it works--feel they need more technical knowledge than they have in order to use it. The truth is you can use Bitcoin without a complete understanding of the underlying technology (or even a completely wrong understanding). This is true for any kind of currency, and I think an important point to get across when the time comes to promote for wide mainstream adoption. Oddly enough, that was the goal of GAW Miners with their "mining platform," hashlets, and later Paycoin. Unfortunately for various reasons that did not work out. But anyway, it's an important point to communicate with the public that technical knowledge, while interesting and helpful in certain circumstances, is not necessary for basic use. It's not too much different with fiat currency. How many of us use fiat everyday and yet do not understand the inner workings of the Federal Reserve? Also, wallets have to work and not require constant updates, downloading of block chains, etc., or the public won't use them. Some altcoins have this problem. As long as there is a full service online alternative, then the techies can play with the QT (or equivalent) wallets as desired. http://www.coindesk.com/study-misconceptions-bitcoin-ease-use/ |
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