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Author Topic: IOTA  (Read 591372 times)
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nexern
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November 26, 2015, 04:46:58 PM
 #841

quantum resistance isn't needed for a service like this. the goal here is a different one.

I disagree, if messages will be decrypted in 10 years then you can't use such service for some confidential communications.

so it's better to skip very usefull things due to 0.1% uncertainty?
nonsens, this argument is very crypto centric and economical also unwise.

ethereum for instance is great and i have to admit that these guys are very good in reaching the external
market but for real nano payments ethereum fees are to expensive. iota could shine here but for this it is
necessary to throw the 100% claim on everything over board.

it's much more simple. things has to work for it's usage scenario. they don't have to be perfect.
this 100% claim is a weak point within the whole cryptosphere and prevents mass market adaption.

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November 26, 2015, 04:50:13 PM
 #842

quantum resistance isn't needed for a service like this. the goal here is a different one.

I disagree, if messages will be decrypted in 10 years then you can't use such service for some confidential communications.

Same here, if you don't want a message to be decrypted by someone else now, why would you take the risk that someone decrypt it in 1, 2, 5 or 10 years ?

a service like this isn't designed for confidential communication, same as e.g whatsapp. it just need todo the job for what it is designed for.
if you need quantum resistant communication create a tool, doing exactly this. different pairs of shoes.

Added:
just some mental gym, would IOTA benefit if e.g. whatsapp would decide tomorrow to include an IOTA payment gateway for microservices?
would this spread the usage of IOTA and increase outside awareness? what would be the disadvantage?

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November 26, 2015, 05:22:48 PM
 #843

so it's better to skip very usefull things due to 0.1% uncertainty?
nonsens, this argument is very crypto centric and economical also unwise.

I think nexern brought out a very important issue for all cryptos here. That is how a crypto reach out the business and industry instead of waiting for the business and industry to reach to the crypto. There are many hurdles between these two worlds. Egos and business expertise are among them.

Crypto devs/experts have lots of egos among themselves. They tend to think the business and industry have to come to us because we are better. It could be true eventually. But when they eventually come to cyrptos, they may not come to your cryptos. They will do whatever can maximize their profit because it is their ultimate goal and motivation. What is driving them is not the ideology

I think business expertise is the second biggest hurdle. Business is another area of study and it needs equal talents to be good at this area. Usually the experts in the crypto world lack this kind business expertise. Whoever master both or a team with both skills will create great business and enterprise as we can see in the history.
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November 26, 2015, 05:27:31 PM
 #844

so it's better to skip very usefull things due to 0.1% uncertainty?
nonsens, this argument is very crypto centric and economical also unwise.

ethereum for instance is great and i have to admit that these guys are very good in reaching the external
market but for real nano payments ethereum fees are to expensive. iota could shine here but for this it is
necessary to throw the 100% claim on everything over board.

it's much more simple. things has to work for it's usage scenario. they don't have to be perfect.
this 100% claim is a weak point within the whole cryptosphere and prevents mass market adaption.

I think it all depends on what market is targetted. I'll create a 100% QC-proof solution, someone could adapt it for "casual" markets.
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November 26, 2015, 06:11:39 PM
 #845


100% is an illusion, nothing is 100% if your resolution is high enough.
an asymptotically nearing, granted but mother nature shows us every day,
that 'good enough to work' is sufficient and probably also the optimum
to run everything.

however, would be nice to see something like the com-wallet hybrid
i mentioned before.

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November 26, 2015, 06:28:50 PM
 #846

100% is an illusion

I disagree. One-time pad seeded with message digest gives 100% unbreakable encryption.
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November 26, 2015, 06:56:15 PM
 #847

100% is an illusion

I disagree. One-time pad seeded with message digest gives 100% unbreakable encryption.

disagree, you can't exclude an alien/meta-math come in existence anytime, able to break even your 'current here and now knowledge level'.
even with close to zero probability you can't give a serious 100% this happen never guarantee. here you have your 100% again.

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November 26, 2015, 07:15:49 PM
 #848

 
Alright, let's get back to brainstorming.
So far we have :
 - encrypted email
 - encrypted message
 - storage
 - nano payment

What about decentralized social networking ? Decentralized identity ?


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November 26, 2015, 07:17:41 PM
 #849


Alright, let's get back to brainstorming.
So far we have :
 - encrypted email
 - encrypted message
 - storage
 - nano payment

What about decentralized social networking ? Decentralized identity ?


No need to just focus on the decentral and encrypted nature, pay per second streaming is another really good potential

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November 26, 2015, 07:23:34 PM
 #850


Alright, let's get back to brainstorming.
So far we have :
 - encrypted email
 - encrypted message
 - storage
 - nano payment

What about decentralized social networking ? Decentralized identity ?


Synereo?

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November 26, 2015, 07:41:15 PM
 #851

disagree, you can't exclude an alien/meta-math come in existence anytime, able to break even your 'current here and now knowledge level'.
even with close to zero probability you can't give a serious 100% this happen never guarantee. here you have your 100% again.

I doubt aliens can hack anything that is mathematically proven to be 100% secure. Math is universal.
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November 26, 2015, 07:43:37 PM
 #852

disagree, you can't exclude an alien/meta-math come in existence anytime, able to break even your 'current here and now knowledge level'.
even with close to zero probability you can't give a serious 100% this happen never guarantee. here you have your 100% again.
I doubt aliens can hack anything that is mathematically proven to be 100% secure. Math is universal.

The universe is not ruled (only) by Maths.
We would know everything otherwise.


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November 26, 2015, 07:49:12 PM
 #853

The universe is not ruled (only) by Maths.
We would know everything otherwise.

I'm not going to start a religious dispute now. Smiley
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November 26, 2015, 07:55:33 PM
 #854

The universe is not ruled (only) by Maths.
We would know everything otherwise.

I'm not going to start a religious dispute now. Smiley

Math may be universal but without a unified theory we do not have the correct math. Wink

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November 26, 2015, 08:01:35 PM
 #855

This will quickly descend into a debate of Platonism vs its alternatives. If you are a strong platonist supporter I recommend 'Our Mathematical Universe' (2014) by Max Tegmark. Gets really trippy really fast.

But let's stay on topic of IOTA in here Smiley

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November 26, 2015, 08:01:58 PM
 #856

disagree, you can't exclude an alien/meta-math come in existence anytime, able to break even your 'current here and now knowledge level'.
even with close to zero probability you can't give a serious 100% this happen never guarantee. here you have your 100% again.

I doubt aliens can hack anything that is mathematically proven to be 100% secure. Math is universal.

no aliens needed here. but it is always good we have at least 'something' we can rely on even if it's just a snapshot i guess.
meanwhile quantum eraser experiments tells us we shouldn't rely to much on this so i will put this phrase into the 'hope dies last' box.

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November 26, 2015, 08:03:01 PM
 #857

Math may be universal but without a unified theory we do not have the correct math. Wink

We were talking about 100% in some variant of math. In that math it's exactly 100%. If you use another math then "100%" claim doesn't make sense in it.
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November 26, 2015, 08:14:14 PM
 #858

This will quickly descend into a debate of Platonism vs its alternatives. If you are a strong platonist supporter I recommend 'Our Mathematical Universe' (2014) by Max Tegmark. Gets really trippy really fast.

But let's stay on topic of IOTA in here Smiley

harhar, i guess your hackles lining up atm if you read all this crypto/meta nonsense and you are right.
IOTA has promising capabilities, i recommend to shift your app/usage ideas a little into the commercial,
mass market direction, ofc only if you intend to reach out for this segment.

i think also that storage related apps and e-governing/prediction market as tobo mentioned are great areas
but this needs more informations about IOTAs storage handling/strategies.

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November 26, 2015, 09:35:30 PM
 #859

Those who use Android, post your screen resolution, please.
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November 26, 2015, 10:31:16 PM
 #860

Those who use Android, post your screen resolution, please.

480x854 Smiley
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