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Author Topic: Obyte: Totally new consensus algorithm + private untraceable payments  (Read 1169327 times)
spark.bet
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January 12, 2017, 11:38:30 AM
 #3381


Is there a reason for the  specific number 2.1111 blackbyte for 1 byteball?
Why not just 2 for 1.

I think this is because of the denominators. Byteballs can be spent at any amount, not blackbytes. Blackbytes are like money, you can spend only use these denominators:

{denomination: 1, count_coins: 10,000,000,000},
{denomination: 2, count_coins: 20,000,000,000},
{denomination: 5, count_coins: 10,000,000,000},
{denomination: 10, count_coins: 10,000,000,000},
{denomination: 20, count_coins: 20,000,000,000},
{denomination: 50, count_coins: 10,000,000,000},
{denomination: 100, count_coins: 10,000,000,000},
{denomination: 200, count_coins: 20,000,000,000},
{denomination: 500, count_coins: 10,000,000,000},
{denomination: 1000, count_coins: 10,000,000,000},
{denomination: 2000, count_coins: 20,000,000,000},
{denomination: 5000, count_coins: 10,000,000,000},
{denomination: 10000, count_coins: 10,000,000,000},
{denomination: 20000, count_coins: 20,000,000,000},
{denomination: 50000, count_coins: 10,000,000,000},
{denomination: 100000, count_coins: 10,000,000,000}

That's how 2.111x10^15 come from.
Thank you in addition I was not aware for the denominators
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SatoNatomato
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January 12, 2017, 11:56:41 AM
 #3382

If the user waits that the transaction is final, he cannot be defrauded.
In your example, you isolate the merchant from the real network and feed him with a fake branch.  The merchant will accept your units and add them to his version of the DAG, but since there are no witness-authored units on your branch, it will not move the stability point forward and your double-spent payment will stay unconfirmed for as long as your attack continues.  Number of nodes is totally irrelevant, it is the presence of witnesses what makes a branch real.

Great, I hope now SatoNatomato sees why IOTA couldn't use the same method of peer discovery.
I hope you now see how Iota is fail. It doesnt even have Sybil-defense without resorting to slack-channels, despite the PoW employed which Byteball doesnt need, and Iota expected to be used on IoT devices? Okay!

Iota - Just another pump and dump ICO coin to enrich the founders - which is why you like spreading FUD on something which actually works, and which actually can be used on IoT devices.
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January 12, 2017, 12:52:38 PM
 #3383

I can't wait to have the buying chat bot on the mainnet: it seems to me a really good achievement tonych! Also I'd add that we all wait to know when the next linking phase will take place.

I am not interested in preserving the status quo; I want to overthrow it. Niccolò Machiavelli
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January 12, 2017, 01:12:45 PM
 #3384

CryptKeeper, are you and how much are you getting paid to run this thread? Are there other people on "the team" getting compensated? Where's the money coming to pay people, presuming people are getting paid?

I'm not getting paid for this. Cheesy  I'm doing this because I'm interested in this new technology and want to help building a community around it!

And it's fun!!!  Grin


(I know that Tony paid some bounties out of his own pocket for translators but I think it's up to him to answer that)

Follow me on twitter for the latest news on bitcoin and altcoins and I'll follow you back the same day!
Obyte - An open cryptocurrency platform ready for real world adoption
SatoNatomato
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January 12, 2017, 01:34:57 PM
 #3385

If the user waits that the transaction is final, he cannot be defrauded.
In your example, you isolate the merchant from the real network and feed him with a fake branch.  The merchant will accept your units and add them to his version of the DAG, but since there are no witness-authored units on your branch, it will not move the stability point forward and your double-spent payment will stay unconfirmed for as long as your attack continues.  Number of nodes is totally irrelevant, it is the presence of witnesses what makes a branch real.

Great, I hope now SatoNatomato sees why IOTA couldn't use the same method of peer discovery.
I now hope you understand Iotas Proof-of-Work is useless as it doesnt prevent against Sybils and is only wasting precious CPU cycles on small IoT devices.  And that Iota is decentralized, but not trustless. Roll Eyes You sire are a scammer and a censoring scoundrel.
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January 12, 2017, 03:05:52 PM
Last edit: January 12, 2017, 03:17:48 PM by CryptInvest
 #3386

Vote for add BYTEBALL on NovaExchange! Voting allowed the owner of any nova exchange account, you can cast your vote one time per day!

https://novaexchange.com/addcoin/

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January 12, 2017, 05:21:31 PM
 #3387

I have a question I linked one of my btc add to the byteball android app than I linked my other one to the linux wallet how long does it take for them two show up on http://transition.byteball.org/  thanks
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January 12, 2017, 06:42:24 PM
 #3388

I have a question I linked one of my btc add to the byteball android app than I linked my other one to the linux wallet how long does it take for them two show up on http://transition.byteball.org/  thanks

Currently, that page is frozen with the balances and linked addresses used for the first round, so for now it is not getting updated. I think it might be the time to unfreeze it and/or maybe keep that state in a separate page: transition.byteball.org/firstround.html for instance, and update the main page with the current links.

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January 12, 2017, 09:22:13 PM
Last edit: January 12, 2017, 09:33:39 PM by drays
 #3389

CryptKeeper, are you and how much are you getting paid to run this thread? Are there other people on "the team" getting compensated? Where's the money coming to pay people, presuming people are getting paid?

Cryptkeeper is just a nice guy and community member, that did this purely out of altruistic reasons.
To be honest, me supporting Byteball also without small financial benefit (during the distribution I have had 3.5 BTC, really not a Byteball whale at all).
But I like Tony and I’m really impressed what he was able the achieve in such a short timeframe. Especially I focus always at new technology and the DAG can be the revolution of Cryptocurrency. It's in my view really a new generation, the third one.

There is at the moment no money at the table. Just the value of the Byteball we have received through the distribution can be lifted.


Yeah, compared to the Sonstebo of IOTA, tonych is a real angel Cool
All of the tech differences aside, I guess that is the actual biggest difference between IOTA and Byteball Grin

So much people are turned off from IOTA because of the leadership problem.
Friendly and truly competent Dev is a great asset of a project, which itself could attract people, and create big and friendly community.

... this space is not for rent ...
zanzibar
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January 12, 2017, 09:34:41 PM
 #3390

All of the tech differences aside, I guess that is the actual biggest difference between IOTA and Byteball Grin

wat? Byteball is cool (I own quite a bit of both) but Iota is really far along with corporate interest, Foundation (funds), exchanges, etc.. Byteball is great but has a long way to go to catch up to Iota on the real world front.
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January 12, 2017, 09:41:25 PM
 #3391

Sorry if this sounds lame (I admit I didn't read the whole whitepaper Grin), but is there any way to see in block explorer or anywhere else, the date/time when a transaction is actually made!?  Huh

Look in the wallet at the "History" tab, then click on a tx to see the details.

Ok, thanks. But I meant the transactions made by others (not from/to my wallet) Smiley
Is there any way to see the timestamps on them?

There are no timestamps in Byteball protocol, they are just not needed.  That's why there are no reliable timestamps.  The ones you see in History tab are the times and dates when your wallet first learnt about the transaction (or, if you are on light wallet, when the light vendor first learnt about the tx).

This is what I actually supposed. Thanks for confirming that, tonich!
But don't you think such timestamps could be useful for some of the applications of Byteball? I understand they are not needed by protocol, but it could be useful to add them as an comment or "additional info", so it could be easier to trace transactions or analyze the chain. Simple example - I was trying to see when an amount was transferred to some address (some minutes ago or few days ago), and I found no way of using that! This is great for making things more obscure, but I suppose that is not something we want to achieve with Byteball...?

... this space is not for rent ...
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January 12, 2017, 09:44:48 PM
 #3392

All of the tech differences aside, I guess that is the actual biggest difference between IOTA and Byteball Grin

wat? Byteball is cool (I own quite a bit of both) but Iota is really far along with corporate interest, Foundation (funds), exchanges, etc.. Byteball is great but has a long way to go to catch up to Iota on the real world front.

Thats right, IOTA is much ahead of Byteball in terms of adoption. But then, IOTA had more than a year to do that, right?
Ok, I agree that is one more big difference Smiley

But I am sure with bright and positive leader who doesn't put people off, Byteball has bigger chances to catch up this year. Though they are not competitors anyway.

... this space is not for rent ...
zanzibar
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January 12, 2017, 09:47:45 PM
 #3393

All of the tech differences aside, I guess that is the actual biggest difference between IOTA and Byteball Grin

wat? Byteball is cool (I own quite a bit of both) but Iota is really far along with corporate interest, Foundation (funds), exchanges, etc.. Byteball is great but has a long way to go to catch up to Iota on the real world front.

Thats right, IOTA is much ahead of Byteball in terms of adoption. But then, IOTA had more than a year to do that, right?
Ok, I agree that is one more big difference Smiley

But I am sure with bright and positive leader who doesn't put people off, Byteball has bigger chances to catch up this year. Though they are not competitors anyway.

Yes, I really like Byteball so far, I also think it has a bright future, the community still needs to do it's part to help adoption.
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January 12, 2017, 09:50:38 PM
 #3394

I have a question I linked one of my btc add to the byteball android app than I linked my other one to the linux wallet how long does it take for them two show up on http://transition.byteball.org/  thanks

Currently, that page is frozen with the balances and linked addresses used for the first round, so for now it is not getting updated. I think it might be the time to unfreeze it and/or maybe keep that state in a separate page: transition.byteball.org/firstround.html for instance, and update the main page with the current links.

yes please allow this to update real-time ...

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January 12, 2017, 10:19:45 PM
 #3395

All of the tech differences aside, I guess that is the actual biggest difference between IOTA and Byteball Grin

wat? Byteball is cool (I own quite a bit of both) but Iota is really far along with corporate interest, Foundation (funds), exchanges, etc.. Byteball is great but has a long way to go to catch up to Iota on the real world front.

Thats right, IOTA is much ahead of Byteball in terms of adoption. But then, IOTA had more than a year to do that, right?
Ok, I agree that is one more big difference Smiley

But I am sure with bright and positive leader who doesn't put people off, Byteball has bigger chances to catch up this year. Though they are not competitors anyway.
They could be competitors, I see no good reason why we couldnt port Byteball to ESP8266 or ESP32, there are module versions of that thing with more than 16MB flash - enough to hold a light wallet and some data. There is already a Javascript firmware for it called Espruino. ESP8266 is anyway the king of IoT, with WiFi, esp32 has bluetooth (is also dual-core), and can do TLS. All in that chip for price of $2 its amazing.

Byteball would blow Iota out of the water on that thing - since it doesnt have PoW to waste precious cycles and battery on - an esp8266 could run for months on two AA batteries, waking up every few minutes to send-transaction and deliver sensor data, or both as part of a byteball smart transaction. All from a wifi-enabled chip smaller than your thumb.

Maybe this is why Iota leadership is so horny on censoring and deleting my posts.
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January 13, 2017, 12:29:55 AM
 #3396

All of the tech differences aside, I guess that is the actual biggest difference between IOTA and Byteball Grin

wat? Byteball is cool (I own quite a bit of both) but Iota is really far along with corporate interest, Foundation (funds), exchanges, etc.. Byteball is great but has a long way to go to catch up to Iota on the real world front.

Thats right, IOTA is much ahead of Byteball in terms of adoption. But then, IOTA had more than a year to do that, right?
Ok, I agree that is one more big difference Smiley

But I am sure with bright and positive leader who doesn't put people off, Byteball has bigger chances to catch up this year. Though they are not competitors anyway.
They could be competitors, I see no good reason why we couldnt port Byteball to ESP8266 or ESP32, there are module versions of that thing with more than 16MB flash - enough to hold a light wallet and some data. There is already a Javascript firmware for it called Espruino. ESP8266 is anyway the king of IoT, with WiFi, esp32 has bluetooth (is also dual-core), and can do TLS. All in that chip for price of $2 its amazing.

Byteball would blow Iota out of the water on that thing - since it doesnt have PoW to waste precious cycles and battery on - an esp8266 could run for months on two AA batteries, waking up every few minutes to send-transaction and deliver sensor data, or both as part of a byteball smart transaction. All from a wifi-enabled chip smaller than your thumb.

Maybe this is why Iota leadership is so horny on censoring and deleting my posts.

I think they are deleting your posts just because they are more interested in their project, not in Byteball. It is not really welcome to hijack some other project discussion threads, and aggressively promote third-party project, while bashing their own one. Their reaction is pretty normal. Don't you think so? Smiley

IOTA has some great community members, and few great developers, they are doing their thing and doing it well. First of all, they do the adoption thing, promotion, find good advisors and create real-world connections. That alone gives that project a great value.

Even if (note the if) Byteball is superior in many aspects, IOTA has a lot on the table, it is not going to be replaced with Byteball, and would be wise not to try to attack them without any need Smiley

If your plan is to attract people from IOTA community to work on Byteball, then probably you chose not the best tactics...


Back to the main topic. It sounds interesting.. Did you measure the performance of Byteball? What makes you belueve it is lightweight enough to be put on such a low-end microcontroller?

Actually this raises a good question: what is the min resource requirement to run Byteball wallet?
 (in terms of CPU power, RAM, Storage).

... this space is not for rent ...
FFI2013
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January 13, 2017, 12:47:26 AM
 #3397

I have a question I linked one of my btc add to the byteball android app than I linked my other one to the linux wallet how long does it take for them two show up on http://transition.byteball.org/  thanks

Currently, that page is frozen with the balances and linked addresses used for the first round, so for now it is not getting updated. I think it might be the time to unfreeze it and/or maybe keep that state in a separate page: transition.byteball.org/firstround.html for instance, and update the main page with the current links.
That would be good I was going crazy thinking it was just me thanks for the update
SatoNatomato
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January 13, 2017, 09:20:19 AM
 #3398

All of the tech differences aside, I guess that is the actual biggest difference between IOTA and Byteball Grin

wat? Byteball is cool (I own quite a bit of both) but Iota is really far along with corporate interest, Foundation (funds), exchanges, etc.. Byteball is great but has a long way to go to catch up to Iota on the real world front.

Thats right, IOTA is much ahead of Byteball in terms of adoption. But then, IOTA had more than a year to do that, right?
Ok, I agree that is one more big difference Smiley

But I am sure with bright and positive leader who doesn't put people off, Byteball has bigger chances to catch up this year. Though they are not competitors anyway.
They could be competitors, I see no good reason why we couldnt port Byteball to ESP8266 or ESP32, there are module versions of that thing with more than 16MB flash - enough to hold a light wallet and some data. There is already a Javascript firmware for it called Espruino. ESP8266 is anyway the king of IoT, with WiFi, esp32 has bluetooth (is also dual-core), and can do TLS. All in that chip for price of $2 its amazing.

Byteball would blow Iota out of the water on that thing - since it doesnt have PoW to waste precious cycles and battery on - an esp8266 could run for months on two AA batteries, waking up every few minutes to send-transaction and deliver sensor data, or both as part of a byteball smart transaction. All from a wifi-enabled chip smaller than your thumb.

Maybe this is why Iota leadership is so horny on censoring and deleting my posts.

I think they are deleting your posts just because they are more interested in their project, not in Byteball. It is not really welcome to hijack some other project discussion threads, and aggressively promote third-party project, while bashing their own one. Their reaction is pretty normal. Don't you think so? Smiley

IOTA has some great community members, and few great developers, they are doing their thing and doing it well. First of all, they do the adoption thing, promotion, find good advisors and create real-world connections. That alone gives that project a great value.

Even if (note the if) Byteball is superior in many aspects, IOTA has a lot on the table, it is not going to be replaced with Byteball, and would be wise not to try to attack them without any need Smiley

If your plan is to attract people from IOTA community to work on Byteball, then probably you chose not the best tactics...


Back to the main topic. It sounds interesting.. Did you measure the performance of Byteball? What makes you belueve it is lightweight enough to be put on such a low-end microcontroller?

Actually this raises a good question: what is the min resource requirement to run Byteball wallet?
 (in terms of CPU power, RAM, Storage).
Yeah, but its one thing to delete my posts where they are moderators in their own Iota thread. Another to delete my own threads.

And its okay to delete my posts if I was spamming, but merely questioning the value and technology behind Iota, comparing it to similar technology, the only other DAG-based coin, asking questions and then deleted is a bit too Stalin-like for my taste. They should be able to respond to any attempted bashing of their precious Iota, unless of course, they also realize its vaporware-shit and only has a good marketing campaign going for it right now.

BTW, my plan isnt to attract anyone to anything, my plan is to discuss and learn new things, and encourage others to learn and improve, and select the best technologies for scalable cryptocurrencies.

Anyway, back to topic. a full GUI wallet is using 38MB resident memory, so it looks good on that front to put it on a microcontroller.
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January 13, 2017, 10:37:30 AM
 #3399

I have a question I linked one of my btc add to the byteball android app than I linked my other one to the linux wallet how long does it take for them two show up on http://transition.byteball.org/  thanks

Currently, that page is frozen with the balances and linked addresses used for the first round, so for now it is not getting updated. I think it might be the time to unfreeze it and/or maybe keep that state in a separate page: transition.byteball.org/firstround.html for instance, and update the main page with the current links.

Thanks for the suggestion, now the transition page updates again, and the balances used in the 1st round are moved to transition.byteball.org/firstround.html.

Simplicity is beauty
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January 13, 2017, 11:10:50 AM
 #3400

This is very strong to understand for 2GB first round now i get 0.2 GB.
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