Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[600watt]

I wanted to check out if kncminer is legit... so i made these thoughts:

The Jupiter has 350GH/S and sells for $7000. Vat is included already and swedish vat is 25%. 25% of $7000 means $5250 is the real selling price because the rest doesnt belong to kncminer, it belongs to the state.

Asicminer claims that they can bring 1TH/s online for costs of $10k. The knc Jupiter has 350GH/s which would mean AM would pay $3500 for the same hashpower getting online. KNCMiner sells the same for $5250. Its not only a blade like with AM, its a complete miner. That means kncminer makes $1750 win only when getting $7000. And that is correct only if they can create a complete miner as cheap as Asicminer a bare erupter blade creates. And AM buys in huge quantities.

So they really sell the miner for so low surcharge? Where do they produce the asics and assemble them? Can it be as cheap as in china where AM produces?

Avalon is taking 101,24BTC for 85GH. That would mean 416BTC for 350GH/s. Or $52100. Avalon... kncminer takes only $7000($5250). Thats 10%.

Asicminer is selling 10GH/s Erupter blades for 50BTC. 1750BTC would that mean for 350GH/s. Or $218750. But kncminer throws its miner away for 2.4% of that?

Then... the avalon chips 10K are selling for 782,1BTC. Each has 282MH/s. Thats 2820GH/s for 10K chips. 350GH/s would mean 1242 Avalon Asic Chips. That would mean 97,14BTC price with avalon for chips having 350GH/s. Or $12142.5. KNCMiner takes for the same hashpower only less than the half price. And avalon is only selling the chips for that price, no miner included...

Im not sure what i should think about it... can kncminer really create miners for prices similar to Asicminer? And they practically throw it away for nothing while resellers could make a fortune with these miners? I tend to think thats a bit strange... i mean are they even more bitcoin friendly than avalon? And avalon is giving away their hashpower for low already... resellers make a fortune with their miners.

For me this doesnt add up at the moment. Any thoughts?

as far as i understood the pricing vat is not included.

if you can supply a vat number it will not be added.

[dan99]

with the changes in the initial offerings of products, how does one find out where exactly they are in the list of "pre-orders"?  before someone yells that there are no pre-orders since no money has been exchanged, thanks I am aware of that, I am just using the terminology used on the website.

Well you did get an order ID, which approximately tells you how many people have pre-ordered before you. The number is very seriously inflated since you don't need to pay anything, I'd go as far as saying that it could easily be 5-15 times more than what these people pre-ordering could actually buy. The order ID is also generic, so it includes all orders, even Mars units - basically all 3 miners they have on the website.
The issue is that if they actually start delivering, all the people who registered 20 pre-orders just because they could at the beginning are possibly going to try to transfer these - sell them. If KnCMiner somehow manages to prevent that, then that's great, but I don't see how they could do it without just starting from scratch on all orders all over again.

You have 10 posts and you want to judge how people run a business, it is always first come first serve, you are late so those who sign up earlier will sure get a head from you, that is how life works.

[Biomech]

I am essentially watching two companies right now. This is one of them, the other is Terrahash. KNC is doing it from scratch, which is likely to be a superiour product if they can pull it off. Terrahash is using Avalon chips and BKKcoins' Klondike design, which might get to market faster. If I had money, I'd pretty evenly divide my bets. As it stands, I have some people who are willing to invest when somebody has a viable product, so it'll be whoever gets there first. Which might be neither of the above, but they are the ones who seem the most likely candidates to me.

As to "post count", it's frankly an irrelevant metric. Having not been here long doesn't mean one is un/informed.

[sickpig]

as far as i understood the pricing vat is not included.

if you can supply a vat number it will not be added.

I've asked to Sam directly via email and I can confirm that
"[knc] list all prices without any taxes or delivery costs included"

[qiuness]

So when can we expect some progress report?
Maybe some pictures?

[dan99]

So when can we expect some progress report?
Maybe some pictures?

probably early next we may get to see some photos or videos

[ecliptic]

So if you are the 50th person to buy a mars, this gives you a 2000$ discount on a Jupiter, and you will be the 50th person to get a jupiter

Is this correct

When does mars go on sale

[stripykitteh]

So if you are the 50th person to buy a mars, this gives you a 2000$ discount on a Jupiter, and you will be the 50th person to get a jupiter

Is this correct

When does mars go on sale

If I understand the site, pre-orders for all 3 models are put in one big queue based on the time of order.

If you pay for your Mars you are entitled to order a Jupiter at $2K off, and it will be built for you in the same queue order as if you had ordered a Jupiter in the first place. So it all comes down to what position you are in the queue for all models, and how many people order Jupiters ahead of you (or convert their own Marses to Jupiters) and actually pay for their order (a high drop-out rate is expected, apparently). I'm #38xx so I don't expect to be in the first batch of Jupiters.

They have a beta-version of the Mars which will be displayed to interested customers in a few days, I believe. Not sure how long 'til they go on sale.

[Twh]

You have 10 posts

Are this sort of people common here? I haven't seen much of this before posting, but now out of the 3 posts I've made it's happened twice. I'm sure making 200 posts in offtopic would greatly increase my knowledge of bitcoins and make me eligible to voice my opinions. It's not as if this was some weird opinion either, a lot of people have said the same thing in this very thread, anyone could make ten thousand preorders just to sell the early ones if they are transferable.

They have a beta-version of the Mars which will be displayed to interested customers in a few days, I believe. Not sure how long 'til they go on sale.

They say on their site that it'd be around 2 months, but I guess that was written when the site went online. Potential delays included it'll probably be around June/July.

[bitpop]

You only have 11 posts.

[vvic]

Hooray! this thread SOOO reminds me of avalon thread back in november 2012... Same doubts, same mocking, same "THIS IS A SCAM" shouts
But seriously if these guys deliver, they will be community heroes and they will NOT lack of customers.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

Hooray! this thread SOOO reminds me of avalon thread back in november 2012... Same doubts, same mocking, same "THIS IS A SCAM" shouts
But seriously if these guys deliver, they will be community heroes and they will NOT lack of customers.

"53,063 bitcoins. 53,064 bitcoins. 53,065..."

"Sonny. KNC might be real!"

"...bitcoins. 53... Damn, you made me lose count, Josh."

"Sorry Sonny. I meant I'm sorry, Sonny"

"Now, I gotta start all over again. 1 bitcoin for me. 2 bitcoins for me. 3..."

[600watt]

You only have 11 posts.

so we know what racism is and we know what sexism is. not very man people know what classism is.

what you are doing is postism....   

[bitpop]

Lmao caste 240, kneel beneath me!

[600watt]

Lmao caste 240, kneel beneath me!

i will catch up. rather.

[Bitcoinorama]

In answer to the VAT, 600w is indeed correct, I emailed as I was under the impression originally it was inclusive;

"Our site is a available from all the countries in the world. We list all our prices in USD without any taxes or Dilevery included for those reasons.

All taxes and dilevery costs are calculated  at the point of checkout."

So unless you can claim it back, it's just become more expensive if anticipated an inclusive price.

Mars = $3,493.75
Saturn = $4,743.75
Jupiter = $8,743.75

[dhenson]

In answer to the VAT, 600w is indeed correct, I emailed as I was under the impression originally it was inclusive;

"Our site is a available from all the countries in the world. We list all our prices in USD without any taxes or Dilevery included for those reasons.

All taxes and dilevery costs are calculated  at the point of checkout."

So unless you can claim it back, it's just become more expensive if anticipated an inclusive price.

Mars = $3,493.75
Saturn = $4,743.75
Jupiter = $8,743.75

I was under the impression that VAT didn't apply if the product was being shipped out of the EU?  Was that totally wrong?  (I'm in the US)

[SebastianJu]

In answer to the VAT, 600w is indeed correct, I emailed as I was under the impression originally it was inclusive;

"Our site is a available from all the countries in the world. We list all our prices in USD without any taxes or Dilevery included for those reasons.

All taxes and dilevery costs are calculated  at the point of checkout."

So unless you can claim it back, it's just become more expensive if anticipated an inclusive price.

Mars = $3,493.75
Saturn = $4,743.75
Jupiter = $8,743.75

I was under the impression that VAT didn't apply if the product was being shipped out of the EU?  Was that totally wrong?  (I'm in the US)

I believe youre right and thats why they didnt include the vat in the price... though i wonder... in germany its so that you have to include the vat, otherwise you go against the law. I thought it goes the same way in sweden too.

[sickpig]

In answer to the VAT, 600w is indeed correct, I emailed as I was under the impression originally it was inclusive;

"Our site is a available from all the countries in the world. We list all our prices in USD without any taxes or Dilevery included for those reasons.

All taxes and dilevery costs are calculated  at the point of checkout."

So unless you can claim it back, it's just become more expensive if anticipated an inclusive price.

Mars = $3,493.75
Saturn = $4,743.75
Jupiter = $8,743.75

I was under the impression that VAT didn't apply if the product was being shipped out of the EU?  Was that totally wrong?  (I'm in the US)

From Sam reply to my question:

All taxes and dilevery costs are different depending on where in the world you are.  For those reasons we list all prices without any taxes or dilevert costs included.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

In answer to the VAT, 600w is indeed correct, I emailed as I was under the impression originally it was inclusive;

"Our site is a available from all the countries in the world. We list all our prices in USD without any taxes or Dilevery included for those reasons.

All taxes and dilevery costs are calculated  at the point of checkout."

So unless you can claim it back, it's just become more expensive if anticipated an inclusive price.

Mars = $3,493.75
Saturn = $4,743.75
Jupiter = $8,743.75

I was under the impression that VAT didn't apply if the product was being shipped out of the EU?  Was that totally wrong?  (I'm in the US)

I was under the impression that Sam, being from the UK, wouldn't misspell the word delivery--TWICE!