Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[wpalczynski]

That is a great analogy of crypto currencies. +1

http://news.stanford.edu/news/2014/february/bitcoin-athey-srinivasan-021814.html


in case you just need some solid academic approval of bitcoin.

g r e a t  interview. don´t miss it.

If the Internet was programmable communication, Bitcoin is programmable money. The analogy is actually a very good one. Before the Internet, in order to deploy a program that used the central communications network, you needed a deal with a network operator like AT&T. With the Internet, individual nodes could write programs to directly communicate with each other, without any central approval required.

In the same way, today, in order to deploy a program that uses the central financial network, you need a deal with a large bank or credit card company. With Bitcoin, individual nodes can write programs to directly send and receive money from each other, without any central approval required.

 

Reposted. Everybody needs to read this.

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[aminorex]

...nonsense...

You should realize that the same can be said of fiat.  Unlike fiat, bitcoin is not designed to rob you.  It is designed to preserve and protect your savings.  When you start to expend a proportionately larger effort in denouncing the ponzi scheme which is fiat, then I will no longer consider you a delusional hypocrite.

You want to protect your countrymen from exploitation?  Convince them to stop using fiat.  But no, instead you are cutting off their only practical avenue of escape from slavery.  That is a despicable treason.

[wpalczynski]

Yup.  Jorge is definitely a HODLER.  Must be a late arrival and needs to average down his DCA.

Cheers!!

PS. For those who insist in knowing my negative views, here is the link to that "parable": http://www.ic.unicamp.br/~stolfi/bitcoin/2014-02-17-HowToMakeSomeEasyMoney.html

[schizoid]

As a rough guess, people who invested in bitcoin must have already poured around a billion dollars into the market, even discounting what they took out. How much of that went to the miners?

And how much of the billions spent on Apple stock went to Apple?

Yes, but when a long-term investor sells his stock to another, he is simply transferring the credit of the loan (and any future dividend and appreciations) to him.  So it is as if the initial loan was made by both of them, and they split the profits and risks in a particular way.

How is this different from bitcoin?

Customers buying bitcoins just to make payments are not "buybacks by the network".  They are like day traders who are forced to buy some stock but do not expect to make profit.  Again, they are just the ultimate new investors that bring their wealth (money or goods) into the system, which is used to pay the profits of earlier entrants; and who will get that wealth back only by selling their bitcoins to someone else who will have to put the same amount of wealth in.  Do I need to I tell you how they would fit into my "parable"?

People who buy bitcoins to make payments are not investors. They're just users of the service. They're not looking for profits.

[aminorex]

in basic physics you learn that you cannot create mass, charge, or energy by smartly moving those things around.

yet in fractional reserve banking fiat is created in this way.  bitcoin does not allow that.

[ChrisML]

Jesus, such long ass posts.

Do some people on here actually work and sleep? Like Jorge, that man writes books.
Enough with the dramatic theory's, worse case scenarios and bible talks about this all.


Makes my head spin.

[kehtolo]

Jesus, such long ass posts.

Do some people on here actually work and sleep? Like Jorge, that man writes books.
Enough with the dramatic theory's, worse case scenarios and bible talks about this all.


Makes my head spin.

Ok.. CCMF.. better now??

[schizoid]

To me it looks like you treat bitcoins as some abstract paper bill with no use at all except for speculation

Yup, this is Jorge's problem. He seems to think that no one does anything with bitcoin other than buy and sell it on exchanges.

[F-bernanke]

...nonsense...

You should realize that the same can be said of fiat.  Unlike fiat, bitcoin is not designed to rob you.

Let me inject this little Rothschild quote in here to underline that statement:

"Give me the control of the credit of a nation, and I care  not who makes the laws." The famous boastful statement of  Nathaniel Meyer Rothschild, speaking to a group of  international bankers, 1912: "The few who could understand  the system (cheque, money, credits) will either be so  interested in its profits, or so dependent on its favours,  that there will be no opposition from that class, while on  the other hand, the great body of people, mentally  incapable of comprehending the tremendous advantage that  capital derives from the system, will bear its burdens  without complaint, and perhaps without even suspecting that  the system is inimical to their interests." The boastful  statement by Rothschild Bros. of London.

THIS, is why I invest in Bitcoin, I don't care if I loose a little money, I stand for my principles.

[Hypnoise]

well actually, if gox's finances in really bad shape, as gambling lady suggested (and it is seems very much so). then everything make a sense. Lock down btc withdrawals, buy btc at low rate, restore btc rate and sale it off books to private party. so what a problem, it is free world isnt it.

[JorgeStolfi]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PszMaZ5Ipk

[Richy_T]

Often I see here complaints about orders suddenly appearing from nowhere in order books, or statements like "there are only XXX coins left to {buy|sell} on exchange YYY".

The books at the larger sites must be huge (millions of entries perhaps), and each chart site in the world requests that data every few seconds.

Correct me if I am wrong, but those exchanges surely must truncate their answers, delivering only the first N (say, 2000) bids and asks in their order books.  

Gox does, Stamp doesn't (Though I believe a full dataset is available from Gox but on a restricted timetable). If you look back at Chartbuddy (which you can't cause I now delete old images), the Gox charts would look "hairy" due to their truncation algorithm whereas for Stamp, I had to do the truncation myself so I could give it a nice, neat haircut.

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[ShroomsKit_Disgrace]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PszMaZ5Ipk

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic.

 

So now, we can come back to "Magic: The Gathering Online eXchange"

[JorgeStolfi]

You should realize that the same can be said of fiat.  [ ... ] When you start to expend a proportionately larger effort in denouncing the ponzi scheme which is fiat,

I hate banks and I am aware that the world's financial system is a humongous runaway Ponzi scheme (in the strict sense of the word).  You will find that among my tweets.

But I do not see how cryptocoins will save us from it.  They too are fiat money, or rather wannabe fiat money for now. Since one cannot prevent new coins from being started, they will be inflationary too.  New cryptos will be created for the same reason that governments print more money and banks fabricate credit withou assets: because it makes the creator richer at the expense of the users.

And "selling" bitcoin as a safe hedge against inflation, at the present time, makes no sense at all. 

[KeyserSoze]

Having looked at Jorge's profile and his comments he seems to have been a supporter and early adopter of the internet: you know you are allowed to be sceptical about something without it making you a bad person or even a 'troll'.

He probably thinks he is a good person, and I'm sure some others think it as well. He seems polite enough. From his viewpoint he's doing a nice thing, trying to save the world from losing our shirts in this "ponzi." But I already have one mom, thanks.

I can't say I care for his gleefully typing smiley emoticons pointed at investors who are underwater. I don't think his demeanor while posting here has been the same as on Twitter which makes me wonder if he thought he was concealing his disdain.

[600watt]

ok, there is trolls and there is academic trolls.  

[kehtolo]

Then just HODL...

[JorgeStolfi]

Gox does, Stamp doesn't (Though I believe a full dataset is available from Gox but on a restricted timetable).

Thanks!

[lemonte]

ok, there is trolls and there is academic trolls.