Off-Topic

[atomicchaos]

I don't need any broken english pointed out. He's upset that Terrahash hasn't responded to a PM asking about how they got the <1% HW resolved.
I'm sure a lot of people are interested, it doesn't mean it didn't happen because they didn't answer a PM LOL relax, you are trying way too hard.

Meanwhile the grownups are having a conversation that would actually help the customers of Terrahash unlike you who doesn't care about any customer of Terrahash and only wants revenge on Terrahash for some unknown reason, but again it isn't for the well-being of Terrahash Customers that is for damn sure.

Baghdad Bob, I think it's going to stick.

[massnerder]

Avalon ASIC
Now accepting refunds from any and all order dates
Due to delays we are now offering full refund in bitcoin for all the Avalon Generation One orders made on any date, It is advise for people to request refunds due to the delay and raise of bitcoin difficulty.

The update refund form can be found on the main store site, linked here.
Due to phishing attempts and spam, any refund request not made containing the original order email and phone number will be automatically rejected by the system and marked as spam, so please bear this in mind.

Avalon Generation Two Chips 55nm
Those who have invested in time and money on Avalon Generation One based devices and clones can rejoice in the fact we had the foresight to make Avalon Generation Two chips completely backward compatible in every way with 110nm generation one chips, which can be expect to go on sale Late October 2013 for immediate shipping. Avalon will no longer participate in any kind of pre-ordering.

Developers and Hobbyists should keep an close eye on our github account as we will be releasing the 55nm chip specification and reference design soon!

Copyright © 2013 BitSyncom LLC, All rights reserved.
You are receiving this email because you have expressed interests in the Avalon ASIC Bitcoin Miner

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At this point Terrahash, it might be better to ask for a full refund for your Avalon chips and extend the offer to Avalon Gen 2 as you can use roughly the same parts you have in stock.

sounds as perfect solution for me

What's funny is new information like this is coming out day after day, it's no wonder Terrahash doesn't want to say anything as what they say could change with the slightest bit of new information coming out and then all the FUDsters would go crazy on them some more.

However I do think that holding out to the Avalon Gen 2 would be a great idea for customers and Terrahash.

Sure Avalon sucks for doing this but honestly they are giving EVERYONE the opportunity to refund in full from them. What other Chip Developer would ever do that? I would buy Gen 2 from them if it was "immediate delivery" as they suggest.

Agreed.  I can hold out for a chip update on my order.

Yes, this a hundred times lol ...  If we could get the same hardware with gen2 chips instead of our original gen1 orders it would be totally worth the wait for us and would also give TH some major reputation points, which they need right now.  

[Bitoy]

Regarding the project as a whole. Since Yifu is offering chip refunds now, we can go that route. But as you know, chips were only about 50-60% cost in our operation, that is all we would be able to refund everyone.

Another option is to get a refund now, and buy the Gen 2 chips in October. Yifu has announced that the Gen 2 chips will be fully compatible with Gen 1. So, we would be able to use the current boards, heat sinks, cases and most (if not all) of the components. And everyone will get about 8-10 times more hashing power for same price. (This is just an estimate, we will get more details once he releases the specs.) And we'll get another month and a half to sort out the issues with the current design. Instead of depending upon BkkCoins this time, we will hire people here to build upon and improve his design. We will open source everything we do.

+1.   If the additional hashing power is 8 x, 2 months time waiting for gen 2 will be ok. 

[kkooks]

Regarding the project as a whole. Since Yifu is offering chip refunds now, we can go that route. But as you know, chips were only about 50-60% cost in our operation, that is all we would be able to refund everyone.

Another option is to get a refund now, and buy the Gen 2 chips in October. Yifu has announced that the Gen 2 chips will be fully compatible with Gen 1. So, we would be able to use the current boards, heat sinks, cases and most (if not all) of the components. And everyone will get about 8-10 times more hashing power for same price. (This is just an estimate, we will get more details once he releases the specs.) And we'll get another month and a half to sort out the issues with the current design. Instead of depending upon BkkCoins this time, we will hire people here to build upon and improve his design. We will open source everything we do.

I vote wholeheartedly on Refunding and getting Gen 2 Chips, however you guys REALLY REALLY REALLY need to open/answer all of your lines of communication. It is unacceptable that so many emails/tickets/phone calls have gone unanswered.

I also think the open sourcing of the project is a great step to rebuilding your relationship back with the community. If this is the route that is taken, please allow for overclocking room in your design revisions.

I still have faith in you Terrahash and so do others as you can see in this thread, but you have given yourselves a black-eye with your lack of customer service. Thankfully this can be remedied easily with some effort

I can promise, we will be more open and be better with customer service this time!

okay lets show us the k16 as promised? 3 weeks ago?

[Axion_Zen]

I would prefer you just get your chips and send out our boards, I do not want to deal with any avalon bs at all, ill take a loss or resell on ebay to break even, just to not deal with this for another 3 months. and I HIGHLY doubt we will be getting 8-10x hashing power at same price point.

[fire5]

Refund my money

[Eric in TX]

Is there any evidence that the 2nd generation Avalon asic chip actually exists?  At least with the current chip we can get working miners.

[hchc]

since Terrahash is not responding IM i'm posting here again.

Terrahash, please just ship me individual k16. Verify that it works in a 10 port hub, let me know which hub to use and i will just running all the k16 individually. I could have mine back the cost of the hubs and usb cable in one day. We chips 1 chips buyer that already received chips is the loser in all these. Please don't drag it on. Thanks.

[jc328]

Regarding the project as a whole. Since Yifu is offering chip refunds now, we can go that route. But as you know, chips were only about 50-60% cost in our operation, that is all we would be able to refund everyone.

Another option is to get a refund now, and buy the Gen 2 chips in October. Yifu has announced that the Gen 2 chips will be fully compatible with Gen 1. So, we would be able to use the current boards, heat sinks, cases and most (if not all) of the components. And everyone will get about 8-10 times more hashing power for same price. (This is just an estimate, we will get more details once he releases the specs.) And we'll get another month and a half to sort out the issues with the current design. Instead of depending upon BkkCoins this time, we will hire people here to build upon and improve his design. We will open source everything we do.

I vote wholeheartedly on Refunding and getting Gen 2 Chips, however you guys REALLY REALLY REALLY need to open/answer all of your lines of communication. It is unacceptable that so many emails/tickets/phone calls have gone unanswered.

I also think the open sourcing of the project is a great step to rebuilding your relationship back with the community. If this is the route that is taken, please allow for overclocking room in your design revisions.

I still have faith in you Terrahash and so do others as you can see in this thread, but you have given yourselves a black-eye with your lack of customer service. Thankfully this can be remedied easily with some effort

I can promise, we will be more open and be better with customer service this time!

Thanks for the update and glad to hear you want to be better with providing information, and responding to inquiries.  However, at this point, some action would be appreciated.  Perhaps a new hire dedicated to CS, like bitfury, or dedicating an hour per day to answer questions....whatever is feasible at this time of course.  

Support tickets, PM's and emails going unanswered, phones disconnected or straight to a disconnected voicemail, no blog and minimal board updates, and an empty office kills confidence quite dramatically.    On top of that, the price tag, which is a down payment for a Tesla Model S, and it is easy to see why there are plenty of upset and uneasy folks.

Also, regarding refunds as stated previously, do you have an estimate as to when you will reach out to those wishing to go that route?  And if we were to wait 3 months for a 100% refund, a firm date would be wonderful.  Thank you.

Best,
JC

[kkooks]

since Terrahash is not responding IM i'm posting here again.

Terrahash, please just ship me individual k16. Verify that it works in a 10 port hub, let me know which hub to use and i will just running all the k16 individually. I could have mine back the cost of the hubs and usb cable in one day. We chips 1 chips buyer that already received chips is the loser in all these. Please don't drag it on. Thanks.

He cannot do that... it appears that he never got a K16 to work properly...

K16 x 4 would take a miracle.

[Silvas]

Regarding the project as a whole. Since Yifu is offering chip refunds now, we can go that route. But as you know, chips were only about 50-60% cost in our operation, that is all we would be able to refund everyone.

Another option is to get a refund now, and buy the Gen 2 chips in October. Yifu has announced that the Gen 2 chips will be fully compatible with Gen 1. So, we would be able to use the current boards, heat sinks, cases and most (if not all) of the components. And everyone will get about 8-10 times more hashing power for same price. (This is just an estimate, we will get more details once he releases the specs.) And we'll get another month and a half to sort out the issues with the current design. Instead of depending upon BkkCoins this time, we will hire people here to build upon and improve his design. We will open source everything we do.

I'm sorry... I've tried to be fair about the fact that the current situation isn't your fault (though as you've admitted in this thread that doesn't change your obligations), but seriously?  Would you honestly trust Bitsyncom to deliver gen 2 chips on time, after the miserable clusterfuck that the existing order has become?  Would you seriously ask any of your customers to extend that trust not only to you, but by extension to Bitsyncom?

Sure Bitsyncom, you fucked us once and caused a lot of damage to our relationship with our customers, but we'll go ahead and order from you for gen 2 and trust you again!  Wait, what?

It's all good and fine to try to have some optimism, but just like the first time around, you either don't mention (or downplay) the risks of chips not being delivered on time/at all.  You come across as "oh we will have these at X time" rather than "we believe we should have these at X time, but the risk is if they don't show up everyone's just stuck".  While people *should* know this, and most probably do, some don't and even some who do will take that as a sign that you have a reason to be confident that chips will be delivered on time.  That's reinforced by the statement that you'll get an extra month and a half to work out board problems, rather than you'll get an extra month and a half or however long it takes chips to arrive.  It sets people's expectations, and then there's horrible blowout when those expectations are not met.

I gotta call a spade a spade here... I get the impression that there's a lack of lessons being learned and heeded right now.  This being one of the ones that's lacking.

[zedicus]

^^ Cha Ching!

[redmetal]

Regarding the project as a whole. Since Yifu is offering chip refunds now, we can go that route. But as you know, chips were only about 50-60% cost in our operation, that is all we would be able to refund everyone.

Another option is to get a refund now, and buy the Gen 2 chips in October. Yifu has announced that the Gen 2 chips will be fully compatible with Gen 1. So, we would be able to use the current boards, heat sinks, cases and most (if not all) of the components. And everyone will get about 8-10 times more hashing power for same price. (This is just an estimate, we will get more details once he releases the specs.) And we'll get another month and a half to sort out the issues with the current design. Instead of depending upon BkkCoins this time, we will hire people here to build upon and improve his design. We will open source everything we do.

I for one would like to go down the route, Might be worth while to ad something on your site to upgrade/exchange for the new model.
Some people may still want to receive their Gen 1 chips and board or gain a 50% refund.

Keep up informed, looking forward to hearing the outcome

[Silvas]

Regarding the project as a whole. Since Yifu is offering chip refunds now, we can go that route. But as you know, chips were only about 50-60% cost in our operation, that is all we would be able to refund everyone.

Another option is to get a refund now, and buy the Gen 2 chips in October. Yifu has announced that the Gen 2 chips will be fully compatible with Gen 1. So, we would be able to use the current boards, heat sinks, cases and most (if not all) of the components. And everyone will get about 8-10 times more hashing power for same price. (This is just an estimate, we will get more details once he releases the specs.) And we'll get another month and a half to sort out the issues with the current design. Instead of depending upon BkkCoins this time, we will hire people here to build upon and improve his design. We will open source everything we do.

I'm sorry... I've tried to be fair about the fact that the current situation isn't your fault (though as you've admitted in this thread that doesn't change your obligations), but seriously?  Would you honestly trust Bitsyncom to deliver gen 2 chips on time, after the miserable clusterfuck that the existing order has become?  Would you seriously ask any of your customers to extend that trust not only to you, but by extension to Bitsyncom?

Sure Bitsyncom, you fucked us once and caused a lot of damage to our relationship with our customers, but we'll go ahead and order from you for gen 2 and trust you again!  Wait, what?

It's all good and fine to try to have some optimism, but just like the first time around, you either don't mention (or downplay) the risks of chips not being delivered on time/at all.  You come across as "oh we will have these at X time" rather than "we believe we should have these at X time, but the risk is if they don't show up everyone's just stuck".  While people *should* know this, and most probably do, some don't and even some who do will take that as a sign that you have a reason to be confident that chips will be delivered on time.  That's reinforced by the statement that you'll get an extra month and a half to work out board problems, rather than you'll get an extra month and a half or however long it takes chips to arrive.  It sets people's expectations, and then there's horrible blowout when those expectations are not met.

I gotta call a spade a spade here... I get the impression that there's a lack of lessons being learned and heeded right now.  This being one of the ones that's lacking.

Of course, we do not and would never trust him. He says he will not take pre-orders and only sell chips when they are ready. So, once he starts taking orders, we will send someone down there to verify that the chips exist, make the payment, and bring the chips back with them. If we get a refund, we are not going to make the same mistake again.

Ok, I'll shut up and see where this goes then

[notlist3d]

Regarding the project as a whole. Since Yifu is offering chip refunds now, we can go that route. But as you know, chips were only about 50-60% cost in our operation, that is all we would be able to refund everyone.

Another option is to get a refund now, and buy the Gen 2 chips in October. Yifu has announced that the Gen 2 chips will be fully compatible with Gen 1. So, we would be able to use the current boards, heat sinks, cases and most (if not all) of the components. And everyone will get about 8-10 times more hashing power for same price. (This is just an estimate, we will get more details once he releases the specs.) And we'll get another month and a half to sort out the issues with the current design. Instead of depending upon BkkCoins this time, we will hire people here to build upon and improve his design. We will open source everything we do.

The math does not add up at all.  All they can give you is 50-60 percent refund?   Yet they have the cash to start a hosting service and also upgrade you to gen 2 chips? 

Show pictures of 100 cases, or the boards, or the tons of components stopping you from 100 percent refund.  Or a video of working k-16.  Its still just your word its working so good.

[gbx]

So wait a second.

Yifu said he had 400,000 chips in hand and is splitting them up and shipping.   And that this should cover orders placed through June. 

Since TerraHash ordered chips in May... we should be good, correct?

I don't want to wait for another fucking pipe dream to come true.  If Yifu said October, that really means to October of 2014.  Engineers (and students) are incredibly susceptible to understating time, cost, and difficulty to complete a project.  Look at this train wreck.

And each day my money isn't hashing is money I'm losing.  I don't care what the next set of chips will hash at.  He won't make an October deadline for this year. 

Let's put this project to bed and call it a day.  Don't refund.  Take the chips, produce the product (please).

Thanks.

[knightlife999]

Regarding the project as a whole. Since Yifu is offering chip refunds now, we can go that route. But as you know, chips were only about 50-60% cost in our operation, that is all we would be able to refund everyone.

Another option is to get a refund now, and buy the Gen 2 chips in October. Yifu has announced that the Gen 2 chips will be fully compatible with Gen 1. So, we would be able to use the current boards, heat sinks, cases and most (if not all) of the components. And everyone will get about 8-10 times more hashing power for same price. (This is just an estimate, we will get more details once he releases the specs.) And we'll get another month and a half to sort out the issues with the current design. Instead of depending upon BkkCoins this time, we will hire people here to build upon and improve his design. We will open source everything we do.

Hi Amir.

What is the order status of your chips? I just want the boards I paid for (nearly $10k worth of k16s). I don't trust Yifu and I don't believe his claims about 55nm chips. It's possible that he used group buy money to design the new chips. Something was done with that money, and it's obvious that Bitsyncom is paying refunds from the bitcoin they have been mining over the last few months.

I am not willing to wait another 2 months to get a vaporware product, and I don't want to give Yifu any additional business.
If bulk chips are actually being shipped, Terrahash should be receiving a couple boxes by next week. I would like my orders filled as ordered.

[syncer]

or go gen2
or get refund and wait for other vector?
i got bitfury devices chips works 2.7/2.9 gh

[knightlife999]

So wait a second.

Yifu said he had 400,000 chips in hand and is splitting them up and shipping.   And that this should cover orders placed through June.  

Since TerraHash ordered chips in May... we should be good, correct?

I don't want to wait for another fucking pipe dream to come true.  If Yifu said October, that really means to October of 2014.  Engineers (and students) are incredibly susceptible to understating time, cost, and difficulty to complete a project.  Look at this train wreck.

And each day my money isn't hashing is money I'm losing.  I don't care what the next set of chips will hash at.  He won't make an October deadline for this year.  

Let's put this project to bed and call it a day.  Don't refund.  Take the chips, produce the product (please).

Thanks.

Very true. Bitsyncom claims that their chips will be ready at the end of October. Even if that is true, the chips would not be in the hands of the DIY community until early to mid November. 2 weeks from then, you're at December 1st. I don't trust Bitsyncom and I don't believe they will honor any timelines. I would like to have my k16s this month.

Now, I am interested in the hosted miners TH is going to put online in November. But, in regards to what I've already ordered... I just want my boards.

[gbx]

Very true. Bitsyncom claims that their chips will be ready at the end of October. Even if that is true, the chips would not be in the hands of the DIY community until early to mid November. 2 weeks from then, you're at December 1st. I don't trust Bitsyncom and I don't believe they will honor any timelines. I would like to have my k16s this month.

Now, I am interested in the hosted miners TH is going to put online in November. But, in regards to what I've already ordered... I just want my boards.

And November/December/January begins the holiday season in the United States.  So, at best, you're looking at a February ship date.

TerraHash:  What's the bottom line on chip orders.  You have claimed to have secured some chip orders and then also shown some of your own order screenshots from Avalon (May orders I believe)?  What exact orders do you have placed in the Avalon queue at the moment and how many chips can we expect?