[ActiveMining] The Official Active Mining Discussion Thread [Self-Moderated]

[chsados]

Did I read that right?  That Ken said he would be able to deploy his miners for these color coins?  There is a reason why we can't use current ASICs to mine for litecoins and other altcoins, and end up resorting to GPU mining.   Are these Fast Hash machines about to break this rule?  I'd like to see an elaboration of this idea that you can use this technology to mine for other coins.. I've never heard of this before!

Colored coins don't need dedicated miners - it uses the normal bitcoin network....

killerstorm

OK, a bit of history: There were several implementation attempts by different people, but (as far as I know) the only one which has decentralized market as a goal is called BitcoinX. It is like the mainstream of colored coins.

People who started it wanted to create an organization of some sort, but it didn't work very well, and basically I was the only permanent team member.

So I worked on it on and off for about a year. (Since September of 2012, when I made the first prototype.)

Until July of 2013 I treated it like a gig, but then I noticed that BitcoinX isn't going anywhere (lead developer of WebcoinX which was supposed to take over development sort of disappeared), but there is a demand for this technology, but nobody is doing it right.

So since July it is, like, my main occupation.

Still, progress have been slower than I expected: I wasn't able to recruit more people, and I had to split my attention between two projects: WebcoinX and NGCCC.

(In retrospect, I should have focused on NGCCC. My hope was that we can quickly make a WebcoinX demo which will help to popularize colored coins, but it looks like colored coins need a robust implementation more than they need popularization. On the other hand, I previously had some bad experience with ArmoryX.)

So the currently status: we are working on it, it is slower than expected, but there is hope that something will be available this month.

Also, as I mentioned elsewhere, sponsors are willing to provide 200 BTC to fund development, so that's not a problem.

More details about status:

    I've recently written an article about the theory of colored coins, it summarizes how it works on the low level, but with a dry language. I also plan to write an article about practical aspects of it, like color definitions/asset definitions, trade, issuance and so on. Meanwhile, all this information is available in bitcoinX group archives, but you have to dig to find it.

    NGCCC: We have coloredcoinlib and CCoinDemo prototype, but this prototype isn't adequate, and I'm currently designing a new core. You can see preview here. Working version will be available in a couple of days.

    WebcoinX: The plan was to implement a demo first, and to improve it to make it work on mainnet second. Demo is almost complete, but there was no development in last couple of weeks. [url-https://trello.com/b/n4qoNDDI/webcoinx]Here's TODO list[/url]

[VolanicEruptor]

chsados, thank you for the info, I understand it more now!

[knybe]

chsados, thank you for the info, I understand it more now!

we've been posting it all over this friggin thread for two days now!

[arousedrhino]

chsados, thank you for the info, I understand it more now!

we've been posting it all over this friggin thread for two days now!

VE is a little short on braincells, its why he always erupts about nothing.

[22naru]

in case you want to  cut your loss , check this out : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=301524.new#new

[Luckybit]

all this is great except for the fact that I have already reduced my ActiveMining position to 0, as I assume most other Americans have done or soon will do.  too little too late.  good luck with the company.

False.

Why would I cash out at a loss when none of the reasons I'm invested in ActM have changed? There are many other of us Americans that are still long on ActM. The exchange issue is short-term.

+++++1

The fundamentals of ActiveMining have not changed. What's more; this has pushed the market to find a decentralized way of exchange.

It's an interesting time... If you have the stomach for it

I think decentralized is the only way to go as this will happen to any other centralized exchange.  Looking into the Namecoin code to create a decentralized exchanged.  As was said above it can be merged mined with Bitcoin.  We could uses our own miners to get it going.

Colored coin or Mastercoin, how exactly would you use Namecoin?

[zumzero]

Hi Ken,

Here is a post I made in the forum.  Hope it goes down well with you.

Cherers.

   -    -    -    -    -    -

Hi Ken,

I think we deserve a sitrep now the forum is back up just to bring everyone back up to speed. How's progress?  Are we to expect a financial report soon?  Any exciting marketing info you'd like to share?
Are you still planning to prioritise the mining farm over hardware sales, or have you planned for achieving achieve both concurrently. Where do you see this company in five years time assuming Bitcoin has seen wider adoption.  Are you developing next gen chips or are you too busy at present?  What are your short to mid term plans for taking on more staff?  Have you learned any important lessons from watching rival companies alienate their customer base, if so, can you share with us your thoughts on how to prevent this happening with ActM?



Thanks in advance.  Smiley

Sales figures for August will be release on the 15th, 3 months P&L, and Balance sheet will be release by the end of October.

5 Years is a very long time in Bitcoin time, we are working on our 28nm chip, we will do what it takes either hardware sales or mining whichever makes the company more profit.  Staffing depends on the market conditions.  Yes, we are very concerned about helping our customers make a ROI on the equipment.  Yes, if our customers when we start shipping can not make a ROI on their investment in VMC equipment we will offer Refunds.

Don't shoot the messenger VE.

[Sou]

@zumzero didn't we already get sales figures for august?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=252531.msg3168832#msg3168832

Weekly Post

We are in the process of hiring a PR firm to help us keep all of our Investor and Customers up to date on the progress of
Active Mining.

We have received the Avalon refund and we are holding it in reserve for expenses for engineering the PCIe boards.

After the eAsic announcement and the price reduction on our Fast-Hash editions of machines we have seen an major increase in sales.

We will start announcing our sales figures after the 15th of the month for the previous months sales.  This gives time for the sales at the
the end of the month to complete.

Here are the August sales:

Total           $89,969.00
Average   $2,902.23

Edit:  The above sales figures are the actual revenue received.

Edit: Added July Sales:

Total             $20,495.00
Average        $661.13/Day







Active Mining PR Staff

So i believe we should be getting sales figures for the month of September next, on the 15th of October.

[zumzero]

That would make most sense so it's fair to assume Ken mistakingly made mention of August and not September.

So only four days remaining until we get some very important information.

Now where's that Labcoin countdown timer?   

[kslaughter]

@zumzero didn't we already get sales figures for august?

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=252531.msg3168832#msg3168832

Weekly Post

We are in the process of hiring a PR firm to help us keep all of our Investor and Customers up to date on the progress of
Active Mining.

We have received the Avalon refund and we are holding it in reserve for expenses for engineering the PCIe boards.

After the eAsic announcement and the price reduction on our Fast-Hash editions of machines we have seen an major increase in sales.

We will start announcing our sales figures after the 15th of the month for the previous months sales.  This gives time for the sales at the
the end of the month to complete.

Here are the August sales:

Total           $89,969.00
Average   $2,902.23

Edit:  The above sales figures are the actual revenue received.

Edit: Added July Sales:

Total             $20,495.00
Average        $661.13/Day

Active Mining PR Staff

So i believe we should be getting sales figures for the month of September next, on the 15th of October.

Yes, sales figures for the last quarter.  The above figures are revenue not sales.  Sales for August ~$330,000.

[superduh]

/you mean net income?

cause sales and revenue mean the same thing...... just a technicality

[minerpart]

/you mean net income?

cause sales and revenue mean the same thing...... just a technicality

No they don't.

Sales would relate to website pre-orders only.
Revenue would be web sales + mining income + whatever else income might be coming in.

[VolanicEruptor]

This is professional accounting 101, ladies and gentlemen

[VolanicEruptor]

so basically if you abandoned your shopping cart because you wanted a cointerra instead, ken is still counting your order as a sale.  

thank god i sold more shares right after I got that response

[superduh]

/you mean net income?

cause sales and revenue mean the same thing...... just a technicality

No they don't.

Sales would relate to website pre-orders only.
Revenue would be web sales + mining income + whatever else income might be coming in.

Yes, sales figures for the last quarter.  The above figures are revenue not sales.  Sales for August ~$330,000.

what you are trying to tell me is that SALES of hardware was more than the REVENUE earned from sales of hardware and mining?
correct, they are different since most company sell stuff to make money - regardless in the way he explained it it didn't make sense

sales can never be more than revenue. the other way around perhaps

[thefunkybits]

Ive got my BTC ready for the weekend share dump!
Chips are right around the corner!

[moribana]

I think a statement from Ken regarding the recent announcement by Bitfunder is a more pressing concern.

How does Ken's nationality affect ActM's ability to remain listed on BF?

Technically speaking, Ken will not be able to own any shares.

e: This is so stupid.

Technically speaking he does not own any shares on Bitfunder any more. He transferred all his shares to someone else on Oct. 9.

[minerpart]

what you are trying to tell me is that SALES of hardware was more than the REVENUE earned from sales of hardware and mining?

Yes. If people don't pay within an agreed time or if there is a chargeback on a credit card purchase, or a cheque is cancelled. etc etc etc.

At some point at the end of the month you need to decide what your sales figures are for the books for that month. Then they are set in stone. Come the first week of the new month if the sales payments for these pre-orders are charged back or cheques don't clear, or cheques don't arrive etc then the actual earned Revenue from these 'declared sales' will obviously be less than the sales figures you put in the books at the end of the previous month.

It's not about people abandoning their shopping carts, it's confirmed orders that the payment just don't arrive for. You can't predict how many people will not pay up after finalising their order and providing a shipping address. It seems there was well over 50% not paying up but this figure should decline hugely when we start shipping actual product and people feel more safe about their purchases.

[VolanicEruptor]

I believe you are supposed to put unpaid sales into the "accounts receivable".
Sales should be money actually received.  
sales and revenue are interchangeable terms though, and his way of using them is really bizarre..
Yes, it's okay to use sales as a subset of revenue, because there may be other revenue sources as well, but in that case the sales will always be LESS than the revenue, as was already pointed out..
In this case, Ken is making up his own accounting rules, and it has bothered me for awhile now..

[minerpart]

In this case, Ken is making up his own accounting rules, and it has bothered me for awhile now..

OK that might be a valid point. Have you thought about making a grown-up post about it and asking Ken to use the traditional accounting format for clarity? Being silly and immature and trying to ridicule the man at every opportunity just because you are a silly and immature person yourself helps no-body.

But if you are having fun maybe that's the main thing.