NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[CIYAM]

And Nxt will be used by traders in the beginning. Let that sink it.

Indeed it will be used by some traders, scammers and hobbyists and little else "in the beginning" - I am looking a little beyond that but it seems many can't see that far.

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[windjc]

This will never sink it. Because its not true. If Nxt is worth pennies there will be no AE. You live with a non-capitalistic mindset.

I am not concerned with ideology - the *reality* is that if people are going to move to using a digital currency they are not going to choose a "Rolls Royce" but something that is efficient and cheap (if has to be *better* than using VISA or there is no point to change).

Nxt will have to adapt as things change. Its called crossing a bridge when you come to it. But now, in the reality of our present moment, most of your suggestions and inputs are just confusing the situation.

[CIYAM]

Your confusion stems from a comment from someone who thinks too much like a programmer and not at all like a real world business person. I would mainly ignore it, although, I realize I haven't taken my own advice.

You should take your own advice - I have owned and worked in businesses for over 20 years so I think I am a "real world business person".

[CIYAM]

Nxt will have to adapt as things change. Its called crossing a bridge when you come to it. But now, in the reality of our present moment, most of your suggestions and inputs are just confusing the situation.

Indeed Nxt will have to adapt as will peoples understanding of what a "platform" is vs. what a "crypto currency" is.

[windjc]

And Nxt will be used by traders in the beginning. Let that sink it.

Indeed it will be used by some traders, scammers and hobbyists and little else "in the beginning" - I am looking a little beyond that but it seems many can't see that far.

No, I think you are imagining an utopia in your own mind that will not play out the way you expect. Its called decentralized free market. It will be driven by greed and innovation. Not by utopian ideals. It will be a human experiment and if guided by people intelligent to create innovative solutions, it will thrive.

[eightspaces]

windjc are u posting BS on purpose or are these posts truly ur standpoint?

[CIYAM]

No, I think you are imagining an utopia in your own mind that will not play out the way you expect. Its called decentralized free market. It will be driven by greed and innovation. Not by utopian ideals. It will be a human experiment and it guided by people intelligent to create innovative solutions it will thrive.

I don't have any such utopian ideals.

I am a pragmatist.

Also btw - I have invested in NXT so I have no great desire to "lose that investment".

I simply am not being delusional about what a "platform" is vs. what a "currency" is - that doesn't mean I think NXT will go "up or down" in value or that it's current price is above or below its "optimum" - the market will decide these things as it should.

[windjc]

windjc are u posting BS on purpose or are these posts truly ur standpoint?

My standpoint.  You actually believe NXT can have a market cap of 1 million dollars and exist as a decentralized platform?

[Eadeqa]

If POS isn't profitable and owning Nxt is not profitable and only owning assets are profitable, no one will be around to develop the asset owning system into the future.

The future is not something we can easily predict - but if you have a choice of two platforms:

1. Fee of 1%
2. Fee of 0.01 USD

The %  doesn't make sense. I hope to see the fees reduced to 0.1 Nxt soon.   I don't "forge" because of "fees". I do it voluntarily to support the network. It costs me absolutely nothing to do so. This applies to vast number (if not all) forgers.  We only need fees to prevent spam, and as of now 0.1 should be enough.

[windjc]

Your confusion stems from a comment from someone who thinks too much like a programmer and not at all like a real world business person. I would mainly ignore it, although, I realize I haven't taken my own advice.

You should take your own advice - I have owned and worked in businesses for over 20 years so I think I am a "real world business person".

Ok. Then explain the incentive to be a POS stakeholder if you can't earn fees and your Nxt is basically worthless? And please answer something besides "you can sell a product as an asset."

[CIYAM]

The %  doesn't make sense. I hope to see the fees reduced to 0.1 Nxt soon.   I don't "forge" because of "fees". I do it voluntarily to support the network. It costs me absolutely nothing to do so. This applies to vast number (if not all) forgers.  We only need fees to prevent spam, and as of now 0.1 should be enough.

Indeed the incentive for forging is not so financial - at best down the track I think that forging rewards might cover the cost of running a server (if that and that's assuming a reasonable stake).

The reason for running a node (or super node) is going to have a lot more to do with the "ecosystem" (due to owning an Asset or a Digital Goods Store or something else that sits on the Nxt *platform*).

[eightspaces]

If it wasnt for ur investments / stakes, u would have given up on Nxt already.

[CIYAM]

Ok. Then explain the incentive to be a POS stakeholder if you can't earn fees and your Nxt is basically worthless? And please answer something besides "you can sell a product as an asset."

There *will always be fees* even if they have to be reduced quite a lot down the track.

How will POS fee rewards compare to say a "bank account" - not sure although already a large % of people get 0% return from their bank accounts so there is still at least some attraction to "having stake" and leasing out your "forging rights".

Always - to earn money you would be best to work hard and/or invest wisely.

Consider perhaps "buying Asset shares" if you see a promising listing (but don't invest in an Asset called CIYAM unless you can verify that it is owned by an AT).

[BrianNowhere]

The value of NXT *can never be very high* as it is basically just *fuel* to run the engine. There seem to be a lot of people in this forum who just "don't get this" (perhaps because "greed" is blinding them to reality).

I'm just going to let this reverberate here for a while. I don't even know what to say to this...yet

Good - let it "sink in" and hopefully a few others will too.

If you have powers to predict markets so well you could make a lot of money on Wall St. Crypto-currency is kind of a new thing by the way and everything about it is unprecedented. The halls of history are lined with the skins of those who thought they could predict the market and I think it's a bit presumptuous of you to say you can predict with certainty what Nxt will be worth.  Market forces are unpredictable, based on emotions, crowd mentality and many other factors including economic, financial and political. If math and market caps could predict everything about markets there's be no Stock market.  

NXt just like XRP is the only trust-less currency that exists in the system, therefore there is a potential for value, depending on the value of the entire ecosystem. All other assets issued are worth only what you can trust the issuer for.

I think I'm starting to see the deep distaste that some in the Nxt development community have for speculators: ie: NXt investors. I find it very concerning and I'm hoping others might pipe in here.

[2Kool4Skewl]

Don't forget that the more NXT you own the more block you forge.  You can selectively include transactions in the blocks you forge.

[CIYAM]

If you have powers to predict markets so well you could make a lot of money on Wall St.

I don't have such powers although I did make quite a bit of money from a few well chosen stocks (such as Sun Microsystems back in the early 90's).

I am "no hippie" but I do *get* what Nxt actually *is*. It is *not* another "pump and dump copy coin" but instead a *platform*.

Right from the start Nxt was presented without the word "coin" and this among other things was *deliberate*.

[windjc]

Ok. Then explain the incentive to be a POS stakeholder if you can't earn fees and your Nxt is basically worthless? And please answer something besides "you can sell a product as an asset."

There *will always be fees* even if they have to be reduced quite a lot down the track.

How will POS fee rewards compare to say a "bank account" - not sure although already a large % of people get 0% return from their bank accounts so there is still at least some attraction to "having stake" and leasing out your "forging rights".

Always - to earn money you would be best to work and/or invest wisely.

Consider perhaps "buying Asset shares" if you see a promising listing.

I'm sorry. I just don't think you live in reality. While you test the AE, the majority of the community is working to develop Nxt as a currency so that it has real value growth AND can exist as both a currency and a platform. And that majority isnt going to change because most of them want to promote their current investment, not a future investment of someone else with an asset to sell.

Now, your model may evolve over time and there might be a day where it could work that way. But that would only be through evolution.

Going around telling people to accept the fact that Nxt won't be worth much just because you have a vision for it that you desire, is disingenious and and really is just counter productive.

[2Kool4Skewl]

NXt just like XRP is the only trust-less currency that exists in the system, therefore there is a potential for value, depending on the value of the entire ecosystem. All other assets issued are worth only what you can trust the issuer for.

I agree.  NXT derives some of its value because it is the trustless intermediate currency in the NXT ecosystem.

[CIYAM]

Going around telling people to accept the fact that Nxt won't be worth much just because you have a vision for it that you desire, is disingenious and and really is just counter productive.

I am doing no such thing - I am simply pointing out that the "market will decide" what the value of NXT will be and what the "parameters" are.

It wasn't *my idea* to create a "2nd Gen" crypto "platform" but that is what we have (so pretending it is just like LTC is not going to work).

[martismartis]

I think @salsacz was thinking about having the NXT core itself his mobile phone.

I wanted to know if this video will be truthful: http://youtu.be/cP4KFH6Iz0g?t=37s (Nxt cryptocurrency: green energy (green coin mining) )

Yep, I know.

It requires NXT core on the mobile phone. Otherwise, you would not forge ON your mobile phone.

Theoretically it is possible to forge on smartphone, but it's complicated for now. I can forge on my Android TV stick, but need to root it and install ubuntu on it. For now my TV stick works as public node. I tried to do the same thing with my Xperia Arc, but with no luck, NRS kills the ubuntu on it. I don't know it is memory or processor related. It's quit old smartphone, but I didn't try on newer ones.