Devcoin

[Icoin]

1. EAW report:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=110884.msg1332267#msg1332267
Thank you jasinlee

[jasinlee]

1. EAW report:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=110884.msg1332267#msg1332267
Thank you jasinlee

No problem, don't worry this looks if it keeps going as it has been to be going in favor of the EAW. The review will be pretty well in your favor.

[Unthinkingbit]

For the work to date on the EAW report:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=110884.msg1332267#msg1332267

Jasinlee will get the 2/5 share report bounty:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=34586.msg1257583#msg1257583

in round 18:
https://github.com/Unthinkingbit/charity/blob/master/bounty_18.csv

The next person who buys Icoin's 250ml EAW demo bottle with devcoins and writes a report, will get 1/5 of share.

[Unthinkingbit]

Hi Pyra-proxy,

Estimates of what project types devcoin can support for a given market capitalization are now at:
http://devtome.org/wiki/index.php?title=Devcoin_Bounty#Project_Types

Devcoin market capitalization is about 70,000 USD at the time of this writing.

Could you not make possibly one of the most significant bounties to the current cryptocoin ecosystem to help deal with this?  And that is a bounty for say one of the following scenarios:

1) Implementation and tested patch to dvc which upgrades the system to a full ledger system complete with empty address pruning etc.
..

That project type would be a modification to a big application:
http://devtome.org/wiki/index.php?title=Devcoin_Bounty#Software_2

which is in the 1,000,000 USD section, too big for devcoin to fund now.

In reference to a post I have just seen:

How about adding devcoin bounty shares for open source DIY low/reasonable costing renewable energy devcoin mining setups.  As part of the conditions I would recommend at least the following:
..
4)  The DIY kit should provide power in 1 of 3 scenarios - a) always available; b) available during day with battery charging for night availability; c) depend on power grid sale/repurchase (i.e. produce extra when power available expecting extra to be sold on the local grid which can then be "repurchased" when the power is unavailable from the kit .... but in all cases the kit provides 24/7 power needs for the targeted platform.

The pure solar power version could be covered by the Sun Tracker in the 10,000,000,USD section:
http://devtome.org/wiki/index.php?title=Devcoin_Bounty#Hardware_3

The battery charging version could be covered by the Energy Storage System in the 100,000,000 USD section:
http://devtome.org/wiki/index.php?title=Devcoin_Bounty#Hardware_4

Both are too big for devcoin to fund right now.

However, if people are offering a sufficient bounty for people to get interested in a project, for example the 185+ BTC - Open Transactions Client (for Grandmas) project:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=105506.0

then I suggest that devcoin pile in with a bounty if the project is at least one quarter funded. In the project types section:
http://devtome.org/wiki/index.php?title=Devcoin_Bounty#Project_Types

it is assumed that the bounty offered would be up to 1% of the market capitalization. So the 1,000,000 USD required for modification to a big application works out to a 10,000 USD bounty, a quarter of which is 2,500 USD.

Should 8 shares be offered if the pledges go above 2,500 USD? Should the pledge target be different?

[jasinlee]

That sounds fair to me.

[xchrix]

is there only vircurex for trading DVC??

[pyra-proxy]

is there only vircurex for trading DVC??

Yes for easy to use web interface, but there is also an open transactions option that markm provides in which you can setup an open transactions client and trade them there as well.

[Icoin]

Yes for easy to use web interface, but there is also an open transactions option that markm provides in which you can setup an open transactions client and trade them there as well.

But we definitly miss a howto setup a OTS server. I realy think that exchanges should be more diversified, and since stuff on one OTS server can be traded on other OTS servers aswell, its greatly decentralized. I allso asked Vircurex about an integration of Cryptostocks into OTS since this part isnt covered by OTS yet.
As i wrote to Markm for some help with setting up an OTS server his response was disapointig but  i should not expect something else from him!
Quote: "It sounds like you are trying to run otserver. You should learn how it all works before trying to set up a server."
Its not realy fair to get help and then answer the way he did. Especialy since him self wrote:
Quote: "With heroic support from FellowTraveler I now have an Open Transactions server up and running."

Even Vircurex started to post a howto setup a BTC/DVC exchange
http://devtome.org/wiki/index.php?title=DVC/BTC_Exchange
There is info on how to compile OTS but unfortunatly there seems to be no info how to setup and run a OTS.

Markm your realy brake out the development, are you sure you work pro Devcoin and not just for yourself ??

BTW what about the integration of the Devcoin Logo i made in to the latest version of Devcoin-qt and when do we get access to the devcoin.org webside to update, its a shame how it looks like actualy.

[markm]

There really is not much demand for Open Transactions servers yet.

Maybe once more people have working clients for it there will be some point in adding more servers but so far the two servers that already exist are pretty much sitting idle other than private person to person transfers between Galactic Milieu players/nations/corps.

Anyone who wants to issue assets can do so on the OTdemo server, for example, so there is no need for them to face the problems of trying to run a server and keep it up to date yet, instead they can first focus on getting adept at the actual issuing of assets part, which few people have managed to master so far. Presumably the point of setting up yet another server would be to issue assets on it? But so far no one has really even managed to issue any serious assets so even if they did fire up even hundreds more servers so what, they all would be sitting empty with no assets on them...

-MarkM-

[Icoin]

Presumably the point of setting up yet another server would be to issue assets on it?

Not in first line. From my perspective all acutal exchanges are vulnerable since you just need to shutdown a centralized exchange and the market is gone.

With OTS there can be trades of the same assets on many different servers the asset would become market independent.

But so far no one has really even man aged to issue any serious assets

Dnt you think that is caused by the missing documentation ??

even if they did fire up even hundreds more servers so what, they all would be sitting empty with no assets on them...

You are wrong, it would be a perfect way to be able to continue to trade on other servers, in case of a shutdown of the acutal market infrastructure. Dont you see that with many servers that trade your asset, you enlarge greatly your market ?? Or arnt you aware that the same asset from one OTS can be traded aswell on other OTS ?

Just an example:

Lets assume there would be a solar flair hitting US/Canada or Japan. With many OTS running, the trading would continue allmost instantly on any other server with the same assets. If one server gets down, the other ones would still be able to trade the same assets. Its not just about issuing assets its about security of the market.

I guess the main idea of cryptocoins is the decentralization, unfortunatly most ppl are still caught in the centralized pyramid... It needs some time to become aware what to think or how to act outside the pyramid is like..

[markm]

The point is people are not trading assets in the first place.

It does not matter how many non existent assets are not being traded on the servers, what matters is actual assets actually being traded.

Demonstrate that trading is happening and doubtless more servers will spring up seeking some of that trade.

So far running a server it simply a financial loss, a cost with no income to offset it.

Generate lots of sales of your assets on Open Transactions servers and the usage tokens that brings in will doubtless inspire others to put up more servers to get some of those usage token sales.

But right now usage tokens even are not working so oops no income in sight yet at all for people running servers.

If you refuse to even demonstrate your assets on the demo server why should anyone go to the expense and trouble of setting up another server for you to similarly refuse to issue your assets on? You have not demonstrated a real willingness to issue any assets on any servers let alone that allowing you to issue your assets on a server would result in any income for the server. Show us some actual traffic, some actual trade in your assets. The more usage tokens your users consume trading your assets the more attractive your assets will be to more servers and maybe then competition for hosting your assets will arise among servers.

-MarkM-

[Icoin]

If you refuse to even desmonstrate your assets on the demo server why should anyone go to the expense and trouble of setting up another server for you to similarly refuse to issue your assets on? You have not demosntrated a real willingness to issue any assets on any servers let alone that allowing you to issue your assets on a server would result in any income for the server. Show us some actual traffic, some actual trade in your assets. The more usage tokens your users consume trading your assets the more attractive your assets will be to more servers and maybe then competition for hosting your assets will arise among servers.

Well here is the point, i usualy setup my servers by myself.
I dnt know on what planet you live but as far i know my assets allready drive the devcoin exchangerate up. You wanna see some trade ?? https://cryptostocks.com/securities/14 i guess allmost 3 million sold shares speaks for it self.
Its just that i wanna have more security for my shareholders then the guys on GLBSE had. With an working OTS in the background such a mess like GLBSE made, would become impossible. I dont doubt the backup abilities of Vircurex, but even vircurex and cryptostocks are actualy unfortunatly centralized..

[markm]

How is it that you imagine Open Transactions in any way preventing you from doing what Nefario did?

Also of course if you wish to improve the documentation you are urged to do so, it is all open source afterall.

-MarkM-

[Unthinkingbit]

That sounds fair to me.

The Open Transactions Client (for Grandmas) bounty at:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=105506.0

is 185 BTC. That times the 11.7 USD/BTC mtgox price gives a total value of about 2,160 USD. If the bounty value goes above 2,500 USD, an eight generation share bounty will be added to the pledges.

[Unthinkingbit]

BTW what about the integration of the Devcoin Logo i made in to the latest version of Devcoin-qt and when do we get access to the devcoin.org webside to update, its a shame how it looks like actualy.

We've had a devcoin logo since devtome was made, about a year ago. It has not been added to the client because there are so many other things to do. Making sure that all the modifications required to make devcoin from bitcoin are done perfectly is the first priority.

Devcoin.org is controlled by Cablepair. He is working full time on starting a business and so devcoin is a low priority for him. Hopefully when he has more time, and/or devcoin goes up in value, he'll do devcoin stuff again.

Overall, at the time of this writing, the devcoin market capitalization is only about 80,000 USD. It is divided finely among many projects. Until the capitalization rises a lot, we won't be able to fully fund big projects, and there will be a lot of small things left undone.

[Icoin]

How is it that you imagine Open Transactions in any way preventing you from doing what Nefario did?

Since i dnt run an exchange and not planing to do so, what you wrote is just ridiculous.

Also of course if you wish to improve the documentation you are urged to do so, it is all open source afterall.

Is that me or you who is allready running a OTS so why should i do the documentation?
I beleve that everything should happen by free will, so to urge someone is not realy wise.

However after a longer discussion with knotwork he convinced me that OTS is not realy suitable for the purpose i would like to have covered and Colored Coins is the bether choise: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=106373.0

We've had a devcoin logo since devtome was made, about a year ago. It has not been added to the client because there are so many other things to do. Making sure that all the modifications required to make devcoin from bitcoin are done perfectly is the first priority.

The procedure is simple please copy the files from http://92.105.105.155/devcoin/icon/ to /devcoin-qt/src/qt/res/icons and overwrite the existing bitcoin.png, bitcoin.svg, bitcoin_testnet.png, toolbar.png and toolbar_testnet.png. I know this is just an optical thing but we should care for the small things that are visible to the user aswell.

Devcoin.org is controlled by Cablepair. He is working full time on starting a business and so devcoin is a low priority for him. Hopefully when he has more time, and/or devcoin goes up in value, he'll do devcoin stuff again.

I offered that i would do the modifications. Im convinced that this has an influence aswell on dvc Not every user is that skilled to be able to compile by him/herself. And with such a representation like it is on devcoin.org, well im not sure that we reach more Devcoin users, and we need more Devcoin users not just developers. Assuming i would be just an user and would open up devcoin.org i would just think to myself how unprofessional, they wanna reach millions worth in USD and are not even able to have a up to date good looking webside (even the favicon.ico is the one from drupal).

I know some of you guys dont realy like me, well i guess its a both sided thing, but we are not here to like or dislike each other, we are here to make Devcoin a success!

[pyra-proxy]

Unthinkingbit.....  any room to support the I0Coin block chain bloat issue, especially since current private bounties have at least attracted some development interests?

....i'll see what I can do!!

And that's what I like to hear! 

Ditto!

Thanks,
Pyra-Proxy

[jasinlee]

Unthinkingbit.....  any room to support the I0Coin block chain bloat issue, especially since current private bounties have at least attracted some development interests?

....i'll see what I can do!!

And that's what I like to hear! 

Ditto!

Thanks,
Pyra-Proxy

That does sound like a worthy venture IMO.

[Unthinkingbit]

Unthinkingbit.....  any room to support the I0Coin block chain bloat issue, especially since current private bounties have at least attracted some development interests?

I'm glad people on the I0Coin thread have started pledging bounties. The calculation for the total pledges follows below:

I0C: 10,000 + 10,000 + 20,000 + 10,000 = 50,000
DVC: 1,000,000
IXC: 4,000
NMC: 200

I was unable to find an I0C value, I'll assume that if I0C went back on vircurex its value would be the same as IXC.

I0C + IXC: 54,000 * 0.00011 BTC/IXC = 5.94 BTC
DVC: 1,000,000 * 0.000002 BTC/DVC = 2 BTC
NMC: 200 * 0.0041 = 0.82 BTC
Total: 8.76 BTC

This times the mtgox price of 11.6 gives a total of 102 USD. This is short of the 2,500 USD pledge level before devcoin will add to a bounty for a modification to a big application:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=34586.msg1335714#msg1335714

I suggest that a pledge thread to fix the bitcoin blockchain bloat be made, that will get more interest which might go above the 2,500 USD level for devcoin to pile on.

[jasinlee]

I concur, unthinkingbit perhaps duplicate your thoughts to a new thread and reference it here.