rpietila Wall Observer - the Quality TA Thread ;)

[seleme]

when bitcoin hits the ceiling in terms of USD value, will the world accept forever that 1BTC= 40 LTC when there are only 4x as much? again, it is a binary move, litecoin will claw to parity with bitcoin over time, or it will fall to zero.

I don't think it is that easy. Fiat currencies' market caps are big and small, and have some relation to their underlying economies, respectively. They also fluctuate against each other.

If LTC userbase is roughly constant 1/10 of BTC, and # of LTC in circulation is 4 times more, then it is realistic to assume that the ratio would be 1:40 perpetually.

The only way for LTC to achieve parity with USD is to actually make every present and future BTC holder to actually hold (an equal value of) LTC, which is quite ridiculous, don't you think so?

I do hold more value in LTC than in BTC, it is true that the current inflation of LTC is 8 times higher than BTC, but the huge trading volume that matches and surpass the BTC trading volume means that there is a big chance for growth,  I did also notice that the sell/buy amounts are shrinking more and more with the huge volume, which could means that LTC is changing hands, which is good.

I usually don't like to compare BTC with LTC, this really doesn't work, BTC has a first mover advantage, network effect, loyalty.... but LTC offer a 2nd choice and I do like choices, and to be honest, name any legitimate alts that have a real development going ? really few if any....  


I have been watching this chart for few months now, and I decided lately to invest a bit more into LTC, best decision ever  





 

You're using data from the period when LTC is highly speculated based on Huobi stuff  

But since LTC goes up to 0.035 regularly than buying now is almost guarantees profit though (buying few days ago was even more guaranteed, lol). There are lot of alts near the bottom though where the potential profit is even bigger than LTC one though.

[mmitech]

when bitcoin hits the ceiling in terms of USD value, will the world accept forever that 1BTC= 40 LTC when there are only 4x as much? again, it is a binary move, litecoin will claw to parity with bitcoin over time, or it will fall to zero.

I don't think it is that easy. Fiat currencies' market caps are big and small, and have some relation to their underlying economies, respectively. They also fluctuate against each other.

If LTC userbase is roughly constant 1/10 of BTC, and # of LTC in circulation is 4 times more, then it is realistic to assume that the ratio would be 1:40 perpetually.

The only way for LTC to achieve parity with USD is to actually make every present and future BTC holder to actually hold (an equal value of) LTC, which is quite ridiculous, don't you think so?

I do hold more value in LTC than in BTC, it is true that the current inflation of LTC is 8 times higher than BTC, but the huge trading volume that matches and surpass the BTC trading volume means that there is a big chance for growth,  I did also notice that the sell/buy amounts are shrinking more and more with the huge volume, which could means that LTC is changing hands, which is good.

I usually don't like to compare BTC with LTC, this really doesn't work, BTC has a first mover advantage, network effect, loyalty.... but LTC offer a 2nd choice and I do like choices, and to be honest, name any legitimate alts that have a real development going ? really few if any....  


I have been watching this chart for few months now, and I decided lately to invest a bit more into LTC, best decision ever  




 

You're using data from the period when LTC is highly speculated based on Huobi stuff  

But since LTC goes up to 0.035 regularly than buying now is almost guarantees profit though (buying few days ago was even more guaranteed, lol). There are lot of alts near the bottom though where the potential profit is even bigger than LTC one though.

I have been looking to this for almost 3 months now, LTC has a really huge volume without exaggerating... 

[Carlton Banks]

LTC volume is misleading, there are fewer HODLers (no publicly known Satoshi-size hoards), fewer lost coins, faster relative supply inflation.

Also, the underlying technicals and mining/network economics are problematic (scrypt gives the mining increased capital & running costs, more orphaned blocks due to lower block rate target, R&D for ASICs is more expensive because of scrypt & accentuates the sunk+running cost issues)

If the world suddenly gets majority/ubiquitous fibre based internet into homes/commercial buildings, then maybe the improved latency will cause the bitcoin core devs to consider lowering the block rate target. Satoshi knew what he was doing re: SHA256 and 10 minute blocks TBH.

[chessnut]

when bitcoin hits the ceiling in terms of USD value, will the world accept forever that 1BTC= 40 LTC when there are only 4x as much? again, it is a binary move, litecoin will claw to parity with bitcoin over time, or it will fall to zero.

I don't think it is that easy. Fiat currencies' market caps are big and small, and have some relation to their underlying economies, respectively. They also fluctuate against each other.

If LTC userbase is roughly constant 1/10 of BTC, and # of LTC in circulation is 4 times more, then it is realistic to assume that the ratio would be 1:40 perpetually.

The only way for LTC to achieve parity with USD is to actually make every present and future BTC holder to actually hold (an equal value of) LTC, which is quite ridiculous, don't you think so?

When BTC hits maximum adoption, LTC may still have a share of the economy. that puts LTC is a situation where it may grow further, but bitcoin cannot.

If BTC will grow the fastest because of networking, then lets assume BTC grows at a rate 3^2, and LTC slower @ 2^2. if now the difference in ratio is 1/40, then after 2x time the ratio must be 1/120, approaching zero until growth stops.

but when growth for bitcoin maxes out, does that mean growth for litecoin maxes out? no, because litecoin simply hasnt grown that big. I think if litecoin is still used at all by then, it will gradually rise in value to bitcoin, and where must it stop?

yeah, it would be silly to make every BTC holder hold 1/4 litecoin, but think, at 1/40 you could corner the market 

what my main point here is that LTCBTC chart looks a bit like BTCUSD. Im just trying to make sense of that. I dont see why Litecoin surpassed BTC in bull season. What is the riddle?

[nakaone]

I am holding about a 70% BTC, 30% LTC portfolio.   I have been much more profitable on my LTC because of my dollar cost average of everything.   Obviously, it is also because I was a little bit behind on my timing for buying the majority of my BTC.   I don't think LTC will ever reach 1/4 of the value of BTC, but the ratio will most likely increase to significantly higher levels than now.   I think it is mainly attractive because of the confirmation times as well as the psychological thought that it is the "next best thing"  for people who feel they missed the boat with BTC

LoL, Who in his sane brains will think that LTC is the "next best thing"?? 
LTC has been here long time ago and it has already his massive pumps and dumps. It is more reasonable to take a look to any of those 2º generation cryptos like nxt, etherium, xcp and so on. Most of them probably fail loudly, but I am sure one of these is called to be the "next best thing".

+1 well this is a thread for daytraders, but I think regarding function they have the potential to add a somewhat cryptofinance to the sphere. But especially the protocols build on top of Bitcoin have quite a high rate to succeed, we will see

[chessnut]

LoL, Who in his sane brains will think that LTC is the "next best thing"??  
LTC has been here long time ago and it has already his massive pumps and dumps. It is more reasonable to take a look to any of those 2º generation cryptos like nxt, etherium, xcp and so on. Most of them probably fail loudly, but I am sure one of these is called to be the "next best thing".

we look at the charts, and we thinks. LTCBTC is behaving fishy.

EDIT: silly me, it's just huobi adding LTC. we might see a rally.

[creekbore]

While I'm hoping that everyone's bullishness comes to pass, I can't help thinking that until the numbers below improve (ie the bid volume increases and the ratio levels out) we are not going anywhere.  I appreciate there is probably a lot of funds sitting on the sidelines.

BitStamp bid/ask

Whole bid volume ----------- Ratio -----------Whole ask volume

14,407,503.04 USD -----------1 : 1.25 --------  18,055,159.13 USD
34,899.29 BTC ------------1 : 0.55 as BTC -----19,358.65 BTC

Edit: formatting

[seleme]

when bitcoin hits the ceiling in terms of USD value, will the world accept forever that 1BTC= 40 LTC when there are only 4x as much? again, it is a binary move, litecoin will claw to parity with bitcoin over time, or it will fall to zero.

I don't think it is that easy. Fiat currencies' market caps are big and small, and have some relation to their underlying economies, respectively. They also fluctuate against each other.

If LTC userbase is roughly constant 1/10 of BTC, and # of LTC in circulation is 4 times more, then it is realistic to assume that the ratio would be 1:40 perpetually.

The only way for LTC to achieve parity with USD is to actually make every present and future BTC holder to actually hold (an equal value of) LTC, which is quite ridiculous, don't you think so?

I do hold more value in LTC than in BTC, it is true that the current inflation of LTC is 8 times higher than BTC, but the huge trading volume that matches and surpass the BTC trading volume means that there is a big chance for growth,  I did also notice that the sell/buy amounts are shrinking more and more with the huge volume, which could means that LTC is changing hands, which is good.

I usually don't like to compare BTC with LTC, this really doesn't work, BTC has a first mover advantage, network effect, loyalty.... but LTC offer a 2nd choice and I do like choices, and to be honest, name any legitimate alts that have a real development going ? really few if any....  


I have been watching this chart for few months now, and I decided lately to invest a bit more into LTC, best decision ever  




 

You're using data from the period when LTC is highly speculated based on Huobi stuff  

But since LTC goes up to 0.035 regularly than buying now is almost guarantees profit though (buying few days ago was even more guaranteed, lol). There are lot of alts near the bottom though where the potential profit is even bigger than LTC one though.

I have been looking to this for almost 3 months now, LTC has a really huge volume without exaggerating... 

It has big volume for an altcoin and during pumps it's huge one but the pic you posted is misleading, it's because of speculation about China sites in last few days.

[gog1]

I am holding about a 70% BTC, 30% LTC portfolio.   I have been much more profitable on my LTC because of my dollar cost average of everything.   Obviously, it is also because I was a little bit behind on my timing for buying the majority of my BTC.   I don't think LTC will ever reach 1/4 of the value of BTC, but the ratio will most likely increase to significantly higher levels than now.   I think it is mainly attractive because of the confirmation times as well as the psychological thought that it is the "next best thing"  for people who feel they missed the boat with BTC

LoL, Who in his sane brains will think that LTC is the "next best thing"?? 
LTC has been here long time ago and it has already his massive pumps and dumps. It is more reasonable to take a look to any of those 2º generation cryptos like nxt, etherium, xcp and so on. Most of them probably fail loudly, but I am sure one of these is called to be the "next best thing".

a lot of the those second generation coin smells like ripple, a bunch of pre-mine scamcoin or closed system for speculative purposes.

[Bitcoin_is_here_to_stay]

I do not understand all this ripple hate here (i.e. pre-mined scamcoin, lol). Ripple protocol is exactly what somebody above said would facilitate bitcoin adoption - a way to conveniently deal with many currencies, without the hassle for the user.

True, pre-mine makes XRP a bad get-rich-quick scheme - but what does it have to do with technology?

So far, whenever we see somebody embracing bitcoin - even regulators or Wall Street - there was very positive reaction. Except for ripple, for some reason?

[TERA]

I do not understand all this ripple hate here (i.e. pre-mined scamcoin, lol). Ripple protocol is exactly what somebody above said would facilitate bitcoin adoption - a way to conveniently deal with many currencies, without the hassle for the user.

True, pre-mine makes XRP a bad get-rich-quick scheme - but what does it have to do with technology?

So far, whenever we see somebody embracing bitcoin - even regulators or Wall Street - there was very positive reaction. Except for ripple, for some reason?

I think it's because ripple is centralized.

[smoothie]

Oh I remember how many die-hard bitcoin ONLY advocates who were bashing Litecoin in 2011 and 2012...now are ALL SILENT.

They had no vision to see LTC as a viable alternative. They missed the very fundamental concept that in free markets there will always be competition.

It would not surprise me if the amount of people who invest in Litecoin increases dramatically over this next year.


HINT: IN 2013 Bitcoin first hit ~$50 in March 2013....Litecoin hit ~$50 in November 2013. So EIGHT months later Litecoin basically hit the same Bitcoin value eight months earlier.


Seems like this ^ will repeat in an accelerated way. Let us watch.

[Bitcoin_is_here_to_stay]

I do not understand all this ripple hate here (i.e. pre-mined scamcoin, lol). Ripple protocol is exactly what somebody above said would facilitate bitcoin adoption - a way to conveniently deal with many currencies, without the hassle for the user.

True, pre-mine makes XRP a bad get-rich-quick scheme - but what does it have to do with technology?

So far, whenever we see somebody embracing bitcoin - even regulators or Wall Street - there was very positive reaction. Except for ripple, for some reason?

I think it's because ripple is centralized.

I think you are still talking currency (XRP) not technology (ripple protocol) that allows decentralized exchanges (so we will not to have to deal with Mt Gox-likes or traditional exchanges).

Btw, Mazacoin - which is premined, centralized and an apparently a complete copycat of an existing protocol was declared "wonderful" by somebody from The Bitcoin Foundation (which, I hear, does not represent any true bitcoiners, but that is another story ) 

[chesthing]

Can someone who knows more about how the markets work (won't be hard to find) explain ltc's immediate jump from .025 to .027 this morning? I understand it was because of the Huobi news, but why the near perfect  ,,,,,,,,,,,l'''''''''''''' in the price? it's as if all the traders were waiting for this news and they all decided .027 was the next reasonable price...

[EEPICYOO]

Oh I remember how many die-hard bitcoin ONLY advocates who were bashing Litecoin in 2011 and 2012...now are ALL SILENT.

They had no vision to see LTC as a viable alternative. They missed the very fundamental concept that in free markets there will always be competition.

It would not surprise me if the amount of people who invest in Litecoin increases dramatically over this next year.


HINT: IN 2013 Bitcoin first hit ~$50 in March 2013....Litecoin hit ~$50 in November 2013. So EIGHT months later Litecoin basically hit the same Bitcoin value eight months earlier.


Seems like this ^ will repeat in an accelerated way. Let us watch.

litecoin is more powerful only in the sense there are more clones of it floating around...;-) mmmm  k?

[mgburks77]

I've actually ended up using litecoin almost exclusively in my trading against other alt coins. I started off with btc/usd only, then started trading btc/ltc, then ltc/nxt and back, and then to mintcoin/btc but recently I've found better opportunity in mnt/ltc and been able to increase my stake nicely.

I like litecoin. I'm finding I don't mind using several coins. I just wish there was more stuff I could spend them on. There's someone developing a service that's supposed enable spending of several cryptos on Amazon. If that comes through I think it will really enhance the perception of utility and value of cryptos in general.

[EEPICYOO]

I've actually ended up using litecoin almost exclusively in my trading against other alt coins. I started off with btc/usd only, then started trading btc/ltc, then ltc/nxt and back, and then to mintcoin/btc but recently I've found better opportunity in mnt/ltc and been able to increase my stake nicely.

I like litecoin. I'm finding I don't mind using several coins. I just wish there was more stuff I could spend them on. There's someone developing a service that's supposed enable spending of several cryptos on Amazon. If that comes through I think it will really enhance the perception of utility and value of cryptos in general.

bath salts and rigged dice games aren't cutting it aye? =O

[mgburks77]

I've actually ended up using litecoin almost exclusively in my trading against other alt coins. I started off with btc/usd only, then started trading btc/ltc, then ltc/nxt and back, and then to mintcoin/btc but recently I've found better opportunity in mnt/ltc and been able to increase my stake nicely.

I like litecoin. I'm finding I don't mind using several coins. I just wish there was more stuff I could spend them on. There's someone developing a service that's supposed enable spending of several cryptos on Amazon. If that comes through I think it will really enhance the perception of utility and value of cryptos in general.

bath salts and rigged dice games aren't cutting it aye? =O

You have the same kind of opinion about altcoins that a fiat user has about btc. (ie you must be one drugs) lol

However, you've been smoking bath salts if you think wasting energy to secure the blockchain fits the criteria for mass adoption. Cryptocurrency is here to stay. That particular feature of cryptocurrency isn't.

Where does that leave btc? It is absolutely retarded to propose that btc is any different than any other alternative currency. It's actually weaker position to take than almost any good PoS coin is because of this design flaw.

[hdbuck]

I've actually ended up using litecoin almost exclusively in my trading against other alt coins. I started off with btc/usd only, then started trading btc/ltc, then ltc/nxt and back, and then to mintcoin/btc but recently I've found better opportunity in mnt/ltc and been able to increase my stake nicely.

I like litecoin. I'm finding I don't mind using several coins. I just wish there was more stuff I could spend them on. There's someone developing a service that's supposed enable spending of several cryptos on Amazon. If that comes through I think it will really enhance the perception of utility and value of cryptos in general.

bath salts and rigged dice games aren't cutting it aye? =O

You have the same kind of opinion about altcoins that a fiat user has about btc. (ie you must be one drugs) lol

However, you've been smoking bath salts if you think wasting energy to secure the blockchain fits the criteria for mass adoption. Cryptocurrency is here to stay. That particular feature of cryptocurrency isn't.

Where does that leave btc? It is absolutely retarded to propose that btc is any different than any other alternative currency. It's actually weaker position to take than almost any good PoS coin is because of this design flaw.

uh?! really?
im all in on doge 

[mgburks77]

it's an objective analysis of the situation. yours isn't