[ANN] [BEN] Benjamins ◄ SHA-256 ►◄ BOUNTY AVAILABLE to make BEN merge mineable!!

[crackfoo]

I found the problem. We will have to fork it. I will let you guys know before we do and there will be plenty of time to update

ok

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[tuner]

if we will have to fork it, i would also suggest implementing quicker difficulty changes, since now it was quite a long time to get to this diff readjusment when a lot of miners left benjamins:)

I found the problem. We will have to fork it. I will let you guys know before we do and there will be plenty of time to update

[Mortimer452]

if we will have to fork it, i would also suggest implementing quicker difficulty changes, since now it was quite a long time to get to this diff readjusment when a lot of miners left benjamins:)

I found the problem. We will have to fork it. I will let you guys know before we do and there will be plenty of time to update

Agreed - we are already at 15x longer than normal blockrates now (16 minutes), I can only assume we will be at 30+ min blocks with this bizarre diff adjustment.  That puts the next diff adjustment at (2016 blocks * 30mins = 60,480mins = 1,008 hours = 42 days) assuming consistent network hashrate.  But that is likely to go down even further now.

[AllAboutTheBenjaminsBaby]

No. The problem is that I fucked up and didn't switch the spacing back between testnet and mainnet

static const int64 nTargetSpacing = 10 * 60;

I have no excuse as to why I didn't notice it until now. We had special numbers for testnet, and I must have forgotten to switch it before the final compile

Should we fork it or roll with the longer block times? It's up to you guys. I fucked up, no excuse

The good news, I guess, is that your Benjamins are about 10 times more rare than they were supposed to be

[iGotSpots]

You're already a month in. I would just leave it at this point. If you shorten it down now the dumpers will have a lot more power

[tuner]

dont be hard on yourself, mistakes sometimes happen ant this is minor one, i think nobody will have troubles redownloading a new wallet.
I would vote for forking

No. The problem is that I fucked up and didn't switch the spacing back between testnet and mainnet

static const int64 nTargetSpacing = 10 * 60;

I have no excuse as to why I didn't notice it until now. We had special numbers for testnet, and I must have forgotten to switch it before the final compile

Should we fork it or roll with the longer block times? It's up to you guys. I fucked up, no excuse

The good news, I guess, is that your Benjamins are about 10 times more rare than they were supposed to be

[Mortimer452]

No. The problem is that I fucked up and didn't switch the spacing back between testnet and mainnet

static const int64 nTargetSpacing = 10 * 60;

I have no excuse as to why I didn't notice it until now. We had special numbers for testnet, and I must have forgotten to switch it before the final compile

Should we fork it or roll with the longer block times? It's up to you guys. I fucked up, no excuse

The good news, I guess, is that your Benjamins are about 10 times more rare than they were supposed to be

I'm confused - the above looks like BEN is supposed to have 10 minute block times

Diff adjustment still doesn't make sense in that case, we we already at 15+ min block times so it should have adjusted down by about 50%

[crackfoo]

if we will have to fork it, i would also suggest implementing quicker difficulty changes, since now it was quite a long time to get to this diff readjusment when a lot of miners left benjamins:)

I found the problem. We will have to fork it. I will let you guys know before we do and there will be plenty of time to update

Agreed - we are already at 15x longer than normal blockrates now (16 minutes), I can only assume we will be at 30+ min blocks with this bizarre diff adjustment.  That puts the next diff adjustment at (2016 blocks * 30mins = 60,480mins = 1,008 hours = 42 days) assuming consistent network hashrate.  But that is likely to go down even further now.

yeah, my pool pretty much emptied out now.

[AllAboutTheBenjaminsBaby]

Correct in what the target is currently. Difficulty is making sense if you use those numbers in the math. The block count is way ahead of where we should be with that target time

[AllAboutTheBenjaminsBaby]

We are going to have a discussion tonight between not only our team, but also Paysha devs and someone from our marketing team to figure out what we are going to do here

The only bad news is that blocks are slower than anticipated. The good news is that your coins are much more rare than thought and the network is secure, so there is no chance of losing anything no matter what we decide to do moving forward

Opinions are always welcome. I have a feeling most will be negative for a little while, but that's fine. Everything else is still on schedule and going to plan

[Mortimer452]

Correct in what the target is currently. Difficulty is making sense if you use those numbers in the math. The block count is way ahead of where we should be with that target time

Ahh, I think I get it - the diff retarget is using the current bock height versus expected block height to determine next difficulty, rather than current network block time.  That explains the huge diff jump, we *should* be at block ~4400 right now

So, this coin is pretty much a clone of BTC, with 10 min block times and 2-week retarget, just with different rewards structure.

My vote goes to a fork asap.  The much, much longer block times not only affect mining but all transactions on the network - BEN is now looking at 30+ minutes per confirmation which will not stand a chance against other coins if the plan is to use BEN for purchasing power through payment providers such as Paysha.

I vote for forking back to the announced coin parameters of 64 second block times, and a much shorter diff retarget, something closer to 60 blocks (~1 hour) rather than 2016.  Just my $0.02

[crackfoo]

Correct in what the target is currently. Difficulty is making sense if you use those numbers in the math. The block count is way ahead of where we should be with that target time

Ahh, I think I get it - the diff retarget is using the current bock height versus expected block height to determine next difficulty, rather than current network block time.  That explains the huge diff jump, we *should* be at block ~4400 right now

So, this coin is pretty much a clone of BTC, with 10 min block times and 2-week retarget, just with different rewards structure.

My vote goes to a fork asap.  The much, much longer block times not only affect mining but all transactions on the network - BEN is now looking at 30+ minutes per confirmation which will not stand a chance against other coins if the plan is to use BEN for purchasing power through payment providers such as Paysha.

I vote for forking back to the announced coin parameters of 64 second block times, and a much shorter diff retarget, something closer to 60 blocks (~1 hour) rather than 2016.  Just my $0.02

+1

[Paysha]

Correct in what the target is currently. Difficulty is making sense if you use those numbers in the math. The block count is way ahead of where we should be with that target time

Ahh, I think I get it - the diff retarget is using the current bock height versus expected block height to determine next difficulty, rather than current network block time.  That explains the huge diff jump, we *should* be at block ~4400 right now

So, this coin is pretty much a clone of BTC, with 10 min block times and 2-week retarget, just with different rewards structure.

My vote goes to a fork asap.  The much, much longer block times not only affect mining but all transactions on the network - BEN is now looking at 30+ minutes per confirmation which will not stand a chance against other coins if the plan is to use BEN for purchasing power through payment providers such as Paysha.

I vote for forking back to the announced coin parameters of 64 second block times, and a much shorter diff retarget, something closer to 60 blocks (~1 hour) rather than 2016.  Just my $0.02

This would affect people trying to buy a soda with it, yes. However, retailers and merchants are used to 2-3 days for transfers via ACH. If it were to stay at 10 minute blocks, it would allow Paysha to process payments earlier than 6 confirmations. Also, in the long run, 10 minute block times are much more secure than 64 seconds. The other 3 coins are secured by large hashrates, Benjamins doesn't have that yet, so the longer block times would help it stay safer, if anyone cares what I think about the situation

It doesn't matter to us either way, but it is our responsibility to give pros and cons for both options as an outside observer. It's pretty close to Bitcoin's numbers, but Bitcoin also started with just CPU mining, so it is a fairly interesting idea showing the impact ASIC miners would have had on Bitcoin when it first launched

Either way, we will still process Benjamins payments, whether it forks or not

[Mortimer452]

Correct in what the target is currently. Difficulty is making sense if you use those numbers in the math. The block count is way ahead of where we should be with that target time

Ahh, I think I get it - the diff retarget is using the current bock height versus expected block height to determine next difficulty, rather than current network block time.  That explains the huge diff jump, we *should* be at block ~4400 right now

So, this coin is pretty much a clone of BTC, with 10 min block times and 2-week retarget, just with different rewards structure.

My vote goes to a fork asap.  The much, much longer block times not only affect mining but all transactions on the network - BEN is now looking at 30+ minutes per confirmation which will not stand a chance against other coins if the plan is to use BEN for purchasing power through payment providers such as Paysha.

I vote for forking back to the announced coin parameters of 64 second block times, and a much shorter diff retarget, something closer to 60 blocks (~1 hour) rather than 2016.  Just my $0.02

This would affect people trying to buy a soda with it, yes. However, retailers and merchants are used to 2-3 days for transfers via ACH. If it were to stay at 10 minute blocks, it would allow Paysha to process payments earlier than 6 confirmations. Also, in the long run, 10 minute block times are much more secure than 64 seconds. The other 3 coins are secured by large hashrates, Benjamins doesn't have that yet, so the longer block times would help it stay safer, if anyone cares what I think about the situation

It doesn't matter to us either way, but it is our responsibility to give pros and cons for both options as an outside observer. It's pretty close to Bitcoin's numbers, but Bitcoin also started with just CPU mining, so it is a fairly interesting idea showing the impact ASIC miners would have had on Bitcoin when it first launched

Either way, we will still process Benjamins payments, whether it forks or not

I agree 2-3 days for ACH transfers is pretty normal, but that's more on the back-end, not at the point-of-sale.  

Right now BEN is looking at 30+ minutes per confirmation just to send coins.  That means if you go to a website, buy stuff, checkout and pay with BEN, the merchant can't know whether he was paid for something like 2-3 hours (length of time for 4-6 confirmations).  It would be like if you swiped your card at Best Buy and the checkout clerk had to wait for 3 hours before she knew your card was approved.  That just can't work.

Cryptocurrencies will probably never offer the same "instant approval" that credit card processing does, but waiting 15 minutes or so is a pretty acceptable compromise in trade for much, much lower fees and much, much less regulatory hassle.  30 minutes per confirmation just isn't going to work.  

At current network hashrates BEN will be stuck with 30 minute confirmations for the next 42 days.  As the days go on, unless BEN's exchange prices go up dramatically, this will increase to 60 minutes or longer, as more miners bail due to the extremely low profitability of this coin.  It will be months before the diff adjusts again and gets us back down to "normal" 10-minute block times.

If anything - I think this goes to show (yet again) that the original BitCoin parameters do *NOT* work in today's world of high-powered ASIC's and drive-by miners.  BTC is only able to stay alive with these parameters due to its massive network hashrate - it's just too big to be swung one way or another.  

Today's coins *require* faster confirmation times and faster difficulty adjustments, or they fail.  EVERY semi-successful coin I have been involved with over the past 6 months that has started with > 1 hour diff retarget has eventually been forced to implement KGW or retarget after every block.  Unfortunately that's just the way it is now.

[Paysha]

Correct in what the target is currently. Difficulty is making sense if you use those numbers in the math. The block count is way ahead of where we should be with that target time

Ahh, I think I get it - the diff retarget is using the current bock height versus expected block height to determine next difficulty, rather than current network block time.  That explains the huge diff jump, we *should* be at block ~4400 right now

So, this coin is pretty much a clone of BTC, with 10 min block times and 2-week retarget, just with different rewards structure.

My vote goes to a fork asap.  The much, much longer block times not only affect mining but all transactions on the network - BEN is now looking at 30+ minutes per confirmation which will not stand a chance against other coins if the plan is to use BEN for purchasing power through payment providers such as Paysha.

I vote for forking back to the announced coin parameters of 64 second block times, and a much shorter diff retarget, something closer to 60 blocks (~1 hour) rather than 2016.  Just my $0.02

This would affect people trying to buy a soda with it, yes. However, retailers and merchants are used to 2-3 days for transfers via ACH. If it were to stay at 10 minute blocks, it would allow Paysha to process payments earlier than 6 confirmations. Also, in the long run, 10 minute block times are much more secure than 64 seconds. The other 3 coins are secured by large hashrates, Benjamins doesn't have that yet, so the longer block times would help it stay safer, if anyone cares what I think about the situation

It doesn't matter to us either way, but it is our responsibility to give pros and cons for both options as an outside observer. It's pretty close to Bitcoin's numbers, but Bitcoin also started with just CPU mining, so it is a fairly interesting idea showing the impact ASIC miners would have had on Bitcoin when it first launched

Either way, we will still process Benjamins payments, whether it forks or not

I agree 2-3 days for ACH transfers is pretty normal, but that's more on the back-end, not at the point-of-sale.  

Right now BEN is looking at 30+ minutes per confirmation just to send coins.  That means if you go to a website, buy stuff, checkout and pay with BEN, the merchant can't know whether he was paid for something like 2-3 hours (length of time for 4-6 confirmations).  It would be like if you swiped your card at Best Buy and the checkout clerk had to wait for 3 hours before she knew your card was approved.  That just can't work.

Cryptocurrencies will probably never offer the same "instant approval" that credit card processing does, but waiting 15 minutes or so is a pretty acceptable compromise in trade for much, much lower fees and much, much less regulatory hassle.  30 minutes per confirmation just isn't going to work.  

At current network hashrates BEN will be stuck with 30 minute confirmations for the next 42 days.  As the days go on, unless BEN's exchange prices go up dramatically, this will increase to 60 minutes or longer, as more miners bail due to the extremely low profitability of this coin.  It will be months before the diff adjusts again and gets us back down to "normal" 10-minute block times.

If anything - I think this goes to show (yet again) that the original BitCoin parameters do *NOT* work in today's world of high-powered ASIC's and drive-by miners.  BTC is only able to stay alive with these parameters due to its massive network hashrate - it's just too big to be swung one way or another.  

Today's coins *require* faster confirmation times and faster difficulty adjustments, or they fail.  EVERY semi-successful coin I have been involved with over the past 6 months that has started with > 1 hour diff retarget has eventually been forced to implement KGW or retarget after every block.  Unfortunately that's just the way it is now

Keeping it at 10 minutes would make our life a lot easier, I should say, since all 4 coins on the site would be the same block times

If a fork were to happen, I would suggest merged mining. That would speed it up quite a bit, but destroy the price most likely. Otherwise I wouldn't bother changing it, but it's not up to me. I don't think they are really trying to be the new groundbreaking coin, but more of a solid system that can be used for payments

[crackfoo]

Next Network Block   24198    (Current: 24197)
Last Block Found   24194
Time Since Last Block   5 hours 6 minutes 25 seconds

moved only 3 blocks in 5 hours.

[crackfoo]

You could probably fork it at 24240 and it'd be plenty of time.

[itsunderstood]

Woo I am top speed on hasher.ca for benjamins.  Oh and I figured out my wallet problems, they were simply network related.   benjamins wallet now syncing all good.

edit

I don't think you guys are giving enough time, this coin has a likeable difficulty in terms of not being a trashcoin from the start, for what y'all are talking, doge is the winner since they have tons of tx's but I like Benjamins because they have the potential to really catch on.  

Frankly, I will look for coins like this that have the same profile as BTC and if this one changes to fit the tx-count modality, I would probably like it less.  When I look at the charting on coinwarz, Benjamins is the only one that resembles something with growing value, and the name is pretty good I think.

Well anyway I am glad to be helping but if you stick to it and wrangle more SHA miners (get these new cubes people are buying and win them over to our side) then the muscle will make the tx situation better.  I would prefer to mine coins that are set with a long-term value scheme, I sense one of these BTC offspring will have the right mix of market and support and magic.  I feel Ben could have that.

[luongdk]

I don't care.
Just bought several thousands, move to cold storage, close all the web and wait for 6 or 12 months later.

[itsunderstood]

I don't care.
Just bought several thousands, move to cold storage, close all the web and wait for 6 or 12 months later.

Your grandchildren will thank you.  Don't lose the key