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Author Topic: [XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency  (Read 4554130 times)
fluffypony
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October 22, 2014, 05:55:47 PM
 #15901

https://forum.monero.cc/2/economics-and-trading

Anyone else get an error "Woops something went wrong" when trying to go to monero forum?

I just got it by clicking on your link... "Whoops, looks like something went wrong."

edit - going to the main forum site works fine. maybe it's just that post you are referencing got deleted?  Cry

That's a link to the whole Economics and Trading Section of the forum, and I noticed the same problem today when clicking on that section from the main forum page.

Try again - we've just deployed a fix for a bug that affected users not logged in:)

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nioc
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out of the blue and into the black


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October 22, 2014, 06:04:05 PM
 #15902

The developers of this coin were the major sponsors of that GUI wallet project.

There is nothing wrong with third party wallets. Having multiple wallets to serve different audiences is a good thing. All of the major wallets for Bitcoin are third party, including Electrum, Multibit, Mycelium, Blockchain.info, etc.

The developers sponsored it, decided it wasn't good enough and then started making a new one from scratch. The new one has been in development for many months.

I took that as an indication of no confidence from the development team.

As I recall it was more like, we know the GUI we want will take a while due to the changes needed to the core to make this possible.  Core changes are a higher priority at this point.  We are offering a bounty to those that can develop a GUI for the current state of development. 

I have no idea what the state or usability of the GUIs are as the CLI works for me.  I never used command line before Monero.

If you don't know where you're going any road will get you there
surfer43
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October 22, 2014, 06:05:45 PM
 #15903

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We have managed to recover wallets from the old server that failed to migrate to "V2": FLT, KARMA, MIN, XCR, XMR, FAIR, SUPER, TES
https://twitter.com/MintPalExchange/status/524963448917344256

smooth
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October 22, 2014, 06:09:43 PM
Last edit: October 22, 2014, 07:13:17 PM by smooth
 #15904

The developers of this coin were the major sponsors of that GUI wallet project.

There is nothing wrong with third party wallets. Having multiple wallets to serve different audiences is a good thing. All of the major wallets for Bitcoin are third party, including Electrum, Multibit, Mycelium, Blockchain.info, etc.

The developers sponsored it, decided it wasn't good enough and then started making a new one from scratch. The new one has been in development for many months.

I took that as an indication of no confidence from the development team.

"Not good enough" is a relative. If the were "not good enough" in an absolute sense, the bounty wouldn't have been awarded at all.

We are doing something (we hope will be) better, but it is also an ambitious brand new design and has always been described as a long term project. Using what exists right now makes a whole lot makes more sense than complaining that an ambitious brand new design and development project isn't done yet.
darlidada
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October 22, 2014, 06:27:29 PM
 #15905

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We have managed to recover wallets from the old server that failed to migrate to "V2": FLT, KARMA, MIN, XCR, XMR, FAIR, SUPER, TES
https://twitter.com/MintPalExchange/status/524963448917344256

thats good no? if true statdude and everyone else will get their xmr back. hopefully he hasnt sell his account yet. would be very unfortunate.
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October 22, 2014, 06:55:29 PM
 #15906

Try again - we've just deployed a fix for a bug that affected users not logged in:)

Thanks fluffypony. That works for me.  Smiley
25hashcoin
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October 22, 2014, 07:41:44 PM
 #15907

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We have managed to recover wallets from the old server that failed to migrate to "V2": FLT, KARMA, MIN, XCR, XMR, FAIR, SUPER, TES
https://twitter.com/MintPalExchange/status/524963448917344256

thats good no? if true statdude and everyone else will get their xmr back. hopefully he hasnt sell his account yet. would be very unfortunate.



I hope its true, but there is no reason to believe anything they say. I also have 1200 XMR missing.

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October 22, 2014, 10:08:55 PM
 #15908

https://forum.monero.cc/2/economics-and-trading

Anyone else get an error "Woops something went wrong" when trying to go to monero forum?

I just got it by clicking on your link... "Whoops, looks like something went wrong."

edit - going to the main forum site works fine. maybe it's just that post you are referencing got deleted?  Cry

That's a link to the whole Economics and Trading Section of the forum, and I noticed the same problem today when clicking on that section from the main forum page.

Try again - we've just deployed a fix for a bug that affected users not logged in:)

works now, thanks smooth.
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Enabling the maximal migration


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October 23, 2014, 12:02:49 AM
 #15909

In the wake of http://www.blockstream.com/ essentially making sidechains an inevitability - what is the point of holding XMR now? Wont all of the privacy Monero offers be available within the bitcoin blockchain?

Bro, do you even blockchain?
-E Voorhees
akula999
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October 23, 2014, 12:41:34 AM
 #15910

Why is the price of XMR going down? Is this a correction?

Bitcoin: 1FzZehkiwfeeUmfmBrym8VvXX7gUj3miHe
XMR: 4AqrzGPfEKeZrVXyPDNXUrNeKZZGNYiXMDoY49PvdffKNTRg6xp2Qz74SZ72gT5F9HH8Vaic99ndRg6 UBGcVijaNStQjwwf
aminorex
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October 23, 2014, 02:46:41 AM
 #15911

In the wake of http://www.blockstream.com/ essentially making sidechains an inevitability - what is the point of holding XMR now? Wont all of the privacy Monero offers be available within the bitcoin blockchain?

how?

Give a man a fish and he eats for a day.  Give a man a Poisson distribution and he eats at random times independent of one another, at a constant known rate.
lebing
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October 23, 2014, 02:51:59 AM
 #15912

In the wake of http://www.blockstream.com/ essentially making sidechains an inevitability - what is the point of holding XMR now? Wont all of the privacy Monero offers be available within the bitcoin blockchain?

how?

As I understand sidechains, you can essentially utilize all of the functionality of an alt while remaining on the bitcoin blockchain. This therefore removes the need for any alt, including Monero.

Bro, do you even blockchain?
-E Voorhees
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October 23, 2014, 03:02:38 AM
 #15913

In the wake of http://www.blockstream.com/ essentially making sidechains an inevitability - what is the point of holding XMR now? Wont all of the privacy Monero offers be available within the bitcoin blockchain?

how?

As I understand sidechains, you can essentially utilize all of the functionality of an alt while remaining on the bitcoin blockchain. This therefore removes the need for any alt, including Monero.

but it would make it so centralized...
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October 23, 2014, 03:03:13 AM
 #15914

In the wake of http://www.blockstream.com/ essentially making sidechains an inevitability - what is the point of holding XMR now? Wont all of the privacy Monero offers be available within the bitcoin blockchain?

how?

As I understand sidechains, you can essentially utilize all of the functionality of an alt while remaining on the bitcoin blockchain. This therefore removes the need for any alt, including Monero.

i see. it is done by hand-waving.

it is a familiar technique, which accomplishes much - but it does not accomplish what you suggest.

Give a man a fish and he eats for a day.  Give a man a Poisson distribution and he eats at random times independent of one another, at a constant known rate.
lebing
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October 23, 2014, 03:16:00 AM
 #15915

In the wake of http://www.blockstream.com/ essentially making sidechains an inevitability - what is the point of holding XMR now? Wont all of the privacy Monero offers be available within the bitcoin blockchain?

how?

As I understand sidechains, you can essentially utilize all of the functionality of an alt while remaining on the bitcoin blockchain. This therefore removes the need for any alt, including Monero.

i see. it is done by hand-waving.

it is a familiar technique, which accomplishes much - but it does not accomplish what you suggest.

Expecting a serious response to a serious question, but I get trolled. If you are looking to instill confidence in Monero this is not the way to go about it.

Bro, do you even blockchain?
-E Voorhees
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October 23, 2014, 03:18:27 AM
 #15916

In the wake of http://www.blockstream.com/ essentially making sidechains an inevitability - what is the point of holding XMR now? Wont all of the privacy Monero offers be available within the bitcoin blockchain?

how?

As I understand sidechains, you can essentially utilize all of the functionality of an alt while remaining on the bitcoin blockchain. This therefore removes the need for any alt, including Monero.

i see. it is done by hand-waving.

it is a familiar technique, which accomplishes much - but it does not accomplish what you suggest.

Expecting a serious response to a serious question, but I get trolled. If you are looking to instill confidence in Monero this is not the way to go about it.

Side-Chains wouldnt matter. You can already build entire currencies ontop the Bitcoin protocol. All side chains do, as another user suggests, is create a monopoly within Bitcoin, and would stop future innovation in cryptocurrencies. That's why I believe side chains wouldn't be popular, people buy alts for a reason, and that's either for p/d, or the belief that their altcoin will eventually overthrow Bitcoin one day given it improves upon Bitcoins many faults.
lebing
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October 23, 2014, 03:26:00 AM
 #15917


Side-Chains wouldnt matter. You can already build entire currencies ontop the Bitcoin protocol. All side chains do, as another user suggests, is create a monopoly within Bitcoin, and would stop future innovation in cryptocurrencies. That's why I believe side chains wouldn't be popular, people buy alts for a reason, and that's either for p/d, or the belief that their altcoin will eventually overthrow Bitcoin one day given it improves upon Bitcoins many faults.

You can already build entire currencies ontop the Bitcoin protocol

-- Currently, no you cannot do that. In order to change something you would need a fork.

All side chains do, as another user suggests, is create a monopoly within Bitcoin, and would stop future innovation in cryptocurrencies.

-- Side chains allow for all of the innovation of an alt while remaining within the blockchain, so the only thing that is monopolized is the finite number of bitcoins (which is a defining feature of crypto imo). The innovation can still happen just as it would in a pure alt.

Bro, do you even blockchain?
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October 23, 2014, 03:37:01 AM
 #15918


Side-Chains wouldnt matter. You can already build entire currencies ontop the Bitcoin protocol. All side chains do, as another user suggests, is create a monopoly within Bitcoin, and would stop future innovation in cryptocurrencies. That's why I believe side chains wouldn't be popular, people buy alts for a reason, and that's either for p/d, or the belief that their altcoin will eventually overthrow Bitcoin one day given it improves upon Bitcoins many faults.

You can already build entire currencies ontop the Bitcoin protocol

-- Currently, no you cannot do that. In order to change something you would need a fork.

All side chains do, as another user suggests, is create a monopoly within Bitcoin, and would stop future innovation in cryptocurrencies.

-- Side chains allow for all of the innovation of an alt while remaining within the blockchain, so the only thing that is monopolized is the finite number of bitcoins (which is a defining feature of crypto imo). The innovation can still happen just as it would in a pure alt.


Ah you're right about, Currently, no you cannot do that. In order to change something you would need a fork. I was really referring to coins like Counterparty that use the Bitcoin blockchain.

I need to read up more on side chains, but going by your defintiion, I don't see any incentive at all to add side chains to Bitcoin, there would be no incentive to develop the chain(altcoin). And, I believe altcoins are made to improve upon Bitcoin itself or even outdo Bitcoin eventually, so Bitcoin having a sidechain doesnt seem like a threat...



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October 23, 2014, 03:37:40 AM
Last edit: October 23, 2014, 04:35:25 AM by smooth
 #15919

In the wake of http://www.blockstream.com/ essentially making sidechains an inevitability - what is the point of holding XMR now? Wont all of the privacy Monero offers be available within the bitcoin blockchain?

I think the answer is no. First of all it is questionable whether you would really want to hold wealth long term on a sidechain. The security assumptions (even when it comes to things like network hash rate, but in other more fundamental respects as well) are questionable. It is more plausible you might want to use services or features on a side chain by moving your bitcoins there and then, relatively quickly, moving them back to the more secure main chain. For example, this might be be used for mixing, by moving your coins to a sidechain with ring signatures, transacting and then moving them back.

But this ends up being a lot like using a Bitcoin mixer, with many of the same issues such as simultaneity. For example, imagine you are making a donation to some controversial organization and you want to delink the bitcoins you are donating.

So you go ahead and move your coins to a ring-sig sidechain, move them around a few times, and then move them back. Unless other people are doing this at the same time, when you move your coins back to the main chain, you will get the same coins back that you started with.

Alternately, perhaps the organization wants to be all anonymous and stuff, so it publishes an address on the sidechain, and you donate to them there. They then withdraw the coins back to the main chain, and they get the exact Bitcoins you sent to the side chain.

Obviously if there are a few other people doing the transfers at the same time, there is a degree of mixing, but it is fairly limited.

I don't think a side chain with a specialized purpose can achieve the same degree of anonymity as a coin designed for that purpose, where the entire chain is being mixed and remixed continually. That is an emperical question though. It is possible that a Bitcoin side chain could get more usage and greater trust of its security for long term holdings than Monero will have. More usage would address the mixing issue to a some extent and trust in the security would address the need to constantly move coins back and forth (though there still may be a loss of network effect here). None of this is clear at all.

I also think it is possible the market may simply reject the notion of adopting the Bitcoin currency for everything. It will be an interesting experiment to decouple new features from using a different currency. We may well find that the reason for altcoins is not the features!



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October 23, 2014, 05:30:00 AM
 #15920

you know monero is undervalued if



lol. What happened to CannabisCoin since last week? I no longer see it on the list.

Great to see that we're above BitShares PTS now: https://coinmarketcap.com/all/views/all/

And we're now only behind Namecoin, which has 2.5 times our market cap.
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