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Author Topic: [ANN][VRC] VeriCoin Proof of Stake-Time Currency | New Roadmap Released  (Read 1346479 times)
MAD945
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September 09, 2014, 10:23:48 PM
 #15841

Ok Doug can you lay it out because there seems to be some confusion here Undecided

We are integrating with SuperNET, working with James on a special project specifically for VeriCoin, I am a trustee of the SuperNET escrow, but the core coin final vote has not occured yet.  However this doesn't change our special positioning in SuperNET it reflects that some things are not yet complete and we are in a very good position.

Thank you for clarifying Doug...can you also clarify what Vericoin's special position is in the SuperNET.

Thanks again
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September 09, 2014, 10:30:15 PM
 #15842

Ok Doug can you lay it out because there seems to be some confusion here Undecided

We are integrating with SuperNET, working with James on a special project specifically for VeriCoin, I am a trustee of the SuperNET escrow, but the core coin final vote has not occured yet.  However this doesn't change our special positioning in SuperNET it reflects that some things are not yet complete and we are in a very good position.

Thank you for clarifying Doug...can you also clarify what Vericoin's special position is in the SuperNET.

Thanks again

James' envisioned role for VeriCoin is mostly the entry point from the fiat world into crypto and the SuperNET.  Our role will be accessing new users from the non crypto market in addition to the crypto market.  This is a unique position and compatible with our vision for VeriCoin originally.  Now it would be with a more substantial infrastructure under which this may flourish to unseen levels, while also enabling access to some of the best cutting edge blockchain tech.
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September 09, 2014, 10:37:30 PM
 #15843

Ok Doug can you lay it out because there seems to be some confusion here Undecided

We are integrating with SuperNET, working with James on a special project specifically for VeriCoin, I am a trustee of the SuperNET escrow, but the core coin final vote has not occured yet.  However this doesn't change our special positioning in SuperNET it reflects that some things are not yet complete and we are in a very good position.

Thank you for clarifying Doug...can you also clarify what Vericoin's special position is in the SuperNET.

Thanks again

James' envisioned role for VeriCoin is mostly the entry point from the fiat world into crypto and the SuperNET.  Our role will be accessing new users from the non crypto market in addition to the crypto market.  This is a unique position and compatible with our vision for VeriCoin originally.  Now with a more substantial infrastructure under which this may flourish to unseen levels, while also enabling access to some of the best cutting edge blockchain tech.

Great...Thanks again!
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September 09, 2014, 10:55:52 PM
 #15844

Let's all just get along and quit the insults among us.  Like I posted a while back.  Group hug.  Come on all together now.   Grin

Welcome to the SuperNET, VRC boyz/girlz/thingz !
Group hugs will, i'm afraid, be compulsory from now on  Grin


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September 09, 2014, 11:02:29 PM
 #15845

Let's all just get along and quit the insults among us.  Like I posted a while back.  Group hug.  Come on all together now.   Grin

Welcome to the SuperNET, VRC boyz/girlz/thingz !
Group hugs will, i'm afraid, be compulsory from now on  Grin



Thanks EvilDave...Welcome to the Vericoin Community!
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September 09, 2014, 11:03:49 PM
 #15846

Some final details for SuperNET
Need to form a 7 member committee for authorizing expenditures as described in: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762346.msg8748412#msg8748412

if you are interested in volunteering, please post in https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=5264.0

The SuperNET has at least 4 standard levels of integration and a couple non standard ones. So there is no in/out binary switch, think of it more like a quantum wave function, even with different orbital energy states. I hope this makes it easier to understand.

http://abyss.uoregon.edu/~js/cosmo/lectures/lec08.html is decent explanation.

James


http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
100+ page annual report for SuperNET
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September 09, 2014, 11:12:52 PM
 #15847

@nosker and @pike:

You guys made conflicting statements yesterday about the escrowed vericoin "donated" by the community.

No need, nosker, to add confusion: no need for even mentioning % since James will not be taking anything from the amount donated REGARDLESS if the initial thesholds are reached or not.

The clarifications needed are:

1 - will the coins be returned to the "donors" since there's no longer a requirement for the reserve to exist ir not.
2 - assuming they will not be returned, the only questions are: pike's "management" of those funds include staking them? Trading?or none of the above?

I believe "donors" and potential "donors" will be interested in the clarifications and, above all, that you both, along with the community, are on the same page. As of the last posts on the matter, you are not.

The reserve is going to still serve the initial purpose that James requested, however, we will be managing it according to the community demands instead of James. The escrow will still ensure that 10k satoshi will be sent for each VRC as per the initial terms once the VRC price breaks 50k satoshi. The rest of the stash is to be used for projects that the community will vote on, as per the initial fundraising criteria. We are still aiming for 10% of VRC to be in this fund and hope donations continue to come in.

The coins will not be staked, for now, as donations in are difficult to track once coins are re-aged. They will not be used for anything until the community decides on a fate for them.

Yes we are in full agreement about this.

That being the case the being on the same page is achieved and everyone is quite clear now.

But if you allow me I believe it is a hasty and not very well thought out decision. For instance, you can, right now, sell those 500k+ vrc return 10k sat to each donor and retain the profit (40%) for future projects with no obligations or strings attached. There are many other options that will be much more beneficial to the community that just doing nothing with it. Staking in such amounts is significant and not benefitting at all from it is quite an unnecessary waste... among those many options i would suggest to create a stabilization fund (a la naut) thst would be instrumental in achieving what should be a target gosl for vrc: reduce volatility to dupport "mass" adoption. There are othrrs... like i said, many and all much more beneficial than just putting those funds undrr the mattress. Give it an additional thought or two if you can.

One other thing: getting to above 50k sat, the noskrr presents as a foregone conclusion, is a very tall order. It may not get thrre -let alone to 100k- and much lesd in the more or less agreen upon (clarification on this is also needed) term of thr next 6 months or first week of March 2015...
Patrick.  I too think we should stake the coins because not staking them is like throwing them in the trash.  Just keep track of what the original donation amount was BEFORE the staking takes place.
  If the coins stake for 1 year it could be as simple as simply adding a flat 2.3% rate (or avg interest rate for the year) of the initial donation amount to the .0001 amount that the coins sell for.  

For example, if you donated 50,000, then after crossing the .0005 threshold, the originating address would receive 5000 VRC back plus 1150 in interest after 1 year.  Then if the 2nd threshold was crossed at .001 during the 2nd year, the address would receive another 2500 VRC back plus another 1150 in interest at the end of the 2nd year.  This method is not 100% exact as it misses some compounding interest but it is pretty close and not hard at all to distribute as a once per year dividend to all the donators who came together to support our coin.

In fact I think it would be pretty fun as a community if we all could celebrate "SuperNET Day" once a year around this time to commemorate this bright new path we have embarked upon this week.  And we would all be excited to receive our once per year dividend payouts IF the best case scenario unfolds and we can make it to .0005 before 1 year ends and .001 before year 2 ends.

I don't mind doing the busy work and making an excel spreadsheet detailing each addresses payouts once per year for let's say all donations 1000 and higher.  Smiley
thanx buddy! really appreciate your work and drive for a successful future in crypto!
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September 09, 2014, 11:13:23 PM
 #15848

@nosker and @pike:

You guys made conflicting statements yesterday about the escrowed vericoin "donated" by the community.

No need, nosker, to add confusion: no need for even mentioning % since James will not be taking anything from the amount donated REGARDLESS if the initial thesholds are reached or not.

The clarifications needed are:

1 - will the coins be returned to the "donors" since there's no longer a requirement for the reserve to exist ir not.
2 - assuming they will not be returned, the only questions are: pike's "management" of those funds include staking them? Trading?or none of the above?

I believe "donors" and potential "donors" will be interested in the clarifications and, above all, that you both, along with the community, are on the same page. As of the last posts on the matter, you are not.

The reserve is going to still serve the initial purpose that James requested, however, we will be managing it according to the community demands instead of James. The escrow will still ensure that 10k satoshi will be sent for each VRC as per the initial terms once the VRC price breaks 50k satoshi. The rest of the stash is to be used for projects that the community will vote on, as per the initial fundraising criteria. We are still aiming for 10% of VRC to be in this fund and hope donations continue to come in.

The coins will not be staked, for now, as donations in are difficult to track once coins are re-aged. They will not be used for anything until the community decides on a fate for them.

Yes we are in full agreement about this.

That being the case the being on the same page is achieved and everyone is quite clear now.

But if you allow me I believe it is a hasty and not very well thought out decision. For instance, you can, right now, sell those 500k+ vrc return 10k sat to each donor and retain the profit (40%) for future projects with no obligations or strings attached. There are many other options that will be much more beneficial to the community that just doing nothing with it. Staking in such amounts is significant and not benefitting at all from it is quite an unnecessary waste... among those many options i would suggest to create a stabilization fund (a la naut) thst would be instrumental in achieving what should be a target gosl for vrc: reduce volatility to dupport "mass" adoption. There are othrrs... like i said, many and all much more beneficial than just putting those funds undrr the mattress. Give it an additional thought or two if you can.

One other thing: getting to above 50k sat, the noskrr presents as a foregone conclusion, is a very tall order. It may not get thrre -let alone to 100k- and much lesd in the more or less agreen upon (clarification on this is also needed) term of thr next 6 months or first week of March 2015...
Patrick.  I too think we should stake the coins because not staking them is like throwing them in the trash.  Just keep track of what the original donation amount was BEFORE the staking takes place.
  If the coins stake for 1 year it could be as simple as simply adding a flat 2.3% rate (or avg interest rate for the year) of the initial donation amount to the .0001 amount that the coins sell for.  

For example, if you donated 50,000, then after crossing the .0005 threshold, the originating address would receive 5000 VRC back plus 1150 in interest after 1 year.  Then if the 2nd threshold was crossed at .001 during the 2nd year, the address would receive another 2500 VRC back plus another 1150 in interest at the end of the 2nd year.  This method is not 100% exact as it misses some compounding interest but it is pretty close and not hard at all to distribute as a once per year dividend to all the donators who came together to support our coin.

In fact I think it would be pretty fun as a community if we all could celebrate "SuperNET Day" once a year around this time to commemorate this bright new path we have embarked upon this week.  And we would all be excited to receive our once per year dividend payouts IF the best case scenario unfolds and we can make it to .0005 before 1 year ends and .001 before year 2 ends.

I don't mind doing the busy work and making an excel spreadsheet detailing each addresses payouts once per year for let's say all donations 1000 and higher.  Smiley

I think we should not stake until we've raised what James considers to be a suitable amount. As this was originally intended to be a fundraising activity until we reach 2.7 million VRC, I think he can call the shots as to when we have enough in the escrow. When that happens, we will audit the donations and get both corresponding VRC and BTC addresses for each donor. That way we can split the share evenly, with precision, and know how to refund the coins. Right now, we just have a VRC address. Ultimately we will need a BTC address to pay the 10k satoshi/VRC payment. But if we start staking, the blockchain gets confusing and we really need it to be as simple as possible to track.

Support the VeriFund Endowment.
VRC: VFEndownxxnHea9mv59kZx8c7TysGbndYx
ereborltc
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September 09, 2014, 11:13:42 PM
 #15849

Some final details for SuperNET
Need to form a 7 member committee for authorizing expenditures as described in: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=762346.msg8748412#msg8748412

if you are interested in volunteering, please post in https://nxtforum.org/index.php?topic=5264.0

The SuperNET has at least 4 standard levels of integration and a couple non standard ones. So there is no in/out binary switch, think of it more like a quantum wave function, even with different orbital energy states. I hope this makes it easier to understand.

http://abyss.uoregon.edu/~js/cosmo/lectures/lec08.html is decent explanation.

James


+1

thanx!
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September 09, 2014, 11:16:16 PM
 #15850

@nosker and @pike:

You guys made conflicting statements yesterday about the escrowed vericoin "donated" by the community.

No need, nosker, to add confusion: no need for even mentioning % since James will not be taking anything from the amount donated REGARDLESS if the initial thesholds are reached or not.

The clarifications needed are:

1 - will the coins be returned to the "donors" since there's no longer a requirement for the reserve to exist ir not.
2 - assuming they will not be returned, the only questions are: pike's "management" of those funds include staking them? Trading?or none of the above?

I believe "donors" and potential "donors" will be interested in the clarifications and, above all, that you both, along with the community, are on the same page. As of the last posts on the matter, you are not.

The reserve is going to still serve the initial purpose that James requested, however, we will be managing it according to the community demands instead of James. The escrow will still ensure that 10k satoshi will be sent for each VRC as per the initial terms once the VRC price breaks 50k satoshi. The rest of the stash is to be used for projects that the community will vote on, as per the initial fundraising criteria. We are still aiming for 10% of VRC to be in this fund and hope donations continue to come in.

The coins will not be staked, for now, as donations in are difficult to track once coins are re-aged. They will not be used for anything until the community decides on a fate for them.

Yes we are in full agreement about this.

That being the case the being on the same page is achieved and everyone is quite clear now.

But if you allow me I believe it is a hasty and not very well thought out decision. For instance, you can, right now, sell those 500k+ vrc return 10k sat to each donor and retain the profit (40%) for future projects with no obligations or strings attached. There are many other options that will be much more beneficial to the community that just doing nothing with it. Staking in such amounts is significant and not benefitting at all from it is quite an unnecessary waste... among those many options i would suggest to create a stabilization fund (a la naut) thst would be instrumental in achieving what should be a target gosl for vrc: reduce volatility to dupport "mass" adoption. There are othrrs... like i said, many and all much more beneficial than just putting those funds undrr the mattress. Give it an additional thought or two if you can.

One other thing: getting to above 50k sat, the noskrr presents as a foregone conclusion, is a very tall order. It may not get thrre -let alone to 100k- and much lesd in the more or less agreen upon (clarification on this is also needed) term of thr next 6 months or first week of March 2015...
Patrick.  I too think we should stake the coins because not staking them is like throwing them in the trash.  Just keep track of what the original donation amount was BEFORE the staking takes place.
  If the coins stake for 1 year it could be as simple as simply adding a flat 2.3% rate (or avg interest rate for the year) of the initial donation amount to the .0001 amount that the coins sell for.  

For example, if you donated 50,000, then after crossing the .0005 threshold, the originating address would receive 5000 VRC back plus 1150 in interest after 1 year.  Then if the 2nd threshold was crossed at .001 during the 2nd year, the address would receive another 2500 VRC back plus another 1150 in interest at the end of the 2nd year.  This method is not 100% exact as it misses some compounding interest but it is pretty close and not hard at all to distribute as a once per year dividend to all the donators who came together to support our coin.

In fact I think it would be pretty fun as a community if we all could celebrate "SuperNET Day" once a year around this time to commemorate this bright new path we have embarked upon this week.  And we would all be excited to receive our once per year dividend payouts IF the best case scenario unfolds and we can make it to .0005 before 1 year ends and .001 before year 2 ends.

I don't mind doing the busy work and making an excel spreadsheet detailing each addresses payouts once per year for let's say all donations 1000 and higher.  Smiley

I think we should not stake until we've raised what James considers to be a suitable amount. As this was originally intended to be a fundraising activity until we reach 2.7 million VRC, I think he can call the shots as to when we have enough in the escrow. When that happens, we will audit the donations and get both corresponding VRC and BTC addresses for each donor. That way we can split the share evenly, with precision, and know how to refund the coins. Right now, we just have a VRC address. Ultimately we will need a BTC address to pay the 10k satoshi/VRC payment. But if we start staking, the blockchain gets confusing and we really need it to be as simple as possible to track.
veri true
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September 09, 2014, 11:39:25 PM
 #15851


I think we should not stake until we've raised what James considers to be a suitable amount. As this was originally intended to be a fundraising activity until we reach 2.7 million VRC, I think he can call the shots as to when we have enough in the escrow. When that happens, we will audit the donations and get both corresponding VRC and BTC addresses for each donor. That way we can split the share evenly, with precision, and know how to refund the coins. Right now, we just have a VRC address. Ultimately we will need a BTC address to pay the 10k satoshi/VRC payment. But if we start staking, the blockchain gets confusing and we really need it to be as simple as possible to track.

If my calculations are correct, there is no need to actually convert to BTC to pay people.  You can pay them in VRC just returned to them.  (Ex.  50,000*.5*.0001=2.5BTC, 2.5BTC buys 5000 VRC @ .0005.).  Thus just return 5000 VRC to the originator and no need to sell VRC and pay in BTC.  Or, actually an even better method is just use whatever the VRC price is AT THE TIME of the end of year distribution.  If after 1 year the price is .0006, then your 2.5BTC of value would represent 4166 VRC plus the 1150 of interest.  The key being it's not too difficult to add in the interest portion to each address once we are done with all donating for this project.

Yeah I agree we don't need a BTC address, that was the original intent for simplicity.  Also drkman if you would be willing to build up the spreadsheet (which would help tremendously) then I would be happy to bring the coins online periodically to earn the interest accrued via coinage.  This is also another incentive to make the pot bigger as the community would be getting some significant interest payments over time.
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September 10, 2014, 12:22:26 AM
 #15852


I think we should not stake until we've raised what James considers to be a suitable amount. As this was originally intended to be a fundraising activity until we reach 2.7 million VRC, I think he can call the shots as to when we have enough in the escrow. When that happens, we will audit the donations and get both corresponding VRC and BTC addresses for each donor. That way we can split the share evenly, with precision, and know how to refund the coins. Right now, we just have a VRC address. Ultimately we will need a BTC address to pay the 10k satoshi/VRC payment. But if we start staking, the blockchain gets confusing and we really need it to be as simple as possible to track.

If my calculations are correct, there is no need to actually convert to BTC to pay people.  You can pay them in VRC just returned to them.  (Ex.  50,000*.5*.0001=2.5BTC, 2.5BTC buys 5000 VRC @ .0005.).  Thus just return 5000 VRC to the originator and no need to sell VRC and pay in BTC.  Or, actually an even better method is just use whatever the VRC price is AT THE TIME of the end of year distribution.  If after 1 year the price is .0006, then your 2.5BTC of value would represent 4166 VRC plus the 1150 of interest.  The key being it's not too difficult to add in the interest portion to each address once we are done with all donating for this project.

Yeah I agree we don't need a BTC address, that was the original intent for simplicity.  Also drkman if you would be willing to build up the spreadsheet (which would help tremendously) then I would be happy to bring the coins online periodically to earn the interest accrued via coinage.  This is also another incentive to make the pot bigger as the community would be getting some significant interest payments over time.

No sense in not staking, just make sure to track the deposit amounts
I think that drkman's idea is pretty good. No sense in converting to BTC.

How about this.

1 year after funding is closed or when the price is above .001, there is a return of VRC. In the latter case, 100% of the donated value comes back. It will be a bit less than 10% of the coins you put in, but getting back all the value is the same as the scenario of the option being used.

Now if the price is .0005 to .001 after one year, then it will be more coins coming back than 10%, up to 20%, but again the outcome is similar to the option being exercised.

The unlikely case is that it is less than .0005, and I think in this case, it is just all returned, unless the donor chooses to keep it in.

If there are some external factors that make sense to change the 1 year cutoff, then it would require a stake weighted vote. Now with a united community and all the things that were already in progress, these unlikely scenarios of <ATH for next 12 months, this is not something I am paying much attention to.

Getting to .001 is a long term of working to improve the value and using the best ideas of the community and already I see a transformation into a can-do attitude. The solution to get the staking and the return of VRC, this is from VRC community, not me. I am just the crazy guy who made some impossible demands, that the VRC community achieved.

So, the power is strong within VRC. Know this. The "impossible" is just an excuse for the people who cant get things done.

The VRC devs are really contributing bigtime with the SuperNET project and shaping it to be much better than I can by myself. I am just one guy and need the help of everyone to make crypto all that it can be and this help from VRC community is making more time for me to do the tech. You should know I am the one to help my friends do as well as they can.

I am doing my best to prevent a huge price pump in the VRC and so please do not go all crazy from the optimism. The VRC is still some months away and it does have me as a friend, so be patient, support the devs, accumulate the VRC at the current prices. Dont chase the price, the weakhands (WH) will give you some favors. The WH are favorites of the BTCD community.

A wealthy community is a happy community. I will be a bit busy as I finish the Teleport and SuperNET tech, but I will try to monitor this thread. If there is anything I can do to help, just ask, but there are so many talents here, it is I that is asking for help!

James

P.S. If there are any expenditures that the VRC donors are all agreeing is making sense, then just have a vote that has 2/3'rds weight. Make sure not to spend more than half the fund! The community fund is for VRC community, it is not for me to decide such things.

http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
100+ page annual report for SuperNET
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September 10, 2014, 12:51:57 AM
 #15853


I think we should not stake until we've raised what James considers to be a suitable amount. As this was originally intended to be a fundraising activity until we reach 2.7 million VRC, I think he can call the shots as to when we have enough in the escrow. When that happens, we will audit the donations and get both corresponding VRC and BTC addresses for each donor. That way we can split the share evenly, with precision, and know how to refund the coins. Right now, we just have a VRC address. Ultimately we will need a BTC address to pay the 10k satoshi/VRC payment. But if we start staking, the blockchain gets confusing and we really need it to be as simple as possible to track.

If my calculations are correct, there is no need to actually convert to BTC to pay people.  You can pay them in VRC just returned to them.  (Ex.  50,000*.5*.0001=2.5BTC, 2.5BTC buys 5000 VRC @ .0005.).  Thus just return 5000 VRC to the originator and no need to sell VRC and pay in BTC.  Or, actually an even better method is just use whatever the VRC price is AT THE TIME of the end of year distribution.  If after 1 year the price is .0006, then your 2.5BTC of value would represent 4166 VRC plus the 1150 of interest.  The key being it's not too difficult to add in the interest portion to each address once we are done with all donating for this project.

Yeah I agree we don't need a BTC address, that was the original intent for simplicity.  Also drkman if you would be willing to build up the spreadsheet (which would help tremendously) then I would be happy to bring the coins online periodically to earn the interest accrued via coinage.  This is also another incentive to make the pot bigger as the community would be getting some significant interest payments over time.

My point exactly... with the added bonus that it will be a significant amount of coins staking and therefore reinforcing the blockchain and protecting the coins from attacks. Especially if the pot can get anywhere near 2 million coins. I already suggested a public honor roll, at least a voluntary one, with the devs listing their contributions to the fund. This could act as an incentive... direly needed for while the "donors" have been quite generous for the most part so far, I feel a very small part of the community has actually donated... in spite of the fact that we have practically doubled the price already exclusively on the "James effect".
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September 10, 2014, 01:09:36 AM
 #15854


I think we should not stake until we've raised what James considers to be a suitable amount. As this was originally intended to be a fundraising activity until we reach 2.7 million VRC, I think he can call the shots as to when we have enough in the escrow. When that happens, we will audit the donations and get both corresponding VRC and BTC addresses for each donor. That way we can split the share evenly, with precision, and know how to refund the coins. Right now, we just have a VRC address. Ultimately we will need a BTC address to pay the 10k satoshi/VRC payment. But if we start staking, the blockchain gets confusing and we really need it to be as simple as possible to track.

If my calculations are correct, there is no need to actually convert to BTC to pay people.  You can pay them in VRC just returned to them.  (Ex.  50,000*.5*.0001=2.5BTC, 2.5BTC buys 5000 VRC @ .0005.).  Thus just return 5000 VRC to the originator and no need to sell VRC and pay in BTC.  Or, actually an even better method is just use whatever the VRC price is AT THE TIME of the end of year distribution.  If after 1 year the price is .0006, then your 2.5BTC of value would represent 4166 VRC plus the 1150 of interest.  The key being it's not too difficult to add in the interest portion to each address once we are done with all donating for this project.

Yeah I agree we don't need a BTC address, that was the original intent for simplicity.  Also drkman if you would be willing to build up the spreadsheet (which would help tremendously) then I would be happy to bring the coins online periodically to earn the interest accrued via coinage.  This is also another incentive to make the pot bigger as the community would be getting some significant interest payments over time.

My point exactly... with the added bonus that it will be a significant amount of coins staking and therefore reinforcing the blockchain and protecting the coins from attacks. Especially if the pot can get anywhere near 2 million coins. I already suggested a public honor roll, at least a voluntary one, with the devs listing their contributions to the fund. This could act as an incentive... direly needed for while the "donors" have been quite generous for the most part so far, I feel a very small part of the community has actually donated... in spite of the fact that we have practically doubled the price already exclusively on the "James effect".

I can't believe it... Barabbas making sense and contributing... Love it!  We are onto something GOOD here!  Cheers Barabbas!

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jl777
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September 10, 2014, 01:31:27 AM
 #15855


I think we should not stake until we've raised what James considers to be a suitable amount. As this was originally intended to be a fundraising activity until we reach 2.7 million VRC, I think he can call the shots as to when we have enough in the escrow. When that happens, we will audit the donations and get both corresponding VRC and BTC addresses for each donor. That way we can split the share evenly, with precision, and know how to refund the coins. Right now, we just have a VRC address. Ultimately we will need a BTC address to pay the 10k satoshi/VRC payment. But if we start staking, the blockchain gets confusing and we really need it to be as simple as possible to track.

If my calculations are correct, there is no need to actually convert to BTC to pay people.  You can pay them in VRC just returned to them.  (Ex.  50,000*.5*.0001=2.5BTC, 2.5BTC buys 5000 VRC @ .0005.).  Thus just return 5000 VRC to the originator and no need to sell VRC and pay in BTC.  Or, actually an even better method is just use whatever the VRC price is AT THE TIME of the end of year distribution.  If after 1 year the price is .0006, then your 2.5BTC of value would represent 4166 VRC plus the 1150 of interest.  The key being it's not too difficult to add in the interest portion to each address once we are done with all donating for this project.

Yeah I agree we don't need a BTC address, that was the original intent for simplicity.  Also drkman if you would be willing to build up the spreadsheet (which would help tremendously) then I would be happy to bring the coins online periodically to earn the interest accrued via coinage.  This is also another incentive to make the pot bigger as the community would be getting some significant interest payments over time.

My point exactly... with the added bonus that it will be a significant amount of coins staking and therefore reinforcing the blockchain and protecting the coins from attacks. Especially if the pot can get anywhere near 2 million coins. I already suggested a public honor roll, at least a voluntary one, with the devs listing their contributions to the fund. This could act as an incentive... direly needed for while the "donors" have been quite generous for the most part so far, I feel a very small part of the community has actually donated... in spite of the fact that we have practically doubled the price already exclusively on the "James effect".
Thank you!

It means more to me that you are now part of VRC than whatever small effect I have had on price so far.

I now know that you meant well all this time, but circumstances just created a "brownian motion" where the conflict just made things go in circles. Now VRC will benefit from your intellect.

With everybody in harmony, the brownian motion is transformed to a laser beam!

James

P.S. Yes, I realize brownian motion are gas molecules and lasers are for photons, plz forgive the scientific inaccuracy. When people join together, anything is possible

http://www.digitalcatallaxy.com/report2015.html
100+ page annual report for SuperNET
KryptoKings
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September 10, 2014, 02:00:14 AM
 #15856

WOW!!! James has taken the phrase "Can't we all just get along" and taken it to a different dimension!!! Love it!!!

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libertynow
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September 10, 2014, 02:46:55 AM
 #15857


I think we should not stake until we've raised what James considers to be a suitable amount. As this was originally intended to be a fundraising activity until we reach 2.7 million VRC, I think he can call the shots as to when we have enough in the escrow. When that happens, we will audit the donations and get both corresponding VRC and BTC addresses for each donor. That way we can split the share evenly, with precision, and know how to refund the coins. Right now, we just have a VRC address. Ultimately we will need a BTC address to pay the 10k satoshi/VRC payment. But if we start staking, the blockchain gets confusing and we really need it to be as simple as possible to track.

If my calculations are correct, there is no need to actually convert to BTC to pay people.  You can pay them in VRC just returned to them.  (Ex.  50,000*.5*.0001=2.5BTC, 2.5BTC buys 5000 VRC @ .0005.).  Thus just return 5000 VRC to the originator and no need to sell VRC and pay in BTC.  Or, actually an even better method is just use whatever the VRC price is AT THE TIME of the end of year distribution.  If after 1 year the price is .0006, then your 2.5BTC of value would represent 4166 VRC plus the 1150 of interest.  The key being it's not too difficult to add in the interest portion to each address once we are done with all donating for this project.

Yeah I agree we don't need a BTC address, that was the original intent for simplicity.  Also drkman if you would be willing to build up the spreadsheet (which would help tremendously) then I would be happy to bring the coins online periodically to earn the interest accrued via coinage.  This is also another incentive to make the pot bigger as the community would be getting some significant interest payments over time.

No sense in not staking, just make sure to track the deposit amounts
I think that drkman's idea is pretty good. No sense in converting to BTC.

How about this.

1 year after funding is closed or when the price is above .001, there is a return of VRC. In the latter case, 100% of the donated value comes back. It will be a bit less than 10% of the coins you put in, but getting back all the value is the same as the scenario of the option being used.

Now if the price is .0005 to .001 after one year, then it will be more coins coming back than 10%, up to 20%, but again the outcome is similar to the option being exercised.

The unlikely case is that it is less than .0005, and I think in this case, it is just all returned, unless the donor chooses to keep it in.

If there are some external factors that make sense to change the 1 year cutoff, then it would require a stake weighted vote. Now with a united community and all the things that were already in progress, these unlikely scenarios of <ATH for next 12 months, this is not something I am paying much attention to.

Getting to .001 is a long term of working to improve the value and using the best ideas of the community and already I see a transformation into a can-do attitude. The solution to get the staking and the return of VRC, this is from VRC community, not me. I am just the crazy guy who made some impossible demands, that the VRC community achieved.

So, the power is strong within VRC. Know this. The "impossible" is just an excuse for the people who cant get things done.

The VRC devs are really contributing bigtime with the SuperNET project and shaping it to be much better than I can by myself. I am just one guy and need the help of everyone to make crypto all that it can be and this help from VRC community is making more time for me to do the tech. You should know I am the one to help my friends do as well as they can.

I am doing my best to prevent a huge price pump in the VRC and so please do not go all crazy from the optimism. The VRC is still some months away and it does have me as a friend, so be patient, support the devs, accumulate the VRC at the current prices. Dont chase the price, the weakhands (WH) will give you some favors. The WH are favorites of the BTCD community.

A wealthy community is a happy community. I will be a bit busy as I finish the Teleport and SuperNET tech, but I will try to monitor this thread. If there is anything I can do to help, just ask, but there are so many talents here, it is I that is asking for help!

James

P.S. If there are any expenditures that the VRC donors are all agreeing is making sense, then just have a vote that has 2/3'rds weight. Make sure not to spend more than half the fund! The community fund is for VRC community, it is not for me to decide such things.

Excellent plan.  Thank you for your response.

Liquid Tech, Asset #17750387231635486778, http://www.liquidtech.info
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September 10, 2014, 02:57:19 AM
 #15858

No sense in not staking, just make sure to track the deposit amounts
I think that drkman's idea is pretty good. No sense in converting to BTC.

How about this.

1 year after funding is closed or when the price is above .001, there is a return of VRC. In the latter case, 100% of the donated value comes back. It will be a bit less than 10% of the coins you put in, but getting back all the value is the same as the scenario of the option being used.

Now if the price is .0005 to .001 after one year, then it will be more coins coming back than 10%, up to 20%, but again the outcome is similar to the option being exercised.

The unlikely case is that it is less than .0005, and I think in this case, it is just all returned, unless the donor chooses to keep it in.

If there are some external factors that make sense to change the 1 year cutoff, then it would require a stake weighted vote. Now with a united community and all the things that were already in progress, these unlikely scenarios of <ATH for next 12 months, this is not something I am paying much attention to.

Getting to .001 is a long term of working to improve the value and using the best ideas of the community and already I see a transformation into a can-do attitude. The solution to get the staking and the return of VRC, this is from VRC community, not me. I am just the crazy guy who made some impossible demands, that the VRC community achieved.

So, the power is strong within VRC. Know this. The "impossible" is just an excuse for the people who cant get things done.

The VRC devs are really contributing bigtime with the SuperNET project and shaping it to be much better than I can by myself. I am just one guy and need the help of everyone to make crypto all that it can be and this help from VRC community is making more time for me to do the tech. You should know I am the one to help my friends do as well as they can.

I am doing my best to prevent a huge price pump in the VRC and so please do not go all crazy from the optimism. The VRC is still some months away and it does have me as a friend, so be patient, support the devs, accumulate the VRC at the current prices. Dont chase the price, the weakhands (WH) will give you some favors. The WH are favorites of the BTCD community.

A wealthy community is a happy community. I will be a bit busy as I finish the Teleport and SuperNET tech, but I will try to monitor this thread. If there is anything I can do to help, just ask, but there are so many talents here, it is I that is asking for help!

James

P.S. If there are any expenditures that the VRC donors are all agreeing is making sense, then just have a vote that has 2/3'rds weight. Make sure not to spend more than half the fund! The community fund is for VRC community, it is not for me to decide such things.

Excellent plan.  Thank you for your response.

Couldn't agree more. It's simply amazing how 1 weekend can completely change the outlooks on everything. I understand the dev team has been working hard night/day regardless of James showing up and great things were in the future regardless but this is just awesome! The ability to completely remove all FUD/trolls from an online chat forum is nothing less than a miracle.

VRC = http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xImIx1nwaS8&t=1m50s
barabbas
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September 10, 2014, 04:37:05 AM
 #15859


I think we should not stake until we've raised what James considers to be a suitable amount. As this was originally intended to be a fundraising activity until we reach 2.7 million VRC, I think he can call the shots as to when we have enough in the escrow. When that happens, we will audit the donations and get both corresponding VRC and BTC addresses for each donor. That way we can split the share evenly, with precision, and know how to refund the coins. Right now, we just have a VRC address. Ultimately we will need a BTC address to pay the 10k satoshi/VRC payment. But if we start staking, the blockchain gets confusing and we really need it to be as simple as possible to track.

If my calculations are correct, there is no need to actually convert to BTC to pay people.  You can pay them in VRC just returned to them.  (Ex.  50,000*.5*.0001=2.5BTC, 2.5BTC buys 5000 VRC @ .0005.).  Thus just return 5000 VRC to the originator and no need to sell VRC and pay in BTC.  Or, actually an even better method is just use whatever the VRC price is AT THE TIME of the end of year distribution.  If after 1 year the price is .0006, then your 2.5BTC of value would represent 4166 VRC plus the 1150 of interest.  The key being it's not too difficult to add in the interest portion to each address once we are done with all donating for this project.

Yeah I agree we don't need a BTC address, that was the original intent for simplicity.  Also drkman if you would be willing to build up the spreadsheet (which would help tremendously) then I would be happy to bring the coins online periodically to earn the interest accrued via coinage.  This is also another incentive to make the pot bigger as the community would be getting some significant interest payments over time.

My point exactly... with the added bonus that it will be a significant amount of coins staking and therefore reinforcing the blockchain and protecting the coins from attacks. Especially if the pot can get anywhere near 2 million coins. I already suggested a public honor roll, at least a voluntary one, with the devs listing their contributions to the fund. This could act as an incentive... direly needed for while the "donors" have been quite generous for the most part so far, I feel a very small part of the community has actually donated... in spite of the fact that we have practically doubled the price already exclusively on the "James effect".
Thank you!

It means more to me that you are now part of VRC than whatever small effect I have had on price so far.

I now know that you meant well all this time, but circumstances just created a "brownian motion" where the conflict just made things go in circles. Now VRC will benefit from your intellect.

With everybody in harmony, the brownian motion is transformed to a laser beam!

James

P.S. Yes, I realize brownian motion are gas molecules and lasers are for photons, plz forgive the scientific inaccuracy. When people join together, anything is possible

My message has always been quite clear all along... including being the first one in this forum in favor of "your plan" when first proposed and no one knew who you were. Vericoin needed someone like you to bring the tech know-how that, unfortunately, our devs don't have. Now there's a possibility, a strong one, of going forward for real and at a good pace... if we are able to set egos and arrogance aside before personal conflict -inevitably- arises.

Back to business: Very few people has, so far, participated in "donating" (thank you, by the way, for giving back to the community the option). Like I have stated before, there are a number of things, quite positive all of them, that can and must be done with those funds -- especially if we get anywhere near 2 million coins -2.7 is completely absurd since at least 7-8 million coins are in exchanges-. Staking, to begin with, is the natural and profitable option; to create an "stabilizing fund", like Nautilus, is another worth considering for we must strive to reach a level of non-volatility that the merchants as well as non-initiated customers, will demand before adoption. And simply funding for projects that require investment. But, like I said, only a very few have gotten involved -albeit quite generously- so far. Much more is needed so it will be the bulk of the community pushing forward and pushing hard.

Hey, if having their stakes doubling in price only because of you don't bring the generosity (which in this case is only technically generosity). I don't know what will. But what we shouldn't do is to call "the community" some 50-odd (at best) people so far carrying the big burden.

Edited to add:

And this is a BIG problem going forward... for which we may have already found the solution: The vision of James with Vericoin as the entrance door from the FIAT world -a vision that coincides exactly with that of Pat, Doug and Dave, as well as the vast majority if not all in the community. We have discussed one of the main obstacles Vericoin -and everyone else- has: The be able to convert FIAT directly to Vericoin, in the US, requires paying a pretty hefty price... anywhere around $150k. Cryptsy paid it. Mintpal -I'm quite sure- will eventually pay it. It is cost-effective, to them. Will it be for Vericoin? IF we are really to go after some kind of "mass" market, definitely. Now, to raise $150k, up until now, has been chimeric and, definitely, within the circumstances, not advisable... but now, circumstances have changed. Drastically. To foresee a very significant increase in price in the more or less close future is not chimeric at all so, where $150k was a huge figure a week ago, unrealistic to be ever assimilated by this project, has become now something (potentially) quite accessible. I am not as optimistic as to believe that we will get to 0.001 BTC within 6 months (I hope I am wrong, of course), but half that seems not too difficult (only a triple from here), so lets assume we can get to something in between, something like 0.0007. Let's also assume that the donations reach 2 million VRC. Those 2 million would be worth $700,000. Even after returning to the "donors" the 10k sat, the community would still have $600k (not even counting the staking in between... or any appreciation of BTC from here to there). Definitely in that circumstance, $150k doesn't look unreachable at all, does it?

The other "problem" that we need to provide solutions for, in advance, is the upcoming, inevitable, regulation. It is not IF, it is when. Vericoin should still welcome it. How the potential integration in the SuperNET could affect compliance depends on what the regulation will demand. But this, in any case, is premature... except that Vericoin must be prepared -with tools, disposition AND RESOURCES- to be the first crypto currency welcoming regulation and be in full compliance and, if possible, with the resources to influence that the compliance is not too strict. Some level of privacy can and must be requested from legislators. Accountability will not be a problem IF the resources are there to cover the risks... yet another reason to make of this pot one as big as we can possibly muster.

So, for those still on the sidelines: Come on: You have doubled your money in just a few days, can't you really afford to give 10% for such purposeful endeavor?

Once again, I encourage the idea of creating an honor roll, if for nothing else, to be thankful to those generous enough to, along with James, having made this actually possible. It is something to be proud of -and thankful for. And it should inspire those with less generous inclinations in the community. It is indeed for a great set of causes.
Jeff Jefferson
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September 10, 2014, 05:35:38 AM
 #15860

hey guys,

still trying to compile my own vericoin raspberry wallet  Angry

i have received following error:

build/bitcoinrpc.o: file not recognized: File truncated
collect2: ld returned l exit status
make: *** vericoin-qt Error l

then it exits

I know there is a binary available but i want to compile it myself. What might be the problem?
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