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Warning: Moderators do not remove likely scams. You must use your own brain: caveat emptor. Watch out for Ponzi schemes. Do not invest more than you can afford to lose.

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Author Topic: [BitcoinMax.com] Closed  (Read 178470 times)
jasinlee
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Its as easy as 0, 1, 1, 2, 3


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October 20, 2012, 03:21:35 AM
 #2281


BTC 1JASiNZxmAN1WBS4dmGEDoPpzN3GV7dnjX DVC 1CxxZzqcy7YEVXfCn5KvgRxjeWvPpniK3                     Earn Devcoins Devtome.com
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chsados
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October 26, 2012, 02:45:32 AM
 #2282

why no scammer tag to pay.btc?

like icebreaker said
Quote
paybtc had no right to deprive me of the opportunity to negotiate or whatever directly with pirate.  That's why he deserves a scammer tag.

on top of that....pay.btc hasn't even responded posted in this thread for roughly 2 months (since September 06).  On TOP of that he has disabled his website... (without any explanation AFIK)

perhaps pay.btc was scammed just as hard as us lenders...but i don't believe for a second he hasn't made major $$ with his venture and i don't think it is acceptable for him not to keep us posted here in his thread with info.

i only put an initial 10 btc in.  probably got under 2 BTC back from interest gathered - that puts me in the hole for <8btc.

I know this is probably negligible to 90%+ of other users.... but pay.btc should take the total amount he MADE from our INITIAL deposits from every user (and subtracting any interest payed ) then dividing that amount by total amount of accounts and send that figure to each user.

/END DRUNKEN RANT
helloworld
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October 26, 2012, 02:54:14 AM
 #2283

why no scammer tag to pay.btc?

Step one is start a thread for him in the Scam Accusations forum. I see no one has bothered yet, including you.

chsados
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October 26, 2012, 03:36:10 PM
 #2284

why no scammer tag to pay.btc?

Step one is start a thread for him in the Scam Accusations forum. I see no one has bothered yet, including you.


I'll take your advice and do it now!

pay.btc - i see you have not been active since     October 21, 2012, 09:26:44  - (nearly a week) why dont you come in here and explain whats going on - or have you "abandoned ship"?

EDIT: done
AngryCatfish
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October 27, 2012, 06:36:22 PM
 #2285

New info:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=120759.0

Progress is slow but it's something.
BrightAnarchist
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October 27, 2012, 08:37:40 PM
 #2286

I realize the info is proly around, but no time to find it - can someone tell me exactly how much bitcoinmax had in total in btcst at the time pirate shut down? I've heard it was around 120K BTC.
Bitsky
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October 27, 2012, 10:33:19 PM
 #2287

I realize the info is proly around, but no time to find it - can someone tell me exactly how much bitcoinmax had in total in btcst at the time pirate shut down? I've heard it was around 120K BTC.

payb.tc are you checking these topics?
are you willing to work together with the people that are going after him to recover our funds ?


https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=109126.0 (Trendon Shavers - Family Contact made)
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=108282.0 (Going after Trendon Shavers, Pirateat40, BTCST)
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=108932.0( Trendon Shavers/Pirate ~ New Info)



sure, if there's anything i can do to help that doesn't require thousands of dollars in lawyers fees or plane tickets, please let me know.
Did you try to contact payb.tc?

Hi!

 I'm a bit late but, WTF?!
 Who wants to buy this shit?!

Code:
Bitcoin Max

Logged in as: ThiagoCMC (User #374 of 373)      Balance: 110.74501165      Next Payment: 7.64140580

Sum total of older accounts: 167728.74239044

Deposit Address: XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Account History   |   Earnings Reports   |   Account Settings   |   Change Password   |   Withdraw   |   Log Out


Account History

Showing latest 4 transactions. Check for new (confirmed) deposits.

Date Description Amount Balance
2012-08-27 21:00 Interest Earned 7.14818129 110.74501165
2012-08-20 21:00 Interest Earned 3.59683036 103.59683036
2012-08-17 05:30 Deposit 95.00000000 100.00000000
2012-08-17 04:00 Deposit 5.00000000 5.00000000

 Can you guys believe that I jumped in on day 17?!?! I must be the luckiest guy on this forum...  lol

Tks!
Thiago
So assuming nobody else sent BTC after that, the sum of all unpaid coins should be 167728.74239044 + 110.74501165 (which includes interest).

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hgmichna
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October 28, 2012, 03:43:58 PM
 #2288

So assuming nobody else sent BTC after that, the sum of all unpaid coins should be 167728.74239044 + 110.74501165 (which includes interest).

The interest is something like a phantasy number. I would consider it uninteresting. The money has never existed and will never be paid.

The only interesting figure is the number of bitcoins actually paid into the scam. And even that would only be interesting if part of it could be recovered. I consider even that unlikely, but we are free to hope.

All I remember is that the pirate took in something between Ƀ100,000 and Ƀ200,000, probably closer to the lower figure, but nobody knows for sure.
btcash
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October 28, 2012, 09:07:11 PM
 #2289

I get a blank page when I try to login.
payb.tc please make the account accesible.

The Americans take our data privacy concerns seriously. - Hans-Peter Friedrich (German Federal Minister of the Interior)
dbox
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October 30, 2012, 09:39:51 PM
 #2290

We should consider payb.tc scammer for that reason, he should keep the website fully functional until the matter is clarified. Imporper communication and no funds means scam.

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October 30, 2012, 10:12:38 PM
 #2291

We should consider payb.tc scammer for that reason, he should keep the website fully functional until the matter is clarified. Imporper communication and no funds means scam.

Unprofessional? Yes.
Scammer? No.
Come on, which money did he steal, again?

Did anyone of you even contact him?

Ente
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October 30, 2012, 11:12:32 PM
 #2292

We should consider payb.tc scammer for that reason, he should keep the website fully functional until the matter is clarified. Imporper communication and no funds means scam.

Unprofessional? Yes.
Scammer? No.
Come on, which money did he steal, again?

Did anyone of you even contact him?

Ente
Actually, I did.
I asked for PGP signed account balances for everybody:
 - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=83904.msg1224833#msg1224833
 - https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=83904.msg1281553#msg1281553

A week ago, I pm'ed him and asked for a confirmation of my account details.
So far, I have not heard anything from him.

Also, in another thread someone argued that we can't really be sure if every PPT forwarded all coins to Pirate, or used some/all for their own investment plans.
I'm not saying payb.tc did, but that argument has been going around in my head since then because it would open up another can of worms.

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adamas
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VIS ET LIBERTAS


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October 31, 2012, 06:15:03 AM
 #2293

We should consider payb.tc scammer for that reason, ...

Come on, which money did he steal, again?
He did steel my money!

"Es ist kein Zeichen geistiger Gesundheit, gut angepasst an eine kranke Gesellschaft zu sein."
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October 31, 2012, 11:16:21 PM
 #2294

Also, in another thread someone argued that we can't really be sure if every PPT forwarded all coins to Pirate, or used some/all for their own investment plans.
I'm not saying payb.tc did, but that argument has been going around in my head since then because it would open up another can of worms.
I don't see where this argument goes though. If you pay someone to do something knowing that they have no way to prove whether they did it or not, how can you later complain that they can't prove they did it? And why would it matter anyway since the consequences are the same -- the money is lost -- either way?

I am an employee of Ripple.
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October 31, 2012, 11:29:21 PM
 #2295

Just to know exactly by whom we were scammed Smiley
...and he could probably at least prove at which address he sent BTC and show us his accountancy

Bitsky
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October 31, 2012, 11:31:26 PM
 #2296

Also, in another thread someone argued that we can't really be sure if every PPT forwarded all coins to Pirate, or used some/all for their own investment plans.
I'm not saying payb.tc did, but that argument has been going around in my head since then because it would open up another can of worms.
I don't see where this argument goes though. If you pay someone to do something knowing that they have no way to prove whether they did it or not, how can you later complain that they can't prove they did it? And why would it matter anyway since the consequences are the same -- the money is lost -- either way?
What if the PPT decided to invest the coins somewhere else? Most investors left their interest in the PPT.
Now that Pirate defaulted a malicious PPT could keep the coins, knowing that Pirate will be blamed for the loss, and get away relatively easy.

Bounty: Earn up to 68.7 BTC
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helloworld
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November 01, 2012, 01:41:50 AM
 #2297

Also, in another thread someone argued that we can't really be sure if every PPT forwarded all coins to Pirate, or used some/all for their own investment plans.
I'm not saying payb.tc did, but that argument has been going around in my head since then because it would open up another can of worms.
I don't see where this argument goes though. If you pay someone to do something knowing that they have no way to prove whether they did it or not, how can you later complain that they can't prove they did it? And why would it matter anyway since the consequences are the same -- the money is lost -- either way?
What if the PPT decided to invest the coins somewhere else? Most investors left their interest in the PPT.
Now that Pirate defaulted a malicious PPT could keep the coins, knowing that Pirate will be blamed for the loss, and get away relatively easy.


It's easy in hindsight, everyone's an expert on Pirate and Ponzi schemes. But in the thick of it 6 months ago, PPT operators would have taken a huge risk to do what you're suggesting, because if Pirate turned out be legit and returned all the coins, then PPT operators had better make sure they can come up with 7% per week somewhere else otherwise they'd get 100% of the blame not just some of it.

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November 01, 2012, 02:37:33 AM
 #2298

Also, in another thread someone argued that we can't really be sure if every PPT forwarded all coins to Pirate, or used some/all for their own investment plans.
I'm not saying payb.tc did, but that argument has been going around in my head since then because it would open up another can of worms.
I don't see where this argument goes though. If you pay someone to do something knowing that they have no way to prove whether they did it or not, how can you later complain that they can't prove they did it? And why would it matter anyway since the consequences are the same -- the money is lost -- either way?
What if the PPT decided to invest the coins somewhere else? Most investors left their interest in the PPT.
Now that Pirate defaulted a malicious PPT could keep the coins, knowing that Pirate will be blamed for the loss, and get away relatively easy.
Again, this argument goes nowhere. Suppose this is true. Your damages are $0. So what difference does it make? Yes, if they could somehow have guessed correctly when Pirate would default, they could make a ton of money that way and nobody would have been harmed by it. So what?

I am an employee of Ripple.
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November 01, 2012, 04:34:30 AM
 #2299

What if the PPT decided to invest the coins somewhere else? Most investors left their interest in the PPT.
Now that Pirate defaulted a malicious PPT could keep the coins, knowing that Pirate will be blamed for the loss, and get away relatively easy.
Again, this argument goes nowhere. Suppose this is true. Your damages are $0. So what difference does it make? Yes, if they could somehow have guessed correctly when Pirate would default, they could make a ton of money that way and nobody would have been harmed by it. So what?
[/quote]

It's basically a case of the smart PPT operator realising that BS&T was a ponzi scheme and deciding that instead of losing his clients' coins to Pirate's ponzi he would keep them for himself, effectively running his own ponzi.  So long as pirate's ponzi closes up shop before the PPT operator runs out of funds it all works out well for the PPT operator.

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November 01, 2012, 09:44:08 AM
 #2300

Again, this argument goes nowhere. Suppose this is true. Your damages are $0. So what difference does it make? Yes, if they could somehow have guessed correctly when Pirate would default, they could make a ton of money that way and nobody would have been harmed by it. So what?
So you are saying that a bunch of possible scammers can be let off the hook just because they lied when they said that they invested with another scammer?
If each and every coin from a PPT went to Pirate, well, bummer. But if only a single coin was not passed through, then the PPT should be treated just like Pirate.

Let's look at the following hypothetical scene:
1. Pirate starts his business
2. PPT's pop up everywhere
3.1. PPT operator sends every coin to Pirate but pulls out before he defaults, or
3.2. PPT operator uses all coins for other projects, or
3.3. PPT operator simply keeps all the coins
4. Pirate defaults
5. PPT operator keeps the coins and Pirate gets the blame

What you are now saying is that this does not matter although those PPT operators could in fact pay the investors back.
If you have a criminal intend and jumped onto the bandwagon, the chances to get the blame is reduced by 50%.

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