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Warning: Moderators do not remove likely scams. You must use your own brain: caveat emptor. Watch out for Ponzi schemes. Do not invest more than you can afford to lose.

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Author Topic: [BitcoinMax.com] Closed  (Read 186279 times)
Grinder
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August 28, 2012, 09:31:55 PM
 #1581

Quote from: Investor
"HRm... looks like I might not get my coins back.  Oh well, it was a calculated risk and I (might have lost).  At least I got something out of it."

Moves on to the next thing
It could have been a much more helpful example if your "investor" didn't lack basic math skills.
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Coin.Karma
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August 28, 2012, 09:33:54 PM
 #1582

dont worry guys everyone is going to get their coins back....relax a bit brothers.....
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August 28, 2012, 09:35:49 PM
 #1583

Aha! My previous post did give me an idea for a way to build something that could make a profit for people who buy it with bitcoins.

We make a corp that offers gains to people in some other currency. The way it makes those gains is by using that other thing to buy bitcoins. The way it is able to cause gains for people who already had bitcoins is, it does not pay out to the other currency people the full amount the bitcoins have gained in value.

Hmm, actually maybe even that seems maybe at least a little scammy. People investing their other currency in it would be better off simply buying bitcoins directly themselves... But I guess that is where our profit comes from: we get to skim some of the profit they would have made by holding bitcoins instead of this offering of ours...

-MarkM-

EDIT: For someone willing to be active rather than passive, maybe providing bitcoins to be cold stored as backing for tokens would be worthwhile if you are prepared to make money by acting as a market-maker...

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JoelKatz
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August 28, 2012, 09:45:24 PM
 #1584

When I see things like JoelKatz trying to tag everybody as a scammer, that's exactly the destructive attitude that I find deplorable.
Please, if I'm wrong, show me where I'm wrong. But I reject the idea that someone should refrain from making a correct, valid, rational argument because the consequences of the argument are unpleasant.

As for a "destructive attitude", there is something here that desperately needs to be destroyed. And if "I did nothing wrong" is the attitude that prevails, we'll have learned nothing from this tragedy.

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dextryn
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August 28, 2012, 09:51:54 PM
 #1585

few minutes ago.

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[13:56:10] <@pirateat40> Notice:  If you are a PPT operator please contact me via PM.  Thanks


Everyone else STFU.  I want to hear what comes of this....
ErebusBat
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August 28, 2012, 10:28:59 PM
 #1586

Quote from: Investor
"HRm... looks like I might not get my coins back.  Oh well, it was a calculated risk and I (might have lost).  At least I got something out of it."

Moves on to the next thing
It could have been a much more helpful example if your "investor" didn't lack basic math skills.
So only people who, in your opinion, understand math have the right to spend their money as they see fit?

Where do I sign comrade?

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JoelKatz
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August 28, 2012, 11:16:22 PM
 #1587

I personally taught that pirate business was legitimate. Like any business, I knew there was a risk. But if somebody asked me what pirate business was all about, since my belief was that it was legitimate, I gave my own answer and said that it was legitimate. From what I understand, doing that is encouraging the scam and so, I'm a scammer.

If I taught that pirate was a ponzi and I invested in it, from what you say, investing in a ponzi is a way to scam others, so I'm also a scammer.

So, overall, if I understood correctly, what you say is that if somebody invest money in pirate, he's a scammer.
No, that's not what I said. I didn't say that just encouraging people to invest in Pirate or just investing in Pirate makes someone a scammer. I try to be very precise in my words, but sometimes I fail. That's not what I'm saying.

Quote
Sorry, but I can't stand the attitude of "either he's with us, either he's against us". Also, the witch hunt against the possible "victims" of all this is also pitiful. The only two sides that seems to exist right now are the "saviors" and the "scammers". This polarizing attitude is what start wars and conflicts. It's not about 0 or 1, there's a lot of nuances between the two extremes.
I agree.

Quote
Destruction doesn't solve anything. You never solve problems with destroying, you only give them fuel to make them worse. You seriously think than putting scammer tags everywhere and censoring people who sided with pirate business is going to help? If you think that simply deleting the people who don't fit in your vision of the world is your way to solve problem, you'll be surprised at how it doesn't make things any better.
I have no interest in putting scammer tags anywhere or censoring anyone. However, the people who scammed other people need to recognize and accept that this is what they did and figure out where they went wrong and how to make sure it never happens again. The community can either learn from these things or repeat them endlessly. I care which of those two things happens. I'm not trying to punish anyone.

If the general response was, "You're right, I'm sorry. My desire to get rich quick and my failure to consider the fact that I was causing harm to others led me to make a mistake from which I will do my best to learn as much as possible.", I wouldn't have had to say another word.

I am an employee of Ripple. Follow me on Twitter @JoelKatz
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August 28, 2012, 11:19:12 PM
 #1588

So only people who, in your opinion, understand math have the right to spend their money as they see fit?
There is no "right" to spend your money hiring someone to steal money from others and give it to you. There is no "right" to hire a hitman.

If some shady looking guy on the street corner offers you a brand new flat screen television with a retail value of $800 for $50 cash, do you have a "right" to think "it's probably stolen, but what the hell, that's a risk I'm willing to take" and buy and keep the television? And while people are yelling at you "it's stolen", do you have a "right" to think, "Well, probably. But hey, maybe I'll wind up getting to keep it. And there's a non-zero chance it's not stolen and they're all wrong".

If you're going to buy cheap televisions from people on the street, then you have to learn how to spot a television that's likely stolen. Otherwise, you can and should be held responsible if the television turns out to be stolen and you ignored all the obvious signs. If you want to phrase it that way, then yes, only people who know how to spot the signs of obviously stolen property "have the right" to buy and keep cheap televisions from shady characters on the street.

I am an employee of Ripple. Follow me on Twitter @JoelKatz
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zyk
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August 29, 2012, 12:39:05 AM
 #1589

Yep there is still and always the divide, which is caused by trying to put the right tag on the whole scenery !!!!


Was this a legitimate but highly risky  buiseness adventure where people could gamble (invest) their money on (in) or was it designed right at the beginning as a defrauding scheme to

enrich the perpetrators ?!!!!


Why all this highly annoying discussions about ones believes and different moral standings???                              Its all cheap talk!


If it hasn´t been outlined because of willfully ignorance and nobody got the right to ask what will come when the money stream stops , as things are fine as long as they
 
work----it has to be shown now  :                                                                                                            Facts are not that easily to ignore!

The smoking gun is the distribution of the allegedly remaining funds of this failed enterprise :


Where is this remnant money going in a bankrupcy HuhHuhHuh?     


And where will the coins remain in a defrauding scam?Huh?


Everybody who can answer those two questions will readily know what the mindset behind this was and what is still going on !

Get to your senses people   -    and stop smoke and bullshiting  the facts !!


Hope that there comes at least 1 single coin to bitcoinmax that i know where i participated  Wink

Cheers Zyk

ErebusBat
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August 29, 2012, 12:41:23 AM
 #1590

Does anyone else have trouble following zyk's posts?

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Raoul Duke
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August 29, 2012, 12:44:21 AM
 #1591

Does anyone else have trouble following zyk's posts?

You should ask if someone understands zyk's posts. Less people need to answer lol

ErebusBat
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August 29, 2012, 12:48:14 AM
 #1592

Does anyone else have trouble following zyk's posts?

You should ask if someone understands zyk's posts. Less people need to answer lol
Ok so it isn't just me then.

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zyk
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August 29, 2012, 12:53:14 AM
 #1593

The gordic knot is not to be disentangled easily by everyone  Undecided

Only when shown everybody could it...... Shocked

Apparently you both still can´t Cool

Cheers Zyk

Hopefully that post didn´t give you a headache
zyk
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August 29, 2012, 01:03:36 AM
 #1594

That should not go in the same vein as all those beliefes and counterbeliefs......

Just give it a try guys to answer those to easy questions, or is my bad grammar

completly obfuscating your abilities to answer...?

Come on post your essays.

Cheers Zyk



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August 29, 2012, 01:03:44 AM
 #1595

since pirate has partially defaulted , can't he just pay back the intrest to the point where he shut down his operation ? atleast better than getting nothing back..
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August 29, 2012, 01:06:33 AM
 #1596

20:54 <@pirateat40> As much as I've tried to meet the deadlines within the community, there're
                    conditions beyond my control which have escalated the process to the point it is
                    today.

20:54 <@pirateat40> Bitcoin Savings & Trust has hereby given notice of default to it's account
                    holders.
20:56 <@pirateat40> No timeline or further information is available at this time.
DeathAndTaxes
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August 29, 2012, 01:07:30 AM
 #1597

since pirate has partially defaulted , can't he just pay back the intrest to the point where he shut down his operation ? atleast better than getting nothing back..

What makes you think he can do that?  What makes you think he can even pay half?  7% compounded weekly creates some insane capitalized interest.  Of course a responsible debtor would indicate the rough value of the trust BTC and/or USD so creditors would have an idea of how much of a haircut they are looking at.

If he repays 30 bitcents on the coin I will be surprised.  Then again with no info it could be half that or double that.
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August 29, 2012, 01:39:24 AM
 #1598

Everybody should really hope for that bitcoinmax at least is given 5300 coins  after the haircut! Cool


Only then should the fun mentioned in the OP get going.....

But you need not to be an oracle to know, that this fun will be prevented, as there is coming zilch, nada überhaupt nichts.

But may this announcement of default ingnite some patsys at least to try to think about the wherewithall?


No of course , nothing to be seen here Huh

We choose to bet on black, the others went on red ?    ---     unluckily it came 0!

Lets move on------Pay.bc already got the next one up his sleeve

Now that the captain defaulted, is he still allowed to keep his former dealings secret and applauded as this would cause unwanted competition?

yeah an X and an U are really difficult to be distinguished

Cheers Zyk
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August 29, 2012, 02:20:04 AM
 #1599

pay.btc can you confirm this announcement?
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Will read PM's. Have more time lately


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August 29, 2012, 03:58:54 AM
 #1600

Payb.tc, please take a look at the summary of the chat-logs you've probably missed: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=101339.msg1141812#msg1141812


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