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Author Topic: [BitcoinMax.com] Closed  (Read 178589 times)
CoinCidental
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August 30, 2012, 10:03:12 AM
 #1801

there is many ways to consider splitting the returned funds IF there are any worth splitting .....

i would think the fair"est " (since there is no 100% fair way to decide who gets a haircut ) way is to return the principals of newest  people  first .......

(im talking about the people who just invested recently and stand to lose near 100% of their principal dont deserve to be raped  like this )

(the people who already have taken out MORE than their principal + the ones who were bragging loudly  that they cant lose etc ... should be suspended at  the back  of the payment line,at least until newer folks have their principal back  )

same goes for people who already taken out more than 100% of what they invested

Im not saying anything intentionally  bad about the early investors  and guys running PPT's etc and i know they also worked hard to "promote  the investment " but if all turned out to be a fraud then i dont think they should profit from the fraudulant transfers over more gullible completely innocent people who stand to lose maybe everything and possibly never recieved any interest payment

if it was a fraud ,nobody should come out with more than he put in or it will just encourage similiar  schemes and instead of trying to build a community of real strength  it will become a community of scams where the biggest challenge is to take as much as you can and get out before you get burned ......

bitcoin has a hard enough rep  to overcome without becoming known as the currency of thieving  scammers as well Smiley

my o.2 btc

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Coin.Karma
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August 30, 2012, 10:21:05 AM
 #1802

The focus should be on initial principal invested, and pirate would like to pay attention to that only. But I think that bitcoin max, has a responsibility to us also, for the trust we have shown yet blindly. So I do not think it would be fair to hold back information. It should be taken to its conclusion as fas as pirate is concerned, let him finish up his excuses, if these are infact excuses.
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August 30, 2012, 10:31:48 AM
 #1803

Where the fuck is payb.tc in all of this?!?! havent heard from him yet...

Probably collapsed. lol


If you still are able to put one feet before the other just complete OP now.

If not here is the copy and paste:

As bitcoinmax always stated, your coins are lost !, as Trendon Shavers shaves us all.

In case the defaulted entity BCST is assuming its liabilities to bitcoinmax or pays out
any amount to bitcoinmax, all principal investments are payed back evenly up to the
amount deposited.  The gained interest of all accounts is put in escrow until further notice.

If bitcoinmax liabilities to you are not fully covered by this proceedure and in case
BCST pays zilch, i payb.tc, will pact with bitlane to recover what is being able to recover
from Trendon Shavers.

The interest which i accrued during operation of bitcoinmax up to date is given back to recover
your principal investments.

As far as it stands, pirate has not option neither right to get your data or information
through my hands.

Seeing forward to provide further investment possibilities to you in the future.

Please comment

Yours sincerely..........



Thanks Zyk
CoinCidental
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August 30, 2012, 10:35:25 AM
 #1804

The focus should be on initial principal invested, and pirate would like to pay attention to that only. But I think that bitcoin max, has a responsibility to us also, for the trust we have shown yet blindly. So I do not think it would be fair to hold back information. It should be taken to its conclusion as fas as pirate is concerned, let him finish up his excuses, if these are infact excuses.

the problem with that would be people joined a year ago :

 for example put in 100 coins  and took out 7% coins per week have already taken out  abt 364 coins

for them to still be able to withdraw another 100 coins of principal  would leave them at with a total of  464 coins etc  and a new guy  who invested 500 coins last week might be at a 100% loss

hardly seems like a nice fair split now does it....... ?
RoloTonyBrownTown
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August 30, 2012, 10:42:56 AM
 #1805

Everyone knew the risks, and everyone is on an equal playing field as far as I'm concerned.

Anyway, how about we worry about that if we actually get anything back at all.

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August 30, 2012, 10:44:19 AM
 #1806

If there's enough coins in the pot, everyones principal should be paid first. Least then no-ones technically lost anything. Not sure about interest though. Tricky one.

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August 30, 2012, 10:44:31 AM
 #1807

Funny, those that came last think they can make the rules. That's not the way things go. All the money has to go to payb.tc ! Anything else is funk. The risk was always the same. It doesn't matter how much we took out.

Coin.Karma
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August 30, 2012, 10:45:45 AM
 #1808

The focus should be on initial principal invested, and pirate would like to pay attention to that only. But I think that bitcoin max, has a responsibility to us also, for the trust we have shown yet blindly. So I do not think it would be fair to hold back information. It should be taken to its conclusion as fas as pirate is concerned, let him finish up his excuses, if these are infact excuses.

the problem with that would be people joined a year ago :

 for example put in 100 coins  and took out 7% coins per week have already taken out  abt 364 coins

for them to still be able to withdraw another 100 coins of principal  would leave them at with a total of  464 coins etc  and a new guy  who invested 500 coins last week might be at a 100% loss

hardly seems like a nice fair split now does it....... ?

of course it might not, very understandable....he would be including that logic also.... But as long as all people get back their principal, it would be fine. The guys who pulled out their interest were good with their investments thats all. The person who put in last week, would get back his full principal......this should sort out your angle.....
RoloTonyBrownTown
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August 30, 2012, 10:49:03 AM
 #1809

It's a pretty moot point right now anyway.   Pirate wants all our contact details, Payb.tc doesn't want to hand them over (correctly or incorrectly, I'm not here to judge).

I'd say we're pretty well screwed at this point.

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August 30, 2012, 10:50:44 AM
 #1810

Of course there's only one man that knows how much is left in the pot, if any! I wouldn't even hazard a guess at that.

We'll all find out eventually.  Shocked

CoinCidental
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August 30, 2012, 10:51:12 AM
 #1811

The focus should be on initial principal invested, and pirate would like to pay attention to that only. But I think that bitcoin max, has a responsibility to us also, for the trust we have shown yet blindly. So I do not think it would be fair to hold back information. It should be taken to its conclusion as fas as pirate is concerned, let him finish up his excuses, if these are infact excuses.

the problem with that would be people joined a year ago :

 for example put in 100 coins  and took out 7% coins per week have already taken out  abt 364 coins

for them to still be able to withdraw another 100 coins of principal  would leave them at with a total of  464 coins etc  and a new guy  who invested 500 coins last week might be at a 100% loss

hardly seems like a nice fair split now does it....... ?

of course it might not, very understandable....he would be including that logic also.... But as long as all people get back their principal, it would be fine. The guys who pulled out their interest were good with their investments thats all. The person who put in last week, would get back his full principal......this should sort out your angle.....

I understand were your coming from
but the thing is ,assuming  its a ponzi  the 7% people have been taking out
has never been real so if all those 7%'s  are gone there may be a big hole where everyones principal used to be

i agree with rolo above  as well ,i have my doubts there may be anything returned
except some small token gesture %
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August 30, 2012, 10:53:32 AM
 #1812

I'd say we're pretty well screwed at this point.

Fuck that ! Let us go down like men not wimps.

zyk
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August 30, 2012, 10:56:08 AM
 #1813

Funny, those that came last think they can make the rules. That's not the way things go. All the money has to go to payb.tc ! Anything else is funk. The risk was always the same. It doesn't matter how much we took out.


Please proceed to the queue , where to leave your fingerprints.

Cheers Zyk

P.S. no problem....the ones who recieved more interest than paid in....just pay the negative balance back

thats why our operator is called pay BTC ! Wink
Bitsky
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August 30, 2012, 11:06:15 AM
 #1814

the "FIFO" thing was only a side-effect of ordering by USER ID (a number), but it doesn't mean if only only get 50% back later accounts will miss out... if i only get 50% back, then all accounts will get 50% back.
- when you negotiate with Pirate on our behalf, will you accept the first offer or try to get as much as possible from him?

- how will a partial payment (eg 50%) be distributed? Will you simply pay everybody 50% of their current account value, or use the coins to first pay back deposits, taking into account previous withdrawals, to minimize the actual losses of your clients? (SUM(deposits) - SUM(withdrawals) > 0)

- will a partial payment be considered a final settlement, or will you keep on trying to get the rest of the entire payment Pirate owes?


there is many ways to consider splitting the returned funds IF there are any worth splitting .....

i would think the fair"est " (since there is no 100% fair way to decide who gets a haircut ) way is to return the principals of newest  people  first .......

(im talking about the people who just invested recently and stand to lose near 100% of their principal dont deserve to be raped  like this )

(the people who already have taken out MORE than their principal + the ones who were bragging loudly  that they cant lose etc ... should be suspended at  the back  of the payment line,at least until newer folks have their principal back  )
You assume that early investors withdrew instead of keeping interest reinvested.
This assumption is often wrong.


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Like my post? Feel free to drop a tip to 1BitskyZbfR4irjyXDaGAM2wYKQknwX36Y
bitsire
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August 30, 2012, 11:10:07 AM
 #1815

Personally I'd like to do whatever will increase my chances of getting all or at least some of my coins back - if that means giving Pirate my forum / bitcoinmax user name and a payout address then so be it - it's not like he's asking for passport scans.

payb.tc - you have my permission to forward on my account info with bitcoinmax to Pirate if that is the approach you decide to take.
zyk
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August 30, 2012, 11:11:50 AM
 #1816

This is obfuscation of bitcoinmax!

You can clearly seperate the accrued interest from deposits and withdrawls made.

Thats why it is to love that interface!

Cheers

Zyk
Coin.Karma
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August 30, 2012, 11:19:01 AM
 #1817

If this was a delaying tactic and an excuse by pirate to create more confusion, lets try and be smarter than him, just send him all the details, so he dosen't have another excuse to say that all did not comply. This thing needs to taken to its logical conclusion, and as law goes, " not guilty until proven "...cheers

the best part is that, I do not think that giving the forum name and details etc can let pirate do anything to us, please try and understand that all of us put in our money with the sole intent of pirate handling it...and it should be so.

double cheers......"come hell or highwater"
memvola
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August 30, 2012, 11:23:43 AM
 #1818

Quote
it's pretty simple... he needs to pay out my BS&T account to my BS&T withdrawal address.

It is NOT that simple, no matter how strenuously you insist it is.  When Madoff's Ponzi went bust, the money recovered did NOT go back to his feeder funds for redistribution.

Well put. It's too late in the game to listen to team Ponzi regardless of whether they have been right. You either continue playing or should never have played from the start. I don't find the reasons for not sharing the data very convincing.

If this was a delaying tactic and an excuse by pirate to create more confusion, lets try and be smarter than him, just send him all the details, so he dosen't have another excuse to say that all did not comply. This thing needs to taken to its logical conclusion, and as law goes, " not guilty until proven "

Exactly. Why change the arguments all of a sudden? All investors to bitcoinmax without doubt would have invested directly to btcst if he accepted direct deposits anyway. That's why I find the the objection somehow suspicious; no offense.
CoinCidental
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August 30, 2012, 11:38:10 AM
 #1819

the "FIFO" thing was only a side-effect of ordering by USER ID (a number), but it doesn't mean if only only get 50% back later accounts will miss out... if i only get 50% back, then all accounts will get 50% back.
- when you negotiate with Pirate on our behalf, will you accept the first offer or try to get as much as possible from him?

- how will a partial payment (eg 50%) be distributed? Will you simply pay everybody 50% of their current account value, or use the coins to first pay back deposits, taking into account previous withdrawals, to minimize the actual losses of your clients? (SUM(deposits) - SUM(withdrawals) > 0)

- will a partial payment be considered a final settlement, or will you keep on trying to get the rest of the entire payment Pirate owes?


there is many ways to consider splitting the returned funds IF there are any worth splitting .....

i would think the fair"est " (since there is no 100% fair way to decide who gets a haircut ) way is to return the principals of newest  people  first .......

(im talking about the people who just invested recently and stand to lose near 100% of their principal dont deserve to be raped  like this )

(the people who already have taken out MORE than their principal + the ones who were bragging loudly  that they cant lose etc ... should be suspended at  the back  of the payment line,at least until newer folks have their principal back  )
You assume that early investors withdrew instead of keeping interest reinvested.
This assumption is often wrong.



Your correct ,in those circumstances where no interest has been pulled out
then ideally everyone should get their principal back first  and then the  interest
can be fought over Cheesy
Coin.Karma
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August 30, 2012, 11:59:35 AM
 #1820

Wasn't it evident from the beginning....Pirate has clearly mentioned in his OP, during the start that " past performance is not a guarantee of future results"...that itself absolves him of any legal action as long as he wasn't using his money for illegal purposes.......so why would what anyone else say about it matter.....lets just get on with taking this episode to a conclusion.
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