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1861  Other / Politics & Society / Re: The technological singularity on: October 02, 2018, 03:41:15 PM
I read a few years ago that we put 300,000 rat neurons into a robot and out of pure boredom the robot started doing things on its own accord.. consciousness in some form was born.. can't we lift the morel dilemma about what is defined as 'life' and start really exploring deeply what happens if we put 30,000,000 human neurons into a robot.

HYBROT


Wont organic neuron's, and bionic CPU's and programmable DNA be the best way to spawn Ai and its artificial general intelligence (AGI)/Consciousness .. and in turn the question/concerns about how will Ai will react to us.. will be that we are nothing more than the antiquated ancestors of the next organic/semiconductor evolutionary step.

Surely that puts to rest the fears of AGI being our demise.

We have already passed the 'A life' stage.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5gIKn7mc2U
1862  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Why do you believe God exists? on: October 02, 2018, 12:40:08 PM
Is there free will in heaven?

You have the free will to do whatever God wants... that's free enough, right?

What if my uncle molested me as a child and I hate him, but he is also a christian?  If he is in heaven too, then it is not heaven for me since I hate him... If God changes me so I don't hate him any longer, then I am not me, and whatever is in heaven, is not me...

Sounds like a lose-lose proposition... glad I'm going to hell so I don't have to worry about it

I was going with

If there is free will in heaven, then there is evil in heaven, so it is not heaven.

If there is no free will in heaven, then it is a prison, so it is not heaven.

i.e. there is no heaven.

All using religitards' logic.
1863  Other / Politics & Society / Re: I am a Muslim, and I am not a terrorist on: October 02, 2018, 11:11:12 AM
Islam has nothing to do with radicalism. Those who say Allahu Akbar and kill innocents have nothing to do with Islam either, because they are not on the tight path that Islam teaches!!! I hate them as a Muslim. In Islam the one who kills one innocent person is like if he has killed the whole humanity, and the one who saves one person is like if he save the whole humanity! I am really sorry for those who get paid for making Islam seem disgusting. Whatever, nothing can change the power of this religion. The more they spend on their cruel plan, the more non-Muslims get to know about Islam which has already resulted in Islam becoming the fastest growing religion! Statistics says that by 2050 Muslim population will equal Christian population and I would love to witness it.

You do realize that Islam is a 6th century social movement consisting of political, legal and religious components.

Are you sure you understand Islam?

BTW, Muhammad died in 632, al-Aqsa Mosque was built in 705.  You do the math.
1864  Other / Politics & Society / Re: SHOULD CITIZENS WHO DON'T PAY TAXES BE ALLOWED TO VOTE? on: October 01, 2018, 08:25:11 PM
I don't pay tax and I'm very happy about it.
I've burned my social security card and I'm very happy about it.
I don't vote and I'm very happy about it.
I'm not on facebook and I'm very happy about it.
Etc...

If everyone was like me, there would be no war.

I really wish that the government would have given me that option of either paying my taxes or not voting because I will without a moment of though pick the latter because regardless of who comes to power, they are all the same people.

Sure, but without paying property or income taxes you'll not get a driver's license, any government services, no garbage collection, no schools for your children, no bank accounts (as you'll have no id), no health care, no job and no money.  If you operate a cash business on the side without any id or registration, you'll be arrested and thrown in jail, and IRS will tell you how much you owe them.

If you don't like paying taxes in your country, leave and live somewhere else.
1865  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Why do you believe God exists? on: October 01, 2018, 01:05:45 PM

Then again, thanks to science we can drive cars, fly planes, fly to mars. That's because it works, the tests works, the method works. It's proven, period. Religion on the other hand, not so much, otherwise we would be praying all the time instead of doing scientific tests, why bother, right? Just pray to god and he will heal us, make the car and planes for us. Yet every religious nutjob out there still goes to the doctor, still takes the medicine, instead of praying to god.

Science works, religion does not.

Then again, thanks to God giving us our whole world, our bodies and our brains, we have the ability to use some of the science He created for us.

Cool

Is there free will in heaven?
1866  Other / Politics & Society / Re: The technological singularity on: October 01, 2018, 12:20:27 PM
The technological singularity, how far are we off from the 2045 date when this will all come together to the next leap in civilisation or that computers will be as smart as humans by 2029 - according to Ray Kurzweil

Whats your guys thoughts..

I think progress in AI will not be linear but 2029 might be too optimistic.

Quantum computing will play a role in AI achieving supremacy over humans.  

Humans are bad at processing large sets of data.

People who are skeptical about AI do not understand AI.

1867  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Why do you believe God exists? on: October 01, 2018, 10:53:45 AM
You have very strong points. I also wonder when a complicat ed thing or design like us humans made it the proof the God exists. I believe that God exists and I also know that he is powerful and only that. All those things that made us believe like He is human like us could not be true because He is God so he is in another high level being and should not be compared to us because we are just lowlifes to him.

What proof do you have? Ignore the scriptures for a second, think of any other reasons to believe.

I for one became skeptical after reading the Bible, then I moved on to Talmud and eventually to Quran.  I found all of the holy books to be written by people who did know much about the world that surrounded them.  The God they described was a human reflection of themselves.

They created God in their own image.
1868  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Evolution is a hoax on: October 01, 2018, 01:19:19 AM

BADLogic: "You are stupid and wrong.  Science proves that evolution is fake (no evidence given or sources cited)   #SmileyGirl Cool"

Google "evolution is impossible" to find all kinds of proof that evolution is impossible.

Evolution is a hoax.

Cool

I can google why evolution is real and find all kinds of proof why it is. I can also google rebuttals to all the supposed proof for why evolution is impossible.

Your rebuttals rebut themselves by making all kinds of assumptions that evolution is factual, when such has not been proven.

Evolution is a hoax.

Cool
1869  Other / Politics & Society / Re: I am a Muslim, and I am not a terrorist on: September 30, 2018, 08:23:19 PM
I am not saying that every Muslim is a terrorist. But every terrorist is a Muslim.“, that’s what I heard somebody saying in the media. When people say that these terrorists, especially ISIS and Taliban, are Muslims, I could also point at a donkey and say it is a horse. There is no right to call these people Muslims. If I call ISIS Muslims, it is an insult to all Muslims. If I call them non-Muslims, it is an insult to all non-Muslims. If I call them humans, it is an insult to the whole humanity. If I call them animals, I’d be insulting all animals, because even the animals will only hunt, when they need to. They are not slaughtering innocent creatures. There is not one word which I would want to use to describe ISIS and Taliban, because no word is suitable for a description without being insulted.  

Islam is not about killing innocent people in the name of religion. ISIS and Taliban are talking about the Jihad. "The fight for the religion." But what they don't understand is, that Jihad is not the fight for religion in the sense of killing non-Muslim people. Jihad is the fight with yourself. Jihad means "to strive" or "to struggle". To reach up to God, you have to find yourself. You need to find out who you are. Only then, when you found your true self, you found Islam. Islam means peace. Only then you found Peace with yourself.

Why do you believe the "night journey" happened?

Where do buraqs live, what animal family do they belong to?

When did Muhammad die?

When was al-Aqsa Mosque built?

Wake up, before it is too late for you.
1870  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Why do you believe God exists? on: September 30, 2018, 03:41:19 PM
I think my god, just like any other god, exist because of just one thing—Faith...

The problem with faith is that is does not lead to the truth.  People have faith in 1000 different religions, but that does not make any of them true.  Some people have faith the Earth is flat, ignoring any evidence to the contrary.

Faith is defined as belief without evidence.  Why believe anything without evidence?  Do you believe in unicorns or vampires or leprechauns or gremlins without evidence?

You talk so silly. Edison, in inventing the light bulb, is said to have tried a thousand different things before he found something that worked. He had enough faith to keep on through hundreds of failures.

Even the Bible says, "Faith is the substance of things hoped for, and the evidence of things not seen." So, faith is both substance and evidence. And God upholds both until they are fulfilled.

Cool

So what, what does that have to do with have thousands of religions while everyone believes they have the real one? Did edison not discard his previous attempts?

So, what does that have to do with the fact that there is faith all over the place, even in science and engineering? Since God created everything, having faith in science and engineering that God created, is having faith in God.

Cool

Exactly why religion is garbage. Everyone claims to have faith in their specific god yet by their definition, only 1 god is real so even if there was 1 real god, all the others have to be false so how do we proceed from here? How do we determine which god is the real one?

They all are equally real.  All 3000+ of them.
1871  Other / Politics & Society / Re: I am muslim, is there a problem? on: September 28, 2018, 03:16:50 PM
There's no problem being a muslim, the problem was some radikalism people are muslim and bring they religion into a bad attitude, like some Haram stuff (not about dog and pork), here in indonesia the Indonesian Council of Ulama said Bitcoin is Haram, WTF dude??
And some people accidentaly are muslim too use the religion for politics, black campaign, etc.
As long u didn't bother other people, i think its okay mate Wink

Standard good Muslims are not Islamic. They should change their religion by rewriting the Koran, removing all the directives to do violence. If they did that, they might be a little closer to being Muslims. As it is, they don't know what being a Muslim is all about... not according to ancient Islamic writings, that is.

Cool

I say you clean up the Bible first.  Be an example for others to follow.

If you can change, they can change.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtDvmV4zr-Q
1872  Other / Politics & Society / Re: blacks have lower IQ than whites on: September 28, 2018, 01:11:50 PM
From the studies I've seen, highest IQ among races.

1. whites
2. asian
3. jews
4. latinos
5. indians
6. blacks

I have never seen a single study about IQ which places whites above asians... never

Asians have been shown to have an average IQ of 10+ points higher than whites in every study

For example, this study shows Korea and Japan with an average IQ of 105+, US with 97, and US Catholics at only 90... no surprise that Catholics have a lower IQ than average Americans

Every study I have seen shows asians about 10 points higher than whites, non-religious about 10 points higher than religious, and whites about 10 points higher than blacks... I wouldn't brag if I were you



Also note, US whites are about 10-15 IQ points lower than whites from the Netherlands, an atheist country... coincidence?

I think he meant to say:

1. asian
2. jews
3. whites
4. latinos
5. indians
6. blacks

We are talking about the averages here. 

Like you said, religiosity, culture also plays a role, not just race.
 
1873  Other / Politics & Society / Re: I am muslim, is there a problem? on: September 28, 2018, 12:33:26 PM
Well the problem is people's ignorance and xenophobia and there's little you can do about that unfortunately. Just know that the root of such Islamophobia (or racism dressed up as a dislike of religion) is misplaced hatred. Deep down they hate themselves and need somebody else to blame for their failings in life so they blame people who are different to them such as foreigners or people with a different viewpoint or religious belief. They're usually too stupid to look in the mirror and realize the only person they should be blaming is themselves, but that's ignorance for you. I hear it's bliss.

Well, this might be true for people who believe in other religions.  Most Atheists think Islam's ideology is a hogwash. Which it is.

We feel sorry for the people who are under its control.

Here is a take on this religion from an Arab who grew up with it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mG64EUUxOj4&feature=youtu.be

The religions are nonsense, and they should be ridiculed, no matter if someone gets offended.  

If you feel offended, well, too bad, grow up.

This particular religion makes people do some crazy stuff, like kill themselves and hurt others.  If you deny this, YOU have a problem.
1874  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Donald Trump separation of families at the border on: September 27, 2018, 01:28:48 PM
Due to the public outcry that greeted Donald Trump's decision to separate the families of illegal immigrants, Donald Trump has reversed the policy.
His decision to reverse the policy was a noble move on his part.  I believe that children should not be deprived of the care and love they deserve. And if the illegal immigrants would be prosecuted,  the families should be detained together.
Finally,  the American government should take steps to ensure children taken away from their parents should be reunited with them once again. And to American parents not able to reunite with their kids,  American citizenship should be given to them (as reparation). Although nothing can replace the loss of a child,  it's only fair the parents should be given a second chance

What would you do if you caught parents with children robbing a bank? 

Would you put both parents and children in the same prison cell?  Or would you separate them?  Would you think that the parents were irresponsible by taking their kids to rob the bank?

There is no such thing as illegal immigrants.  All immigrants are legal.  That is why there is an IMMIGRATION ACT.

People who cross the border illegally are not immigrants.  They are just people who crossed the border illegally.
1875  Other / Politics & Society / Re: Ted Kaczynski - The Unabomber | Was he right? on: September 27, 2018, 01:19:20 PM
I would love to know the opinions of people who are interested in this very cutting edge field of blockchains and decentralisation. A lot of people who I often speak with believe that Ted Kaczynski was ahead of his time. And a lot of the ideas in his manifesto are becoming true...

Do you agree with Ted's Manifesto? and could there of been a better way today for him to have got the attention he needed for this important debate?

For anybody who's interested in his manifesto its available here.
http://editions-hache.com/essais/pdf/kaczynski2.pdf


Of course he was right.  Technology is a two edge sword.  On one hand, it helps save and prolong lives, improves the quality of our lives and on the other, it provides for a more efficient way to extract natural resources, change the natural landscape, kill and eradicate other species of plant and animals faster than ever before in our human history. 

I agree with him on the symptoms of the problem.  I do not think technological progress is to blame though.  It is a means not the actual root cause.

The root cause of our issues is the human population growth.  If we had zero or negative population growth in all countries around the globe, we would not have these issues.  We could actually get a handle on recycling, reducing our impact on the natural environment.

Our human civilization will not survive if we continue on this path.  The efforts to consume less, renewable energy, recycling etc. will not work if the global population doubles every 60-70 years.

To solve this problem, we would need to change our natural instincts to reproduce, something that helped us to be where we are now.

Population growth is the inconvenient truth.

1876  Other / Politics & Society / Re: I am muslim, is there a problem? on: September 27, 2018, 12:40:59 PM
Hello;

Please I want to discuss a very important topic, it's about the relation between Islam and extremism.

I Don't know why people are still believing that all muslims are terrorists, or extremists, I know that the majority of Muslim countries suffers from lack of democracy, but people and youth in these countries know crypto, use Facebook, Twitter, Telegram, Instagram… etc. listen to music, have boy or girlfriend, etc.

I personally suffer from those haters especially when I travel.

So, Where is the problem? I Don't know?

The problem is simple. Most Muslims are barely Muslim. Why? Because they don't obey the Koran - http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/quran/023-violence.htm. If they obeyed the Koran, they would be on eternal Jihad, just like ISIS.

So, the problem is this. When a Muslim is close to you, you don't know if he is a peaceful, almost non-Muslim Muslim, or if he is a lying, Jihad Muslim, just waiting for the right time to pounce.

And here is the problem with peaceful, almost non-Muslim Muslims. If a strong, jihad Muslim is in their presence, and he says, "Start fighting, right now, because the Koran says so, and if you don't, I will execute you, according to Koran dictates," what does the peaceful, almost non-Muslim Muslim do? He fights or dies, right?

What does this mean? It means that any peaceful, almost non-Muslim Muslim can be converted into a jihad Muslim, almost on a moment's notice. It's only the peaceful, almost non-Muslim Muslims who don't understand this. The rest of the people understand. So they are scared of Muslims, and protest them right out of the rest of society.

Cool

I agree with you that this ideology is very coercive.  "You are either with us or against us" type of deal.

The death penalty for leaving Islam makes this religion very similar to mafia, with Allah being the "capo dei capi".
1877  Other / Politics & Society / Re: I am muslim, is there a problem? on: September 26, 2018, 11:24:27 AM
Hello;

Please I want to discuss a very important topic, it's about the relation between Islam and extremism.

I Don't know why people are still believing that all muslims are terrorists, or extremists, I know that the majority of Muslim countries suffers from lack of democracy, but people and youth in these countries know crypto, use Facebook, Twitter, Telegram, Instagram… etc. listen to music, have boy or girlfriend, etc.

I personally suffer from those haters especially when I travel.

So, Where is the problem? I Don't know?

Problem with Islam is that it is not just a belief in a deity.  It is also a political and legal system masquerading as a religion.

There are many Muslims (especially those who grew up in non-Muslim cultures or those who converted to Islam from non-Muslim cultures) who ignore the political and legal teachings and focus on the religious aspects, belief in Allah the merciful, do not harm others, help others, love your brothers and sisters the way Jesus did.  Maybe you are one of those Muslims and you ignore what is happening in Saudi Arabia or Somalia.  Maybe you think that the extremists are some lunatics who misinterpret the teachings of Muhammad.

However a vast majority of Muslims in Muslim countries and Muslim cultures believe that Quran needs to be followed literally.  If Muhammad lived today, he would identify himself with groups like ISIS not with some wishy-washy Muslims who live among the non believers.

Problem is that it is impossible to separate the three fundamental components of Islam.

You have to ignore large parts of Quran to stay peaceful and sane.

Christians have the same issue.  Almost all Christians do not want to follow the legal teachings provided in the Bible, killing gays or owning slaves comes to mind.

To do the same in Islam you have to admit that Muhammad was wrong.
1878  Other / Politics & Society / Re: The difference between science and religion on: September 25, 2018, 09:15:27 PM

Common myths establish an immediate trust between strangers and allow for unimpeded cooperation.

That is why people who otherwise would kill each other work together and trust each other when they believe in the same religious or political dogma.

This of course has nothing to do if the underlying dogma is true or not.

...

Cooperative myths do indeed establish trust between strangers but such a process is self limited if the myths are false.

Cooperation forms a foundation that society builds itself upon. It allows for the unfolding of potential into higher orders of development. If the shared beliefs are false, that foundation will eventually fail and the society with it.

With increasing cooperation the power and understanding of a society grows progressively with time. Such understanding will explore and and expose any demonstrable untruths in the shared belief structure.

When this happens the common basis for cooperation fails and the society fragments and starts the process of collapse.

What is universe changing, however, is an inclusive paradigm that allows for genuine total and voluntary cooperation that cannot ever be falsified with progress. This is what is achieved by grounding ones foundation for cooperation in God.

God cannot be falsified, is entirely consistent with our knowledge of truth, and maximizes cooperation over time.

You are certainly free to reject God and attempt to ground your reality in some other faith. That is exactly what you have done with your embrace of nihilistic principles.

You can live your life as though your existence is simply chance.
You can deny any ultimate purpose to your existence.
You can even decide that you have no inherent value or worth.

In the long run, however, these are not viable beliefs. They have no future because they don't form the necessary foundation needed to sustain cooperation and hence life over time.


Not if the participants do not know that the underlying myth is false.

Who said there is no purpose of your existence in absence of a common supernatural myth?

The purpose of any living organism is to procreate. Trees, fish, humans or any other living thing have this in common.  Pass your genes to the next generation.  Have you ever wondered why grandparents are happy to see their grandchildren?   Thanks to science not supernatural myths we know better how life forms function.

If you ever farmed or did some gardening you would understand that plants and animals go to extra lengths to pass their seeds, and make sure that some of the seeds germinate and start a new life.  This is true universally all across the animal and plant kingdoms.

The superimposed purpose provided by a supernatural myth is just that.  Nothing to do with reality.

BTW, most secular nations around the world function quite well.  The religious governments are the most oppressive; Saudi Arabia, Somalia, Israel (although they consider themselves a secular nation) etc.  Your notion that you need a religious supernatural myth to unite a nation is just false.  

Nationalism, politics can unite people just as well, and unite them long-term.
1879  Other / Politics & Society / Re: The difference between science and religion on: September 25, 2018, 02:31:35 PM
Give me your best example of when God intervened to make "things that work".  I fail to see any "hand of God" in this universe.

You answered this question yourself you just don't realise it.

That is the only reason why...  Cooperation and socialization.

What does God have to do with cooperation. This is a challenging topic so I will start with the comments of miscreanity who commented on it earlier.

What is actually the worst possible outcome is to have one strategy, religion, or culture adopted by everyone.

This is the point I disagree with. I think we both agree that the optimal way to increase degrees of freedom for individuals is to allow and enable instead of controlling. A universal strategy is an essential foundation that enables freedom. Without that, we have the situation that is developing now with varying viewpoints where some sets are progressing toward destruction and others are being dragged into declining entropy. Competition can take place when there is room for growth but on a globally saturated scale, nobody wins.

Reproductive strategy is likely to become essentially irrelevant for humanity, possibly within our lifetimes. It seems inevitable that our existing biological bodies will give way to different forms that will carry us off-planet. At that point, allowing and enabling all individuals to thrive in a constructive environment becomes paramount. What then is the protocol that keeps that freedom from becoming destructive? Of course, my thinking is that the protocol is outlined in the Christian bible.

This relationship between God and cooperation is as fundamental as it is necessary. God breaks us free from ultimately self-destructive conflict and enables ever higher orders of cooperative synergy. The more we bring ourselves into alignment with God the greater the levels of cooperation that become possible.

I discussed this point in some detail here:
See: Superrationality and the Infinite

Common myths establish an immediate trust between strangers and allow for unimpeded cooperation.

That is why people who otherwise would kill each other work together and trust each other when they believe in the same religious or political dogma.

This of course has nothing to do if the underlying dogma is true or not.

Many UFOlogists would immediately trust other UFOlogists.  Same goes for FlatEarthers, Christians or Muslims.

The lower the IQ of individuals in any given group, the easier it is to establish that common trust based on the underlying myth or belief.


If the trust has been established, it remains even though the myths are shown for what they are... myths. How much stronger is the trust among believers, when the Bible is proven to be truth and fact.

Cool

Re-read my post and think about it some more.

Christian myth is the same as the Flat Earther movement from the psychological point of view. Once you are part of the group with common beliefs you cling onto that belief no matter what, that is because most people (with lesser intelligence) do not want to be wrong.

You convince yourself that what you believe is true and when you see others in your group expressing their beliefs it validates your (false) belief.  Herd mentality and confirmation bias is at play here.

It is easier to abandon your false beliefs when you leave the group, and/or have good critical thinking skills.

PS. Most scientists love to be wrong, that is why you don't see too many scientists who believe in ancient myths.

1880  Other / Politics & Society / Re: The difference between science and religion on: September 25, 2018, 11:30:23 AM
Give me your best example of when God intervened to make "things that work".  I fail to see any "hand of God" in this universe.

You answered this question yourself you just don't realise it.

That is the only reason why...  Cooperation and socialization.

What does God have to do with cooperation. This is a challenging topic so I will start with the comments of miscreanity who commented on it earlier.

What is actually the worst possible outcome is to have one strategy, religion, or culture adopted by everyone.

This is the point I disagree with. I think we both agree that the optimal way to increase degrees of freedom for individuals is to allow and enable instead of controlling. A universal strategy is an essential foundation that enables freedom. Without that, we have the situation that is developing now with varying viewpoints where some sets are progressing toward destruction and others are being dragged into declining entropy. Competition can take place when there is room for growth but on a globally saturated scale, nobody wins.

Reproductive strategy is likely to become essentially irrelevant for humanity, possibly within our lifetimes. It seems inevitable that our existing biological bodies will give way to different forms that will carry us off-planet. At that point, allowing and enabling all individuals to thrive in a constructive environment becomes paramount. What then is the protocol that keeps that freedom from becoming destructive? Of course, my thinking is that the protocol is outlined in the Christian bible.

This relationship between God and cooperation is as fundamental as it is necessary. God breaks us free from ultimately self-destructive conflict and enables ever higher orders of cooperative synergy. The more we bring ourselves into alignment with God the greater the levels of cooperation that become possible.

I discussed this point in some detail here:
See: Superrationality and the Infinite

Common myths establish an immediate trust between strangers and allow for unimpeded cooperation.

That is why people who otherwise would kill each other work together and trust each other when they believe in the same religious or political dogma.

This of course has nothing to do if the underlying dogma is true or not.

Many UFOlogists would immediately trust other UFOlogists.  Same goes for FlatEarthers, Christians or Muslims.

The lower the IQ of individuals in any given group, the easier it is to establish that common trust based on the underlying myth or belief.
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