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Author Topic: Bitmain's Released Antminer S9, World's First 16nm Miner Ready to Order  (Read 500458 times)
d57heinz
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June 03, 2016, 06:50:16 PM
 #181

*cough**cough* buy some bitcoin muddles under his breath *cough*cough*  https://bitcoinwisdom.com/markets/coinbase/btcusd

 Grin Grin Grin Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy Cheesy

edit. maybe just something around 10 20% of what you would have put on batch 1..This has some great upside potential yet.  IMO 700 - 800.  but take that with grain of salt:)

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d57heinz

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SaBit
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June 03, 2016, 07:28:05 PM
 #182

No -- It really is a no-brainer vs keeping the S7's Running


My Calculations include shipping, customs and leave a little spare -- 3 Machines - $180 per month - Where do you find power costs like that?   --  Each Machine uses around 1000Kwh per month $110 per month to run each  -- that is a saving of $220 per month  -- 2 months pretty much pays the difference no matter what happens to the price or difficulty

Return on investment on the S7's MEH -- Not really important for the decision to upgrade.   ROI on the cost of the upgrade (in power savings) is in 2.5 months tops  -- ROI on the total cost  --- I don't really care



It looks like I'll cover 75% of the cost by selling 3 S7's  -- So it is a no-brainer  -- if I can get stock

Well, I don't see how this is actually a no-brainer.  You are exchanging 14TH/s for a more efficient 14TH/s, not actually increasing your hash rate.  With the sale of your S7s covering 75% of the cost to upgrade you are still paying a minimum of $525 for that increased efficiency.  That's if you had already taken into account the shipping and customs/VAT <- depending on location.  If you simply mean 75% of $2,100 you are probably likely paying close to $600 for that increased efficiency.

The average cost to run 3 S7s for a month is $180 from what I've experienced and what I've seen other share.  The S9 will potentially lower that bill to $60.  That means you are saving $120/month with the S9 in place of the 3 S7.  So that efficiency upgrade will, by itself, will take 5 months to ROI.

But that isn't the end of the story.  Have you already hit ROI on your S7s?  If not, you didn't pay one investment off before buying another.  That means whatever you had left to ROI on the S7s must be accomplished by the S9.  The S9 can concurrently contribute to both the efficiency upgrade and the initial investment which does help out.  Depending on the batch of S7s you could have anywhere between 0-7 months of hashing remaining to ROI.

Best case scenario, you already hit ROI on a triple Batch 1 S7 setup and can focus the entire profit of the S9 into that $500-$600 investment for energy efficiency.  In this case, you're right, no-brainer.  That would be a quick 2 month ROI.  Worst case scenario you still have 5-7 months to ROI on your current S7 setup.  This would mean your shortest ROI period is 5 months, with the longest being approximately 6 months (5 months to ROI on the energy savings investment running concurrently with the 5 months to ROI on the initial investment.  After 5 months, the energy savings can then be applied to the initial investment closing the gap from 2 remaining months to potentially a single month).

So without knowing exactly what batch S7 you have or the remaining months to ROI on that investment it is hard to say, but you could be facing anything from 2 months to 6 months to ROI.  As you're selling your S7 now, that timer won't start until you receive the S9.

I don't see how anything about that was a no-brainer.  I would have to give serious thought about taking on a 6 month ROI.  That's quite a bit of risk considering all the variables and potential for failure and having every egg in a single S9 basket.
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June 03, 2016, 08:20:16 PM
 #183

No -- It really is a no-brainer vs keeping the S7's Running


My Calculations include shipping, customs and leave a little spare -- 3 Machines - $180 per month - Where do you find power costs like that?   --  Each Machine uses around 1000Kwh per month $110 per month to run each  -- that is a saving of $220 per month  -- 2 months pretty much pays the difference no matter what happens to the price or difficulty

Return on investment on the S7's MEH -- Not really important for the decision to upgrade.   ROI on the cost of the upgrade (in power savings) is in 2.5 months tops  -- ROI on the total cost  --- I don't really care



It looks like I'll cover 75% of the cost by selling 3 S7's  -- So it is a no-brainer  -- if I can get stock

Well, I don't see how this is actually a no-brainer.  You are exchanging 14TH/s for a more efficient 14TH/s, not actually increasing your hash rate.  With the sale of your S7s covering 75% of the cost to upgrade you are still paying a minimum of $525 for that increased efficiency.  That's if you had already taken into account the shipping and customs/VAT <- depending on location.  If you simply mean 75% of $2,100 you are probably likely paying close to $600 for that increased efficiency.

The average cost to run 3 S7s for a month is $180 from what I've experienced and what I've seen other share.  The S9 will potentially lower that bill to $60.  That means you are saving $120/month with the S9 in place of the 3 S7.  So that efficiency upgrade will, by itself, will take 5 months to ROI.

But that isn't the end of the story.  Have you already hit ROI on your S7s?  If not, you didn't pay one investment off before buying another.  That means whatever you had left to ROI on the S7s must be accomplished by the S9.  The S9 can concurrently contribute to both the efficiency upgrade and the initial investment which does help out.  Depending on the batch of S7s you could have anywhere between 0-7 months of hashing remaining to ROI.

Best case scenario, you already hit ROI on a triple Batch 1 S7 setup and can focus the entire profit of the S9 into that $500-$600 investment for energy efficiency.  In this case, you're right, no-brainer.  That would be a quick 2 month ROI.  Worst case scenario you still have 5-7 months to ROI on your current S7 setup.  This would mean your shortest ROI period is 5 months, with the longest being approximately 6 months (5 months to ROI on the energy savings investment running concurrently with the 5 months to ROI on the initial investment.  After 5 months, the energy savings can then be applied to the initial investment closing the gap from 2 remaining months to potentially a single month).

So without knowing exactly what batch S7 you have or the remaining months to ROI on that investment it is hard to say, but you could be facing anything from 2 months to 6 months to ROI.  As you're selling your S7 now, that timer won't start until you receive the S9.

I don't see how anything about that was a no-brainer.  I would have to give serious thought about taking on a 6 month ROI.  That's quite a bit of risk considering all the variables and potential for failure and having every egg in a single S9 basket.

I'm in North Texas on a 100% wind plan that is $0.067/kWh. The guys on coal are getting a slightly better deal and farms are at half that cost using commercial accounts. If you're trying to mine at >$.1/kWh I could understand paying $500 for efficiency. Then again, if you're mining at those rates you're never going to get your BTC back anyway. Which explains your closing statement.

Most people care whether they make their money back so this isn't a no-brainer for most people.
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June 03, 2016, 11:05:52 PM
 #184

Batch 1 is up for sale again.
hawkfish007
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June 03, 2016, 11:20:49 PM
 #185

Batch 1 is up for sale again.

Just ordered one Smiley

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June 03, 2016, 11:31:21 PM
 #186

I think we will see soon Bitmain S9-LN with PSU about 7 TH/s , 700 watt. Its gonna be more comfortable for home miners. IMHO.
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June 04, 2016, 12:44:10 AM
 #187

Batch 1 is up for sale again.

Just ordered one Smiley
Ditto. Was afraid I missed getting one as with Summer upon us I want to take 3 of the s7's at home offline and replace with the s9. 'Bout the same TH/s but knocking 2.6kw off of the heat load my AC has to handle. Happy Happy, Joy Joy!

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philipma1957
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June 04, 2016, 12:52:30 AM
 #188

I may order a third one today.

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June 04, 2016, 01:34:17 AM
 #189

you guys are wild, but I like the spirit of "shut up and take my money"  Grin
edonkey
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June 04, 2016, 01:44:45 AM
 #190

Shipping is right after the Dragon Boat festival. I hope that doesn't mean shipping delays for those that bought B1.

Probably not. You have to hope they learned their lesson from the S7 B1 delays.

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June 04, 2016, 01:52:45 AM
 #191

Shipping is right after the Dragon Boat festival. I hope that doesn't mean shipping delays for those that bought B1.

Probably not. You have to hope they learned their lesson from the S7 B1 delays.

The lesson being "let's promise compensation and forget it until months later"?  Grin

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June 04, 2016, 01:56:18 AM
 #192

Oh man the S9 that was pretty quick from the last release I feel like but I guess in the bitcoin world things move real fast lol
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June 04, 2016, 02:02:16 AM
 #193

This thing is going to make the difficulty go to heights never before seen and massive 20% increases are pretty much guranteed.  But WOW this thing is amazing its too bad the halving is happening so soon, itll be hard to be profitable but then again who knows what will happen after the halving anyway the btc price can spike up or old miners turn off lowering difficulty, only time will tell i suppose
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June 04, 2016, 02:27:55 AM
 #194

B1 S9 is gone again?
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June 04, 2016, 02:40:51 AM
 #195

B1 S9 is gone again?

Yes, out of stock again. Kudos to Bitmain for not letting too many people get sucked into buying these Smiley

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June 04, 2016, 02:55:56 AM
 #196

B1 S9 is gone again?

Yes, out of stock again. Kudos to Bitmain for not letting too many people get sucked into buying these Smiley
As has already repeated ad-nauseum here and in other 16nm threads, 'tisn't Bitmain that limited the supply, it's TSMC. Pretty safe bet that given a choice Bitmain would much rather be pumping these things out the door as fast as possible.

I don't doubt that Bitmain is on an allocation schedule from TSMC so other 16nm boutique chips can be ran (maybe BitFury's? Been mighty quiet in that camp...) until all the delayed production is being covered and eventually is caught up. Until then it will be interesting to see how batch timing goes.

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June 04, 2016, 03:27:45 AM
 #197

B1 S9 is gone again?

Yes, out of stock again. Kudos to Bitmain for not letting too many people get sucked into buying these Smiley

 
I could not clear my funds for my purchase.. Will stick with  the 2.

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June 04, 2016, 03:32:51 AM
 #198

Bitmain have hacked stratum in the S9 miner.
Adding their own special command for antpool ... who knows what they do with that extra command during authentification ...

We don't allow invalid commands during authentication e.g. to stop DDoS attempts sending rubbish to the pool when they connect.
So, yep as of now the S9 wont work on CKPool.
Any pool that allows the miner to send random rubbish during connection will allow it.

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June 04, 2016, 03:38:16 AM
 #199

Bitmain have hacked stratum in the S9 miner.
Adding their own special command for antpool ... who knows what they do with that extra command during authentification ...

We don't allow invalid commands during authentication e.g. to stop DDoS attempts sending rubbish to the pool when they connect.
So, yep as of now the S9 wont work on CKPool.
Any pool that allows the miner to send random rubbish during connection will allow it.

Can this be worked around using a local proxy?

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June 04, 2016, 04:04:51 AM
 #200

Bitmain have hacked stratum in the S9 miner.
Adding their own special command for antpool ... who knows what they do with that extra command during authentification ...

We don't allow invalid commands during authentication e.g. to stop DDoS attempts sending rubbish to the pool when they connect.
So, yep as of now the S9 wont work on CKPool.
Any pool that allows the miner to send random rubbish during connection will allow it.

You used to have a special hookup for asicminer tubes.

Been a while since I had a tube.

Will you be able to allow the s-9 in the same manner?

I have two on order and I don't want to point at antpool.
I may have to not order a third or fourth one.

I mine alt coins with https://simplemining.net...
I see BTC as the super highway and alt coins as taxis and trucks needed to move transactions.
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