Swedish ASIC miner company kncminer.com

[lightfoot]

Fixing the batch 2's for 0.2 btc would be worth it if it were batch one. I sold batch 2 for 0.15 BTC. You might want to price match the fix so batch 2 customers don't feel like they are paying for a whole new board.

Well, since the batch 2 boards appear broken I would assume that the seller refunded the cost of the board as what was delivered appears to be (at least in the case of 2 received and reviewed so far) a non-working board. That's not my issue or concern, and doesn't affect the prices I charge for my tools and time.

By that logic the total increase in cost of ownership to the end user is only .05btc plus shipping. .2 also accounts for my time, effort, and the (one) Pi fried so far in troubleshooting this thing blind, as the maker of the board is unable/unwilling to provide information on it. So I have to do it the good old fashioned way (my brain and time), just like the KNC boards.

C

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[Searing]

Fixing the batch 2's for 0.2 btc would be worth it if it were batch one. I sold batch 2 for 0.15 BTC. You might want to price match the fix so batch 2 customers don't feel like they are paying for a whole new board.

Well, since the batch 2 boards appear broken I would assume that the seller refunded the cost of the board as what was delivered appears to be (at least in the case of 2 received and reviewed so far) a non-working board. That's not my issue or concern, and doesn't affect the prices I charge for my tools and time.

By that logic the total increase in cost of ownership to the end user is only .05btc plus shipping. .2 also accounts for my time, effort, and the (one) Pi fried so far in troubleshooting this thing blind, as the maker of the board is unable/unwilling to provide information on it. So I have to do it the good old fashioned way (my brain and time), just like the KNC boards.

C

Again ..no slam on you...just saying no one getting the  batch 2 qberty boards as of *yet I hope still*  has been compensated for the fact they did not work..probably (my guess 20 folk?)

I was just a venting Likely if you get them to work I will FLIP the bridge boards with some Jupiter boards and a PI and maybe get what I got in out of this with someone who needs a complete bridge/titan board setup

but like most plans ..it is probably moot I have no control over any of this

We will see if qberty comes thru on 3rd batch and replaces the non working stuff as he says he may to the 2nd batch non-working folk  Again Qberty no slam intended but it has been months....so not exactly looking good from our end in the consumer dept of the product ...

Not much I can do about it at this point in time but send lightfoot the bridges and get something out of it

later

[qberty]

It feels like you guys are being hostile when i'm not. There's only so much I can do when it comes to crowdfunded products. You are providing a service to fix the boards for a price. That is not the same and comparable to what I did in making them. 0.2 BTC would literally cost a customer more than the price of the board itself and all the parts put together by anyone at the current rate of BTC to fiat right now. My point is, for the big bulk buyers that got it for 0.15 and the smaller buyers that got it for 0.20 paid way earlier in the year with the price being of lower value.

So unless you're saying that your fix is of higher value/comparable to someone designing a PCB, buying all the parts, and putting it together as a product, it just seems like you're taking advantage of people's need for the fix. I'd like to see you try and design it and source all the parts and have it manufactured (while controlling the fab) and still only charge 0.2 btc for your "tools and time". You know full well I can't just release a company trade secret yet you add the "/unwilling" end as if i'm purposefully trying to hide everything. If that were the case, I wouldn't even have made batch 1's and none of the big miners would be running their titans. I take offense.

Searing, I know you're venting, but you clearly don't understand the circumstances. A refund makes sense and is feasible when you make a product, have it mass produced, and sell it. Refunding can be done on a singular basis and can be taken out of the owners funds. A crowdfunded product was only possible using the funds from everyone combined to get the product to even exist. Refunds aren't feasible as there's no mass production, there's no development teams to deal with it easily, and there certainly isn't the capital to handle it. Again, you're treating me like i'm a self-contained company. I'm just a guy that's trying to help KNC customers. It worked the first time, failed the second time. So I learn from it. If I had the capital to offer refunds, then a crowdfunding thing wouldn't even be necessary.

I'm literally making titan mining still doable as it's rare that any big buying customers with more than 1 set, have their original bridges without burning them.

On my third batch I did say, if I get a bulk enough order than i'll be shipping the rest to batch 2 buyers for free and i'm sticking to my word. I'm waiting for a couple more people to get on board before I start however.

I'm also working on an extremely cheap closed loop liquid cooling solution that seems to be working nicely. Looks like I can reproduce stable 65-70 C temps on the VRMs reliably. I'll post some pics soon.

[lightfoot]

It feels like you guys are being hostile when i'm not. There's only so much I can do when it comes to crowdfunded products. You are providing a service to fix the boards for a price. That is not the same and comparable to what I did in making them. 0.2 BTC would literally cost a customer more than the price of the board itself and all the parts put together by anyone at the current rate of BTC to fiat right now. My point is, for the big bulk buyers that got it for 0.15 and the smaller buyers that got it for 0.20 paid way earlier in the year with the price being of lower value.

Um.... No, not hostile, just working. I charge my time and effort which includes figuring things out. Remember I've spent part of a week taking this little bridge board thing apart, reverse engineering the leads, scratching my head at why the grounds are different from a rational design (most people don't route 3.3v from a charge pump to ground) figuring out the component using a scope, and risking my own gear (my bridgeboard, my pi, and my controller board which costs me $90 in parts and an hour of cursing and two reheats to swap the fpga every time I blow it out because KNC didn't #&$@*$@ put any buffers on the outputs).

That's totally independent of the time it takes to design (if I had the design I would be a big big big step ahead in life but I don't and that's that) and work with a firm to fab boards. If I had the mask files for any of this, it would be a snap.

So unless you're saying that your fix is of higher value/comparable to someone designing a PCB, buying all the parts, and putting it together as a product, it just seems like you're taking advantage of people's need for the fix. I'd like to see you try and design it and source all the parts and have it manufactured (while controlling the fab) and still only charge 0.2 btc for your "tools and time". You know full well I can't just release a company trade secret yet you add the "/unwilling" end as if i'm purposefully trying to hide everything. If that were the case, I wouldn't even have made batch 1's and none of the big miners would be running their titans. I take offense.

It's different skills, and thus not comparable. I charge at least $150 an hour for professional work partially because I value my time and partially because I can get paid a lot more for my main line of work (and there are only so many hours in the day). So far this week I have spent a lot more than that figuring out some of these problems, so my bill rate is probably pretty low :-)

As for you not being able to say anything, well you can't and that's fine, I can figure it out myself. Just takes a long time, using fuzzers on these boards is a bitch on wheels  due to the 6-8 layers and the monster ground planes in there. Also stuff goes weird places and some of the design decisions don't match what I would call anything rational. Which is why I post my stuff on my fixing forum, because other people should (and have done) working on my work. Since I have no encumbrances I can do that.

As for value, let's just say rework is not something that can be done easily (I have reversed the damage done by at least one other person trying to rework SOT23's with a blowtorch somewhere in the world) and takes some skill. If people wish to undercut me on price then by all means please DO SO!, having more people fixing this stuff is good, and gives home miners options.

I'm literally making titan mining still doable as it's rare that any big buying customers with more than 1 set, have their original bridges without burning them.

I appreciate this, that's why I fix this stuff. Big big customers have their own shops and have probably twisted KNC's arm for the schematics. I just help level the field for the home miners. I also dispense advice around here, mostly telling people to STOP RUNNING THEM AT FULL BLAST and run them at 60mh per cube. Cooler, less power overload, etc. Also this is a several thousand dollar item made of ultra cutting edge parts for a cryptocurrency philosophy that is the cutting edge of the future. Don't run it in a fucking barn (I say as I literally had to clean horse crap out of one board. Yes. Straw included. Yes, the Straw had caught fire. Several Times based on the burns on the board).

On my third batch I did say, if I get a bulk enough order than i'll be shipping the rest to batch 2 buyers for free and i'm sticking to my word. I'm waiting for a couple more people to get on board before I start however.

Sounds good. In the meantime if anyone is dead in the water drop me a line or read my other thread on fixing these things for fun and laughs. You can do the fix yourself on the stock KNC boards (I believe I documented it in my thread) if you can use a fine-tipped soldering iron, have good eyes or a 3x loupe, and can get wire wrap wire from Radio Slack. That and a steady hand will do it.

[lightfoot]

And in the ter-fucking-ific category, it looks like the Rpi model B 1.2 models currently on Amazon.com have a slightly different CPU and will not boot the stock KNC firmware. So we're dead in the water there.

Stupid micro-code. This could be a problem.

[Searing]

And in the ter-fucking-ific category, it looks like the Rpi model B 1.2 models currently on Amazon.com have a slightly different CPU and will not boot the stock KNC firmware. So we're dead in the water there.

Stupid micro-code. This could be a problem.

You could be correct  Element 14 has them on eBay and they look like this with heatsinks built in



vs the old without heatsinks included version of Raspberry Pi B+ 512mb v1.2




Anyway ...the pic with the heatsinks may come with the CPU mod you specify. The dates on the board are the same. So maybe there is a way to tell the difference just by the
heatsinks?

Anyway, all I got. Others can chime in if they are getting Pi's w/o this heatsink mod which will make my above point moot. But what I saw on eBay at a quick glance.

So if correct we will have to avoid the NEW versions with the heatsink. (no way to tell used ones if someone added a heatsink thou).

Hopefully at least a guy will have that much as a hint?

[lightfoot]

I think we're fucked. I just spent 6 hours working on this code trash heap they call KNC. The problem is when you update the damn OS it breaks all the I2C extensions and re-enabling them is a work of pain.

Somebody else fix this, ok? It's pretty obvious that even older revision technology is incompatible with itself. Because stupid. It looks like it might be in the device tree support; I was able to get at least something up with turning that off, but the one i2c driver does not see any of the devices on the Pi at all.

Whole day shot to hell.

[Searing]

I think we're fucked. I just spent 6 hours working on this code trash heap they call KNC. The problem is when you update the damn OS it breaks all the I2C extensions and re-enabling them is a work of pain.

Somebody else fix this, ok? It's pretty obvious that even older revision technology is incompatible with itself. Because stupid. It looks like it might be in the device tree support; I was able to get at least something up with turning that off, but the one i2c driver does not see any of the devices on the Pi at all.

Whole day shot to hell.

So when the 'old stock' of the labeled the same Raspberry Pi B+ 512mb units are gone. WE are screwed..because there is NO WAY to tell till you plug the puppies in
IF they are newer and won't work?

IS there any difference on the boards. The heatsink picture is what comes up on some  new sales I've seen but all else on the board is identical including the silkscreen of

v1.2 2014 tag

Gonna be really, really annoying if there is no way to tell old v1.2 from new version v1.2 Raspberry Pi 512 mb boards. I looked at my boxes for such, no code version on the boxes

I have either.

Anyway is the above where we are at? The units I found new with heatsinks mean nothing for identification? They were just an add on of no conseguence?

Again if so that will really suck

[AmDD]

Not good news at all. I try to keep up with the hardware issues on these things even though so far Ive been lucky and only had to deal with dead dies on my titan. No controller issues at all *knocks on wood*.

lightfoot, I took your advice (i think it was yours anyway) awhile back and only ran mine at 275mhz per die and have upgraded the cooling per searings advice just to get this thing to last as long as possible.

[lightfoot]

Indeed. The problem seems to be that the video chip in use in the latest RPi B+ 512 1.2 Pi's requires the later bootloader and kernel than what is in the 2.00 release. The problem with this is the latest kernel totally breaks the SIO interface so things don't work for crap. It's possible someone can find the last kernel, bootloader, and elf that supported the old SPI standards we could try that. I spent all weekend screwing with this, someone else can help.

In the meantime I've picked up the "make the damn beaglebone work". After pounding for the rest of the weekend I have waas up, website up, I can configure the Titans (and Neptunes), and have bfgminer compiled to the point where it can see the knc0-4 devices but they don't initialize.

So close. There are a lot of errors in the KNC documentation, compiling this is a pain in the ass. I think the final issue is in asic.c.

C

[vegasguy]

Do you think Tarkin can modify his code to boot with a later pi version? I would gladly pay to see this done, as I was the first to pay for custom work from him for the Titan miner project.

Vegas

[dogjunior]

My rb pi is a rb pi 3 model B V1.2. Will this work with the Qberty board? Maybe this is why my board does not function? I did not think of this.

[Searing]

My rb pi is a rb pi 3 model B V1.2. Will this work with the Qberty board? Maybe this is why my board does not function? I did not think of this.

How do you tell old version from new?  Heatsinks? The silkscreen on board is the same.

[dogjunior]

My rb pi is a rb pi 3 model B V1.2. Will this work with the Qberty board? Maybe this is why my board does not function? I did not think of this.

How do you tell old version from new?  Heatsinks? The silkscreen on board is the same.

Why didn't those pricks use a beaglebone? RB pi nothing but problems.

[GenTarkin]

Do you think Tarkin can modify his code to boot with a later pi version? I would gladly pay to see this done, as I was the first to pay for custom work from him for the Titan miner project.

Vegas

Problem is, I dont have physical interaction w/ my Titan and henceforth its RPI...so, I cant really chance updating anything that would cause it to not easily be recoverable =(

[lightfoot]

Do you think Tarkin can modify his code to boot with a later pi version? I would gladly pay to see this done, as I was the first to pay for custom work from him for the Titan miner project.

Vegas

Problem is, I dont have physical interaction w/ my Titan and henceforth its RPI...so, I cant really chance updating anything that would cause it to not easily be recoverable =(

That's a problem. I put the BB port on the side for a bit, if someone really wants me to blow a weekend hacking a version of Debian/Pi that will boot let me know.

[Searing]

Do you think Tarkin can modify his code to boot with a later pi version? I would gladly pay to see this done, as I was the first to pay for custom work from him for the Titan miner project.

Vegas

Problem is, I dont have physical interaction w/ my Titan and henceforth its RPI...so, I cant really chance updating anything that would cause it to not easily be recoverable =(

That's a problem. I put the BB port on the side for a bit, if someone really wants me to blow a weekend hacking a version of Debian/Pi that will boot let me know.

Damn..it would help us greatly if you could become WEALTHY as well as eccentric...to keep the BBB project and others going on here..don't ya know Work on that will ya?

By the By I assume the Qberty 2nd batch PI fix attempts are also 'dead' at this time? (going for 100% in the wrong direction..its a theme I tell ya.. ..ho ya ..)

[lightfoot]

Damn..it would help us greatly if you could become WEALTHY as well as eccentric...to keep the BBB project and others going on here..don't ya know Work on that will ya?

By the By I assume the Qberty 2nd batch PI fix attempts are also 'dead' at this time? (going for 100% in the wrong direction..its a theme I tell ya.. ..ho ya ..)

I'll put some time on it this weekend, been testing your cube (the cap is back on, the solder was bad, 64mh as seen below) and on a separate controller Johnny's (fun little project, was totally dead, now running fine but occasionally resets the power supply. Run it on its' own supply and it is happy). His other cube is a mystery: Supplies now come up (two shorted), communications restored, but the chip doesn't hash.

As for the BB's I was waiting for a need for more fpga's so I don't do a 5 buck order. Sure enough got another one in for fixing, so order going out for higher pf crystals.

C

 bfgminer version 5.4.2-titan-2.02 - Started: [2016-12-02 20:21:48] - [  0 days 17:18:49]
 [M]anage devices [P]ool management Settings [D]isplay options                                                                               [H]elp [Q]uit
 Pool 0: us.litecoinpool.or  Diff:125m  +Strtm  LU:[13:40:26]  User:Well yeah, right....
 Block: ...2a7ab326c9461e01  Diff:67.7k (484.8G)  Started: [13:38:43]  I: 1.22mBTC/hr
 ST:21  F:0  NB:411  AS:0  BW:[ 24/ 14 B/s]  E:0.77  BS:485
 1/4           | 66.05/64.25/64.14Mh/s | A:7304 R:42+0(.57%) HW:1207/.50%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 KNC 0a:       | 13.98/13.57/13.57Mh/s | A:1543 R: 6+0(.39%) HW: 203/.40%
 KNC 0b:       | 10.91/13.59/13.56Mh/s | A:1514 R: 9+0(.59%) HW: 221/.44%
 KNC 0c:       | 24.05/18.56/18.52Mh/s | A:2146 R:14+0(.65%) HW: 415/.60%
 KNC 0d:       | 19.57/18.52/18.48Mh/s | A:2102 R:13+0(.61%) HW: 368/.53%
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 [2016-12-03 13:35:56] Accepted 0005a5a2 KNC 0c Diff 177m/125m

[lightfoot]

My rb pi is a rb pi 3 model B V1.2. Will this work with the Qberty board? Maybe this is why my board does not function? I did not think of this.

The qberty board has a short on its' 3.3 volt line where it runs through the crystal. That keeps the Pi from even powering up (and might blow up the Pi if your PSU was big enough). I've cleared the short on a test board, but am also fiddling with the crystals.

C

[imbladednow]

And in the ter-fucking-ific category, it looks like the Rpi model B 1.2 models currently on Amazon.com have a slightly different CPU and will not boot the stock KNC firmware. So we're dead in the water there.

Stupid micro-code. This could be a problem.

You could be correct  Element 14 has them on eBay and they look like this with heatsinks built in



vs the old without heatsinks included version of Raspberry Pi B+ 512mb v1.2




Anyway ...the pic with the heatsinks may come with the CPU mod you specify. The dates on the board are the same. So maybe there is a way to tell the difference just by the
heatsinks?

Anyway, all I got. Others can chime in if they are getting Pi's w/o this heatsink mod which will make my above point moot. But what I saw on eBay at a quick glance.

So if correct we will have to avoid the NEW versions with the heatsink. (no way to tell used ones if someone added a heatsink thou).

Hopefully at least a guy will have that much as a hint?

How much can that chip mine?