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Question: What year will we achieve a new ATH?
2019 - 50 (30.7%)
2020 - 64 (39.3%)
2021 - 34 (20.9%)
2022 - 8 (4.9%)
2023 - 2 (1.2%)
Never - 5 (3.1%)
Total Voters: 163

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Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 21183008 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (24 posts by 13 users deleted.)
HairyMaclairy
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April 16, 2019, 05:32:53 AM

I am not sure I understand the goals of libertarians. If they want to build their own country, they have to be able to defend it.  

A small group of 40 - 50 heavily armed people will never do. A decent defense force means a large population and a taxation systems to support it. Gathering a large population is easy, you simply need to gather the world’s refugees and offer them something better.  You might even gain the support of Western governments if you promise to take their unwanted refugee claimants. Israel was invented to house Jewish refugees and the model is replicable.

But all you have done is recreate the existing state system, with taxes. And that doesn’t seem to be the point.


The US did fine for 137 years with no income tax. Tariffs alone could be enough to support a reasonable, modern military. Maybe throw in corporate taxes so you can weaponize space.


Edit: I also realized r0ach has been gone for a while.
Theories: 1)He's on vacation with V8,  2)He was touring the Notre Dame spire today, 3)He's staying in a small seastead off the coast of Thailand.

Tarriffs are a tax - just levied on imports instead of income.  Effectively a consumption tax like VAT.

Of course if you impose tariffs you will trigger a trade war and your exports will be hit.
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April 16, 2019, 05:39:30 AM

Good Morning !

Hi WO,s

This is the presentation format of the monthly statistics, it will be published on the last day of the month.

Good initiative. Maybe add the % change of replies and views (and hats) in addition to the BTC % change for easier comparison. Willing to bet there's a positive correlation between all 3.

Maybe the hats are the causative effect, as in more commenters wearing hats is a bullish indicator.
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April 16, 2019, 05:43:12 AM
Merited by silverfuture (1)


Edit: I also realized r0ach has been gone for a while.
Theories: 2)

We are not that lucky are we?
-----------

Bullish on the WO you dont say?  There seems to be ample growth opportunity.

Good morning VB. Thanks for your contributions.

+1 WOsMerit



------------
The market seems to want to continue barting...upwards. Unsure what to make of it. Further analysis needed.

#dyor
1h


definitely Wednesdays are better than Tuesdays
2h


4h

#stronghands'19
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April 16, 2019, 05:45:46 AM

VB1001, nice effort and looking forward to all the data and monthly update. Well done!
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April 16, 2019, 05:58:54 AM

What a shitty day, hope they can rebuild it.
Going to bed, nightynight you all.

 Today was indeed a very sad day.  Hopefully tomorrow brings some better events.
 Good night.


It seems it touched many people outside of France too. I'm quite surprised by such reactions actually.
Pinault, a French Billionaire has offered 100 millions to rebuild it.
And there are already 3 fund raisings opened.
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April 16, 2019, 06:00:18 AM

Last of the V8s - Last online 6 April

I hope you’re ok buddy, I just thought about you & wondered where you are. Not seen you post for a while. Let us know you’re ok when you get chance.

You’re probably on holiday or something, I’m just used to seeing you post regularly.

Let us know if you read this.

Indeed he's being missed in here  Undecided

He said he was on a trip and yeah his sense of humor is missed.
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April 16, 2019, 06:39:05 AM
Merited by vapourminer (1)

What he has been doing has been obvious to me (I think) and this supports it.  He has been trying to make "bitcoin" something that the state and the CBs could embrace.

Question: Would you prefer to prohibit any state actor from participating in Bitcoin?

Followup: If answer to above is 'yes', how do you square this with the mutually-exclusive attribute of 'permissionless'?
I differentiate between participation and taking over control, which is what was suggested during a Coingeek conference in which the blights of society were supposed to get sufficient tools to keep doing what they have been in a more efficient manner.

You would need to provide more info if you expect me to know what you are talking about. All I have seen from CSW as public pronouncements on changes to the protocol have been to restrict any such protocol changes to be to 'unfucken' (not his term, actually Shadders', I believe) it back to parity with v0.1. Any tools sitting atop such a protocol are just that - not base layer. Accordingly, I don't understand what that has to do with SV. If any public pronouncement has even been made.

I note also that you have not answered the posited question(s).

Quote
If Roger hadn't teamed up with CSW and Bitmain (phony hash war)

Exactly what is a 'phony hash war'? As differentiated, I suppose, from a 'real hash war?
I don't care enough to dig out the exact Coingeek conference at which they specifically suggested that Bitcoin needs to "grow up" (from it's anti-establishment narrative) and get into bed with the FED and other institutions to succeed as strictly a means of p2p payment system as opposed to a solution to (the bigger portions of) governments and central banks being a detriment to humanity. I also don't feel like copy/pasting the countless other contradictions to Satoshi that have eluded CSW.

All I know is that I don't want to support someone of his character in any way. Based on what I've seen the only thing standing between him and becoming a dictator in the image of notorious figures of the past is the necessary infrastructure to facilitate his rise to power and given the power he certainly isn't of the type of character to allow people to criticize or oppose him.

Even if BSV was technologically superior, there is no excuse for supporting a character like CSW over forking BSV#2 to make sure that a person that is more likely than the majority of people to silence others won't ever get the power to do so.
And if you truly believe in the potential of Bitcoin then you're surely aware that a person with excessive control over Bitcoin, and thus the potential money of the future, would have potentially free reign. Lots of conditionals happening in convolution here, but an outcome that should be avoided at all costs regardless.


A phony hash war is what we've seen take place. If it [redirection of hash rate] was for strictly technological reasons they wouldn't have switched back to BTC when they realized they were burning too much money and simply shut off as much as necessary to stay green on their own chain. Hence, they are either in it for money or for power with a tilt towards the latter in the case of CSW.

Edit: I don't care if people act for money. That's fair game depending on the methods employed. CSW is very different from Roger and possibly Jihan though.
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April 16, 2019, 06:48:55 AM
Merited by nutildah (1), HairyMaclairy (1)

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April 16, 2019, 06:56:54 AM

What he has been doing has been obvious to me (I think) and this supports it.  He has been trying to make "bitcoin" something that the state and the CBs could embrace.

Question: Would you prefer to prohibit any state actor from participating in Bitcoin?

Followup: If answer to above is 'yes', how do you square this with the mutually-exclusive attribute of 'permissionless'?
I differentiate between participation and taking over control, which is what was suggested during a Coingeek conference in which the blights of society were supposed to get sufficient tools to keep doing what they have been in a more efficient manner.
This could also be the issue on which CSW and Roger parted and to some extent why I don't have any hard feelings against him. CSW clearly cares about nothing worth caring about, unlike Roger (anti-establishment).

If Roger hadn't teamed up with CSW and Bitmain (phony hash war) I might've very well been persuaded to at least keep sensible portions of both chains in cold storage.

Roger isn't much better than Craig. He is a fucking opportunist. (one of the most disgusting) He allied with Craig when his actions were benefiting his agenda and he didn't say a word against Craig till the last second before BcashSV and BcashABC were decoupled.

He used or tried to use Craig just like he tried to use Bitcoin. Bitcoin was good when it was benefiting his own agenda but it became super bad when the devs didn't act and do what he proposed.

How is he different than Craig?

Craig is following exactly the same route as Roger except he is too obvious about what he is doing. (lying) Roger is also a two faced sociopath who's going to say whatever lie to get what he wants. (less obvious, but still obvious)

Both of them are disgusting piece of shits but If I had to choose one, I would choose Craig just because he is a fucking clown and unlike him Roger has a slight chance to succeed, which is scary.

Fuck both of them in the end. Btw Bought more BTC today from $5.2k.  Cheesy
I can't read minds and Roger stated that he was fooled. This could very well be him covering his ass.

But unlike CSW, Roger is still openly against government and central banking. CSW is not. And if there's one thing we know about con-men like CSW it's that they are pretty good at fooling people for short periods of time. And that effect is amplified when a person feels like the world is out against them.

In short, I don't know if Roger is anti-BTC because of he truly believes that BABC is better or because he's strictly an opportunist. In CSW's case it's much more clear.

Or in other words, I'm certain that CSW is an evil little cunt. With Roger I am not certain, so I can't put him in the same boat as CSW. If the evidence changes I will quickly amend my opinion (for better or for worse).
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April 16, 2019, 06:58:29 AM


This almost makes me want to upload my drivers license to shapesh... umm... well... not quite.

Wink
Does Shapeshift require KYC now? Doesn't that defeat its purpose? lol


The required reply when anyone tries to tell you any of the following:

1. Bitcoin is going to crash to zero

2. BCH is the real Bitcoin

3. Craig Wright is the real Satoshi

4. X/Y/Z shitcoin will supersede Bitcoin

5. China bans Bitcoin

6. Governments will outlaw Bitcoin

7. Bitcoin mining is unsustainable and consumes too much energy


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GM-e46xdcUo
Damn, thanks for the trip down nostalgia lane.
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April 16, 2019, 07:04:00 AM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26LDWnM7qe4

6:55

Craig claims that Bitcoin was not created to fix "the system", while Satoshi created Bitcoin as a reaction to the 2008 financial crisis.

His quote: "That's [debt and the debt crisis] not what Bitcoin helps with."

Every other time he opens his mouth he directly contradicts Satoshi.

He fails to understand that once we will use currency that price will keep increasing in time taking debt will be extremely unpopular. There will be also little interest for people to offer debts. 
I don't think that debt will disappear and I don't think debt is inherently a problem. Out of control debt and bailouts at tax payers' expense are the issue. There is and always will be need and use for debt though.

Who will loan something that will gain price in year fro like 10%. Or more?  I mean you will take small loans fro something that will bring you huge profit. But it will not be like there is today when they dont even want to sell you a car unless you take it on loan. Or when countries have for half year of production of debt. If not they looks stupid. Trust me this will stop.
If you think that Bitcoin will perpetually gain 10% per year you're mistaken. And for the time that it does there will be similar downswings. So taking and giving loans at the right times means profit for the party that played it better.
Never mind that people will help others for any number of reasons if they require money in the short term. There are also stablecoins to peg the loans to and there will always be people who hedge some risks in all sorts of stable assets.
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April 16, 2019, 07:11:52 AM

Good to see this notification today morning!



Good effort by a reputed person like CZ in helping community to avoid scam project investments. Kudos to Binance and CZ.
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April 16, 2019, 07:48:21 AM

Either Ayre knows something we don't, got conned, or he's preparing to break ties with CSW.



"This industry needs to grow up and Craig proving he is Satoshi is the only way past this Troll attack that is so bad for the industries reputation. He now has a duty to set the record straight for us all. The Trolls all know he is Satoshi hence the fear."

https://twitter.com/CalvinAyre/status/1117706922415853569
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April 16, 2019, 08:06:44 AM

Either Ayre knows something we don't, got conned, or he's preparing to break ties with CSW.



"This industry needs to grow up and Craig proving he is Satoshi is the only way past this Troll attack that is so bad for the industries reputation. He now has a duty to set the record straight for us all. The Trolls all know he is Satoshi hence the fear."

https://twitter.com/CalvinAyre/status/1117706922415853569

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April 16, 2019, 08:07:53 AM

Either Ayre knows something we don't, got conned, or he's preparing to break ties with CSW.



"This industry needs to grow up and Craig proving he is Satoshi is the only way past this Troll attack that is so bad for the industries reputation. He now has a duty to set the record straight for us all. The Trolls all know he is Satoshi hence the fear."

https://twitter.com/CalvinAyre/status/1117706922415853569

Bluff, nothing more.
Or he's been fooled by CSW.
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April 16, 2019, 08:17:45 AM
Last edit: April 16, 2019, 08:46:41 AM by fillippone
Merited by vapourminer (1)

I am not sure I understand the goals of libertarians. If they want to build their own country, they have to be able to defend it.  

A small group of 40 - 50 heavily armed people will never do. A decent defense force means a large population and a taxation systems to support it. Gathering a large population is easy, you simply need to gather the world’s refugees and offer them something better.  You might even gain the support of Western governments if you promise to take their unwanted refugee claimants. Israel was invented to house Jewish refugees and the model is replicable.

But all you have done is recreate the existing state system, with taxes. And that doesn’t seem to be the point.


I think their utopistic point is that in a libertarian world, organisations would adopt sound money (say, BTC) instead of FIAT Money (money that can be printed at will to finance any implausible war a government would want to fight), every nation-scale war would be simply too dear to finance, hence the necessity of every national scale defense would be unnecessary.

F. A. Hayek once said: I do not think it is an exaggeration to say history is largely a history of inflation, usually inflations engineered by governments for the gain of governments.

Another important point is the fundamental difference regarding the approach. In the current system the approach is TOP DOWN: you have to pay taxes because the government decided you have to. In the second system you have to pay the “fees” because you exercise the option to join that particular community. The outcome of paying might be similar, but the underlying logic is totally different.
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April 16, 2019, 08:39:33 AM

I think Ayre is trying to break ties with CSW. If he keeps calling CSW Satoshi as if it was fact and CSW then loses in court Ayre can then claim that he got conned and walk away unscathed.
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April 16, 2019, 08:42:13 AM

Either Ayre knows something we don't, got conned, or he's preparing to break ties with CSW.



"This industry needs to grow up and Craig proving he is Satoshi is the only way past this Troll attack that is so bad for the industries reputation. He now has a duty to set the record straight for us all. The Trolls all know he is Satoshi hence the fear."

https://twitter.com/CalvinAyre/status/1117706922415853569

I don't think the Court politics will work here anyway!

Bitcoin does not work with it, rather it is works upon a decentriziled way and every Bitcoin follower and user knows that its just another big troll. Many people have claimed in past about them being the real Satoshi and have the same vision but this could never be proved even if some legal laws are applied to it.

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April 16, 2019, 08:44:30 AM

I hope all governments in the Indian subcontinent will follow the same if some sense prevails into their mind, especially my home country. Without any legit regulation

India is suffering from Brain drain because the good amount of the crypto enthusiastic moving out from the Country. Zebpay is a big example.

Quote
France will push for the European Union to adopt a regulatory framework on cryptocurrencies similar to the one it brought in last week at a national level, becoming the first major country to do so, French Finance Minister Bruno Le Maire said on Monday.

https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-france-cryptocurrencies/france-to-ask-eu-partners-to-adopt-its-cryptocurrency-regulation-idUKKCN1RR1Y0
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April 16, 2019, 08:48:52 AM



Satoshi is a very popular and talented person in this world she/he is a created a new world cryptocurrency and kick out the bank system, Everyone is hesitant  Wink

It is a real Shatoshi Grin
Quote
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