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October 15, 2019, 04:52:29 AM *
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Question: Oct. 5 Closing Price:
$0 - 5 (3.5%)
<$8,000 - 38 (27%)
$8,000-$8,500 - 16 (11.3%)
$8,500-$9,000 - 10 (7.1%)
$9,000-$9,500 - 13 (9.2%)
$9,500-$10,000 - 12 (8.5%)
$10,000-$10,500 - 10 (7.1%)
$10,500-$11,000 - 5 (3.5%)
$11,000-$11,500 - 2 (1.4%)
$11,500-$12,000 - 4 (2.8%)
>$12,000 - 17 (12.1%)
>$20,000 - 9 (6.4%)
Total Voters: 141

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Author Topic: Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion  (Read 21401790 times)
This is a self-moderated topic. If you do not want to be moderated by the person who started this topic, create a new topic. (107 posts by 21 users deleted.)
jbreher
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May 22, 2019, 06:57:04 PM

Should we believe, the US registration and move on with Craig Wright being the real Satoshi ? Or its just another fud which will go around in some days ? What can we do to stop this shit?
A simple registration is enough for you to believe someone who has constantly lied and refused to simply sign the Genesis block? It hasn't been approved by the copyright office just a registration, it can still be denied.

Well, the copyright office does not 'approve' claims. The registration is merely prima facie evidence of a superior claim. Any further action is contingent upon court action. Only such would lead to 'denial'.
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May 22, 2019, 06:59:22 PM

https://www.forbes.com/sites/billybambrough/2019/05/22/twitters-jack-dorsey-and-square-are-making-mass-bitcoin-adoption-inevitable

Resistance is futile
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May 22, 2019, 07:00:17 PM
Merited by siggy_77 (1)

[edited out]

I think this thread has a saying "never go full fiat" .. I have taken that to heart.. Even at $1million, I'm not anywhere near full fiat.   I just haven't yet put any thought into how I'll modify the formulas past that point.  

Yes.  I think that the expression works in both directions.  Don't go full fiat and don't go full BTC.  Most of the time, these days, a vast majority of people are not going to be able to go full BTC even if they wanted to, but the point remains that we are still in a fiat world, so there are many investments that are going to exist in fiat, and it remains a matter of remaining cognizant of both your investments and your allocation levels.

Some people do play around with going full fiat (or completely getting out of BTC to try to buy lower, and I personally consider that approach as an unnecessary extreme - even if the odds are decently in favor of the BTC prices going down... Hey an extreme case scenario, in my view, might be selling 80% of your BTC or something like that, but for myself, I could not imagine a feeling of necessity to sell more than 50 of my BTC in any one swoop - unless I was getting close to death or some other extreme personal scenario.



From reading all of the above, it looks like we have _scarily_ similar thought processes on this concept as a whole.  

I've found the same phenomenon with the BTC to Fiat percentages, although, mine seems to stabilize around 80% BTC to 20% fiat...  "Fiat" in this case is shorthand for "diverse portfolio of stocks, bonds, property, cash equivilants, etc..."

Well you are thinking about the matter a bit different from me in terms of how to incorporate your other investments into your BTC portfolio allocation determinations, so in that regard, I would be much less into BTC than you because I was talking about how to consider the fiat that I have dedicated to BTC investing, and I was not referring to other investments that I have.  We are all different in that regard, and there are some younger folks who get into bitcoin and they have little to no investment in other asset classes, and then they start to erroneously believe that sufficient diversification comes from investing in other cryptos....

Anywho, I am getting a bit away from the topic, and my initial goal, when getting into BTC, was to put about 10% of my total quasi-liquid assets into Bitcoin, and I probably got into the 12% to 13% territory since BTC prices remained quite flat through 2015... and furthermore, BTC's subsequent enormous price appreciation caused my allocation towards BTC to occupy a much higher amount that I did not really diversify out of, but I conceptualize the investments somewhat differently and I consider my investment in BTC to serve as a kind of self-contained and separate play toy.. that currently does add up to more than my other investments... more than double, based on current BTC prices.   

Amazingly, the stabalization point for me seems also to be around $500k.  I'd honestly be rather interested in finding out if any other WO posters are seeing the same with their long term plans...

Well, it could depend upon how much equity that they have at this point and/or if they are heavily into accumulation versus a phase that has more maintenance emphasis.  And the later stage would be a kind of cashing out phase (like you mentioned, even the cashing out phase might be incremental and prudent in terms of never cashing out all BTC absent extreme circumstances).

And yes, I agree with your quandry of figuring out ways to spend excess money. I call this my "hookers and blow" stage.. not to be taken literally of course.

Yep...  If prices are now below $10k, there should be a decent number of us active BTC HODLers who should be able to reach a kind of hookers, blow and lambo stage, especially if prices go supra $100k (of course the exact price point is going to vary).


I figure if/when BTC ever hits about $250k, then I'll take the time to extend the planning out past a million.

Like you suggest, might be too early to get ahead of ourselves in that regard.

I just can't in good faith put serious thought to that at the moment, cuz I'm sure once the point arrives where I really don't have to worry about finances for the rest of my life, I won't be exactly the same person I am now...

Ugg. heavy thoughts..  

Well, that too.  Sometimes, it is better to consider such changes and adjustments once the situation changes in a way to make the planning more realistic and more in line with where you are going to be at that time, whether that time comes in 1 year, 5 years, 10 years or some other time frame (hoping that such a time frame comes). 
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May 22, 2019, 07:00:45 PM

Should we believe, the US registration and move on with Craig Wright being the real Satoshi ? Or its just another fud which will go around in some days ? What can we do to stop this shit?
A simple registration is enough for you to believe someone who has constantly lied and refused to simply sign the Genesis block? It hasn't been approved by the copyright office just a registration, it can still be denied.

Well, the copyright office does not 'approve' claims. The registration is merely prima facie evidence of a superior claim. Any further action is contingent upon court action. Only such would lead to 'denial'.

It’s not prima facie evidence of anything other than evidence of a claim having been made, which claim could be made by my dog
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May 22, 2019, 07:02:54 PM

Quote from: jbreher
Quote from: infofront
The immutability of the 1MB blocksize still stands if we throw out the word "protocol". Satoshi knew that once he slipped that blocksize limit into the core client, it would be there forever,  

I think the interim limits of 250KB and 500KB invalidate your assertion.

I assume you're talking about the default, "soft block limits" that miners were free to choose, as long as they were under the 1MB hard (consensus) limit?

Yes. I'll read your references before further comment in this direction.

Quote
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May 22, 2019, 07:03:43 PM
Merited by infofront (1)

Let's assume that in the year 2023 BTC is 250K without hyperinflation in fiat (as per Draper's numbers since he nailed the 10K time spot precisely).
Whatcha gonna do?

Retire?
Buy RE in trendy places (SF, NY, London)?
Buy a ranch (not for me), maybe a house in the woods?
Travel (or alternating between golfing, skiing and parasailing)?

Anybody care to say?

My choices (in the aforementioned scenario):
1. Retire (70-75% probability).
2. A small apartment, maybe NY or San Fran or even LA (got tired of all the heat in TX). Location is more important than size. Views are much better in San Fran, but the city loses it's culture mix, apparently.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/how-san-francisco-broke-americas-heart/2019/05/21/ef9a0ac0-70ea-11e9-9eb4-0828f5389013_story.html
3. A basic house in the woods-Oregon, maybe.
4. A few trips to Europe, maybe Japan. Will go to a few CL finals, hopefully!

Oh, forgot to say that I would not do anything if we keep oscillating between 5k and 20K.
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May 22, 2019, 07:08:05 PM

I wonder if the coingeek article counts as wire fraud.  They are getting dangerously close to pissing off the USG.
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May 22, 2019, 07:08:48 PM


The immutability of the 1MB blocksize still stands if we throw out the word "protocol". Satoshi knew that once he slipped that blocksize limit into the core client, it would be there forever, and become the de facto standard in all bitcoin software implementations. That's why Garzik and the others were opposed to it at the time. Satoshi said that it was temporary, but he knew enough about game theory to realize 1MB blocks would become a Schelling Point within the bitcoin network if it was left in the core client long enough.

I agree fully with the above but unfortunately the 1MB block size has already been abandoned when segwit was introduced.

Reading between the lines, it appears that infofront may adhere to the following hypothesis:
Once enough value gets bound up in segwit addresses, it becomes an irresistible honeypot. For while those addresses hold value under segwit rules, under the previous protocol rules, they are 'anyonecanspend' transactions. To the extent that the miners collude to roll back the chain, they are free to claim these 'anyonecanspend' TXOUTs for themselves. Every additional UTXO held in a segwit addy is additional incentive for them to behave thusly.

Once done, then the protocol and system would be back to the ersatz immutable 1MB block chain cap.

But hey - we've been over this already.

It's a theory. One which infofront may also not adhere to.  Huh

You laid that out pretty well. I'm not as certain as Shelby or TMSR that it will happen though.

My biggest concern with that theory is that the honeypot will be devalued after it's taken by the miners, which reduces the incentive to take it. OTOH, the segwit coin airdrop they'd get might make up for any devaluation of the 1MB chain caused by miners taking the 'anyonecanspend' transactions. And what do you think?
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May 22, 2019, 07:09:09 PM
Merited by infofront (1)

Did your old account get banned for plagiarism or what happened?

Nothing happened, and is it not relevant for new people to discuss here ? Or whats the issue?

I'm guessing that the comment was precipitated by the universal belief -- on pretty solid evidence --  that Dorian is not that Satoshi Nakamoto.

“I am no longer involved in bitcoin and I cannot discuss it… It’s been turned over to other people. They are in charge of it now. I no longer have any connection.”
~ Dorian ( satoshi ) Nakamoto

 Cool

choo choo ===> weeeee

#hatpeople

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May 22, 2019, 07:11:47 PM

Masterluc via Telegram

So what, a triangle on Thursday into 10k?

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May 22, 2019, 07:11:57 PM

You guys think we will ever see BCash @$4k again within any bullrun? I feel like I lost a fortune by not selling @4k and kept that scam hodling.

You will not find anyone here who thinks that BCH will ever be $4k again

False statement is false.

XD

False statement is false.

Are you really that obtuse?

I believe BCH will again attain $4K. I am here. Ergo...
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May 22, 2019, 07:14:28 PM

Let's assume that in the year 2023 BTC is 250K without hyperinflation in fiat (as per Draper's numbers since he nailed the 10K time spot precisely).
Whatcha gonna do?

Retire?
Buy RE in trendy places (SF, NY, London)?
Buy a ranch (not for me), maybe a house in the woods?
Travel (or alternating between golfing, skiing and parasailing)?

Anybody care to say?

My choices (in the aforementioned scenario):
1. Retire (70-75% probability).
2. A small apartment, maybe NY or San Fran or even LA (got tired of all the heat in TX). Location is more important than size. Views are much better in San Fran, but the city loses it's culture mix, apparently.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/how-san-francisco-broke-americas-heart/2019/05/21/ef9a0ac0-70ea-11e9-9eb4-0828f5389013_story.html
3. A basic house in the woods-Oregon, maybe.
4. A few trips to Europe, maybe Japan. Will go to a few CL finals, hopefully!

Oh, forgot to say that I would not do anything if we keep oscillating between 5k and 20K.

Retire, move to Texas or Florida, spend my time studying computer science, parenting, being a beach bum, and growing tropical fruit. When the kid has summers off from school, take long foreign trips.
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May 22, 2019, 07:19:49 PM

let´s quickly check how sustainable bSV is rewarding miners with fees to secure the network:

Quote
Today's earned fees across Bitcoin forks...

Bitcoin: $1.8M of fees earned by miners
Bitcoin Cash: $461 of fees earned by miners
Bitcoin SV: $16 of fees earned by miners
Bitcoin Gold: $2 of fees earned by miners

Yet the SV blockchain continues. Funny, that.

Looks like a ripe target to me.

Indeed it does. Why does nobody attack it?

Is it perhaps because SV miners have hash power in reserve at the moment, and could easily re-revert any reversion made with the assumption that the reversion would stand due to lack of hashpower to re-revert?
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May 22, 2019, 07:20:23 PM

Let's assume that in the year 2023 BTC is 250K without hyperinflation in fiat (as per Draper's numbers since he nailed the 10K time spot precisely).
Whatcha gonna do?

Retire?
Buy RE in trendy places (SF, NY, London)?
Buy a ranch (not for me), maybe a house in the woods?
Travel (or alternating between golfing, skiing and parasailing)?

Anybody care to say?

My choices (in the aforementioned scenario):
1. Retire (70-75% probability).
2. A small apartment, maybe NY or San Fran or even LA (got tired of all the heat in TX). Location is more important than size. Views are much better in San Fran, but the city loses it's culture mix, apparently.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/how-san-francisco-broke-americas-heart/2019/05/21/ef9a0ac0-70ea-11e9-9eb4-0828f5389013_story.html
3. A basic house in the woods-Oregon, maybe.
4. A few trips to Europe, maybe Japan. Will go to a few CL finals, hopefully!

Oh, forgot to say that I would not do anything if we keep oscillating between 5k and 20K.

Retire, move to Texas or Florida, spend my time studying computer science, parenting, being a beach bum, and growing tropical fruit. When the kid has summers off from school, take long foreign trips.

I hear you, but are we moving (presumably) in opposite directions, lol?
In TX already. Like the people, and no state tax, don't like the heat and HIGH RE taxes (they are more than three times higher than in CA and seven times higher than in Hawaii).
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May 22, 2019, 07:27:49 PM

Those building & investing in crypto:

- Fidelity
- Nasdaq
- NYSE
- Yale
- Harvard
- Fairfax County Pension
- Founders Fund
- Union Square
- Amazon
- JPMorgan
- Starbucks
- a16z
- IBM
- Facebook

Are you going to bet against the most successful companies & investors in the world?

https://twitter.com/APompliano/status/1131270293689966593
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May 22, 2019, 07:28:11 PM

Let's assume that in the year 2023 BTC is 250K without hyperinflation in fiat (as per Draper's numbers since he nailed the 10K time spot precisely).
Whatcha gonna do?

Retire?
Buy RE in trendy places (SF, NY, London)?
Buy a ranch (not for me), maybe a house in the woods?
Travel (or alternating between golfing, skiing and parasailing)?

Anybody care to say?

My choices (in the aforementioned scenario):
1. Retire (70-75% probability).
2. A small apartment, maybe NY or San Fran or even LA (got tired of all the heat in TX). Location is more important than size. Views are much better in San Fran, but the city loses it's culture mix, apparently.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/how-san-francisco-broke-americas-heart/2019/05/21/ef9a0ac0-70ea-11e9-9eb4-0828f5389013_story.html
3. A basic house in the woods-Oregon, maybe.
4. A few trips to Europe, maybe Japan. Will go to a few CL finals, hopefully!

Oh, forgot to say that I would not do anything if we keep oscillating between 5k and 20K.

So at 250k, I'll already be retired and have a decent amount of extra fiat accumulated from incremental sales between there and 250..   I'm thinking next step is a large tract of woods, (Ozarks maybe? ) where I'll put a house smack dab in the middle.  I'm not a people person, so anything that  involves "trendy" or "city" is prolly not my thing.   Finding a like minded companion to do some traveling with does hold some appeal however...  There are a lot of sights to see stateside without needing to venture overseas.  

And have to agree on the "nothing before 20k" thing .. current plan has me HODLing till 20k before I start doing anything else.
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May 22, 2019, 07:32:55 PM

Moved Jbreher on unignored out of curiosity, perhaps he changed.

Quite disappointed to see (as expected) the usual bullshit.



Back on ignored...lol.

::le sigh::

Yup. I've been negged. By (last time I looked) two individuals with whom I have never carried out, nor agreed to carry out, nor even discussed the possibility of carrying out, a transaction. One of them an admitted extortionist even.

Why? For merely having the temerity to utter my belief that SV is the Bitcoin-iest of all the Bitcoins. Oh! The heresy!

If you want to outsource your trust to abusers, knock yourself out. If you want to think for yourself, clicking on the Trust link in the sidebar will allow you to trace the source of the negs to their rationale and sources.

Not that I'd expect anything but taking the easy way out (with a gratuitous sideswipe doled out like a cherry on top) from you.
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May 22, 2019, 07:34:00 PM
Merited by jbreher (10)

Let's assume that in the year 2023 BTC is 250K without hyperinflation in fiat (as per Draper's numbers since he nailed the 10K time spot precisely).
Whatcha gonna do?

Retire?
Buy RE in trendy places (SF, NY, London)?
Buy a ranch (not for me), maybe a house in the woods?
Travel (or alternating between golfing, skiing and parasailing)?

Anybody care to say?

My choices (in the aforementioned scenario):
1. Retire (70-75% probability).
2. A small apartment, maybe NY or San Fran or even LA (got tired of all the heat in TX). Location is more important than size. Views are much better in San Fran, but the city loses it's culture mix, apparently.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/how-san-francisco-broke-americas-heart/2019/05/21/ef9a0ac0-70ea-11e9-9eb4-0828f5389013_story.html
3. A basic house in the woods-Oregon, maybe.
4. A few trips to Europe, maybe Japan. Will go to a few CL finals, hopefully!

Oh, forgot to say that I would not do anything if we keep oscillating between 5k and 20K.

So at 250k, I'll already be retired and have a decent amount of extra fiat accumulated from incremental sales between there and 250..   I'm thinking next step is a large tract of woods, (Ozarks maybe? ) where I'll put a house smack dab in the middle.  I'm not a people person, so anything that  involves "trendy" or "city" is prolly not my thing.   Finding a like minded companion to do some traveling with does hold some appeal however...  There are a lot of sights to see stateside without needing to venture overseas.  

And have to agree on the "nothing before 20k" thing .. current plan has me HODLing till 20k before I start doing anything else.

I am going to tackle some real problems. Like solving homelessness in Los Angeles and using it as a prototype for other cities to follow.
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May 22, 2019, 07:36:12 PM

Nodes set the rules, not miners
If the majority of miners mine blocks against consensus rules, as defined by nodes, nothing happens, as mined block, even if the longest chain is produced, are not relayed trough the network as rejected by the nodes.

The only option a so-called 'node' has when it encounters a chain it doesn't like is to orphan itself from that chain. And hope it can find another it is happy with. If the miners en masse move to a new implementation, each and every so-called 'node' merely fucks itself individually.

Do we have to UASF every time you raise this misconception?  We have had this exact discussion at least five times. 

I guess if you could point to a UASF that was carried out without majority participation by the miners, you'd have an argument.
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May 22, 2019, 07:41:03 PM

Let's assume that in the year 2023 BTC is 250K without hyperinflation in fiat (as per Draper's numbers since he nailed the 10K time spot precisely).
Whatcha gonna do?

Retire?
Buy RE in trendy places (SF, NY, London)?
Buy a ranch (not for me), maybe a house in the woods?
Travel (or alternating between golfing, skiing and parasailing)?

Anybody care to say?

My choices (in the aforementioned scenario):
1. Retire (70-75% probability).
2. A small apartment, maybe NY or San Fran or even LA (got tired of all the heat in TX). Location is more important than size. Views are much better in San Fran, but the city loses it's culture mix, apparently.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/how-san-francisco-broke-americas-heart/2019/05/21/ef9a0ac0-70ea-11e9-9eb4-0828f5389013_story.html
3. A basic house in the woods-Oregon, maybe.
4. A few trips to Europe, maybe Japan. Will go to a few CL finals, hopefully!

Oh, forgot to say that I would not do anything if we keep oscillating between 5k and 20K.

Retire, move to Texas or Florida, spend my time studying computer science, parenting, being a beach bum, and growing tropical fruit. When the kid has summers off from school, take long foreign trips.

I hear you, but are we moving (presumably) in opposite directions, lol?
In TX already. Like the people, and no state tax, don't like the heat and HIGH RE taxes (they are more than three times higher than in CA and seven times higher than in Hawaii).

Haha I'm in the far northern US, and I'm tired of the damn winters. I don't know how I"ll be able to tolerate the heat.

Yeah the RE taxes in TX look a little ridiculous, and I heard they're trying to increase the sales tax to 8.25% or so. That might steer me toward FL. I love the state culture of TX, and the food (tex-mex and barbecue) though.
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