Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[HairyMaclairy]

I wonder if the coingeek article counts as wire fraud.  They are getting dangerously close to pissing off the USG.

[infofront]

The immutability of the 1MB blocksize still stands if we throw out the word "protocol". Satoshi knew that once he slipped that blocksize limit into the core client, it would be there forever, and become the de facto standard in all bitcoin software implementations. That's why Garzik and the others were opposed to it at the time. Satoshi said that it was temporary, but he knew enough about game theory to realize 1MB blocks would become a Schelling Point within the bitcoin network if it was left in the core client long enough.

I agree fully with the above but unfortunately the 1MB block size has already been abandoned when segwit was introduced.

Reading between the lines, it appears that infofront may adhere to the following hypothesis:
Once enough value gets bound up in segwit addresses, it becomes an irresistible honeypot. For while those addresses hold value under segwit rules, under the previous protocol rules, they are 'anyonecanspend' transactions. To the extent that the miners collude to roll back the chain, they are free to claim these 'anyonecanspend' TXOUTs for themselves. Every additional UTXO held in a segwit addy is additional incentive for them to behave thusly.

Once done, then the protocol and system would be back to the ersatz immutable 1MB block chain cap.

But hey - we've been over this already.

It's a theory. One which infofront may also not adhere to.  

You laid that out pretty well. I'm not as certain as Shelby or TMSR that it will happen though.

My biggest concern with that theory is that the honeypot will be devalued after it's taken by the miners, which reduces the incentive to take it. OTOH, the segwit coin airdrop they'd get might make up for any devaluation of the 1MB chain caused by miners taking the 'anyonecanspend' transactions. And what do you think?

[gembitz]

Did your old account get banned for plagiarism or what happened?

Nothing happened, and is it not relevant for new people to discuss here ? Or whats the issue?

I'm guessing that the comment was precipitated by the universal belief -- on pretty solid evidence --  that Dorian is not that Satoshi Nakamoto.

“I am no longer involved in bitcoin and I cannot discuss it… It’s been turned over to other people. They are in charge of it now. I no longer have any connection.”
~ Dorian ( satoshi ) Nakamoto

 

choo choo ===> weeeee

#hatpeople

[d_eddie]

Masterluc via Telegram

So what, a triangle on Thursday into 10k?

[jbreher]

You guys think we will ever see BCash @$4k again within any bullrun? I feel like I lost a fortune by not selling @4k and kept that scam hodling.

You will not find anyone here who thinks that BCH will ever be $4k again

False statement is false.

XD

False statement is false.

Are you really that obtuse?

I believe BCH will again attain $4K. I am here. Ergo...

[infofront]

Let's assume that in the year 2023 BTC is 250K without hyperinflation in fiat (as per Draper's numbers since he nailed the 10K time spot precisely).
Whatcha gonna do?

Retire?
Buy RE in trendy places (SF, NY, London)?
Buy a ranch (not for me), maybe a house in the woods?
Travel (or alternating between golfing, skiing and parasailing)?

Anybody care to say?

My choices (in the aforementioned scenario):
1. Retire (70-75% probability).
2. A small apartment, maybe NY or San Fran or even LA (got tired of all the heat in TX). Location is more important than size. Views are much better in San Fran, but the city loses it's culture mix, apparently.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/how-san-francisco-broke-americas-heart/2019/05/21/ef9a0ac0-70ea-11e9-9eb4-0828f5389013_story.html
3. A basic house in the woods-Oregon, maybe.
4. A few trips to Europe, maybe Japan. Will go to a few CL finals, hopefully!

Oh, forgot to say that I would not do anything if we keep oscillating between 5k and 20K.

Retire, move to Texas or Florida, spend my time studying computer science, parenting, being a beach bum, and growing tropical fruit. When the kid has summers off from school, take long foreign trips.

[jbreher]

let´s quickly check how sustainable bSV is rewarding miners with fees to secure the network:

Today's earned fees across Bitcoin forks...

Bitcoin: $1.8M of fees earned by miners
Bitcoin Cash: $461 of fees earned by miners
Bitcoin SV: $16 of fees earned by miners
Bitcoin Gold: $2 of fees earned by miners

Yet the SV blockchain continues. Funny, that.

Looks like a ripe target to me.

Indeed it does. Why does nobody attack it?

Is it perhaps because SV miners have hash power in reserve at the moment, and could easily re-revert any reversion made with the assumption that the reversion would stand due to lack of hashpower to re-revert?

[Biodom]

Let's assume that in the year 2023 BTC is 250K without hyperinflation in fiat (as per Draper's numbers since he nailed the 10K time spot precisely).
Whatcha gonna do?

Retire?
Buy RE in trendy places (SF, NY, London)?
Buy a ranch (not for me), maybe a house in the woods?
Travel (or alternating between golfing, skiing and parasailing)?

Anybody care to say?

My choices (in the aforementioned scenario):
1. Retire (70-75% probability).
2. A small apartment, maybe NY or San Fran or even LA (got tired of all the heat in TX). Location is more important than size. Views are much better in San Fran, but the city loses it's culture mix, apparently.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/how-san-francisco-broke-americas-heart/2019/05/21/ef9a0ac0-70ea-11e9-9eb4-0828f5389013_story.html
3. A basic house in the woods-Oregon, maybe.
4. A few trips to Europe, maybe Japan. Will go to a few CL finals, hopefully!

Oh, forgot to say that I would not do anything if we keep oscillating between 5k and 20K.

Retire, move to Texas or Florida, spend my time studying computer science, parenting, being a beach bum, and growing tropical fruit. When the kid has summers off from school, take long foreign trips.

I hear you, but are we moving (presumably) in opposite directions, lol?
In TX already. Like the people, and no state tax, don't like the heat and HIGH RE taxes (they are more than three times higher than in CA and seven times higher than in Hawaii).

[El duderino_]

Those building & investing in crypto:

- Fidelity
- Nasdaq
- NYSE
- Yale
- Harvard
- Fairfax County Pension
- Founders Fund
- Union Square
- Amazon
- JPMorgan
- Starbucks
- a16z
- IBM
- Facebook

Are you going to bet against the most successful companies & investors in the world?

https://twitter.com/APompliano/status/1131270293689966593

[siggy_77]

Let's assume that in the year 2023 BTC is 250K without hyperinflation in fiat (as per Draper's numbers since he nailed the 10K time spot precisely).
Whatcha gonna do?

Retire?
Buy RE in trendy places (SF, NY, London)?
Buy a ranch (not for me), maybe a house in the woods?
Travel (or alternating between golfing, skiing and parasailing)?

Anybody care to say?

My choices (in the aforementioned scenario):
1. Retire (70-75% probability).
2. A small apartment, maybe NY or San Fran or even LA (got tired of all the heat in TX). Location is more important than size. Views are much better in San Fran, but the city loses it's culture mix, apparently.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/how-san-francisco-broke-americas-heart/2019/05/21/ef9a0ac0-70ea-11e9-9eb4-0828f5389013_story.html
3. A basic house in the woods-Oregon, maybe.
4. A few trips to Europe, maybe Japan. Will go to a few CL finals, hopefully!

Oh, forgot to say that I would not do anything if we keep oscillating between 5k and 20K.

So at 250k, I'll already be retired and have a decent amount of extra fiat accumulated from incremental sales between there and 250..   I'm thinking next step is a large tract of woods, (Ozarks maybe? ) where I'll put a house smack dab in the middle.  I'm not a people person, so anything that  involves "trendy" or "city" is prolly not my thing.   Finding a like minded companion to do some traveling with does hold some appeal however...  There are a lot of sights to see stateside without needing to venture overseas.  

And have to agree on the "nothing before 20k" thing .. current plan has me HODLing till 20k before I start doing anything else.

[jbreher]

Moved Jbreher on unignored out of curiosity, perhaps he changed.

Quite disappointed to see (as expected) the usual bullshit.



Back on ignored...lol.

::le sigh::

Yup. I've been negged. By (last time I looked) two individuals with whom I have never carried out, nor agreed to carry out, nor even discussed the possibility of carrying out, a transaction. One of them an admitted extortionist even.

Why? For merely having the temerity to utter my belief that SV is the Bitcoin-iest of all the Bitcoins. Oh! The heresy!

If you want to outsource your trust to abusers, knock yourself out. If you want to think for yourself, clicking on the Trust link in the sidebar will allow you to trace the source of the negs to their rationale and sources.

Not that I'd expect anything but taking the easy way out (with a gratuitous sideswipe doled out like a cherry on top) from you.

[windjc]

Let's assume that in the year 2023 BTC is 250K without hyperinflation in fiat (as per Draper's numbers since he nailed the 10K time spot precisely).
Whatcha gonna do?

Retire?
Buy RE in trendy places (SF, NY, London)?
Buy a ranch (not for me), maybe a house in the woods?
Travel (or alternating between golfing, skiing and parasailing)?

Anybody care to say?

My choices (in the aforementioned scenario):
1. Retire (70-75% probability).
2. A small apartment, maybe NY or San Fran or even LA (got tired of all the heat in TX). Location is more important than size. Views are much better in San Fran, but the city loses it's culture mix, apparently.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/how-san-francisco-broke-americas-heart/2019/05/21/ef9a0ac0-70ea-11e9-9eb4-0828f5389013_story.html
3. A basic house in the woods-Oregon, maybe.
4. A few trips to Europe, maybe Japan. Will go to a few CL finals, hopefully!

Oh, forgot to say that I would not do anything if we keep oscillating between 5k and 20K.

So at 250k, I'll already be retired and have a decent amount of extra fiat accumulated from incremental sales between there and 250..   I'm thinking next step is a large tract of woods, (Ozarks maybe? ) where I'll put a house smack dab in the middle.  I'm not a people person, so anything that  involves "trendy" or "city" is prolly not my thing.   Finding a like minded companion to do some traveling with does hold some appeal however...  There are a lot of sights to see stateside without needing to venture overseas.  

And have to agree on the "nothing before 20k" thing .. current plan has me HODLing till 20k before I start doing anything else.

I am going to tackle some real problems. Like solving homelessness in Los Angeles and using it as a prototype for other cities to follow.

[jbreher]

Nodes set the rules, not miners
If the majority of miners mine blocks against consensus rules, as defined by nodes, nothing happens, as mined block, even if the longest chain is produced, are not relayed trough the network as rejected by the nodes.

The only option a so-called 'node' has when it encounters a chain it doesn't like is to orphan itself from that chain. And hope it can find another it is happy with. If the miners en masse move to a new implementation, each and every so-called 'node' merely fucks itself individually.

Do we have to UASF every time you raise this misconception?  We have had this exact discussion at least five times. 

I guess if you could point to a UASF that was carried out without majority participation by the miners, you'd have an argument.

[infofront]

Let's assume that in the year 2023 BTC is 250K without hyperinflation in fiat (as per Draper's numbers since he nailed the 10K time spot precisely).
Whatcha gonna do?

Retire?
Buy RE in trendy places (SF, NY, London)?
Buy a ranch (not for me), maybe a house in the woods?
Travel (or alternating between golfing, skiing and parasailing)?

Anybody care to say?

My choices (in the aforementioned scenario):
1. Retire (70-75% probability).
2. A small apartment, maybe NY or San Fran or even LA (got tired of all the heat in TX). Location is more important than size. Views are much better in San Fran, but the city loses it's culture mix, apparently.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/how-san-francisco-broke-americas-heart/2019/05/21/ef9a0ac0-70ea-11e9-9eb4-0828f5389013_story.html
3. A basic house in the woods-Oregon, maybe.
4. A few trips to Europe, maybe Japan. Will go to a few CL finals, hopefully!

Oh, forgot to say that I would not do anything if we keep oscillating between 5k and 20K.

Retire, move to Texas or Florida, spend my time studying computer science, parenting, being a beach bum, and growing tropical fruit. When the kid has summers off from school, take long foreign trips.

I hear you, but are we moving (presumably) in opposite directions, lol?
In TX already. Like the people, and no state tax, don't like the heat and HIGH RE taxes (they are more than three times higher than in CA and seven times higher than in Hawaii).

Haha I'm in the far northern US, and I'm tired of the damn winters. I don't know how I"ll be able to tolerate the heat.

Yeah the RE taxes in TX look a little ridiculous, and I heard they're trying to increase the sales tax to 8.25% or so. That might steer me toward FL. I love the state culture of TX, and the food (tex-mex and barbecue) though.

[jbreher]

Should we believe, the US registration and move on with Craig Wright being the real Satoshi ? Or its just another fud which will go around in some days ? What can we do to stop this shit?

A simple registration is enough for you to believe someone who has constantly lied and refused to simply sign the Genesis block? It hasn't been approved by the copyright office just a registration, it can still be denied.

Well, the copyright office does not 'approve' claims. The registration is merely prima facie evidence of a superior claim. Any further action is contingent upon court action. Only such would lead to 'denial'.

It’s not prima facie evidence of anything other than evidence of a claim having been made,

That's exactly what I said.

which claim could be made by my dog

A dog capable of filling out a copyright registration application would seem to be a pretty unique animal. Of course, I'm not a zoologist.

[MrFreeRoMan]

Those building & investing in crypto:

- Fidelity
- Nasdaq
- NYSE
- Yale
- Harvard
- Fairfax County Pension
- Founders Fund
- Union Square
- Amazon
- JPMorgan
- Starbucks
- a16z
- IBM
- Facebook

Are you going to bet against the most successful companies & investors in the world?

https://twitter.com/APompliano/status/1131270293689966593

They are people too! Why not?

[jbreher]

Reading between the lines, it appears that infofront may adhere to the following hypothesis:
Once enough value gets bound up in segwit addresses, it becomes an irresistible honeypot. For while those addresses hold value under segwit rules, under the previous protocol rules, they are 'anyonecanspend' transactions. To the extent that the miners collude to roll back the chain, they are free to claim these 'anyonecanspend' TXOUTs for themselves. Every additional UTXO held in a segwit addy is additional incentive for them to behave thusly.

Once done, then the protocol and system would be back to the ersatz immutable 1MB block chain cap.

But hey - we've been over this already.

It's a theory. One which infofront may also not adhere to.  

You laid that out pretty well. I'm not as certain as Shelby or TMSR that it will happen though.

My biggest concern with that theory is that the honeypot will be devalued after it's taken by the miners, which reduces the incentive to take it. OTOH, the segwit coin airdrop they'd get might make up for any devaluation of the 1MB chain caused by miners taking the 'anyonecanspend' transactions. And what do you think?

I could see your devaluation scenario as one strong possibility.

There is an alternate scenario, whereby the world at large comes to see the entire SegWit Omnibus Changeset period as a hijacking of the real Bitcoin (maybe or maybe not TRB in a TMSR sense), and the return to original protocol as a restoration - a righting of a wrong. In which case, the incident could result in a net increase in value.

I don't know how to evaluate the relative probabilities of such scenarios.

I still think the chain that can provide more utility to more people has the long-term greater value proposition, regardless.

[jbreher]

Did your old account get banned for plagiarism or what happened?

Nothing happened, and is it not relevant for new people to discuss here ? Or whats the issue?

I'm guessing that the comment was precipitated by the universal belief -- on pretty solid evidence --  that Dorian is not that Satoshi Nakamoto.

“I am no longer involved in bitcoin and I cannot discuss it… It’s been turned over to other people. They are in charge of it now. I no longer have any connection.”
~ Dorian ( satoshi ) Nakamoto

 

choo choo ===> weeeee

#hatpeople

The quote seems to have been adequately explained away.

That photo tho. Looks like Dorian in a Circle hat, and Silbert!?!?

[El duderino_]

Moved Jbreher on unignored out of curiosity, perhaps he changed.

Quite disappointed to see (as expected) the usual bullshit.



Back on ignored...lol.

::le sigh::

Yup. I've been negged. By (last time I looked) two individuals with whom I have never carried out, nor agreed to carry out, nor even discussed the possibility of carrying out, a transaction. One of them an admitted extortionist even.

Why? For merely having the temerity to utter my belief that SV is the Bitcoin-iest of all the Bitcoins. Oh! The heresy!

If you want to outsource your trust to abusers, knock yourself out. If you want to think for yourself, clicking on the Trust link in the sidebar will allow you to trace the source of the negs to their rationale and sources.

Not that I'd expect anything but taking the easy way out (with a gratuitous sideswipe doled out like a cherry on top) from you.

I wouldn't give red trust myself for speaking your own mind on a polite manner (what is usually the case) ......

But I would suggest of creating a thread BSV to discuss there what is better... I do get a bit the feeling you try to convert people and maybe try to have effect on silent reading people or newbies...cause this is the most viewed page of the forum....

I you would give a sign of don't wanna annoy people with creating a specific thread would be a real improvement IMO.....

I always have respect for people speaking there own mind, but just in the appropriate atmosphere.  

[Last of the V8s]

I'm not a zoologist.

A dyslexic skier forgets which way to go down the mountain.
He goes up to the nearest fellow, "Excuse me, can you remind me which way to go down. Is it zig-zag or zag-zig?"
"Well, I wouldn't know, I'm a tobogganist."
"Oh in that case can I have 20 Benson & Hedges and a box of matches please?"